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Let's be optimistic a little bit...

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Old
12-16-2004, 10:29 AM
  #1
ChemiseBleuHonnete
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Let's be optimistic a little bit...

I always thought that there'll be a season. No matter how far the nhlpa and the nhl seem to be at this point. Honestly I was really dissapointed after the nhl counter-offer. The players looked so angry and the ditch separating both sides never looked bigger.

Now, think about it for a second. There's no way in hell that there won't be a season. The players aren't stupid, and they want to play. I read this morning that they want to play for what they call the right causes. They want to play for charity events and they're glad to do it for free. It's obvious that they're not doing it to help improve their image. The players were so proud of what they did with la caravane. I think that many of them are playing for money, it's what happens when you're paid that much. But they still love the game.

This lock-out is so stupid. Everyone knows that there'll be an agreement down the road. Why don't they reach to an agreement right now? It will be the same cba if it's signed today or in a year. The only thing that changes if it's signed in a year instead of today, is all the money that they'll lost. The teams won't have any revenue for a while and the players won't get paid. It will be all lost and it will have zero impact on the next CBA. The players aren't stupid, nor the owners (a 40 games season = you pay half of the player's salary, nice heh? cause the players don't get paid to play in the playoffs! shortened season + playoffs = very lucrative for the owners). They will reach to an agreement, there's no doubt about it. Both sides have too much too lose. Don't forget that the players love the game and the owners are the fans with the deepest wallets.

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12-16-2004, 10:38 AM
  #2
romain_jaime
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Actually, the players are in a better situation then owners... They have been locked out which means they can go off and find another job while they wait for a new CBA.

Hence the huge influx of players heading to Europe. You're enthusiasm is fantastic however, it's miss guided.

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12-16-2004, 10:40 AM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ax˛+bx+c
I always thought that there'll be a season. No matter how far the nhlpa and the nhl seem to be at this point. Honestly I was really dissapointed after the nhl counter-offer. The players looked so angry and the ditch separating both sides never looked bigger.

Now, think about it for a second. There's no way in hell that there won't be a season. The players aren't stupid, and they want to play. I read this morning that they want to play for what they call the right causes. They want to play for charity events and they're glad to do it for free. It's obvious that they're not doing it to help improve their image. The players were so proud of what they did with la caravane. I think that many of them are playing for money, it's what happens when you're paid that much. But they still love the game.

This lock-out is so stupid. Everyone knows that there'll be an agreement down the road. Why don't they reach to an agreement right now? It will be the same cba if it's signed today or in a year. The only thing that changes if it's signed in a year instead of today, is all the money that they'll lost. The teams won't have any revenue for a while and the players won't get paid. It will be all lost and it will have zero impact on the next CBA. The players aren't stupid, nor the owners (a 40 games season = you pay half of the player's salary, nice heh? cause the players don't get paid to play in the playoffs! shortened season + playoffs = very lucrative for the owners). They will reach to an agreement, there's no doubt about it. Both sides have too much too lose. Don't forget that the players love the game and the owners are the fans with the deepest wallets.
Thank you, it's what i've said all along, there's way too much to be lost, there's no way the NHL will be the only professional sports league to not have a regular season and have a champion crowned, it can't happen, the NHL is already a league with a low profile, they wouldn't risk that, however, like you said, each side will push each other to the limit to show that they mean business, and to try to acquire as much as they can, neither side wants to lose leverage, this is the art of negotiation, this will be resolved, we'll have a shortened season, I have no doubt...

There was a good article from Bill Clement on ESPN who basically says the same thing, the sides are much closer than most think, they're close in terms of numbers, it's the philosophy or the idealogy that differs right now...either way

I don't understand why having a salary cap would be so horrible for the players, because having a cap would enable the league and the players to share revenue, and it seems the players forget the all important fact that as the league implements cost certainty, it's revenue will increase, thus there will be more money to share, and whatever the cap value is, it will increase every year the revenue increases, so to me, it's a win/win situation, as long as they can agree on reasonable figures for both sides

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12-16-2004, 10:42 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romain_jaime
Actually, the players are in a better situation then owners... They have been locked out which means they can go off and find another job while they wait for a new CBA.

Hence the huge influx of players heading to Europe. You're enthusiasm is fantastic however, it's miss guided.
Please, you think playing in Europe is what these players want to do, or that they would do that permanantely?

They have families, lives in North America, playing in Europe for a few months is fun, it's like a vacation, but playing on the road in the NHL is hard enough for some players, imagine playing halfway across the world, right now playing in Europe is paying the bills, nothing else!



it's the owners that are in the drivers seat, and the players know it

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12-16-2004, 10:45 AM
  #5
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I agree, but I was merely replaying to his comment saying that the players are not being paid.

I truly believe that the season is lost and nothing that anyone says will change my opinion on that one.

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12-16-2004, 11:19 AM
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I find it insulting to my intelligence when Mr. Domi says the 35 % salary rollback is insulting to the players, after all, they voluntarily offered 24 %.

Taxes, which are designed by geovernment tax the richest most, the players want the NHL to rollback the salary of those who earn the least? That's insulting.

Edit: Perhaps I should clairify, it is generally agreed upon by Western society that the richest should pay the most tax, Mr. Domi's comments are therefore, counter-intuitive.


Last edited by Habbadasher: 12-16-2004 at 11:38 AM.
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12-16-2004, 12:01 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Machiavelli
I find it insulting to my intelligence when Mr. Domi says the 35 % salary rollback is insulting to the players, after all, they voluntarily offered 24 %.

Taxes, which are designed by geovernment tax the richest most, the players want the NHL to rollback the salary of those who earn the least? That's insulting.

Edit: Perhaps I should clairify, it is generally agreed upon by Western society that the richest should pay the most tax, Mr. Domi's comments are therefore, counter-intuitive.
Seeing that you're from Canada (as I am), you have to realise that that way of thinking is genrally very well accepted HERE, bu tin the US it's a different sroty. Some americans, way more of them thant canadians, prefer a standard tax rate. It's called capitalism at it's finest: the richest want to be richer, while they don't give a crap about if their neighbor's kids have any sort of health insurance.

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12-16-2004, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romain_jaime
Actually, the players are in a better situation then owners... They have been locked out which means they can go off and find another job while they wait for a new CBA.

Hence the huge influx of players heading to Europe. You're enthusiasm is fantastic however, it's miss guided.
I dont think the players are in a better situation at all. The team owners are already loaded and own other companies and such. I dont think many of the owners are really seeing a big difference in their pocket from this lockout. Some of them are even saving money.

Players on the other hand probably dont want to play in Europe for too too long. Like 417 said, their homes and families are in America. And the money they get paid in Europe doesn't even compare to the money they made here.

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12-16-2004, 03:20 PM
  #9
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I'm starting to be sick to hear the argument that the lockout is so bad for hockey in USA (or even in Canada).

I'm a baseball fan and I read everything about it anytime. You know what? Hockey never received as much publicity as right now. Every reporter in every sport is talking about the NHL's lockout almost every week. People who never heard about hockey are starting to hear or read about it, even if they don't want to. Same in Canada. The NHL's lockout is now a regular news and therefore, people who don't care about hockey are now stuck with it everyday.

And can you imagine all the publicity that will occure once the conflict is resolved? Every player will be smiling and giving things to community, like they did in baseball after their lockout, and they will be talking about how it is good that now, their team has a fair chance of winning the cup. Same for the owners. I bet a lot of people in USA will suddenly want to watch their first hockey game...

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12-16-2004, 03:30 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Machiavelli
I find it insulting to my intelligence when Mr. Domi says the 35 % salary rollback is insulting to the players, after all, they voluntarily offered 24 %.

Taxes, which are designed by geovernment tax the richest most, the players want the NHL to rollback the salary of those who earn the least? That's insulting.

Edit: Perhaps I should clairify, it is generally agreed upon by Western society that the richest should pay the most tax, Mr. Domi's comments are therefore, counter-intuitive.
No offence to Domi, but he is none other than a fighter for his team because of his stockyness and agressiveness. That is why he is in the NHL. He is the last person that should be ranting about how his buddies are mad at the counter-offer. Sorry Domi, but last time I checked, Federov, Sundin and Brodeur could speak for themselves.

To LePoche69:

I agree with some things you are saying but in many places in the US that aren't hockey based, you will not see any sort of reference to the Lockout in the media.

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12-16-2004, 03:30 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LePoche69
I'm starting to be sick to hear the argument that the lockout is so bad for hockey in USA (or even in Canada).

I'm a baseball fan and I read everything about it anytime. You know what? Hockey never received as much publicity as right now. Every reporter in every sport is talking about the NHL's lockout almost every week. People who never heard about hockey are starting to hear or read about it, even if they don't want to. Same in Canada. The NHL's lockout is now a regular news and therefore, people who don't care about hockey are now stuck with it everyday.

And can you imagine all the publicity that will occure once the conflict is resolved? Every player will be smiling and giving things to community, like they did in baseball after their lockout, and they will be talking about how it is good that now, their team has a fair chance of winning the cup. Same for the owners. I bet a lot of people in USA will suddenly want to watch their first hockey game...
Nobody cares about the lockout in the US...it's more of a "ohh By the way, the NHL is still shutdown"

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12-16-2004, 03:32 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 TO MTL
Nobody cares about the lockout in the US...it's more of a "ohh By the way, the NHL is still shutdown"
That's pretty much it right there. The reality is that only the cities who are known for hockey are talking about it but it is hard to find Lockout talk anywhere else.

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12-16-2004, 03:39 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brisson11
That's pretty much it right there. The reality is that only the cities who are known for hockey are talking about it but it is hard to find Lockout talk anywhere else.
Even in "hockey cities" like Detroit, New York, Minnesota, Philly, they have other sports teams whom they're devoting more time to, they don't care about the lockout in the states, We get the Detroit feed here on channel 36 fox, and when it's sports, they talk about the Pistons, who the Tigers might sign this offseason, and a whole lot of talk about the Detroit Lions, once in a while they'll interview some Wings players who gives a quick soundbyte and that's it, unlike Canada, cities often have other sports to watch if there's no hockey, NBA, NFL, MLB, Nascar, College football and basketball, arena football, golf, etc.

When in Canada, if you take away hockey, what are you left with, the CFL?? The Toronto Raptors, is all there is on a national level that can draw interest, there's no more Expos...

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12-16-2004, 03:40 PM
  #14
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I strongly disagree with you when you said hockey is receiving more publicity right now.

Yes, there's is good media reports about the lockout and we heard a lot about it. But in my opinion, the media give in Canada about 1/2 of the usual time allow for hockey and it goes to 1/3 in USA, maybe even less.

Add to that all you can heard is about money and problems compared to the usual best plays, game reports, etc...

It's bad, especially with the Americans medias which are the most potential income of any sports industry. I'm sorry but thinking this lockout is good because americans heard about hockey is way out of mind but i understand your logic.

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12-16-2004, 08:39 PM
  #15
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My point is that even in strickly football or basketball cities, people do read Sports Illustrated or Baseball Weekly, or any other pro sport publication. While most of these publications don't give a crap about Hockey, they do talk about it right now in their articles, even if it's to make a joke. So when the lockout will end, all those reader will know it, in a bigger way than if NHL would acually be playing.

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12-16-2004, 08:43 PM
  #16
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...just today, I read two american articles (in no way related to hockey or NHL or any other sports) where the authors are talking about the NHL's lockout, at least making references to it.

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