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2012 Offseason Thread II: The Offseasoning

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Old
06-01-2012, 01:54 AM
  #201
glovesave_35
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I don't think he walks away that easily unless he knows his body is absolutely shot.

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06-01-2012, 01:59 AM
  #202
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If it doesn't get any better, I could see him not wanting to go elsewhere. Definitely not move just for it.

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06-01-2012, 03:29 AM
  #203
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
After Gully publicly endorsing the center bandwagon like Gaglardi and Lites, I really do believe Dallas is going to go hard after Jarret Stoll. Unfortunately ... or fortunately ... I think a big motivating factor will be Michael Ryder. By that, I think they'll identify him as a 3rd line player on a great team who could blossom with increased minutes and responsibility. IMO ... they'll be telling him he'll get Top 6 minutes.

I was more comfortable with Stoll as a great 3rd line center, but I think they'll let him be the guy that pushes Benn back to wing if they can land him.

Gully said he wants someone to win faceoffs ... Stoll can do that.

GM Joe in the past ... pre-Souray ... constantly talked about a big shot from the point on the PP ... Stoll can do that. Plus, they've talked about focusing on the PP this off-season. He'd give you a big right shot next Goligoski on the top PP.

Plus ... GM Joe will get to say 5 to 10 times about how great Stoll's playoff experience is, and how he's made the Stanley Cup Finals twice (and probably won once).
Don't forget he is/was also a great shooter in the shootout. 2010-2011 he had 10 attempts and scored 9times.

This season he wasn't so successful just 2 of 8.

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06-01-2012, 04:02 AM
  #204
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
After Gully publicly endorsing the center bandwagon like Gaglardi and Lites, I really do believe Dallas is going to go hard after Jarret Stoll. Unfortunately ... or fortunately ... I think a big motivating factor will be Michael Ryder. By that, I think they'll identify him as a 3rd line player on a great team who could blossom with increased minutes and responsibility. IMO ... they'll be telling him he'll get Top 6 minutes.

I was more comfortable with Stoll as a great 3rd line center, but I think they'll let him be the guy that pushes Benn back to wing if they can land him.

Gully said he wants someone to win faceoffs ... Stoll can do that.

GM Joe in the past ... pre-Souray ... constantly talked about a big shot from the point on the PP ... Stoll can do that. Plus, they've talked about focusing on the PP this off-season. He'd give you a big right shot next Goligoski on the top PP.

Plus ... GM Joe will get to say 5 to 10 times about how great Stoll's playoff experience is, and how he's made the Stanley Cup Finals twice (and probably won once).
It certainly fits the "sign a 3rd/4th liner from the Cup winner" strategy.

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06-01-2012, 06:51 AM
  #205
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If it doesn't get any better, I could see him not wanting to go elsewhere. Definitely not move just for it.
I just have a hard time thinking a guy who is one season removed from 30+ goals packs it in that easily. For all the crap we've (deservedly) given Morrow recently I still think he's a competitor and a professional athlete with an ego.

Just personal opinion but I don't really agree that moving cities for a few years is really that big of a deal to a guy like Morrow. He'll probably continue to live in Dallas after he's done playing anyways and if it's clear that his career is winding down (it is) the team would be doing him a career favor by sending him to a winning situation. Wife and kids can adapt for a year or two.

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Old
06-01-2012, 11:06 AM
  #206
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That would be a big mistake I think. Unlike Ryder, the pedigree isn't there. He hasn't cracked a 50 point season in 7 years.
I definitely agree it would be a mistake to count on him as a Top 6 center, but I do get the feeling they could identify him as a candidate. Unfortunately, I think you're just swapping one ideal third liner (Steve Ott) in the Top 6 for a another (Jarret Stoll).

The obvious reason they won't/shouldn't is it would go against frivolous spending in free agency, but they are pushing needing a center pretty hard. I mean, the owner, president, and head coach have all identified it as a need. The GM started the whole conversation about Benn possibly not being a center.

Ideally, I don't know why you wouldn't want Jamie Benn to continue being the stop gap center until you could acquire another (probably two unless you are re-signing Ribeiro). However, I would not be totally shocked to see them to give Stoll 4 years, and then allow him to keep a Top 6 center spot warm until the could acquire/develop a better player.

One other thing … if you're wanting to improve your faceoffs … Benn and Ribeiro both were not good, but Benn was better. In the system, Alex Chiasson (based on several games I've watched where he was the primary faceoff guy playing wing at BU) is the best option for a winger to take faceoffs for Ribeiro. He was excellent in the BU games I saw this year after BU lost their top center.

A handful of reports identified Scott Glennie as a good faceoff man around the time he was drafted, but I haven't really seen anything since.

I can't really think of a winger available right now (Free agency or via trade) that would be a good candidate for Top 6/faceoff specialist. I'd prefer they be patient with these guys by allowing them more time in the AHL, but I wonder if Chiasson and Glennie get a leg up on a roster spot if they can prove they can consistently win faceoffs.

Eriksson-Ribeiro-Chiasson/Glennie
Benn-Stoll-Ryder

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Old
06-01-2012, 11:50 AM
  #207
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Originally Posted by Elysian View Post
Thoughts on Gaborik? He likely just played his last game as a Ranger...
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Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Yea, no.

There's no way he's getting traded. None at all. Unless I missed something major, I really, really doubt they'd ever let him go.
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Being put on the 3rd line in the Playoffs when you were the leading goal scorer during the season tells me they don't have a ton of faith in him when the pressure is high.
Just announced that Marion Gaborik was playing with a torn rotator cuff that requires surgery. He'll likely miss the start of next season.

Seems like it was an injury rather than effort or the coach being pissed that saw his ice time and production go down.

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06-01-2012, 01:38 PM
  #209
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It's one of those days when I wish I actually DID work for the Stars rather than just be a blowhard on the Internet.

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06-01-2012, 01:39 PM
  #210
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If we're taking a 3rd line center to fit into the top 6, I'd rather take Kelly than Stoll. He'll probably be more expensive, but if he's got decent line mates (which he obviously will here), he could still score 15-20 goals and put up 45-50 points. And he's actually done it recently.

Even on the 3rd line, he should be able to. Not like Ott and Vincour are garbage.

Unless he is unhappy at center, I just don't see him moving back to wing. Benn is arguably our best offensive player, and if he can play center (as long as he's just as effective, if not more) as opposed to wing, I don't see how you can justify moving him to wing for a career 3rd line center.

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06-01-2012, 02:21 PM
  #211
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This is Parise's opinion, but you'd think Phili brass would feel the same way:

Quote:
In discussing the New Jersey forecheck about a week ago, Parise gave some insight into what Philadelphia will be looking for. Parise said one of the reasons the Devils successfully pressured the Flyers was the lack of a right-shot defenceman to move the puck on that side. The only one on the roster is Pavel Kubina, who was a healthy scratch for the series.
Robidas for Meszaros?

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06-01-2012, 02:27 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
Its a solid theory. I think its easier to play on your offside as a forward but dmen often struggle with it. A guy like Daley is good at it because he can skate the puck out of trouble so smoothly.

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06-01-2012, 02:36 PM
  #213
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Its a solid theory. I think its easier to play on your offside as a forward but dmen often struggle with it. A guy like Daley is good at it because he can skate the puck out of trouble so smoothly.
Downside would be Dallas would now have 2 lefties playing right, but Meszaros and Daley have both played that position before.

Goligoski-Meszaros
Dillon-Daley
Fistric-Larsen

That's not an order really. I think 1st, 2nd, and 3rd pair would all be up for grabs. You get younger moving in a 21 and 26 year old for two 35 year olds, and I think you get better. Dillon should be able to offer some of Souray's intimidation, but hopefully without the dumb penalties. Meszaros is another big body that can skate. He has some offensive upside too so he could help on the PP.

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06-01-2012, 02:47 PM
  #214
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
Downside would be Dallas would now have 2 lefties playing right, but Meszaros and Daley have both played that position before.

Goligoski-Meszaros
Dillon-Daley
Fistric-Larsen

That's not an order really. I think 1st, 2nd, and 3rd pair would all be up for grabs. You get younger moving in a 21 and 26 year old for two 35 year olds, and I think you get better. Dillon should be able to offer some of Souray's intimidation, but hopefully without the dumb penalties. Meszaros is another big body that can skate. He has some offensive upside too so he could help on the PP.
Yeah and the other thing is Dallas isnt likely to be a contending team next year so playing a few guys on their non optimum side isnt as big of a deal.

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06-01-2012, 03:27 PM
  #215
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Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Unless he is unhappy at center, I just don't see him moving back to wing. Benn is arguably our best offensive player, and if he can play center (as long as he's just as effective, if not more) as opposed to wing, I don't see how you can justify moving him to wing for a career 3rd line center.
I don't think the Stars employees who are continually talking about finding a center as a top need are targeting a lower line player. From all of these interviews, I get the impression they want to add a center to the top six, which leaves us with one of three possibilities:

(1) get rid of Ribeiro;
(2) get rid of Benn; or
(3) move Benn back to wing.

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06-01-2012, 03:34 PM
  #216
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I don't think the Stars employees who are continually talking about finding a center as a top need are targeting a lower line player. From all of these interviews, I get the impression they want to add a center to the top six, which leaves us with one of three possibilities:

(1) get rid of Ribeiro;
(2) get rid of Benn; or
(3) move Benn back to wing.
2nd one sure as hell isn't happening, 3rd one shouldn't. But I don't know if they can move Ribeiro, either.

If it's not broken, don't fix it.

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06-01-2012, 04:15 PM
  #217
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Getting Morrow to Boston is going to be more difficult now.

It's now been confirmed by Peter Chiarelli that Tim Thomas may sit out for the entire season. Chiarelli confirmed that Thomas will still count against the cap 100% even if he's suspended by the team (similar to Avery in Dallas several years ago).

They have $58,623,809 in only 18 players (I subtracted Krug). They still don't have Rask signed , and they probably need 2 more forwards and 2 more D.

Next years cap is now being projected between $60 and $63 million after a new CBA is agreed upon.

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06-01-2012, 04:20 PM
  #218
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
Getting Morrow to Boston is going to be more difficult now.

It's now been confirmed by Peter Chiarelli that Tim Thomas may sit out for the entire season. Chiarelli confirmed that Thomas will still count against the cap 100% even if he's suspended by the team (similar to Avery in Dallas several years ago).

They have $58,623,809 in only 18 players (I subtracted Krug). They still don't have Rask signed , and they probably need 2 more forwards and 2 more D.

Next years cap is now being projected between $60 and $63 million after a new CBA is agreed upon.
Why doesn't Thomas just retire...?

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06-01-2012, 04:46 PM
  #219
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Why doesn't Thomas just retire...?
It wouldn't matter. His contract was signed after he was 35 years old. He'd still count against the cap.

I agree with what most of the hockey writers are saying ... this is a power move. Now ... no team will touch him unless they get 100% guarantee he'll play for them. His movement clause expires on July 1st ... this little stunt is basically his own personal movement clause.

BTW .. I forgot to mention that Savard could go on LTIR for Boston which would give them $4 million more in cap space.

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06-01-2012, 04:47 PM
  #220
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One interesting note ... I wish I could remember which Twitter feed proposed this ... Boston could trade him to a cap floor team.

He'd be a free $5 million cap booster. I'm sure the Islanders would love that. You will get to suspend him ... pay him no money ... but he inflates your cap by $5 million.

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06-01-2012, 04:55 PM
  #221
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I saw that too. I think it was DownGoesBrown haha. But it's absolutely true.

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06-01-2012, 05:57 PM
  #222
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Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
One interesting note ... I wish I could remember which Twitter feed proposed this ... Boston could trade him to a cap floor team.

He'd be a free $5 million cap booster. I'm sure the Islanders would love that. You will get to suspend him ... pay him no money ... but he inflates your cap by $5 million.
I could definitely see the Islanders doing that. Would be stupid, but it makes sense for them with how they run things.

I really don't know what to think of Thomas anymore.

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06-01-2012, 06:30 PM
  #223
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I could definitely see the Islanders doing that. Would be stupid, but it makes sense for them with how they run things.

I really don't know what to think of Thomas anymore.
Why would that be stupid? That team can't pay people to play there and they don't want to spend any money. Here is a chance to hit the floor like they did with Rolston without having somebody in the locker room at all.

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06-01-2012, 07:46 PM
  #224
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For PHX or NYI who have problems hitting the floor Thomas may be an excellent move. He doesn't want to play, fine. They've still got to fill the cap space, don't spend any of their money and probably get something for the trouble or get to jettison their own problem child upon Boston. What's not to like?

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06-01-2012, 09:54 PM
  #225
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I just have a hard time thinking a guy who is one season removed from 30+ goals packs it in that easily. For all the crap we've (deservedly) given Morrow recently I still think he's a competitor and a professional athlete with an ego.

Just personal opinion but I don't really agree that moving cities for a few years is really that big of a deal to a guy like Morrow. He'll probably continue to live in Dallas after he's done playing anyways and if it's clear that his career is winding down (it is) the team would be doing him a career favor by sending him to a winning situation. Wife and kids can adapt for a year or two.
Man I'm watching some full games from last season, and it's ridiculous how different Morrow looks as compared to any time this season.

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