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2012 NHL Draft Thread III (June 22nd-23rd)

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Old
06-18-2012, 10:41 PM
  #876
CBJWennberg41
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If Grigorenko is there, we should package LA's pick + 31+ whatever to get there. Goalies take a long time to develop, and busting a 12th overall pick is more tolerable than busting the #2. The guy has amazing ability and could be every bit as good as Yakupov with right coaching.

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06-18-2012, 10:48 PM
  #877
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By the way, in terms of the goaltender watch from the Final TSN Draft Rankings, here are the goalies in the top 60...

24. Andrei Vasilevski
25. Malcolm Subban
35. Oscar Dansk
54. Matthew Murray

I'd like to see one of these 4 nabbed with one of our 2nd round picks.

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06-18-2012, 11:11 PM
  #878
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Since everyone is stating their preferences, here are mine:

1. Nail Yakupov. I think most of us agree here, but he will likely not be an option for us. Imagine this guy on a line with Ryan Johansen...
2. Alex Galchenyuk. Had he stayed healthy, I truly think he would be the obvious choice - for the Oilers at #1. His injury has once again added to the "CBJ curse", perhaps as much as losing the lottery did... As it stands, he is my pick if Nail Yakupov is gone.
3.Ryan Murray. JFW, usually I agree with you, but here I think you're wrong. Murray is a "safe pick" for exactly the reasons you mentioned; but I think he does have #1 defenseman upside. That being said, he isn't our biggest need.
4. Filip Forsberg. I won't be disappointed if it's Forsberg, but I think we have a real opportunity to hit a homerun with a guy like Galchenyuk, and that is why I think we should swing for the fences. I really like Forsberg's game, but it's clear that he won't be an impact player for at least 3-4 years from now, and by that point, who knows where this team will be?

As it stands, we have to come away with one of these four players at the draft. I think we should carry the Kings pick over until next year; use our own second rounder to secure either a goaltender, or perhaps one of the big defensemen that fall to us (there will be some very good D-men in that range still). The other second round pick, I'd love to see us add another Boone Jenner type working player to our stable - personally, I'm a big fan of Mike Winther, and he should be around with that pick ... with second/third line NHL potential, and an excellent demeanor on and off the ice.

If we can secure another first round pick in a Nash trade, that's excellent - but I'd prefer if it is in the 2013 draft, personally. I don't think we'll be finding game changers in the mid first round (granted, good players, but not the type that will replace a Rick Nash); and we might be able to do so next year.

I shared my mock, there are my preferences. Take them for what they are worth

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06-18-2012, 11:45 PM
  #879
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I guess I'll throw in my 2 cents

1. Galchenyuk. I'm going to go out on a limb (albeit a short one) and say Galchenyuk is the best player to come out of this draft by a long way.
2. Yakupov, tons of talent and a great work ethic. I feel that he is a bit of a risky pick given his game. Relying so much on speed I feel his game is going to be somewhat limited at the pro level. I just don't see him being an offensive dynamo in an offensive set.
3. Murray. The safe pick. Solid all around player that could surprise at just how good he is going to be, however I I'm taking a defenseman I'd rather work a trade for Reinhart or Trouba.
4. Forsberg. Debated about putting him higher, but his offensive upside is still in question. I think he could end up being as good as, if not better, than Yak but his offensive upside is to much of a question mark to take him ahead of Murray or Yakupov.

In all I wouldn't be upset with any of the four, but I think that there is alot of risk in each of the picks. Murray (could end up as a second pairing d-man), Yakupov (speed and dominance could fail to transition to NHL game), Forsberg (could end up lacking top line offensive talent)

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06-19-2012, 12:44 AM
  #880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Since everyone is stating their preferences, here are mine:

1. Nail Yakupov. I think most of us agree here, but he will likely not be an option for us. Imagine this guy on a line with Ryan Johansen...
2. Alex Galchenyuk. Had he stayed healthy, I truly think he would be the obvious choice - for the Oilers at #1. His injury has once again added to the "CBJ curse", perhaps as much as losing the lottery did... As it stands, he is my pick if Nail Yakupov is gone.
3.Ryan Murray. JFW, usually I agree with you, but here I think you're wrong. Murray is a "safe pick" for exactly the reasons you mentioned; but I think he does have #1 defenseman upside. That being said, he isn't our biggest need.
4. Filip Forsberg. I won't be disappointed if it's Forsberg, but I think we have a real opportunity to hit a homerun with a guy like Galchenyuk, and that is why I think we should swing for the fences. I really like Forsberg's game, but it's clear that he won't be an impact player for at least 3-4 years from now, and by that point, who knows where this team will be?

As it stands, we have to come away with one of these four players at the draft. I think we should carry the Kings pick over until next year; use our own second rounder to secure either a goaltender, or perhaps one of the big defensemen that fall to us (there will be some very good D-men in that range still). The other second round pick, I'd love to see us add another Boone Jenner type working player to our stable - personally, I'm a big fan of Mike Winther, and he should be around with that pick ... with second/third line NHL potential, and an excellent demeanor on and off the ice.

If we can secure another first round pick in a Nash trade, that's excellent - but I'd prefer if it is in the 2013 draft, personally. I don't think we'll be finding game changers in the mid first round (granted, good players, but not the type that will replace a Rick Nash); and we might be able to do so next year.

I shared my mock, there are my preferences. Take them for what they are worth
How does Winther compare to Scott Kosmachuk?

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Old
06-19-2012, 12:46 AM
  #881
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fro View Post
i agree...but I feel the same for Galy as you do for Murray...but I agree about Murray, I just think with this team never having a legit #1C, while we do have 2 solid top line defensemen, we take the offensive threat that could MAYBE step in this year...
The main issue and error that will haunt Howson in the coming years is that the CBJ are set on defense with MFJJ and Wis.....

The problem is that niether are great defenseman, they are ok but you will soon see their true value is the PP and offense, not preventing goals.

The CBJ defense is improved but hardly playoff ready if true defense is the subject, the Jackets need guys to help the goalie, they need Murray type players for the future.

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06-19-2012, 01:08 AM
  #882
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My preferences are:
1. Nail Yakupov. If he's there, Columbus really needs to take him. Whether or not Galchenyuk is better is unknown, but you can pretty much guarantee you are getting a top line winger in Yakupov.

2. Alex Galchenyuk. He's not some mercurial russian. Instead, he's a decent sized center with great hands and excellent hockey smarts. He can score just as well as he can make plays. His year off may have hurt his stock, but I don't think it hurt his development very much. He's a hard worker and is the one I hope we pick if Yakupov is gone.

3. Ryan Murray. Sure he may not have the upside that Griffin Reinhart or Matthew Dumba has, but he's idiot proof and the Jackets have their fair share. Has future captain potential and can step in as early as next year.

4. Filip Forsberg. If we take Forsberg, I want it to be because he is seen as being the SECOND BEST PLAYER in the draft. Not because he's a winger, not because he'll be there at 5th. You don't hear about Burke slavering over Forsberg like he is with Galchenyuk. I'll be damned if Howson and our team of scouts is smarter than any of the other teams out there. If Forsberg is there at #4 or #5, it is because he's not the second best player in the draft. As someone said previously, we need a dime as opposed to two nickels. Use the #2 overall pick on who you think is the 2nd best player available after Yakupov. Don't settle for something like Schenn + 5th.


Last edited by Crede777: 06-19-2012 at 01:15 AM.
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06-19-2012, 01:27 AM
  #883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
How does Winther compare to Scott Kosmachuk?
I prefer Mike Winther, but it's really more a matter of preference than anything. With the lack of talented wings in this draft, I think it's entirely possible that Kosmachuk goes 5-10 spots ahead of Winther, but I don't think that has anything to do with skill level. What I love about Winther is that he has all of the tangibles, including an unparalleled work ethic. He plays center, but can play on the wing if he has to. With Kosmachuk, you're getting more of an up and down type player, a guy who drives the net and plays a more physical game than Winther.

Style comparison for Winther would have to be Brandon Dubinsky. For me, I see some obvious similarities in their games ... whether or not Winther ever gets to that level is debatable, though. For Kosmachuk, think more along the lines of Scottie Upshall ... a mid-sized winger with grit. Again, skillset comparison, not upside comparison.

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06-19-2012, 04:06 AM
  #884
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Leafs fan here, coming in peace.

First of all, absolutely brutal luck with Edmonton winning the draft lottery. I felt for you guys, truly.

So is the general consensus among your fanbase that you want to pick a forward with the #2 pick? It seems like the natural thing to do to try and find a new franchise forward with Nash on his way out. I've read that Howson and other CBJ management are enamoured with Forsberg.

Lastly, would you have any appetite for moving back to #5 in a swap with the Leafs? #35 and possibly a B-level prospect would likely be coming your way.


Last edited by Duke Silver: 06-19-2012 at 04:23 AM.
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06-19-2012, 06:49 AM
  #885
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Originally Posted by Duke Silver View Post
Leafs fan here, coming in peace.

First of all, absolutely brutal luck with Edmonton winning the draft lottery. I felt for you guys, truly.

So is the general consensus among your fanbase that you want to pick a forward with the #2 pick? It seems like the natural thing to do to try and find a new franchise forward with Nash on his way out. I've read that Howson and other CBJ management are enamoured with Forsberg.

Lastly, would you have any appetite for moving back to #5 in a swap with the Leafs? #35 and possibly a B-level prospect would likely be coming your way.
In the mock draft this fanbase (HF) picked Murray with 48% of the vote to around 30 for Galchenyuk. Today, if the vote was re-taken I' guess it would be closer between the two. Of Yak falls he'd win in a landslide (I think).

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06-19-2012, 06:54 AM
  #886
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My preferences are:

1. Nail Yakupov
2. Griffin Reinhart
3. Alex Galchenyuk
4. Matt Dumba
5. Andrei Vasilyevski (in the second round of course)

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Old
06-19-2012, 07:00 AM
  #887
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Originally Posted by CBJBrassard16 View Post
If Grigorenko is there, we should package LA's pick + 31+ whatever to get there. Goalies take a long time to develop, and busting a 12th overall pick is more tolerable than busting the #2. The guy has amazing ability and could be every bit as good as Yakupov with right coaching.

I agree-he is a risk but at that level he'd be attractive. That being said, I don't think he gets past #5. I think those TSN rankings were influenced a bunch by Button's rankings which are totally out of line with every other consensus ranking.

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06-19-2012, 08:03 AM
  #888
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
I agree-he is a risk but at that level he'd be attractive. That being said, I don't think he gets past #5. I think those TSN rankings were influenced a bunch by Button's rankings which are totally out of line with every other consensus ranking.
No, they survey 10 NHL scouts and use those results to make the list. It's not an average of the different rankings where Button's would pull the average down.

It's not a mock draft, so it doesn't take into account team needs. But, it's done a decent job of predicting relative order the last couple of years.

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06-19-2012, 08:23 AM
  #889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Since everyone is stating their preferences, here are mine:

1. Nail Yakupov. I think most of us agree here, but he will likely not be an option for us. Imagine this guy on a line with Ryan Johansen...
2. Alex Galchenyuk. Had he stayed healthy, I truly think he would be the obvious choice - for the Oilers at #1. His injury has once again added to the "CBJ curse", perhaps as much as losing the lottery did... As it stands, he is my pick if Nail Yakupov is gone.
3.Ryan Murray. JFW, usually I agree with you, but here I think you're wrong. Murray is a "safe pick" for exactly the reasons you mentioned; but I think he does have #1 defenseman upside. That being said, he isn't our biggest need.
4. Filip Forsberg. I won't be disappointed if it's Forsberg, but I think we have a real opportunity to hit a homerun with a guy like Galchenyuk, and that is why I think we should swing for the fences. I really like Forsberg's game, but it's clear that he won't be an impact player for at least 3-4 years from now, and by that point, who knows where this team will be?
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphafox View Post
I guess I'll throw in my 2 cents

1. Galchenyuk. I'm going to go out on a limb (albeit a short one) and say Galchenyuk is the best player to come out of this draft by a long way.
2. Yakupov, tons of talent and a great work ethic. I feel that he is a bit of a risky pick given his game. Relying so much on speed I feel his game is going to be somewhat limited at the pro level. I just don't see him being an offensive dynamo in an offensive set.
3. Murray. The safe pick. Solid all around player that could surprise at just how good he is going to be, however I I'm taking a defenseman I'd rather work a trade for Reinhart or Trouba.
4. Forsberg. Debated about putting him higher, but his offensive upside is still in question. I think he could end up being as good as, if not better, than Yak but his offensive upside is to much of a question mark to take him ahead of Murray or Yakupov.

In all I wouldn't be upset with any of the four, but I think that there is alot of risk in each of the picks. Murray (could end up as a second pairing d-man), Yakupov (speed and dominance could fail to transition to NHL game), Forsberg (could end up lacking top line offensive talent)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
My preferences are:
1. Nail Yakupov. If he's there, Columbus really needs to take him. Whether or not Galchenyuk is better is unknown, but you can pretty much guarantee you are getting a top line winger in Yakupov.

2. Alex Galchenyuk. He's not some mercurial russian. Instead, he's a decent sized center with great hands and excellent hockey smarts. He can score just as well as he can make plays. His year off may have hurt his stock, but I don't think it hurt his development very much. He's a hard worker and is the one I hope we pick if Yakupov is gone.

3. Ryan Murray. Sure he may not have the upside that Griffin Reinhart or Matthew Dumba has, but he's idiot proof and the Jackets have their fair share. Has future captain potential and can step in as early as next year.

4. Filip Forsberg. If we take Forsberg, I want it to be because he is seen as being the SECOND BEST PLAYER in the draft. Not because he's a winger, not because he'll be there at 5th. You don't hear about Burke slavering over Forsberg like he is with Galchenyuk. I'll be damned if Howson and our team of scouts is smarter than any of the other teams out there. If Forsberg is there at #4 or #5, it is because he's not the second best player in the draft. As someone said previously, we need a dime as opposed to two nickels. Use the #2 overall pick on who you think is the 2nd best player available after Yakupov. Don't settle for something like Schenn + 5th.
Yep.

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Old
06-19-2012, 08:27 AM
  #890
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
My preferences are:
1. Nail Yakupov. If he's there, Columbus really needs to take him. Whether or not Galchenyuk is better is unknown, but you can pretty much guarantee you are getting a top line winger in Yakupov.

2. Alex Galchenyuk. He's not some mercurial russian. Instead, he's a decent sized center with great hands and excellent hockey smarts. He can score just as well as he can make plays. His year off may have hurt his stock, but I don't think it hurt his development very much. He's a hard worker and is the one I hope we pick if Yakupov is gone.

3. Ryan Murray. Sure he may not have the upside that Griffin Reinhart or Matthew Dumba has, but he's idiot proof and the Jackets have their fair share. Has future captain potential and can step in as early as next year.

4. Filip Forsberg. If we take Forsberg, I want it to be because he is seen as being the SECOND BEST PLAYER in the draft. Not because he's a winger, not because he'll be there at 5th. You don't hear about Burke slavering over Forsberg like he is with Galchenyuk. I'll be damned if Howson and our team of scouts is smarter than any of the other teams out there. If Forsberg is there at #4 or #5, it is because he's not the second best player in the draft. As someone said previously, we need a dime as opposed to two nickels. Use the #2 overall pick on who you think is the 2nd best player available after Yakupov. Don't settle for something like Schenn + 5th.
Agreed, on it all....

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06-19-2012, 08:44 AM
  #891
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Dispatch article on Murray from this morning below. I'm sure most here have read this by now, but thought I would share regardless for those who haven't.

Quote:
TORONTO — It’s one thing to hear an NHL general manager or scout describe defenseman Ryan Murray as “NHL-ready” or “polished.” But there was irrefutable proof in April, when Murray was asked to play for Team Canada at the world championships.

Canada sends established NHL players — grown men — to the world championships, not players plucked out of the junior ranks. Murray, 18, was the first player since Paul Kariya in 1993 to play for Canada at the worlds before getting drafted by an NHL club.

“That sends a huge message to the hockey world about where this kid’s game is,” Blue Jackets general manager Scott Howson said.
Link: http://www.bluejacketsxtra.com/conte...y-for-nhl.html

Good grief, I can't wait for the draft! I'm like a kid on Christmas Eve. Silly? Yes! But that's just how I feel. Anyone else giddy about the draft this weekend?

Ok, you can all make fun of me now.

MOD EDIT: please don't quote entire articles, just quote a relevant portion and link to the entire article.


Last edited by SuperGenius: 06-19-2012 at 10:30 AM.
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06-19-2012, 09:01 AM
  #892
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Well, the offseasons have generally been more exciting than the seasons around here. And this one is shaping up to be the biggest one ever for this organization.... Its certainly the most important from a ton of different angles.


So far:

We've resigned depth and bottom tier players, let some depth in certain areas walk, interviewed a hands down respected NHL executive in a search to (hopefully) shake up the management structure and, essentially, punted on a new coach.....

We still have bullets to fire, including the biggest one in team history (Nash) and maybe even the second biggest one in team history (the 2nd overall). We need three goaltenders by my count and we still need another solid player that can play down the middle next season because going into next season with Brassard as the #1 will be a epic fail.


Last edited by KeithBWhittington: 06-19-2012 at 09:13 AM.
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06-19-2012, 09:52 AM
  #893
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ernmorris View Post
Dispatch article on Murray from this morning below. I'm sure most here have read this by now, but thought I would share regardless for those who haven't.


Link: http://www.bluejacketsxtra.com/conte...y-for-nhl.html

Good grief, I can't wait for the draft! I'm like a kid on Christmas Eve. Silly? Yes! But that's just how I feel. Anyone else giddy about the draft this weekend?

Ok, you can all make fun of me now.
I may be mistaken, but I don't think you're permitted to post entire articles from the paper. You might wish to edit it down to highlights and then provide the link.

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06-19-2012, 09:57 AM
  #894
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The Coach's v3.0 mock draft

http://www.theunionblue.com/2012/06/...3-0/#more-1697

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06-19-2012, 10:27 AM
  #895
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My preferences for the draft:

1. Galchenyuk - I don't think you can ever have enough top line center potential (certainly additional top 6 centers for options). This kid is powerful, dedicated/hard working, great vision, two way player with offensive instincts. Sounds like the full package without the flair or flat out speed of Yakupov.

2. Yakupov - Offensively gifted with speed to burn. Any comparison to Bure excites me except he appears to have more guts to go in high traffic areas and lay the body. It's this area that concerns me. He isn't a big guy (I'm not sure small is accurate either) and if you play that type of game I would be concerned he's not long for high level in the NHL. Can't deny his skill, drive, speed or desire to win.

3. Murray - We may have a fairly deep defense and pipeline, however, I think Murray would move ahead of all of our "young" depth and could easily be playing alongside JMFJ within 2-3 years on the top pair. Kid can skate, has amazing poise, very sound defensive game, some offensive upside and intangibles that every team wants. I want winners and this kid gets it. I prefer the offensive flair with the first pick but have absolutely no problem with Murray

4. Forsberg - Youngest of the top 4 by a good margin and already has a decent frame. I've seen his skating as a plus and a minus which tells me it's unorthodox and COULD be a problem in the NHL (probably not though). Appears to have the ability to play C or W and can hold the puck. isn't sublime but has excellent offensive instincts yet plays a sound 2-way game (from what little I have seen). Appears to have a great attitude and willing to learn. More picked on POTENTIAL than the others which scares me as a CBJ fan but sounds like he has the goods. Definitely a longer term project.

5. Morgan Reilly - could be the best transition player in the draft. Sublime skater, with speed, shiftiness and great hockey sense. better size than I thought and could turn out to be the best d-man in the draft. not physical but not completely shy either. Needs work in own zone and coming off significant injury. I don't take him at #2 but would at #8 when we get Carolina's pick

6. Griffin Reinhart - Size, skill, skating... has a full package but needs to put it all together. Not flashy but will put up points and got more physical as the season went along. He's my sleeper in this draft. Again, I take him at #8...

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06-19-2012, 10:29 AM
  #896
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sore Loser View Post
Since everyone is stating their preferences, here are mine:

1. Nail Yakupov. I think most of us agree here, but he will likely not be an option for us. Imagine this guy on a line with Ryan Johansen...
2. Alex Galchenyuk. Had he stayed healthy, I truly think he would be the obvious choice - for the Oilers at #1. His injury has once again added to the "CBJ curse", perhaps as much as losing the lottery did... As it stands, he is my pick if Nail Yakupov is gone.
3.Ryan Murray. JFW, usually I agree with you, but here I think you're wrong. Murray is a "safe pick" for exactly the reasons you mentioned; but I think he does have #1 defenseman upside. That being said, he isn't our biggest need.
4. Filip Forsberg. I won't be disappointed if it's Forsberg, but I think we have a real opportunity to hit a homerun with a guy like Galchenyuk, and that is why I think we should swing for the fences. I really like Forsberg's game, but it's clear that he won't be an impact player for at least 3-4 years from now, and by that point, who knows where this team will be?

I agree pretty much 100%. Your logic on Murray is spot on.

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06-19-2012, 10:30 AM
  #897
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
The main issue and error that will haunt Howson in the coming years is that the CBJ are set on defense with MFJJ and Wis.....

The problem is that niether are great defenseman, they are ok but you will soon see their true value is the PP and offense, not preventing goals.

The CBJ defense is improved but hardly playoff ready if true defense is the subject, the Jackets need guys to help the goalie, they need Murray type players for the future.
How do you feel about Savard and Moore?

I feel like we have the best blue line prospects we've ever had currently in the system, on top of the best 3 pairings on the ice we've ever had. I would give this defensive unit (JJ,Wiz,Tyutin,Nik,Methot,Lebda,Moore,Savard,Ruth, Regner) a solid B grade, while our goaltending (D) and skaters (D without Nash, C with Nash) are severly lacking.

I prefer a straightforward approach: draft to your needs, current then future. Our needs are best filled by Yakupov, Galchenyuk, Forsberg, and Grigorenko, in that order imo.


Last edited by Nordique: 06-19-2012 at 10:46 AM.
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06-19-2012, 10:42 AM
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Not gonna lie, I'd be really happy with that draft. Galchenyuk, Frk, and Dansk...

On a side note where would you guys consider taking Grigorenko? I know some want to take him #1 overall and some think he's to risky for much more than a late first rounder. Would you guys be willing to trade up to get him if he falls? How far would he have to fall?

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06-19-2012, 10:45 AM
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Galchenyk, Frk, and Dansk I could see happening, coupled with a SJ trade that brings Niemi and other minor pieces here for Nash.

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06-19-2012, 11:01 AM
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How do you feel about Savard and Moore?

I feel like we have the best blue line prospects we've ever had currently in the system, on top of the best 3 pairings on the ice we've ever had. I would give this defensive unit (JJ,Wiz,Tyutin,Nik,Methot,Lebda,Moore,Savard,Ruth, Regner) a solid B grade, while our goaltending (D) and skaters (D without Nash, C with Nash) are severly lacking.

I prefer a straightforward approach: draft to your needs, current then future. Our needs are best filled by Yakupov, Galchenyuk, Forsberg, and Grigorenko, in that order imo.
I don't know about Robert, but I feel Savard and Moore are question marks at this point. It isn't clear to me that Savard will ever be good enough in his zone to become anything more than a bottom pairing player. Moore clearly struggled as the season progressed last year. So to just assume the cupboard is full and we can close up shop is misguided.

The only guy in our entire system that I personally think of as a true top pairing defenseman is Johnson. That said, he and Wiz had good chemistry last season and I'm hoping that they continue to work as a pair. However, that wouldn't keep me from drafting a Murray or a Reinhart (depending on trades within the draft). Nashville has done a pretty good job by always having defensive prospects knowing that they can always trade them for forwards if they need to. Finding later that you have to trade for defense is not a good position to be in.

I wouldn't touch Grigorenko with a 10 foot poll, I don't care how much skill he has.

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