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THN confirms having a shootout is a "done deal" when the NHL returns

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Old
12-13-2004, 03:50 PM
  #26
tomerez
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not good at all.. but it was inevitable, hopefully this cheesy gimmick will blow over quickly enough and the NHL will rid itself of it soon.. get this over with

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12-13-2004, 03:50 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Guys I have nothing against you but why is it that almost everyone is against a shootout?
because it's not hockey. its a warm up.

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12-13-2004, 03:50 PM
  #28
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I'm personally against it... But I'm going to give it a shot. They shouldn't try to change the game too much imo. Anyways, let's see what it gives.

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12-13-2004, 03:50 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seven_Nation_Army
it has nothing to do with the team aspect!!, just cherry pickers
Yeah I get your point but what would you rather have? A tie after watching 65 minute game and see no winner or have an exciting shootout and see a winner?

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12-13-2004, 03:52 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Guys I have nothing against you but why is it that almost everyone is against a shootout?
I'll answer that with the quote supplied in the THN article

Quote:
I think (the shootout) screws fans. Real fans. Fans who know enough about hockey to understand that it is a team game. The NHL is trying to placate that huge group of fans south of the border who don't really understand hockey, but can actually follow a puck in a shootout. It's simple. It gives people more scoring. What's not to love, except for the fact that it flies in the face of the whole team concept of the game. The players' association will love it because it makes the cheesy 'superstars' even more valuable. Now someone may actually want Jaromir Jagr for the stupid sum he gets paid. The shootout is a travesty.

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12-13-2004, 03:53 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Guys I have nothing against you but why is it that almost everyone is against a shootout?
If games are tied going into the third, teams will play extremely conservatively in the 3rd and OT not wanting to risk a loss knowing they have a point in the bank and will take their chances in the shootout to get the bonus point. Therefore we will have extremely boring hockey in the 3rd and OT. Destroying 25 minutes of good hockey in order to have an excitement of a shootout isn't a worthy tradeoff IMO.

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Old
12-13-2004, 03:53 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Yeah I get your point but what would you rather have? A tie after watching 65 minute game and see no winner or have an exciting shootout and see a winner?
What is the problem with ties? It's an 82 game season. I would understand changing the game to ensure that there would be no ties if it were a 5 game season.

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12-13-2004, 03:55 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Guys I have nothing against you but why is it that almost everyone is against a shootout?
Because it changes the fabric of the game. Because it's a gimmick. Because it has no relation to the play in the game itself, which is supposed to decide the result. Instead the game is decided based on one arbitrary skill. Because skilled teams will play for the shootout instead of going for it in overtime. Because I like when two evenly matched teams finish tied, and don't see the need for a definite result. Because it's catering to non-fans while ignoring hard core fans. Because it's a band-aid solution to try and generate excitement, rather than an attempt to increase excitement by improving the flow of the game itself. Because it creates statistical anomalies (ie teams win 3-2 in shootout, but there are only two goalscorers for the winning team). Because it makes getting wins easier, and voids historical statistical comparisons.

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Old
12-13-2004, 03:55 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Guys I have nothing against you but why is it that almost everyone is against a shootout?


my reasons:

1. Its gimmicky...would you like basketball games to end in slam dunk contests, baseball to end in home run derbies? the thing with hockey is that you can TIE, but apparently thats a bad thing.
2. Hockey = team game shootouts = individual...a shootout can totally negate 60 minutes of team play because one player made/missed

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12-13-2004, 03:55 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MS


What a crock of s***. If a game is tied, why don't we just put the two goaltenders in a hot dog eating contest to decide who wins the game? Because that would be just as relevent to the 65 minutes of play beforehand as a shootout.
Exactly.. teams with defensive work ethic will be less effective.. and no more ties? Hmm... don't like it one bit.

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12-13-2004, 03:55 PM
  #36
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Pathetic.

I'm not watching.

Quote:
Hey at least the NHL is making an ATTEMPT (perhaps however feeble) to appeal to a wider audience.
Why would I care if the NHL appeals to a wider audience?

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12-13-2004, 03:56 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MS
Because it changes the fabric of the game. Because it's a gimmick. Because it has no relation to the play in the game itself, which is supposed to decide the result. Instead the game is decided based on one arbitrary skill. Because skilled teams will play for the shootout instead of going for it in overtime. Because I like when two evenly matched teams finish tied, and don't see the need for a definite result. Because it's catering to non-fans while ignoring hard core fans. Because it's a band-aid solution to try and generate excitement, rather than an attempt to increase excitement by improving the flow of the game itself. Because it creates statistical anomalies (ie teams win 3-2 in shootout, but there are only two goalscorers for the winning team). Because it makes getting wins easier, and voids historical statistical comparisons.




^^^^^^^

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12-13-2004, 03:56 PM
  #38
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Yeah but there are teams in the league who just have great goalies so they just go into overtime and sit back and play defense as they're sure they wont lose. This way teams who dont exactly have great talented players to win a shootout will try to score more goals in the third period or break the tie thus leading to more goals scored.

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Old
12-13-2004, 03:59 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomerez
I'll answer that with the quote supplied in the THN article
And as usual, THN does not make much sense.

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:02 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeuceUNO
Its gimmicky...would you like basketball games to end in slam dunk contests, baseball to end in home run derbies? the thing with hockey is that you can TIE, but apparently thats a bad thing.

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:04 PM
  #41
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And I thought just having the lockout was bad enough...

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12-13-2004, 04:07 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by edmontonoilers89
And I thought just having the lockout was bad enough...
a-men ... *grabs the rope and hangs himself*

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:08 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Accord
The Hockey News has confirmed that it's pretty much a done deal that whenever the NHL returns, the shootout will be used to decide games if the 5 minute 4-on-4 OT period failed to produce a winner.
And in related news, the NBA has announced that it will begin deciding tied games with free-throw shooting contests.

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:12 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Guys I have nothing against you but why is it that almost everyone is against a shootout?
HF is a board of followers.

Aslong as its only regular season I have no problem with this. Hopefully they also take the one point away for losing though.

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:13 PM
  #45
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If a shootout is put in then they should change the point system.

Regulation
4 for winning
0 for losing

Overtime
3 for winning
1 for losing

Shootout
2 for win
1 for loss

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:14 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lexicon Devil
Pathetic.

I'm not watching.



Why would I care if the NHL appeals to a wider audience?
Most hardcore hockey fans will watch no matter what.

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12-13-2004, 04:16 PM
  #47
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Am I the only one that doesn't even find shootouts particularly exciting?

Wait
Wait
Wait
Save
Wait
Wait
Wait
Save

Gee. Fun stuff. A regular breakaway is 10 times more exciting than a penalty shot/shootout. A well executed powerplay is 100 times more exciting than a penalty shot/shootout.

I want to throw up every time I hear the penalty shot described as "the most exciting play in hockey". Far from it.

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:17 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrash27
If a shootout is put in then they should change the point system.

Regulation
4 for winning
0 for losing

Overtime
3 for winning
1 for losing

Shootout
2 for win
1 for loss
They should abandon the point system all together and just go by wins and losses.

 
Old
12-13-2004, 04:19 PM
  #49
Vlad The Impaler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MS
Because it changes the fabric of the game. Because it's a gimmick. Because it has no relation to the play in the game itself, which is supposed to decide the result. Instead the game is decided based on one arbitrary skill. Because skilled teams will play for the shootout instead of going for it in overtime. Because I like when two evenly matched teams finish tied, and don't see the need for a definite result. Because it's catering to non-fans while ignoring hard core fans. Because it's a band-aid solution to try and generate excitement, rather than an attempt to increase excitement by improving the flow of the game itself. Because it creates statistical anomalies (ie teams win 3-2 in shootout, but there are only two goalscorers for the winning team). Because it makes getting wins easier, and voids historical statistical comparisons.
Historical statistical comparisons already mean squat.

And here we get to the heart of the problem. All you "purists" do not seem to grasp the fact hockey is *already* a mutated game. It has changed a great deal over time.

Shootouts are not a gimmick. Not anymore than the penalty shot. They've been there for a long time, it's just that the former is not currently used in the NHL.

Shootouts do not catter only to non-fans. Many hardcore fans (of which I am, and I AM a purist and respect the history of the NHL a great deal, not to mention I actually KNOW the history of the NHL unlike those who'd like to think it has always been the way it's being played in 2004) absolutely love the penalty shot.

The penalty shot is just a matter of taste. Some fans do not like it and want to go all high and mighty and PRETEND it's going to be a black eye on this great game when it's not. They'd like to think the NHL has always been this way but it's not the case.

There have been countless changes from equipment to training to techniques to strategies and to yes, rules. Such as penalties, how long they are and when they end.

As for claiming that skilled teams will play for the shootout, I don't know what that means exactly. Certainly not all skilled teams will do it. Certain teams will be advantaged. That's a layer of strategy. Is it different from the way the NHL plays right now.

NO.

Let me repeat: No.

Teams that are coached smartly always try to take advantage of the rules. Any rule in the NHL, any trends as far as calls, non-calls, etc. is taken advantage of. I have no problems with this particular layer of strategy. It's not like it's a gaping hole that will result in very boring games. We're talking about regular season here, not playoffs hockey.

It will affect a very little number of games and statistically, as Epsilon said, it should not result in earth shattering changes in the dynamic of the league.

You're telling me they'll go for a shootout instead of going for overtime... that isn't really accurate. Like all teams, they'll try to finish this off in regulation. Hockey is played safe these days anyway, with or without shootoutsm with or without the current OT format.

It has plenty of relation to the game itself. You've got a guy, with a puck and he tries to score on the goalie. He's not breakdancing on skates for crying out loud. Are we going to freak out when a penalty shot is taken too? Does this have any relation to the game?

Oh, that's right. Nobody minds the penalty shot because you grew up with penalty shots. Right? So it doesn't mess the pseudo-integrity. Sorry, I don't really buy all this stuff.

The statistical anomalies I don't see as a big deal, sorry.

The only thing where I can say you have a point is when you say you like a tie and can deal with a game ending as a tie. A simple matter of preference and nothing to do with the integrity of the game, which will be damn fine with or without this rule.

I completely agree with you that it shouldn't be a band aid however. Yes, I agree they can improve the flow of the game and should do so. That might require just calling the rulebook as it is or perhaps more changes to the game. Personally, I like many of Shanahan's suggestions and feel they would respect the integrity of the game (more than many of Campbells' ideas, like the horrible idea to prevent goalies from handling the puck).

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Old
12-13-2004, 04:19 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsjohn
They should abandon the point system all together and just go by wins and losses.
They should just go by wins.

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