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The Nash Thread II (all things Nash here)

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Old
05-27-2012, 09:56 AM
  #126
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05-27-2012, 10:06 AM
  #127
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totally agree with this ...

but man, I really, really, really don't want any part of any Kostitsyn.

that being said , i HOPE they sign J.Harding , P.A. Parenteau and C.Kelly

and bring back another lottery pick with the Nash trade and maybe even use LA's pick in this draft leaving us with possibly

#2 overall ( Forsberg ? )
#5 overall ( Galchenyuk )
#29 overall ( best goalie available ) or bpa
#30 overall ( bpa defense ? )
#44 overall (best goalie or bpa )

that could plug a few holes

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05-27-2012, 10:32 AM
  #128
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Lots of good ideas, but the suggestion that Prospal can still play top line minutes is seriously flawed. He's a nice piece to have and he helps most any line he plays on; but, by the end of last season, he could barely keep up with the flow of the game. Age and lack of speed prevent him from being an option on the first line. Vinny, RJ and Letestu would be my choice for an effective third line, with Dorsett, DMac, and Gilles on the fourth. The Nash trade has to yield pieces that can fill in effectively on the first two lines, along with free agent signings, other possible trades, and, perhaps, a top one or two draft picks.

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05-27-2012, 10:47 AM
  #129
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Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
Agree wholeheartedly.

And as far as 4th line goes-all of NJ's 4th liners- Gionta,Carter & Bernier are all UFA's. Love to see the Jackets add one of them, though I suspect the Devils sign them. Then again, Lou L is a cheap guy so maybe one can be had. Let Boyce go. Sign two and let Boll go.

Heck, sign all 3 and let them lead us to the Cup finals.
haha..

Really love Gionta's game. Remind me a lot of DD actually. Guy busts his ass every shift, decent enough scoring touch and savvy to be in the right place a lot of the time.

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05-27-2012, 10:55 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
We need goals on that top line. I think the guy we want at right wing is P-A Parenteau.

Which leads me to another question. Help me to understand what the deal is with Semin. Why don't they want him in Washington?
Because he is a talented but lazy Russian. Questionable attitude and work ethic.

This link has insight from a former teammate.

http://eye-on-hockey.blogs.cbssports...94626/31372169

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05-27-2012, 11:27 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
Because he is a talented but lazy Russian. Questionable attitude and work ethic.

This link has insight from a former teammate.

http://eye-on-hockey.blogs.cbssports...94626/31372169
Well, that certainly sounds familiar! Thanks Balls.

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05-27-2012, 12:24 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
We need goals on that top line. I think the guy we want at right wing is P-A Parenteau.
Setting aside the fact that this is kind of self-contradictory Parenteau worries me. I fear he may end up being a bidding war disappointment.

Frankly, we've got guys who can make plays (Vinny, Brass, Johan, et al). We need finishers - right now our only ones are Nash and Umberger (and potentially Attaboy). Which is why I'm kind of hoping for Hudler - or, barring that, that we can make a successful reclamation project out of Boyes.

I'm half-expecting to see Parenteau end up in Montreal as part of a three-P (Pacioretty/Plekanec/Parenteau) line.

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05-27-2012, 01:05 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Setting aside the fact that this is kind of self-contradictory Parenteau worries me. I fear he may end up being a bidding war disappointment.

Frankly, we've got guys who can make plays (Vinny, Brass, Johan, et al). We need finishers - right now our only ones are Nash and Umberger (and potentially Attaboy). Which is why I'm kind of hoping for Hudler - or, barring that, that we can make a successful reclamation project out of Boyes.

I'm half-expecting to see Parenteau end up in Montreal as part of a three-P (Pacioretty/Plekanec/Parenteau) line.
20 goal scorer (or close to it) the past 2 seasons. On the right wing, we have Cam and Dorsett. Need more talent on that side. On the left, I kinda hop we bring back Ray Whitney on a 2 year deal to finish his career.


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05-27-2012, 01:09 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
Well, that certainly sounds familiar! Thanks Balls.
But from the recent reports, Semin not returing back to Washington seemed like a mutual agreement. Semin was upset with his lack of ice time in the playoffs(might have felt he should have gotten PK time?).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Setting aside the fact that this is kind of self-contradictory Parenteau worries me. I fear he may end up being a bidding war disappointment.Frankly, we've got guys who can make plays (Vinny, Brass, Johan, et al). We need finishers - right now our only ones are Nash and Umberger (and potentially Attaboy). Which is why I'm kind of hoping for Hudler - or, barring that, that we can make a successful reclamation project out of Boyes.

I'm half-expecting to see Parenteau end up in Montreal as part of a three-P (Pacioretty/Plekanec/Parenteau) line.
I can see us landing Parenteau, via massive over payment. I think his up coming contract will be his biggest so he might be looking to cash in. Kind of how we got Wizniewski. Wiz was looking to cash in and he signed with us and we over payed(guy makes/cap hit is close to Duncan Keith). Should Howson acquire his rights before July 1st and offer a similiar deal he made with the Canadiens or just wait it out until UFA begins? I wonder if Wiz was good with PA when he was playing in NYI. Can he talk him into joining Columbus once anyone can contract him without tampering?


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Old
05-27-2012, 02:03 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Lots of good ideas, but the suggestion that Prospal can still play top line minutes is seriously flawed. He's a nice piece to have and he helps most any line he plays on; but, by the end of last season, he could barely keep up with the flow of the game. Age and lack of speed prevent him from being an option on the first line. Vinny, RJ and Letestu would be my choice for an effective third line, with Dorsett, DMac, and Gilles on the fourth. The Nash trade has to yield pieces that can fill in effectively on the first two lines, along with free agent signings, other possible trades, and, perhaps, a top one or two draft picks.
Yes. It depends of course on what kind of team you're building and what roles your system demands from its various lines, but consider me on board for this. My guess, though, is one of RJ or Vinny will have to play top 6, again depending on combinations/roles.

I mean, moving both to 3rd line means the team is even more dependant on Atkinson on a permanent top 6 wing. Also think Dorse is OK with Letestu and either Vonny or RJ on the third. Would then want a budget UFA alongside DMac and Gillies on the 4th.

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Old
05-27-2012, 02:30 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Lots of good ideas, but the suggestion that Prospal can still play top line minutes is seriously flawed. He's a nice piece to have and he helps most any line he plays on; but, by the end of last season, he could barely keep up with the flow of the game. Age and lack of speed prevent him from being an option on the first line. Vinny, RJ and Letestu would be my choice for an effective third line, with Dorsett, DMac, and Gilles on the fourth. The Nash trade has to yield pieces that can fill in effectively on the first two lines, along with free agent signings, other possible trades, and, perhaps, a top one or two draft picks.
I'm sure that'd be the choice for many teams. Sadly, there aren't enough NHL wingers such that guys who routinely score 20 goals and 40-60 points can be dumped on the third line without causing your top-6 to suffer.

Seriously, I swear to G-d if we go through one more "R.J. is a third liner" madness episode I will murder the entire ****ing world. People seriously need to open their damn eyes and look at the sorts of players playing in the top-6 of quality, competitive, playoff and Stanley Cup competing teams who aren't superstars.

Heck, just look at the left wings of every single Conference Final team this year. Particularly on the second line. And then come back and tell me with a straight face that RJ wouldn't be an upgrade on every single damn one.

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05-27-2012, 02:45 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by thrillermiller89 View Post
Trade Nash for Krejci and Rask
Trade Mason
Sign Andrei Kostitsyn
Send RyJo to the AHL so that he can play top minutes

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER

FORWARDS
Vinny Prospal ($2.500m) / David Krejci ($5.250m) / Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.500m)
R.J. Umberger ($4.600m) / Derick Brassard ($3.200m) / Cam Atkinson ($0.875m)
Matt Calvert ($0.892m) / Mark Letestu ($0.625m) / Derek Dorsett ($1.633m)
Colton Gillies ($0.625m) / Derek MacKenzie ($1.250m) / Jared Boll ($0.788m)
Ryan Russell ($0.700m) / Darryl Boyce ($0.700m) /

DEFENSEMEN
Jack Johnson ($4.357m) / James Wisniewski ($5.500m)
Fedor Tyutin ($4.500m) / Nikita Nikitin ($1.250m)
John Moore ($0.965m) / Marc Methot ($3.000m)
Brett Lebda ($0.700m) /

GOALTENDERS
Tuukka Rask ($3.000m)
Curtis Sanford ($0.600m)

BUYOUTS
Mike Commodore ($1.542m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $52,551,309; BONUSES: $300,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $11,748,691

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Boston's roster after the Nash trade and some re-signings

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER

FORWARDS
Milan Lucic ($4.083m) / Tyler Seguin ($3.550m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Brad Marchand ($2.500m) / Patrice Bergeron ($5.000m) / Nathan Horton ($4.000m)
Brian Rolston ($1.750m) / Rich Peverley ($3.250m) / Jordan Caron ($1.100m)
Benoit Pouliot ($1.100m) / Gregory Campbell ($1.250m) / Shawn Thornton ($1.100m)
Chris Bourque ($0.525m) / Jamie Arniel ($0.633m) /

DEFENSEMEN
Zdeno Chara ($6.917m) / Johnny Boychuk ($3.367m)
Dennis Seidenberg ($3.250m) / Andrew Ference ($2.250m)
Mike Mottau ($0.800m) / Adam McQuaid ($1.567m)
Matt Bartkowski ($0.660m) /

GOALTENDERS
Tim Thomas ($5.000m)
Anton Khudobin ($0.875m)

BUYOUTS
Patrick Eaves ($0.258m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,584,166; BONUSES: $2,850,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $1,715,834

SOOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH CAP SPACE!!! figure yakupov(or murray) will only get the what 3 yr 950k entry contract. So that leaves lots of room and incentive for players to come to CBJ

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05-27-2012, 08:56 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I'm sure that'd be the choice for many teams. Sadly, there aren't enough NHL wingers such that guys who routinely score 20 goals and 40-60 points can be dumped on the third line without causing your top-6 to suffer.

Seriously, I swear to G-d if we go through one more "R.J. is a third liner" madness episode I will murder the entire ****ing world. People seriously need to open their damn eyes and look at the sorts of players playing in the top-6 of quality, competitive, playoff and Stanley Cup competing teams who aren't superstars.

Heck, just look at the left wings of every single Conference Final team this year. Particularly on the second line. And then come back and tell me with a straight face that RJ wouldn't be an upgrade on every single damn one.
RJ is a good second liner, but could be a VERY good third liner because he is responsible defensively and will dig the puck out of the corners. Not an indictment of his talents, just a different viewpoint on how to best use them.

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05-27-2012, 11:23 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
RJ is a good second liner, but could be a VERY good third liner because he is responsible defensively and will dig the puck out of the corners. Not an indictment of his talents, just a different viewpoint on how to best use them.
I think the only reasonable context in which one can discuss that sort of thing is when talking less about the Blue Jackets and more about Team USA. Generally you're not going to see that kind of depth otherwise.

By similar comparison, Nash can be very effective as a shutdown winger on Team Canada. Is that therefore the ideal role for him on an NHL team?

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05-28-2012, 06:17 AM
  #140
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Wasn't Umbie a third liner with the Flyers before he went nutso in the playoffs?

Nash as a shutdown winger? Hell, he was a "shutdown" winger for the Jackets most of last year

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05-28-2012, 07:42 AM
  #141
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I am curious to see if Nash is really a super star or just the best player on a lousey team. We will now find out.

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05-28-2012, 10:11 AM
  #142
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Originally Posted by EspenK View Post
Wasn't Umbie a third liner with the Flyers before he went nutso in the playoffs?
In the same fashion that Nash was a third-liner here before he won the Rocket Richard.

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Nash as a shutdown winger? Hell, he was a "shutdown" winger for the Jackets most of last year
...you did watch the Olympics two years back, right?

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05-28-2012, 03:53 PM
  #143
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Nash as a shutdown winger? Hell, he was a "shutdown" winger for the Jackets most of last year



Classic.

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05-28-2012, 04:06 PM
  #144
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Glad to see at least someone is awake.

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05-28-2012, 06:17 PM
  #145
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Glad to see at least someone is awake.
Meh. I just didn't think it was funny or accurate.

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05-28-2012, 06:18 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I think the only reasonable context in which one can discuss that sort of thing is when talking less about the Blue Jackets and more about Team USA. Generally you're not going to see that kind of depth otherwise.

By similar comparison, Nash can be very effective as a shutdown winger on Team Canada. Is that therefore the ideal role for him on an NHL team?
I don't care about Team Canada, or even Team USA in this discussion. There's no reason why it's unreasonable to discuss using Umby's two-way play on the third line vs. a more offensive role on the second line for the CBJ.

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05-28-2012, 06:31 PM
  #147
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I don't care about Team Canada, or even Team USA in this discussion. There's no reason why it's unreasonable to discuss using Umby's two-way play on the third line vs. a more offensive role on the second line for the CBJ.
Other than the fact that there are literally no teams in the NHL with the scoring depth on the wing to justify burying Umby like that?

Hell, even the Hollywood Stars LA Kings have the likes of 17-points-in-65-games Dustin Penner playing in the top 6, with occasional bonus appearances by half-a-point-per-game-rookie Dwight King.

Seriously. Look at the damn depth charts all around the league someday, look at the players and how well and consistently they produce, and then come back and tell me with a straight face that RJ should and would be a third liner anywhere else. I personally guarantee that you won't be able to, because everybody has at least one "not quite as great" guy being carried by other folks in the top 6. Everybody. And RJ doesn't need to be "carried" like that to put up points on the second line.

I'll grant that if we've got him on the first line, that's a potential indictment of our scoring depth. But he's just fine as a second liner.

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05-28-2012, 07:11 PM
  #148
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Other than the fact that there are literally no teams in the NHL with the scoring depth on the wing to justify burying Umby like that?

Hell, even the Hollywood Stars LA Kings have the likes of 17-points-in-65-games Dustin Penner playing in the top 6, with occasional bonus appearances by half-a-point-per-game-rookie Dwight King.

Seriously. Look at the damn depth charts all around the league someday, look at the players and how well and consistently they produce, and then come back and tell me with a straight face that RJ should and would be a third liner anywhere else. I personally guarantee that you won't be able to, because everybody has at least one "not quite as great" guy being carried by other folks in the top 6. Everybody. And RJ doesn't need to be "carried" like that to put up points on the second line.

I'll grant that if we've got him on the first line, that's a potential indictment of our scoring depth. But he's just fine as a second liner.
And that will happen naturally as injuries occur during the season. Go into the season with him on the second line, and then someone gets hurt on the top line, and guess where Umby is playing?!?

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05-28-2012, 07:19 PM
  #149
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And that will happen naturally as injuries occur during the season. Go into the season with him on the second line, and then someone gets hurt on the top line, and guess where Umby is playing?!?


I meant to start the season. Good lord almighty, I swear some folks are ****ing allergic to the very idea that RJ actually scores as much as he does. Like it's somehow aesthetically offensive we can have a former Buckeye who doesn't suck.

Once again. Look at the depth charts. Please. For the love of Almighty G-d, look at the other depth charts in the NHL.

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05-28-2012, 07:31 PM
  #150
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I meant to start the season. Good lord almighty, I swear some folks are ****ing allergic to the very idea that RJ actually scores as much as he does. Like it's somehow aesthetically offensive we can have a former Buckeye who doesn't suck.

Once again. Look at the depth charts. Please. For the love of Almighty G-d, look at the other depth charts in the NHL.
You crack me up when you get all wound up!

I know what you meant - hence, the disagreement.

I love Umby as much as the next guy (or gal), but we need guys who can score AND slow down the opponent's top players. Not everyone can do it. Umby can. And yes, he can play the second line too, but not the first. So it's not sacrilege to suggest we build a roster where he can start the season on the 3rd and move up to the 2nd when injuries happen.

OK OK! I'm going to look at the other rosters now. Gheez!

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