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Justin Schultz Part 2 (Update: Will not be a Duck according to Murray)

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05-26-2012, 09:02 PM
  #1
s7ark
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Justin Schultz Part 2 (Update: Will not be a Duck according to Murray)

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A few posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheatking View Post
It's not tampering if Whitney or Petry pick up the phone and say "hey, fellow Dman who took the college route. You'll get tons of ice time in Edmonton and playing with Hall, Eberle and RNH is pretty fun".

I'm not getting my hopes up. Is there any evidence of him actually want to play here or are we just going off of Bob McKenzie throwing us out there on the quiz one night? Seems kind of crazy that this thread is at 40 pages if there isn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giant Moo View Post
I never said that. Stop building strawmen. You can do better than putting words in my mouth.

The rest of your post is just more wishful thinking in 1000 words or less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usual_Suspect View Post
If there's truth to this it would also rule out the argument to trade for his rights...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermullet View Post
Not too crazy. Our top scorer on the blueline had all of 5 goals last year, and it was a major miracle considering his past production. The kids are a ways off, and the fanbase is anxious for some help back there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SK13 View Post
Well, yeah. It just makes sense. He likes the City, he's from Western Canada, he's an offensive defenseman looking to secure an NHL job and the Oilers offer him one of the better, younger cores of offensive players in the National Hockey League.

By the sounds of it, Bob McKenzie had no real definitive chatter to back-up picking Edmonton in that Quiz segment, he just looked at all of those facts and thought "good fit".

Which is as good of a reason as any to speculate that he may sign here. At least, in lieu of having an actual, sourceable insider saying he's not interested or will sign somewhere else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermullet View Post
Yup. That's dead in the water now.



Completely agree with you, my point was that fans here actually have justification to discuss Schultz endlessly, because we desperately need someone like him. I think he ranked #21 in THN's NHL top prospects not in the league, which puts him in strong company with some real blue-chip prospects.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
Isn't it?

If I remember Ron Wilson was fined due tampering when he said the leafs would be interested in the Sedin twins if they reach free agency.

Now it's not exactly the same, nor as direct, but I could see a case for it no?

More than anything I think this would be the Ducks' attempt to secure some sort of compensation for Schultz. More than likely if the NHL finds any evidence of tampering, they'll charge the team with a pick. I'm not sure the Ducks would be given the pick(I thought the NHL just takes it out of the draft?), but it would 'cost' the team who gets Schultz something I guess.



Not really at all. Anything suggesting Edmonton is coincidental really.

You can't really say he'd like to come here based on the Bobby Mac segment nor an outdated draft profile stating Edmonton was his favorite city to visit(which I still don't get).

I guess the good news is that there really hasn't been any evidence to suggest any other city either. I mean I guess Toronto if we are to believe he won't sign in Anaheim primarily because they traded Gardiner (which is hard to believe), but apart from that, there isn't much chatter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SK13 View Post
I don't see why not.

I mean, making a claim is one thing, but speculating based on the only available information - all of which at least indicates Edmonton should have a shot - seems like acceptable fodder for a discussion.

And weirdly, the whole 'tampering' thing only helps. That's the kind of thing this management group would get into
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
I should've clarified, I don't mind the speculation at all, I was just saying there isn't any real evidence(atleast imo) to say he prefers Edmonton one way or another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloned View Post
Oilers get caught tampering ---> Oilers forfeit #1 pick.

Yeah, I know, but it's still amusing to consider it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usual_Suspect View Post
When's the last time a team was penalized for tampering? I find it hard to believe that this would actually happen. It would have to be overwhelmingly blatant for the NHL to issue a punishment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr V View Post
Could just be a misunderstanding. You know who else is a Kelowna resident? Maybe Dany Heatley just showed Schultz the video the Oilers gave him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giant Moo View Post
The Ducks want to pursue us for tampering?

Haven't I heard this tune before? Maybe four years ago?

"Hey Bob, it's Brian. Can do you me a solid?"
Quote:
Originally Posted by SK13 View Post
Burke has been pinged a couple times for tampering, but that's more along the lines of issuing public statements than secretly wooing another teams player.

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Old
05-26-2012, 09:09 PM
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If Burke has been talking to Schultz it will be an absolute gong show. Wouldn't be surprised to see him lose his job or get a heavy fine if he's tampering yet again. Although if it's a case of Gardiner talking to Schultz, without Burke involved, it should be fine, no?

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05-26-2012, 09:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lay Z Boy GM View Post
If Burke has been talking to Schultz it will be an absolute gong show. Wouldn't be surprised to see him lose his job or get a heavy fine if he's tampering yet again. Although if it's a case of Gardiner talking to Schultz, without Burke involved, it should be fine, no?
You cannot ever police these kind of things where the player gets indirectly talk to.

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05-26-2012, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrolean View Post
You cannot ever police these kind of things where the player gets indirectly talk to.
Unless the player himself blows the whistle that is. That or another teammate or management hears it first hand. Any team that would formally contact him would be very stupid to do so.

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05-26-2012, 10:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lay Z Boy GM View Post
If Burke has been talking to Schultz it will be an absolute gong show. Wouldn't be surprised to see him lose his job or get a heavy fine if he's tampering yet again. Although if it's a case of Gardiner talking to Schultz, without Burke involved, it should be fine, no?
When Toronto was fined for tampering previously, it was because of a stupid comment by Wilson during a radio interview, not Burke.

There's really little incentive for Toronto to get in touch with Schultz before they're allowed to - Schultz knows Toronto has interest in him because it's common knowledge they tried to acquire him via trade and since ELCs are capped, Schultz knows exactly what kind of contract Toronto will likely be offering as soon as they're able to. I don't see why you'd risk anything. What's the point?

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05-26-2012, 10:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrolean View Post
You cannot ever police these kind of things where the player gets indirectly talk to.
Yep. It's no coincidence that there are so many deals signed within five minutes of free agency opening on July 1. There are obviously some sketchy lines of communication open between management and player agents. So even if Anaheim gets screwed and they file tampering charges, it'll be hard for them to prove it's anything more than just sour grapes.

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05-26-2012, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutchecktime View Post
When Toronto was fined for tampering previously, it was because of a stupid comment by Wilson during a radio interview, not Burke.
Burke was accused of tampering as well. He's flirted with that line a couple times actually.

And they lost a pick for signing Frogren to a deal whose terms broke the CBA, which is in a way related to tampering, in that it created an uneven playing field and infringed on the abilities of other teams to compete.

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05-26-2012, 11:23 PM
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Schultz is most likely going to Toronto.

Burke is all over that NCAA scene.

Add in the tampering allegations and its a lock.

On the off chance he doesnt go there, it will be Vancouver imo.

He isnt coming here.

McKenzie probably comes by here and lurks for laughs.

Cruel bugger.

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Old
05-26-2012, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Schultz is most likely going to Toronto.

Burke is all over that NCAA scene.

Add in the tampering allegations and its a lock.

On the off chance he doesnt go there, it will be Vancouver imo.

He isnt coming here.

McKenzie probably comes by here and lurks for laughs.

Cruel bugger.
Toronto also has their AHL affiliate in the same city, which is huge for a young guy. Schultz can set some roots down before camp even starts and buy or rent a place in TO knowing he's there regardless of whether he makes the team. Burke has mentioned this has been a factor in landing undrafted players before.

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Old
05-26-2012, 11:29 PM
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Well reading all that... I'd lean towards him ending up in TO. It's all just hearsay and rumours but as they say where there's smoke there's fire. As if they need even more good dmen there.

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Old
05-26-2012, 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex87 View Post
Yep. It's no coincidence that there are so many deals signed within five minutes of free agency opening on July 1. There are obviously some sketchy lines of communication open between management and player agents. So even if Anaheim gets screwed and they file tampering charges, it'll be hard for them to prove it's anything more than just sour grapes.
Some deals are signed within 2-3 hours of free agency opening, but that doesn't require any tampering. All it requires is an offer to be made with a short expiry.

ie. "We really like your player, but if we can't get him signed quickly we'll have to move onto someone else so we aren't left with no one. So we offer your client X dollars over Y years, and that offer expires in one hour."

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05-26-2012, 11:47 PM
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There's a giant hole in that theory about a team getting to him to talk him out of signing with Anaheim; his agent. An NHL team doesn't have to approach him, if his agent wasn't a complete moron, he'd be the one to tell him not to sign and to hold out for a better situation. It's in Schultz's best interests, and it's fully within his rights.

I don't think anyone's been tampering. I just think his agent gave him some good advice and he's not a moron so he's taking it.

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05-27-2012, 12:01 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex87 View Post
Toronto also has their AHL affiliate in the same city, which is huge for a young guy. Schultz can set some roots down before camp even starts and buy or rent a place in TO knowing he's there regardless of whether he makes the team. Burke has mentioned this has been a factor in landing undrafted players before.
Young guys dont buy houses early in their careers anyways, need to live with vets!

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05-27-2012, 12:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobBrownHero View Post
Young guys dont buy houses early in their careers anyways, need to live with vets!
Schultz is turning 22 in July.

Being based in one city is a big selling point.

Although I wouldnt be surprised if he was told he would be in the nhl.

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05-27-2012, 12:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Schultz is turning 22 in July.

Being based in one city is a big selling point.

Although I wouldnt be surprised if he was told he would be in the nhl.
And even if he's not buying, wouldn't you rather rent a furnished place than spend the entire month of September (and then some) in a hotel?

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05-27-2012, 12:22 AM
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Wouldn't he be more likely to crack the Oiler lineup than the Leafs? That's gotta be worth something ... along with the prospect of playing with Eberle, Hall, RNH, Yak for years.

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05-27-2012, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex87 View Post
And even if he's not buying, wouldn't you rather rent a furnished place than spend the entire month of September (and then some) in a hotel?
Or having to move back and forth all the time, with long flights to and fro added onto the extensive travel they already have to endure.

It would be huge for a tweener.

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05-27-2012, 12:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex87 View Post
Toronto also has their AHL affiliate in the same city, which is huge for a young guy. Schultz can set some roots down before camp even starts and buy or rent a place in TO knowing he's there regardless of whether he makes the team. Burke has mentioned this has been a factor in landing undrafted players before.
This is why I'd love to see the Barons in Edmonton some day. It's great for the players and great for the fans to not only have another option for hockey but to watch the development of our young players.

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05-27-2012, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Or having to move back and forth all the time, with long flights to and fro added onto the extensive travel they already have to endure.

It would be huge for a tweener.
I would think whoever signs him is heavily pitching a full time NHL role.

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05-27-2012, 01:13 AM
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Not sure if his first contract would be a 2 way, but if it is, would he like to make NHL money or the 70-90,000 that an AHL contract would provide? And if that is the case, who's roster does he have a better chance of cracking, Edmonton's or Toronto's?

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05-27-2012, 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Stoneman89 View Post
Not sure if his first contract would be a 2 way, but if it is, would he like to make NHL money or the 70-90,000 that an AHL contract would provide? And if that is the case, who's roster does he have a better chance of cracking, Edmonton's or Toronto's?
Nothing that a Luke Schenn to Edmonton for Sam Gagner wouldnt fix.

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05-27-2012, 02:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Lay Z Boy GM View Post
This is why I'd love to see the Barons in Edmonton some day. It's great for the players and great for the fans to not only have another option for hockey but to watch the development of our young players.
Edmonton is just too small for that.

The Oil Kings had a tough time drawing crowds until the finals, I think the Barons would have an even tougher time.

I like the idea of seperate Western version of the AHL for the Western NHL teams. I know that LA, Phoenix and a bunch of other teams were trying to get this organized. It would probably hurt the US WHL teams though.

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05-27-2012, 02:48 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Schultz is most likely going to Toronto.

Burke is all over that NCAA scene.

Add in the tampering allegations and its a lock.

On the off chance he doesnt go there, it will be Vancouver imo.

He isnt coming here.

McKenzie probably comes by here and lurks for laughs.

Cruel bugger.
It wasn't just McKenzie though. From here

Quote:
An agent, who doesn't represent Schultz said this, "If he was my client I'd recommend he seriously look at the Oilers. They have the trio of Hall, Eberle and Nugent-Hopkins so they should improve quickly. Most importantly he could step right in and play on their blueline. He's great on the powerplay and he'd put up some big points, which could earn him a very good 2nd contract."
If other agents are thinking this then Schultz's agent probably is too. We wouldn't be on thread 2 if the only reason was a 10 second clip from Bob McKenzie.

We had zero offense from our blueline last year and Schultz would immediately become our top PP option. He's a perfect fit for this team right down to his shooting side. Then when you add in things like rumours of wanting to play in a place with a winter season, and him mentioning Edmonton as his favourite place to visit a few years back, we get to where we are. No we aren't unique in what we can offer him, but we should still be in the conversation when he reaches UFA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Schultz is turning 22 in July.

Being based in one city is a big selling point.

Although I wouldnt be surprised if he was told he would be in the nhl.
I agree, I don't see this being as big a selling point for Schultz. Whoever he signs with will be offering him a roster spot so the location of the AHL affiliate shouldn't be that big an issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennertration View Post
Wouldn't he be more likely to crack the Oiler lineup than the Leafs? That's gotta be worth something ... along with the prospect of playing with Eberle, Hall, RNH, Yak for years.
This is exactly what I am hoping we stress. Send out those 4 kids to visit him the day he hits UFA and just say, this could be the PP you are on for the next 10 years if you like. Eberle + 3 1st overalls should be a nice lure.

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05-27-2012, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SK13 View Post
Burke was accused of tampering as well. He's flirted with that line a couple times actually.

And they lost a pick for signing Frogren to a deal whose terms broke the CBA, which is in a way related to tampering, in that it created an uneven playing field and infringed on the abilities of other teams to compete.
He was accused of tampering by Vancouver when he mentioned a trade rumour between Vancouver and another club during the Behind the Scenes draft program. The league never ruled that to be tampering and there was no punishment.

Burke wasn't even in Toronto when the Frogren signing occurred.

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05-27-2012, 10:52 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokersarejokers View Post
Edmonton is just too small for that.

The Oil Kings had a tough time drawing crowds until the finals, I think the Barons would have an even tougher time.

I like the idea of seperate Western version of the AHL for the Western NHL teams. I know that LA, Phoenix and a bunch of other teams were trying to get this organized. It would probably hurt the US WHL teams though.
Enter Saskatoon or Regina. I think we would be much better off with our farm team in Saskatchewan. There was an article not long ago talking about the prospects of the NHL going to Saskatoon. I think they could try the AHL first.

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