HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > International Tournaments
International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

2014 - Finland Roster Discussion

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-25-2013, 03:27 AM
  #601
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,582
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaps View Post
I think he could have other reasons besides just wanting to be fresh for a cup run, but at this point they're just my speculation.
Might as well say 'em out loud: It's a leadership issue. He knows he'll no longer be the loudest voice in the locker room - the Lions are Mikko's team now. I'm not saying it's ego, he could simply be realizing that having the old mane present could be distracting. Especially with some other guys in there who are used to looking at his direction when the occasion calls for it.

Luckily centre depth is currently one thing we exactly have no issues with. 2C/3C is one of the most contested spots in the squad.

FiLe is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 03:52 AM
  #602
QnebO
Registered User
 
QnebO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 3,979
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
Sure, but by thinking about it for a while, he knows fully well that Finlands window to win has closed, while his chance to win a Cup is still possible. It probably could be seen as provocative for finns, but at the same time, maybe its time to just give your new generation a head start.
It's not closed, Saku just isn't guaranteed to make team any way.

QnebO is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 03:55 AM
  #603
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by QnebO View Post
It's not closed, Saku just isn't guaranteed to make team any way.
Yeah right. When Canadas form will just become better and better during the tournament, like it always becomes as long as the team is well chosen, i'm having great trouble seeing you guys beating them in a final. Sweden probably wont beat them, and Russia becomes just another factor lowering even our chance to win it all to like 15 percent. You guys have like a 5 percent chance, getting a medal at all is probably 25 percent at most.

Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 04:13 AM
  #604
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,582
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
Yeah right. When Canadas form will just become better and better during the tournament, like it always becomes as long as the team is well chosen, i'm having great trouble seeing you guys beating them in a final. Sweden probably wont beat them, and Russia becomes just another factor lowering even our chance to win it all to like 15 percent. You guys have like a 5 percent chance, getting a medal at all is probably 25 percent at most.
*Yawn*. The odds have been about the same for as long as we've had best-on-best tournaments.

Best team on paper =/= best performance on ice.

Finland overachieving is by no means be a rule to go by, but in a tournament like this all you really need is a hot goalie and two good, cohesive units that can bury it, as long as the rest of the team sticks to the game plan. Finland definitely has every chance to deliver those, and playing as a team has never been an issue.


The tournament format will also play its own tricks concerning the end result. Thanks to the group seeding, we'll no doubt see some highly anticipated matchups as early as in the QFs and some will never come to be. In fact, the current groups almost guarantee that at least one of Canada, USA, Sweden and Russia will be out of the semis. The team(s) to sneak in might not be Finland, might as well be the Czechs or the Slovaks, but this alone turns your percentages perfectly worthless. Might as well wipe your backside with 'em. In the end, the best way to describe the odds is the following: It's a crapshoot. For ALL countries.

FiLe is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 04:32 AM
  #605
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
*Yawn*. The odds have been about the same for as long as we've had best-on-best tournaments.

Best team on paper =/= best performance on ice.

Finland overachieving is by no means be a rule to go by, but in a tournament like this all you really need is a hot goalie and two good, cohesive units that can bury it, as long as the rest of the team sticks to the game plan. Finland definitely has every chance to deliver those, and playing as a team has never been an issue.


The tournament format will also play its own tricks concerning the end result. Thanks to the group seeding, we'll no doubt see some highly anticipated matchups as early as in the QFs and some will never come to be. In fact, the current groups almost guarantee that at least one of Canada, USA, Sweden and Russia will be out of the semis. The team(s) to sneak in might not be Finland, might as well be the Czechs or the Slovaks, but this alone turns your percentages perfectly worthless. Might as well wipe your backside with 'em. In the end, the best way to describe the odds is the following: It's a crapshoot. For ALL countries.
I dont agree with this, your team is not close to your 2004 and 2006 ones, and they did not win which is important here. History has shown that in best on best tournaments Canada wins about half of the times. That's 50 percent which left the rest to about i guess five to six countries. In 2014, in my estimation they perhaps have only 40 percent, Russia 25, Sweden and the USA 15(Could be 10), and you know, one of the rest gets the last 5-15 percent by pure lottery(If the czechs in fact does not take 5 for free). That's for GOLD, the medals becomes another estimate in which the chance for the lesser elite teams increases quite much, which you experienced in 2004 and 2006 although you also where stronger then.


Last edited by Darth Yoda: 10-25-2013 at 04:57 AM.
Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 04:59 AM
  #606
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,582
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
I dont agree with this, your team is not close to your 2004 and 2006 ones, and they did not win which is important here. History has shown that in best on best tournaments Canada wins about half of the times. That's 50 percent which left the rest to about i guess five to six countries. In 2014, in my estimation they perhaps have only 40 percent, Russia 25, Sweden and the USA 15, and you know, one of the rest gets the last 5 percent by pure lottery. That's for GOLD, the medals becomes another estimate in which the chance for the lesser elite teams increases quite much, which you experienced in 2004 and 2006 although you also where stronger then.
You know, some advanced statistics wouldn't do bad for you. First of all, you can't give subpar odds to EVERY team in a tournament someone is guaranteed to win. Beating the odds means beating a favorite (e.g. more than 50 percent chance of winning). The thing with odds is that they're always slated in the favor of someone. If you give Canada a 40 per cent chance, that would mean even they have some odds to beat to make it - which is an impossibility in a setting where someone is guaranteed to win.

The correct way to count the probabilities are to count a single team's chances of winning another, and then working out the median. For example, if we are to say that Finland vs. Canada has around 70-30 odds in favor for Canada and 60-40 chance of winning against Sweden, the odds for Finland finishing on top of that speculative group is 35 percent, not 5.

In fact, you can't currently accurately count any given country's odds of winning. Finland, for example, has around 95% chance of making at least the QF. Then, they have perhaps 60-40 chance of winning that game, either slated in their favor or against them, depending on who they face. And then they've got some kind of odds between the 70-30 range of winning the remaining two matches. I can't say what the exact percentage is, but it IS far more than 5. And similarly, Sweden's chance is far better than 15.

It's not a pie chart, kiddo. Statistics 101. Now, back to your books.

FiLe is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:00 AM
  #607
QnebO
Registered User
 
QnebO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 3,979
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
I dont agree with this, your team is not close to your 2004 and 2006 ones, and they did not win which is important here. History has shown that in best on best tournaments Canada wins about half of the times. That's 50 percent which left the rest to about i guess five to six countries. In 2014, in my estimation they perhaps have only 40 percent, Russia 25, Sweden and the USA 15(Could be 10), and you know, one of the rest gets the last 5-15 percent by pure lottery. That's for GOLD, the medals becomes another estimate in which the chance for the lesser elite teams increases quite much, which you experienced in 2004 and 2006 although you also where stronger then.
Finland not getting Gold 2004 and 2006 was more coin flip than big difference between teams. Winning gold isn't that of a major factor because it happens based on one game that can be very close. Its the major goal but its not major factor, if your team makes multiple times to silver, your chance to win gold is much more than 5% if you have any logics. Of course the team is now different but the chance to win single games against Canada or any country is much more than 5%, its clear, and in this tournament, winning 3 important games is enough.


Last edited by QnebO: 10-25-2013 at 05:08 AM.
QnebO is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:07 AM
  #608
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
You know, some advanced statistics wouldn't do bad for you. First of all, you can't give subpar odds to EVERY team in a tournament someone is guaranteed to win. Beating the odds means beating a favorite (e.g. more than 50 percent chance of winning). The thing with odds is that they're always slated in the favor of someone. If you give Canada a 40 per cent chance, that would mean even they have some odds to beat to make it - which is an impossibility in a setting where someone is guaranteed to win.

The correct way to count the probabilities are to count a single team's chances of winning another, and then working out the median. For example, if we are to say that Finland vs. Canada has around 70-30 odds in favor for Canada and 60-40 chance of winning against Sweden, the odds for Finland finishing on top of that speculative group is 35 percent, not 5.

In fact, you can't currently accurately count any given country's odds of winning. Finland, for example, has around 95% chance of making at least the QF. Then, they have perhaps 60-40 chance of winning that game, either slated in their favor or against them, depending on who they face. And then they've got some kind of odds between the 70-30 range of winning the remaining two matches. I can't say what the exact percentage is, but it IS far more than 5. And similarly, Sweden's chance is far better than 15.

It's not a pie chart, kiddo. Statistics 101. Now, back to your books.
This is not an hour of mathematics in school though, this is real life sport. My estimation is that in 2014 Canada DOES have the odds slightly against them to win. If they win they do, but if they dont, they dont. In Finlands case, you have NEVER won a best on best, so why should you get more than a five percent chance now, with this sub par edition?

Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:09 AM
  #609
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by QnebO View Post
Finland not getting Gold 2004 and 2006 was more coin flip than big difference between teams. Winning gold isn't major factor because it happens based on one game. Its the major goal but its not major factor, if your team makes multiple times to silver, your chance to win gold is much more than 5% if you have any logics. Of course the team is now different but the chance to win single games against Canada or any country is much more than 5%, its clear, and in this tournament, winning 3 important games is enough.
You can call if a coin toss, sure. But you need to win at least three of those tosses in a row and when all teams is geared up. If you ask me, you have gotten your lucky bounces (Two out of three at best in 2004 and 2006) and now it's most probably someone elses turn. But as i said, you might have about 25 percent for a silver or bronze, but not gold, not three in a row this time either.

Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:16 AM
  #610
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,582
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
This is not an hour of mathematics in school though, this is real life sport. My estimation is that in 2014 Canada DOES have the odds slightly against them to win. If they win they do, but if they dont, they dont. In Finlands case, you have NEVER won a best on best, so why should you get more than a five percent chance now, with this sub par edition?
And this is how real-life odds are counted. QED.

Besides, because every country comes in with a different team, every tournament forms its own microcosm within which the odds are counted. It doesn't matter how this Finland compares to former Finlands. The only thing that matters is how they compare to their current opponents. And there is not a single team in this tournament that is slated to win a single game matchup 95-5 against Finland.

Of course, having to beat the odds again and again does affect the curve, so it's not the exact median. But since Finland is technically guaranteed to make the QF, they need to beat the odds only twice or thrice. Which is entirely doable for them. As it is for every other country making that stage.

Really, yours isn't even an argument. Not because you miscalculated Finland's (and every other country's) odds, but because you claimed that there is no favorite, e.g. someone with better than 50 per cent chance to win. In real life sports, there is ALWAYS a favorite.

Seriously. Any stats prof or bookie would just laugh you out of their room. So please, stop making an ass of yourself.

FiLe is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:21 AM
  #611
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
And this is how real-life odds are counted. QED.

Besides, because every country comes in with a different team, every tournament forms its own microcosm within which the odds are counted. It doesn't matter how this Finland compares to former Finlands. The only thing that matters is how they compare to their current opponents. And there is not a single team in this tournament that is slated to win a single game matchup 95-5 against Finland.
Can you please get it in your head that i'm talking about the chances for a GOLD MEDAL, not a silver or a bronze. Three in a row, and let me tell you, the coin Finland has to toss in 2014 is severely off balanced and more probable to at each toss land at a loss.

Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:33 AM
  #612
QnebO
Registered User
 
QnebO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 3,979
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
You can call if a coin toss, sure. But you need to win at least three of those tosses in a row and when all teams is geared up. If you ask me, you have gotten your lucky bounces (Two out of three at best in 2004 and 2006) and now it's most probably someone elses turn. But as i said, you might have about 25 percent for a silver or bronze, but not gold, not three in a row this time either.
We still are waiting for our lucky bounces! 2006 we beat Canada and Russia by shutouts being clearly better, but didin't get the lucky bounce needed in Final, unlike Sweden. I think sweden has used it lucky bounces as it has so many golds, if Finland keeps playing like it has, golds should start coming sooner or later. And the team will be better than in 2010 this time.

Point:
I know there are teams more likely to get the gold... but they are just few teams, the "door for gold" hasnt been shut.

QnebO is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:40 AM
  #613
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Yeah maybe i should not have said that it has closed when i at the same time threw five percent out there. It's not closed, but you will have to open it up a little bit more before your chance increases, which you will with your new talent coming in the future, but in 2014 the SISU better be REAL strong with you to put it like they did in Star Wars.

Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:42 AM
  #614
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,582
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
Can you please get it in your head that i'm talking about the chances for a GOLD MEDAL, not a silver or a bronze. Three in a row, and let me tell you, the coin Finland has to toss in 2014 is severely off balanced and more probable to at each toss land at a loss.
I get it. And will you get it what I said: History doesn't matter. The relations of teams in THIS TOURNAMENT is all that does. Finland, and every other participant's, odds are counted as the tournament progresses. Another err in your logic is that you don't take it into factor that other teams can beat the odds too, which will fluctuate all the chances across the board.


First toss: the QF. It's either balanced in favor of Finland, or against them. But it still gives 'em a fair chance to come out on top.

Second toss: The semi. Perhaps slated, but depending on if some OTHER team beats their own odds, it could also be favored. In any case, it's hardly more 60 against. Even 70 would be reaching it. Beatable.

Third toss: The Final. Likely slated against. But once again, it's an individual matchup with previous results affecting it very little.


Finland probably is not at any point favored to win the gold, that much is true. But there are so many different little things at play here that trying to cram all the odds into a single pie chart where every participant has their own slice is simply a travesty. Even bigger travesty is claiming that the past matters. It does not. If Finland is weak, it's weak because it's weak against other countries in this tourney. Not because it's weak against its past incarnations or incarnations of its opponents, and failed to win because of that. Therefore, could you please drop that "couldn't win in the past, can't win it now" line?

FiLe is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 07:00 AM
  #615
Erikfromfin
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,035
vCash: 500
98 Nagano
Russia was best team
Czech Won

02 Salt Lake City
Sweden was best team
Canada Won

06 Torino
Finland was best team
Sweden won

10 Vancouver
USA was best team
Canada won

Erikfromfin is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 08:57 AM
  #616
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,615
vCash: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erikfromfin View Post
98 Nagano
Russia was best team
Czech Won
Just becouse Bure slaughtered you dont mean he had anything on the greatest goalie in the historys greatest accomlishment. Everyone knows the czechs was almost a one man show that time.

Quote:
02 Salt Lake City
Sweden was best team
Canada Won
We were not best. In more or less meaningless round robin games we where, but its not the only time we've faltered when it matters. Ask Selanne about 98.

Quote:
06 Torino
Finland was best team
Sweden won
Maybe, i really dont know. But we had the swords tip with our golden generation, believe that.

Quote:
10 Vancouver
USA was best team
Canada won
'
Again,Canada had the swords tip. USA worked well and did not give up, but where always behind.


Last edited by Darth Yoda: 10-25-2013 at 09:03 AM.
Darth Yoda is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 09:11 AM
  #617
mattihp
Registered User
 
mattihp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Årsta
Country: Finland
Posts: 14,555
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Yoda View Post
Maybe, i really dont know. But we had the swords tip with our golden generation, believe that.
Totally true. But Lundqvist and Lidström decided they'd play at their own level for ONE game. The game where it mattered the most

mattihp is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 10:08 AM
  #618
FiLe
Mr. Know-It-Nothing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 2,582
vCash: 500
You know what's funny? Some people say that 2014 Finland won't hold a candle to 2006 Finland on paper... but when you look at it more closely, they actually do. No, they're better on paper.

As a matter of fact, 2006 Finland had only two things riding for 'em - a red-hot goalie in Niittymäki, and perhaps one of the best top lines modern hockey has seen. The rest of the forwards were somewhere between okay and adequate.

Finland can totally have a solid goalie in Sochi as well, and while the forward group won't have a tip as sharp that Lehtinen-Koivu-Selänne -line (even if one or two them come round for one mo'), but there's far more depth in there. We have quality centres to fill not just one, but two teams. The winger group will be far more prepped to play against NHL opposition as well, from 1st line to the 4th.

And that greatly dissed defense ain't that much weaker either. In 2006, Finland had 5 NHL regulars in the lineup, the 2014 projection has 4. Timonen, Salo and Teppo Numminen were the household names, with Lydman being somewhat reliable depth player... and I don't have to start about Berg.

The 2014 iteration still has both Timonen and Salo, admittedly older, but still top-pair guys in their club teams. Vatanen has been one of the Ducks' best d-men this season, if not the best. And Määttä breaking the Pens' stacked defense speaks volumes.

And when you look at those bottom pairs from Turin: Berg, Kukkonen, A-J Niemi... complete garbage when you compare it to other rosters. Perfectly comparable names to 2014 Kukkonen, Väänänen, Lepistö and who else.


It all comes down to team cohesion. While the 2006 Finland was far from the best squad on paper, they had the most solid team play of all of them. 2010 Finland was also comparable on paper, perhaps slightly better as well, but that was the weak point back then. Their team play was too on-off. That squad had three adequate periods in the QF and two good ones in the bronze game, which was enough to medal... this should tell us volumes what kind of a crapshoot this tournament is.

So, if 2014 Finland can find the same team cohesiveness as the 2006 iteration did, can they repeat the Turin performance? Absolutely. There's nothing in the quality of individual players that will prevent that.

FiLe is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 10:15 AM
  #619
Erikfromfin
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,035
vCash: 500
well said File

Erikfromfin is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 10:18 AM
  #620
Gaps
Registered User
 
Gaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,199
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
Might as well say 'em out loud: It's a leadership issue. He knows he'll no longer be the loudest voice in the locker room - the Lions are Mikko's team now. I'm not saying it's ego, he could simply be realizing that having the old mane present could be distracting. Especially with some other guys in there who are used to looking at his direction when the occasion calls for it.

Luckily centre depth is currently one thing we exactly have no issues with. 2C/3C is one of the most contested spots in the squad.
I have no idea if this is about anyone's ego and even if it was, it would not matter much, but I do appreciate it if Saku is capable of thinking what's in the team's best interest and is willing to stay at home if he feels him being there would cause problems. He has been saying since the summer that he will decline the invitation if he's not fit and I believe that, but I also think he has been preparing people (including himself) for the possibility that he will decline due to not wanting to cause issues. The absolute last thing we need is for there to be an 'Old Boys' Club' vs. everyone else kind of a situation.

Mikko's way of doing things will IMO work better with a younger team anyway. He wants everyone together off the ice and likes to control a lot of things and while I believe the youngsters might welcome this and his peers won't mind either, vets like Saku and Teemu might have a more difficult time accepting it.

Gaps is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 10:23 AM
  #621
Erikfromfin
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,035
vCash: 500
For me it would have been as long as Saku plays he should have been the captain but yes indeed its probaply right that he let go of it. I cant imagine scenario where Erkka calls and asks Saku to Sochi and he declines. His the perfect 3rd line Center for team Finland.

Erikfromfin is offline  
Old
10-25-2013, 05:28 PM
  #622
Staberg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Gothenburg
Country: Sweden
Posts: 23
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
For what it's worth, Jokinen thought himself a lock for the 2010 games...

Realistically though, if Määttä keeps playing as he has this far, it's going to take a pretty strong argument that will drop him from the squad.
Yeah, and he should have been a part of that team because he scored goals almost every game that autumn 09' with Carolina. What was the reason given by the coach, Jokinen did not suit the tactical system or something? I thought it was a little unfair but of course Jalonen had a plan with it.

Staberg is offline  
Old
10-26-2013, 12:18 AM
  #623
wirelessflyingcord
An Oxymoron
 
wirelessflyingcord's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 850
vCash: 500
That escalated quickly...

If we come back to Koivu's statement, I think the winning chances are kind of irrelevant for a player or whether the window is open at all. I can't imagine any player anywhere sees the chances this way at all, instead they think if there is a chance, there is a chance. In this case clearly it is only about what is more important for a player that might be retiring, the Cup run or olympic tournament (and of course it is obvious which one is more important).

Infact, if the chances were much greater, then the depth would be much deeper and Koivu shouldn't even be in the speculation.


Last edited by wirelessflyingcord: 10-26-2013 at 01:09 AM.
wirelessflyingcord is offline  
Old
10-26-2013, 05:02 AM
  #624
Gaps
Registered User
 
Gaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,199
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Staberg View Post
Yeah, and he should have been a part of that team because he scored goals almost every game that autumn 09' with Carolina. What was the reason given by the coach, Jokinen did not suit the tactical system or something? I thought it was a little unfair but of course Jalonen had a plan with it.
IIRC, Jalonen said he just didn't see a spot for JJ on the team. In his place, Jalonen took along one of his favorites from Europe. Pretty much the entire team underperformed in Vancouver despite the good end result, so I doubt Jussi being there would have made much of a difference in the end. But yes, he should have been on that team.

If Jalonen was still the coach, the Sochi team would look very different too. You could forget about all the old guys from the NHL, none of them would be on the team, with the exception of possibly Timonen and Salo. Players like Karalahti and Nummelin would have been out of the question as well. I also believe he would have favored prime-aged KHL defensemen over NHL youngsters like Määttä and Ristolainen. Barkov would still have been in the running though.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Erikfromfin View Post
For me it would have been as long as Saku plays he should have been the captain but yes indeed its probaply right that he let go of it. I cant imagine scenario where Erkka calls and asks Saku to Sochi and he declines. His the perfect 3rd line Center for team Finland.
You have to know that would not work in this case. Saku has no control over his brother and our European-based players as well as most Finns in the NHL see Mikko as their leader. Times have changed. Saku still being captain would not be ideal for him, the team or Mikko. Perhaps in different circumstances that could have worked, but now I seriously doubt it. The best possible scenario would be Saku coming along and doing his job as the 3rd line C and possibly alternate captain, but if for whatever reason that is not a possibility, then the only even somewhat sensible option is for Saku to not come at all.

Gaps is offline  
Old
10-26-2013, 05:35 AM
  #625
glassbangers
Samu MacGyver
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: UVI
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,835
vCash: 50
Valtteri Filppula - Mikko Koivu - Jussi Jokinen
Tuomo Ruutu - Aleksander Barkov - Lauri Korpikoski
Mikael Granlund - Olli Jokinen - Teemu Selänne
Jesse Joensuu - Saku Koivu - Sean Bergenheim

Kimmo Timonen - Olli Määttä
Janne Niskala - Sami Salo
Sami Lepistö - Sami Vatanen

Tuukka Rask (Antti Niemi)

glassbangers is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:48 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.