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Old
03-03-2012, 08:47 PM
  #1
Esa 10
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CBA News

A couple of interesting bits by Glen Healy on Hot Stove about new CBA.

1. He said that something will be changed about 2nd contracts. He used a direct example of MDZ and McD, saying NYR will not have to give long expensive contracts to the pair.

2. He also said that the feeling is that there will definitely be a rollback on current contracts. Thus, any FA signed this summer (Parise to NYR ) will have their salary reduced by next season.

Perhaps this is why Sather had no qualms going after Nash.

Mods: If you feel like this belongs in a different thread, please move. Thanks.

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03-03-2012, 08:57 PM
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Define rollback ? Does that mean cap hits are re scaled ?

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03-03-2012, 09:01 PM
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If the owners are going to push for rollbacks, we could be looking at another lockout, because I can't see the union agreeing to it again.

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03-03-2012, 09:10 PM
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Rollbacks? Meaning players with current contracts will be getting paycuts? Ouch. Lockout, here we come.

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03-03-2012, 09:19 PM
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Esa 10
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Originally Posted by AlphaQUp View Post
Rollbacks? Meaning players with current contracts will be getting paycuts? Ouch. Lockout, here we come.
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
Define rollback ? Does that mean cap hits are re scaled ?
Exactly. Just like in 2005. Let's say Dubi is making $4m per year. A 25% rollback would make his yearly salary and cap hit $3m.

Healy seemed awfully sure of both rollbacks and change in favor of teams on players' 2nd contracts. I think he used to work for the PA, so he's fairly plugged in on the issues. Lockout? Very possible in my view, just won't be as long as the last one.

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03-03-2012, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Esa 10 View Post
Exactly. Just like in 2005. Let's say Dubi is making $4m per year. A 25% rollback would make his yearly salary and cap hit $3m.

Healy seemed awfully sure of both rollbacks and change in favor of teams on players' 2nd contracts. I think he used to work for the PA, so he's fairly plugged in on the issues. Lockout? Very possible in my view, just won't be as long as the last one.
The salary and cap hit are affected by the rollback?

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03-03-2012, 09:45 PM
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won't the player have the same salary, but just the actual cap hit will be down 25%?

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03-03-2012, 09:46 PM
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Friendly advice, don't waste your time trying to speculate on how this is going to play out because it's next to impossible to do so. Time will tell what happens but I wouldn't lose any sleep over it at this point.

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03-03-2012, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by nyrpassion View Post
won't the player have the same salary, but just the actual cap hit will be down 25%?
yeah, i could see that happening...i dont know if the salaries would ever actually drop.

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03-03-2012, 09:57 PM
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Esa 10
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The salary and cap hit are affected by the rollback?
Yes, that's the whole point of it. Why else would they do it?

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Originally Posted by nyrpassion View Post
won't the player have the same salary, but just the actual cap hit will be down 25%?
No. The owners want the money.

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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
yeah, i could see that happening...i dont know if the salaries would ever actually drop.
Why not??? That's exactly what happened during the last lockout. Player salaries and cap hits were reduced. Why would the owners want a fictional rollback that just affects the cap hit? Why would the players care if was just the cap hit? The owners want more money.

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03-03-2012, 09:58 PM
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A contract is a contract, right? unless they put in there that their salary can be rolled back, but I doubt it. Then again I really have no clue.

Edit: the guy above me is making sense. See, I said I didn't know what I was saying.

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03-03-2012, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Friendly advice, don't waste your time trying to speculate on how this is going to play out because it's next to impossible to do so. Time will tell what happens but I wouldn't lose any sleep over it at this point.
Not only that, but I wouldn't listen too closely to what Healy has to say anyway. He's not a bad guy, but his ability to analyze his sources information has always been suspect. For example, there's pretty much no way MDZ and McD are getting long term, large contracts from the Rangers or anyone else.

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A contract is a contract, right? unless they put in there that their salary can be rolled back, but I doubt it. Then again I really have no clue.
All contracts have to follow the letter of the CBA. If the CBA stipulates that all existing contracts are rolled back, and both parties agree, then all existing contracts are rolled back. It's that simple.

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03-03-2012, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Esa 10 View Post
Why not??? That's exactly what happened during the last lockout. Player salaries and cap hits were reduced. Why would the owners want a fictional rollback that just affects the cap hit? Why would the players care if was just the cap hit? The owners want more money.
Erm... because all future contracts will follow a reduced scale?

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03-03-2012, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Esa 10 View Post
Yes, that's the whole point of it. Why else would they do it?



No. The owners want the money.



Why not??? That's exactly what happened during the last lockout. Player salaries and cap hits were reduced. Why would the owners want a fictional rollback that just affects the cap hit? Why would the players care if was just the cap hit? The owners want more money.

because last time we lost a full season of hockey. I think doing that this time could be disastrous.

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03-03-2012, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Not only that, but I wouldn't listen too closely to what Healy has to say anyway. He's not a bad guy, but his ability to analyze his sources information has always been suspect. For example, there's pretty much no way MDZ and McD are getting long term, large contracts from the Rangers or anyone else.
I wouldn't be so sure about McD. The way he's playing, if he does it again next year, he's in line for a Staal type contract. Maybe more, considering he will be arbitration eligible.

Of course, the rules for arbitration could change in the next CBA and they could negotiate something that keeps 2nd contracts within a certain range like they do with ELCs, but based on the way it works now, I would bet he's getting a long term deal.

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03-03-2012, 10:25 PM
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Erm... because all future contracts will follow a reduced scale?
How does that work? Reduced scale? Do they tell players, ok, I'll give you 4 mil, but there's a 25% rollback, so it's really only 3 mil?

If there are rollbacks, existing contracts will be rolled back, the same as they were in the last CBA. It will have no bearing on future contracts other than that the contract must fit under the new cap.

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03-03-2012, 10:31 PM
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I've never seen nor heard of a rollback that didn't affect current contracts. In sports labor or in the real world. And that's what I do for a living. A rollback is done at the behest of ownership/management because they want more money now. Just altering things on paper doesn't accomplish that.

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03-03-2012, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
How does that work? Reduced scale? Do they tell players, ok, I'll give you 4 mil, but there's a 25% rollback, so it's really only 3 mil?

If there are rollbacks, existing contracts will be rolled back, the same as they were in the last CBA. It will have no bearing on future contracts other than that the contract must fit under the new cap.
I don't think that's necessarily true. The owners could (and should) agree to grandfather the existing contracts in, but make their cap hits lower so that future contracts have to follow a reduced scale.

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03-03-2012, 10:34 PM
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I don't think that's necessarily true. The owners could (and should) agree to grandfather the existing contracts in, but make their cap hits lower so that future contracts have to follow a reduced scale.
They could do that, but I've never in my life seen it happen. Not that I can recall.

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Old
03-04-2012, 12:10 AM
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Please be no lockout (missed games specifically).

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03-04-2012, 12:24 AM
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rollback=no hockey next year

if thats what the owners are aiming for then find different plans for next year cause bettman is shutting down the league for ANOTHER season. cause there is no way the players and don fehr agree to rollbacks without a major fight

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03-04-2012, 01:42 AM
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CM- Nah, a roll back is actually in the PAs interest too.

The NHL and the PA will negotiate about a bag of money (% of HRR) to be given to the players. When that is done, the PA will have a set sum of money to dived among it's members.

If the cap is reduced 10%, the most fair option is to roll back existing contracts. Because if they don't roll back, future FAs will basically pay the new CBA for guys with long contracts.

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03-04-2012, 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted by CM PUNK View Post
rollback=no hockey next year

if thats what the owners are aiming for then find different plans for next year cause bettman is shutting down the league for ANOTHER season. cause there is no way the players and don fehr agree to rollbacks without a major fight
The problem is how can you lower the salary cap without a rollback of salaries? I wish they could just agree to freeze the cap for a couple years and call it a day.

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03-04-2012, 05:42 AM
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The 2nd contract is the major problem with the NHL. Rick Nash was the first player to receive a huge 2nd contract.

The NBA CBA does have a cap of how much salaries can increase. They also have contract length restrictions.

Quote:
The agreement includes a 50-50 split of basketball-related income, a higher luxury tax with progressive tax rates and the retention of a soft salary cap system. The maximum length of player contracts will be five years (previously six) and maximum annual increases in salaries will be 7.5% for teams re-signing their own players and 4.5% for teams signing other teams' free agents.
http://www.nba.com/2011/news/12/08/l...hed/index.html

I read another option is increasing the years in the entry level system. Instead of it being 3 years for 18-21 year olds,2 years for 22-23 year olds and 1 year for 24 year olds,they could increase it by a 1 or 2 years.

They can play around with the average yearly increases. When Tyler Myers goes from entry level money to a $5.5M cap hit. Something is very wrong.

The NHL will want to restrict contract lengths. The NBA had that in its last CBA and they shortened the lengths again in the current CBA.

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03-04-2012, 06:33 AM
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1 . If we talking pay cuts good bye hockey for next year or longer
2. Trading prospects for Nash and going for it might not been a bad idea if no hockey for near future potentially

3. Why would Kreider leave BC to come here
When he could stay in school and play another season and become a free agent the next year and control his own destiny and make whatever he wants as a UFA rather then sign an ELC .
4. This whole thing really sucks . If the owners want more money they should contract some of these bottom feeding small market teams that have no hockey market to begin with .

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