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The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

no owner should take home more than the single highest paid player.

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Old
12-18-2004, 09:09 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by DementedReality
this is the sound of the point going over most of your heads.

and what i earn and do is not relative. my employer doesnt ask me to tie my salary to the company revenue nor am i limited in asking for what i think is fair market value for my services.

dr
Wow, second dumbest thing you have said in this thread. You don't think your alary is tied to the revenues of the company where you work? I'd like to know where that is and if they are hiring? Every company budgets and that budget is approved once it is measured against the projected earnings for the year and works within the structures placed on that company by ownership or the board of directors. Go ask your HR manager what the manpower budget is for the year and they will tell you exactly what percentage of the projected earnings they get to play with. Every position is budgetted and if a position is not that position must be approved at the executive level. Please tell me which Calgary company you work for that does not follow that principle and who the CEO is. I think we'll be able to call bull on you very quickly.

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Old
12-18-2004, 09:25 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by hockeytown9321
I wouldn't be so sure they're all behind him. All he needs is 8 to agree with him. If I'm Ed Snider, of course I'm going to support Bettman publically. I have no vote as long as the Carolina's and Nashville's have a disporportionate amount of power, so why should I risk being fined $1 million?

the owners voted that provission in so they get what they want....

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12-18-2004, 09:53 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by The Iconoclast
Wow, second dumbest thing you have said in this thread. You don't think your alary is tied to the revenues of the company where you work?
I can't speak for DR but I would assume that he gets paid what other people in his profession make. In other words he gets paid the market rate. He doesn't see his base salary calculated as a percentage of his employer's revenues.

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Every company budgets and that budget is approved once it is measured against the projected earnings for the year and works within the structures placed on that company by ownership or the board of directors.
And that is different from the NHL during the past 10 years how?

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12-18-2004, 10:06 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by BlackRedGold
I can't speak for DR but I would assume that he gets paid what other people in his profession make. In other words he gets paid the market rate. He doesn't see his base salary calculated as a percentage of his employer's revenues.
So you're saying that because he works in a given "profession" that his salary is not subject to basic accounting procedures that affect every single business in the world? I'll ask again, what "profession" is this? Every "profession", no matter what it is, is subject to budgetary controls and approval of the directors of the business. Unless you are self employed you are subject to someone's budget and how your salary works into that budget. Even consultants are subject to budget controls and approval for purchase of their services. I'm curious what type of job you think does not have to meet some sort of budgetary approval, especially one where "market rate" supercedes what a company is willing or capable of paying.

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And that is different from the NHL during the past 10 years how?
The players association has been able to supercede the budget through the mechanism of arbitration and forces of hold outs. You don't get that luxury in the real world.

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12-18-2004, 11:06 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Iconoclast
Every company budgets and that budget is approved once it is measured against the projected earnings for the year and works within the structures placed on that company by ownership or the board of directors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackRedGold
And that is different from the NHL during the past 10 years how?

exactly .. why do the pro cappers think the NHL owners deserve to operate differently ? i mean, isnt it enough they own the player from the time they turn 18 ?

dr

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12-18-2004, 11:10 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by The Iconoclast
So you're saying that because he works in a given "profession" that his salary is not subject to basic accounting procedures that affect every single business in the world? I'll ask again, what "profession" is this? Every "profession", no matter what it is, is subject to budgetary controls and approval of the directors of the business. Unless you are self employed you are subject to someone's budget and how your salary works into that budget. Even consultants are subject to budget controls and approval for purchase of their services. I'm curious what type of job you think does not have to meet some sort of budgetary approval, especially one where "market rate" supercedes what a company is willing or capable of paying.

.
who said that my compensation isnt budgeted for ? who is suggesting the NHL owners not set a budget ?

i am at the level that sets budgets and approves compensation and what we pay our employees is not tied to our revenue. It is however RELATIVE to the revenue, and no one is suggesting it shouldnt be.

dr

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12-18-2004, 11:11 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by The Iconoclast
The players association has been able to supercede the budget through the mechanism of arbitration and forces of hold outs. You don't get that luxury in the real world.
you dont if you are dime a dozen at what you do. if you are of an elite level, you get many mechanisms that the average clerk doesnt.

dr

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12-18-2004, 11:11 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DementedReality
exactly .. why do the pro cappers think the NHL owners deserve to operate differently ? i mean, isnt it enough they own the player from the time they turn 18 ?

dr
They don't own the player dude. They own his "rights" to play in their league under certain laws and restrictions. The player is free to go and play in another league if he wishes. Just as you are free to go to another job if you wish.

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12-18-2004, 11:18 PM
  #59
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Am I the only one who thinks this smells like coummunism as unintentional as it may be?

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12-18-2004, 11:27 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DementedReality
i am at the level that sets budgets and approves compensation and what we pay our employees is not tied to our revenue.

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12-18-2004, 11:35 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by jacketracket


should i care if you dont believe me ? there are a number of posters at HF who know me and if they come into this thread, they can back me up. otherwise, i wont lose sleep.

dr

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12-18-2004, 11:41 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by DementedReality


should i care if you dont believe me ? there are a number of posters at HF who know me and if they come into this thread, they can back me up. otherwise, i wont lose sleep.

dr
No, you shouldn't .... and I don't.

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12-19-2004, 12:18 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by jacketracket
No, you shouldn't .... and I don't.
so what was your point ?

can we get back to the discussion at hand ?

dr

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Old
12-19-2004, 12:39 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by DementedReality
so what was your point ?
Answering your question.

Quote:
can we get back to the discussion at hand ?
This is a part of the discussion. You attempted to buttress your argument by claiming that you "set budgets and approve of compensation" for others.

I've noticed a level of naivety in many of the posts/threads you start --- for instance, the two started today --- that would tend to belie that assertion.

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12-19-2004, 12:57 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacketracket
Answering your question.

This is a part of the discussion. You attempted to buttress your argument by claiming that you "set budgets and approve of compensation" for others.

I've noticed a level of naivety in many of the posts/threads you start --- for instance, the two started today --- that would tend to belie that assertion.

lol ... ok ...

dr

edit: i did not insert that into the thread to support anything. it was in reply to someone wondering what i did

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12-19-2004, 01:09 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DementedReality
who said that my compensation isnt budgeted for ? who is suggesting the NHL owners not set a budget ?

i am at the level that sets budgets and approves compensation and what we pay our employees is not tied to our revenue. It is however RELATIVE to the revenue, and no one is suggesting it shouldnt be.

dr

Then your revenue obviously exceeds what the general salary demands are and therefore you don't have to worry about it... or you work for the government.

Or perhaps you're a street mime with an inflated ego. Whatever.

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12-19-2004, 01:13 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by DementedReality
edit: i did not insert that into the thread to support anything. it was in reply to someone wondering what i did
Sure you did.

You responded to a question asking --- in short --- what type of job doesn't have a compensation level budgeted for, and tied to, the company's revenue by suggesting that you "set budgets and approve of compensation" for others, and that this compensation isn't tied to revenues.

That's bunkum. If revenues fall dramatically, that company simply isn't going to budget for as many positions (downsizing) --- and will likely offer less in raises and other benefits for those it does choose to continue employing.

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12-19-2004, 01:16 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by jacketracket
Sure you did.

You responded to a question asking --- in short --- what type of job doesn't have a compensation level budgeted for, and tied to, the company's revenue by suggesting that you "set budgets and approve of compensation" for others, and that this compensation isn't tied to revenues.

That's bunkum. If revenues fall dramatically, that company simply isn't going to budget for as many positions (downsizing) --- and will likely offer less in raises and other benefits for those it does choose to continue employing.
ok, so why cant the NHL do this again ?

dr

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12-19-2004, 01:25 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by DementedReality
ok, so why cant the NHL do this again ?

dr
My understanding of the situation is that the league is attempting to do that now.

They can either do it behind the player's backs --- collusion --- or by negotiating directly with the players.

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12-19-2004, 01:38 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by jacketracket
My understanding of the situation is that the league is attempting to do that now.

They can either do it behind the player's backs --- collusion --- or by negotiating directly with the players.
Without any job loss for the players...

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Old
12-19-2004, 04:11 AM
  #71
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Segway from the topic

Someone mentioned Owner's cap and golden handshake. Don't know why this made me recall the following:
"Ovitz, Disney chief executive Michael Eisner and several current or former directors are being sued in the Delaware Court of Chancery over a $140 million severance package paid to Ovitz when he left Disney after 14 months as the company's second in command."
This guy Ovitz made $10 mil a month. Over and above his regular salary. There are obviously players and Players.

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Old
12-19-2004, 08:05 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by DementedReality
i am at the level that sets budgets and approves compensation and what we pay our employees is not tied to our revenue. It is however RELATIVE to the revenue, and no one is suggesting it shouldnt be.

dr
Ah, okay, so were going to argue semantics here (that's right, I'm risking being labled as being anti-semantic). Salaries are not tied to revenues, they're only RELATIVE to revenues. Yeah, and your BUDGET is only RELATIVE to revenues. You NHLPA shills will resort to anything!

:lol

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Old
12-19-2004, 08:44 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by The Iconoclast
Ah, okay, so were going to argue semantics here (that's right, I'm risking being labled as being anti-semantic). Salaries are not tied to revenues, they're only RELATIVE to revenues. Yeah, and your BUDGET is only RELATIVE to revenues. You NHLPA shills will resort to anything!

:lol
in reading alot of his posts, i cant help but to look over my shoulder for the Candid Camera hidden somewhere in the room.

I truly hope when this is done and over with He will come out with a big "Fooled you" post and say he was just taking the position he did to spark debate.

I really do hope that....

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Old
12-19-2004, 09:02 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Lou is God
Am I the only one who thinks this smells like coummunism as unintentional as it may be?
To be fair, a lot of cap-and-revenue-sharing proposals are pretty close to communism themselves. Even more horrifying an idea than a hard cap is the suggestion that fans in one city should be paying part of their ticket prices to give to another team so they can sign players and directly compete with the team they are paying to see. Thankfully I don't think either side has tabled a marxist revenue sharing plan along the lines of what some fans want to see.

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Old
12-19-2004, 10:59 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by The Iconoclast
Ah, okay, so were going to argue semantics here (that's right, I'm risking being labled as being anti-semantic). Salaries are not tied to revenues, they're only RELATIVE to revenues. Yeah, and your BUDGET is only RELATIVE to revenues. You NHLPA shills will resort to anything!

:lol
maybe im not clear ?

we dont tell the sales manager for BC that he cant have a raise because we have a salary cap. we pay him what is fair for his position and his experiance and we arent forced to let him go to the competition if this amount doesnt fit under an artficial barrier.

i think we are off topic now.

dr

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