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Old
06-21-2012, 09:10 PM
  #601
Sabresfansince1980
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Yeah, but if the Pens say they want to keep him so he costs more, I think other teams just give up on the idea instead of actually paying more. It might be different if there was a decent chance of Staal re-signing with the new team, but this situation gives almost zero confidence in that happening.

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06-21-2012, 09:15 PM
  #602
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
why did eric sign such a long term deal then? he didn't turn down the long term money to team up with jordan somewhere in 2013... if this was "planned" why didn't eric insist on a 4 yr deal?
He's the big brother and Marc and Jordan need to come to him!

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06-21-2012, 09:17 PM
  #603
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Originally Posted by LoveDaSwords View Post
Well, this also is contingent on the Pens being sold on trading him now, instead of taking another stab at the Cup with him in the fold.

The Penguins could very well say "we're not looking to move him, we'll take our chances but we think we can get a Cup this year." In which case, the price it takes to pry him out could easily go back up. We're discussing how a team who thinks they can contend this season might try to get him for 1 year...the Pens you'd have to consider in the same boat.
Plus, they might think that worst case, they can get a 2nd+ for his negotiating rights next June.

A 2nd in 2013 may be worth a mid to late 1st in 2012......

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06-21-2012, 09:18 PM
  #604
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bob View Post
He's the big brother and Marc and Jordan need to come to him!
jordan better watch out... things didnt work out too good for morgan earp

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06-21-2012, 09:20 PM
  #605
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
jordan better watch out... things didnt work out too good for morgan earp
But like you agreed with earlier, only Jordan knows what he wants to do. Perhaps his desire to play with Eric is a lot stronger than Eric's desire to play with his brothers is. It could be that just as easily as it is Jordan wanting to be "The Man" on a team.

Heck, maybe he wants to play for the Leafs since they are the closest team to the old sod farm....

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06-21-2012, 10:33 PM
  #606
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Originally Posted by Der Jaeger View Post
I'd risk it. Miller, Vanek, and Pominville are free agents after the 2013-2014 season. Leopold, Roy, Regehr, and Sulzer are all UFA's after this season. He's got to reload at some point.
Reloading isn't dealing multiple pieces for a year of Staal.

Reloading for that eventuality would be keeping the 4 picks we have, and all prospects. Or spinning them into more assets/prospects/ or what DR said he would do: not trade them for 1 year of someone.

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06-21-2012, 10:46 PM
  #607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sba View Post
Reloading isn't dealing multiple pieces for a year of Staal.

Reloading for that eventuality would be keeping the 4 picks we have, and all prospects. Or spinning them into more assets/prospects/ or what DR said he would do: not trade them for 1 year of someone.
Like I said, if they trade assets for Staal you can bet your ass Pegula & Co lock him up for the rest of his foreseeable career.

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06-21-2012, 10:56 PM
  #608
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpatterson14206 View Post
Like I said, if they trade assets for Staal you can bet your ass Pegula & Co lock him up for the rest of his foreseeable career.
Except for the fact that we can't offer him what it seems he really wants to do, play with his family?

Not worth the risk

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06-21-2012, 11:30 PM
  #609
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Off topic: just out of curiosity do all the Staal brothers want to play together? Marc?

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06-21-2012, 11:36 PM
  #610
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Originally Posted by sba View Post
Except for the fact that we can't offer him what it seems he really wants to do, play with his family?

Not worth the risk
The logical solution is to acquire Marc and Eric Staal tomorrow.

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06-21-2012, 11:37 PM
  #611
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Originally Posted by BuiltTagonTough View Post
The logical solution is to acquire Marc and Eric Staal tomorrow.
It's decided then.

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06-22-2012, 12:23 AM
  #612
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Reminder of Regier's words:

Quote:
If there is a position that we’re focused in on it’s probably in the middle still,” Buffalo General Manager Darcy Regier said. “Tyler Ennis obviously did an excellent job, and so did Cody Hodgson. Derek Roy is a known commodity. You can look at a size factor, and that’s certainly one area we’re looking in.”
Quote:
“I’m not talking about a one-year fix or a player that is going to be looking at becoming an unrestricted free agent and you don’t think you’re going to have the ability to sign and keep, then you’re going to lean more toward the draft,” Regier said. “If you have the opportunity to add someone who’s either under contract or is a high-profile player at a reasonable – whatever reasonable accounts for these days – cost, then certainly that’s something we’ll pursue.”
http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/sa...ece?sabrespace

Even with the news about Staal rejecting the Pens' offer, if Regier and Pegula pulled back from chasing Brad Richards because they saw it as a low-probability play for a player that had already made up his mind on where he wanted to play, I don't see it being any different with Staal obviously wanting to get to free agency and probably join his brother.

The Sabres may desperately need a player of Staal's skillset, size and potential - but they don't need it only for 1 year.

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06-22-2012, 01:03 AM
  #613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
Even with the news about Staal rejecting the Pens' offer, if Regier and Pegula pulled back from chasing Brad Richards because they saw it as a low-probability play for a player that had already made up his mind on where he wanted to play, I don't see it being any different with Staal obviously wanting to get to free agency and probably join his brother.
People are making the assumption that the reason he turned down the offer is to hit free agency but it could be as simple as he wants to force Pittsburg's hand to move him. If that's the case they can negotiate an extension with Staal before trading for him.

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06-22-2012, 04:56 AM
  #614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sba View Post
Reloading isn't dealing multiple pieces for a year of Staal.

Reloading for that eventuality would be keeping the 4 picks we have, and all prospects. Or spinning them into more assets/prospects/ or what DR said he would do: not trade them for 1 year of someone.
Obviously, I'm considering Pegula talking Staal into resigning.... not a one-year rental.

So, you'd rather have the four picks over Staal, Hodgson, and Ennis as the team's centers? I'd rather have those three, long-term, all under 25-years-old.

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06-22-2012, 05:04 AM
  #615
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Der Jaeger View Post
Obviously, I'm considering Pegula talking Staal into resigning.... not a one-year rental.

So, you'd rather have the four picks over Staal, Hodgson, and Ennis as the team's centers? I'd rather have those three, long-term, all under 25-years-old.
I think that decision is made before the trade. I think Regier would negotiate with Staal´s agent before Buffalo trade´s assets away.

Buffalo also could take on Martin and his 5m as I hear the Penguins are trying to unload him. Of course we would have to send salary the other way.

Also I am hoping if Staal comes this way Ennis and Hodgson are not going to other way. Sure Staal is a huge improvement over the two but the sabres interests should lie in building a winner and Ennis and Hodgson should be included in that plan

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06-22-2012, 05:08 AM
  #616
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How much are you willing to pay Staal

I am wondering if Buffalo trades for Staal how much are you willing to sign him for before you let him walk?

6m?
7m?
8m?

Interested to see what Jame would sign him for?


What would the contract look like? Would giving him 8,000,000 handcuff the sabres becoming a winner?

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06-22-2012, 06:35 AM
  #617
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heartsabres View Post
I am wondering if Buffalo trades for Staal how much are you willing to sign him for before you let him walk?

6m?
7m?
8m?

Interested to see what Jame would sign him for?


What would the contract look like? Would giving him 8,000,000 handcuff the sabres becoming a winner?
I don't think Staal's contract becomes prohibitive at any on those salaries, unless the cap goes down drastically.

Assuming Buffalo makes the Pominville/Adam for Staal/Kennedy trade that I've been advocating, here's the lineup:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Der Jaeger View Post
Ville Leino ($4.500m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Tyler Kennedy ($2.000m)
Thomas Vanek ($7.143m) / Cody Hodgson ($1.667m) / Corey Tropp ($0.700m)
Marcus Foligno ($0.900m) / Tyler Ennis ($3.500m) / Drew Stafford ($4.000m)
Nathan Gerbe ($1.433m) / Jay McClement ($2.000m) / Patrick Kaleta ($1.003m)
Matt Ellis ($0.525m) / Cody McCormick ($1.200m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Andrej Sekera ($2.750m) / Tyler Myers ($5.500m)
Christian Ehrhoff ($4.000m) / Alexander Sulzer ($0.725m)
Robyn Regehr ($4.020m) / Jordan Leopold ($3.000m)
Mike Weber ($0.950m)
GOALTENDERS
Ryan Miller ($6.250m)
Jhonas Enroth ($0.675m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,440,606; BONUSES: $1,035,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $7,859,394
Key point - Buffalo's ~$4M under the 2011-2012 cap with this roster, with the only other actions being to move Roy - maybe for one of Chicago's centers (Pirri, McNeill, Kruger) that might not make the roster, and signing McClement.

So, even if Buffalo doesn't put Pominville in the trade, they're still way under the projected cap. And if they do trade Pominville, if the cap goes down, they're looking pretty decent. They can still move Leopold, for example, if they needed to shed cap space.

In the future, it's obviously going to look better - for Buffalo, that cap future looks dramatically better over the next two seasons:

- After the 2012-2013 season, not counting RFA's or saved cap from a projected Roy trade, the Sabres lose ~$8.2M in cap space (Ellis, Regehr, Leopold, Sulzer). If Regier works a new Staal contract like he did Myers, and 2013 is the first year of Staal's new contract, there's the space right there.

- After 2013-2014, Buffalo's cap goes down ~14.5M, not counting RFA's or my projected Pominville trade (Vanek, Miller, McCormick).

With all that in mind, I don't see a Staal contract even as high as $8M being restrictive.

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06-22-2012, 07:02 AM
  #618
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I'm starting to wonder if the reason they don't want expiring contracts is the CBA situation...there's no guerentee that there will even be a season next year so you'd be paying for nothing in essence....

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06-22-2012, 07:27 AM
  #619
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Pominville fo one year of Staal is just silly.

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06-22-2012, 08:15 AM
  #620
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I'm not sure if maybe you guys aren't familiar with how the league works.

Before a deal is EVER reached, the Sabres will ask the Penguins for permission to speak to Staal and in almost all cases with get it. If they feel they absolutely CANNOT work out an extension, they won't even bother making the trade.

This happens all the time, a lot of times a team will speak to an opposing player, they make come to an agreement, but at the end of the day the two teams can't work it out and nothing even happens.

So there's two possilbities

1) Sabres talk to Staal and they feel they can get him signed to a long term extension, they make an offer
2) Sabres talk to Staal and they don't feel like they can get him signed long term, they walk away

It's as simple as that. This whole "trading X for a year of Staal" isn't happening, because if the Sabres aren't positive they can sign him long term they won't even bother with it.

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06-22-2012, 08:23 AM
  #621
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Pittsburgh should just keep him, make a run at a Cup this year, and let the chips fall where they may in free agency.

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06-22-2012, 08:30 AM
  #622
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I wonder if there's a possibility of a Staal for Roy+ basis for a trade. Both are expiring assets, but you have to think that Pittsburgh could convince Roy to sign long term at a reasonable cap hit.

The option of having a 3rd center in Roy with the option to play him on the wing/powerplay with Geno or Sid seems like something that could be of interest to the Pens.

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06-22-2012, 08:34 AM
  #623
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
I wonder if there's a possibility of a Staal for Roy+ basis for a trade. Both are expiring assets, but you have to think that Pittsburgh could convince Roy to sign long term at a reasonable cap hit.

The option of having a 3rd center in Roy with the option to play him on the wing/powerplay with Geno or Sid seems like something that could be of interest to the Pens.
Don't see it. I'd imagine they want a good checking line center to play in Staal's spot. That's why Carolina makes even more sense, because I think they'd give up Sutter in such a deal.

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06-22-2012, 08:36 AM
  #624
Jame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heartsabres View Post
I am wondering if Buffalo trades for Staal how much are you willing to sign him for before you let him walk?

6m?
7m?
8m?

Interested to see what Jame would sign him for?


What would the contract look like? Would giving him 8,000,000 handcuff the sabres becoming a winner?
i'd give him 10 million per year for the first 4 years... and then enough years and reductions in salary to make his cap hit less then 6 million... example:

10
10
10
10
6
6
6
4
4
2
1
1

= 12 yrs / 70 million / 5.83 cap hit

pegula bucks

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06-22-2012, 09:32 AM
  #625
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
i'd give him 10 million per year for the first 4 years... and then enough years and reductions in salary to make his cap hit less then 6 million... example:

10
10
10
10
6
6
6
4
4
2
1
1

= 12 yrs / 70 million / 5.83 cap hit

pegula bucks
Just thinking about any of these guys making that much money makes my head spin.

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