HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Schultz talk pt. 2

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-11-2012, 11:05 AM
  #576
RangerBoy
1994 FOREVER
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yossarian54 View Post
So, you mean the same contract that every other team in the NHL, including Anaheim, is going to offer him?
You think every team will offer the MAXIMUM money allowed? Burke has so many principles running in that head of his. Some teams don't pay their own top picks MAX bonus money.

RangerBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:06 AM
  #577
Liminality
Registered User
 
Liminality's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 3,043
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
You know what's funny about that they get all these free agents and not one has turned into a player of significance. The ones that do ususally dont sign with the Leafs.
Bozak has been great, Scrivens shows promise and the other goalies are just prospects atm. The idea has clearly worked to bring players in and will probably continue to work. Just like all prospects though these players won't all pan out.

I would rather we get players and prospects basically for free than get no prospects or players come over at all, wouldn't you?


After this whole ordeal I'm sure Schultz will be motivated to develop with the team he decides to go with. After all the press, it's on him to show why he should be so sought after.

Liminality is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:09 AM
  #578
DPyro
Registered User
 
DPyro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,237
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Wings View Post
You know what's funny about that they get all these free agents and not one has turned into a player of significance. The ones that do ususally dont sign with the Leafs.
Bozak, Scrivens and Owuya are all pretty good players that will play a role in the NHL. Can't argue with free.

DPyro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:22 AM
  #579
silvercanuck
Registered User
 
silvercanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,899
vCash: 500
It will be extremely interesting to see what happens with Detroit now that Lidstrom is gone. If they take a nose dive in the standings - which seems pretty likely - things will snowball and it will become harder to attract players. I think they could become like Edmonton after they stopped being a dynasty. If they're not winning players are going to scrutinize the city a lot more.

silvercanuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:26 AM
  #580
zeus3007*
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Red Deer, Alberta
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
I haven't been following really close, but Murray and Getzlaf calling out the kid is a bush league move. Even if everything they said is 100% true, that is the kind of thing that should be kept behind closed doors, there is no need in a professional league for these kind of things to be said to the media. I'm not saying Schultz was right for not signing with the Ducks, but the way that organization has handled the situation isn't ideal in my opinion.

zeus3007* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:28 AM
  #581
zeus3007*
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Red Deer, Alberta
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
It will be extremely interesting to see what happens with Detroit now that Lidstrom is gone. If they take a nose dive in the standings - which seems pretty likely - things will snowball and it will become harder to attract players. I think they could become like Edmonton after they stopped being a dynasty. If they're not winning players are going to scrutinize the city a lot more.
Meh, Detroit will go hard for Suter and probably one of Garrison or Carle. Obviously that won't make up for losing Lidstrom, but I don't see the transition being as difficult for them as it could be.

zeus3007* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:30 AM
  #582
Provost
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 276
vCash: 500
The only thing that is almost for certain is that he will be overpaid. Some idiot GM will throw $3 million one way contract his way without him every having played an NHL game.

Provost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:32 AM
  #583
Spongolium*
Potato Magician
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bridgend,UK
Country: Wales
Posts: 8,653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Provost View Post
The only thing that is almost for certain is that he will be overpaid. Some idiot GM will throw $3 million one way contract his way without him every having played an NHL game.
Why do people not understand. You can only offer him the max ELC contract.

Spongolium* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:34 AM
  #584
disgruntleddave
Registered User
 
disgruntleddave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,476
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Provost View Post
The only thing that is almost for certain is that he will be overpaid. Some idiot GM will throw $3 million one way contract his way without him every having played an NHL game.
Except for the fact that he is still subject to an entry level contract. Bonuses can take him up to that level, but probably won't end up being an issue. He'll make basically the same anywhere he goes (not taking taxes into consideration).

disgruntleddave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:40 AM
  #585
Vipers31
Moderator
Advanced Stagnostic
 
Vipers31's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Bergisch Gladbach
Country: Germany
Posts: 10,067
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeus3007 View Post
I haven't been following really close, but Murray and Getzlaf calling out the kid is a bush league move. Even if everything they said is 100% true, that is the kind of thing that should be kept behind closed doors, there is no need in a professional league for these kind of things to be said to the media.
Based on what? They feel betrayed by a kid they drafted with a 2nd round pick, which is a valuble currency in the league. They have kept everything behind close doors for a very long time. If what they say is indeed 100% true, what's the point in letting this slide? When you pull a move like that, you should at least be sure that you're going to hear about it. It could be talked up to be an almost educational move for Schultz (although we know that's not going to change that outcome) and kids facing this situation down the road. You're going to make a lot of fans that invest a lot of time and money in their team very angry. And I'd rather have them angry with a kid that went back on his word (if that's, as indicated and not refuted) than at our GM, who has been with the team for a long time and will be be going forward.

Vipers31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:46 AM
  #586
jax00
DangleSnipe&Celly
 
jax00's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Anaslime
Country: United States
Posts: 8,491
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Based on what? They feel betrayed by a kid they drafted with a 2nd round pick, which is a valuble currency in the league. They have kept everything behind close doors for a very long time. If what they say is indeed 100% true, what's the point in letting this slide? When you pull a move like that, you should at least be sure that you're going to hear about it. It could be talked up to be an almost educational move for Schultz (although we know that's not going to change that outcome) and kids facing this situation down the road. You're going to make a lot of fans that invest a lot of time and money in their team very angry. And I'd rather have them angry with a kid that went back on his word (if that's, as indicated and not refuted) than at our GM, who has been with the team for a long time and will be be going forward.
Pretty much. He had to know this was gonna piss some people off.

You reap what you sow.

jax00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:46 AM
  #587
TheJoeMan
Registered User
 
TheJoeMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Rancho Cucamonga, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 4,056
vCash: 500
Let me break this down for people who are looking at this kid's behavior with rose colored glasses because they want him on their team:

Schultz is drafted 43rd overall in '08 and we're pretty stoked because the scouting report on him is really promising. He might have gone higher if he played in a better league and/or was a little bigger. The consensus is we may have drafted a steal.

Over the next four years Schultz improves every season. He attends two rookie camps and looks good. During this time he has expressed his desire to one day play for the Ducks otherwise he would have been traded long before now. The summer before Gardiner was traded Murray told me personally that the Ducks staff viewed Schultz as a better prospect than Jake Gardiner. Later that season Gardiner is in fact traded and Schultz is retained.

After his sophomore season Murray wanted to sign Schultz very much and Schultz asked him, not told him, ASKED him if he could play his junior year and sign after that. Murray obliged. If he had any indication from this kid at this point that he never intended to play for the Ducks he would have traded him immediately.

Junior year comes around and he has a record breaking season but his team isn't strong. During a Ducks-Blackhawks game Schultz meets with Murray and Boudreau. Murray tells him that once his season is over he can sign and will be inserted into the lineup immediately and get to burn off a year of his entry-level contract. Schultz tells Murray and then Boudreau he can't wait to join the team.

March rolls around and sure enough Wisconsin isn't going to advance to the NCAA tournament and Schultz's season is over whereas the Ducks have about a dozen games left to go. Murray is in Denver to promptly offer Schultz the contract that he assumes this kid has been waiting for his whole life to sign. Says no. Wants to finish school even though the Ducks' season will be over in April and he won't have finals until late May. Fine whatever. You are the jewel in our prospect crowd so take all the time you need.

Rumblings start that this kid wants to go to free agency where he can and would make just as much money with the Ducks as with any other team. He officially leaves school and gives the Ducks 30 days to negotiate a contract. Nothing has been signed and by all indications he will become an unrestricted free agent on July 1st and sign with a different team.

What we Ducks fans are so mad about is this kid clearly lied. Yes he has all the right in the world to do what he's doing but to tell the team that drafted you, that waited four years for you, that traded away a stud prospect in favor of you, that offered you to become an NHL player immediately, that you told you can't wait to play for them and then not even tell them why you are not signing is disgraceful.

If he has legitimate reasons for not signing with the Ducks then let's hear them. If he wants to play on a team close to home fine. Tell us that. If he wants to be on a team that suits his playing style (which the Ducks do) fine. Tell us that. If he simply can't fathom being on a team named after a water fowl, whatever. Effing tell us that. Don't leave us in the dark and put our GM in a position where he can't do anything about it. If this kid had a shred of integrity he would make his intentions plain and suggest the teams he'd like to play for.

That way Murray can trade his rights and salvage at least a scrap of an asset out of this. But no, he's given the entire league the hope that he'll sign with any team, even the Oilers, so why would anybody waste an asset trying to acquire his rights? This kid is a punk. Plain and simple and you can have him.

To defend this kid is ridiculous. He is a great prospect but to pull this crap is unbelievable. The irony is that in this whole situation his status and potential have been blown out of proportion. Had he signed in March he would have played in a dozen pressure-free games and got his feet wet with this team. Our expectations would have been in line with that of a regular rookie. But now he'll have so much more pressure playing for whatever team that signs him and chances aren't great that he'll live up to them. He still is a skinny kid and we don't know how he'll adapt to the speed of the NHL. Good luck Schultz, you little *******.

TheJoeMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:49 AM
  #588
TheJoeMan
Registered User
 
TheJoeMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Rancho Cucamonga, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 4,056
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeus3007 View Post
I haven't been following really close, but Murray and Getzlaf calling out the kid is a bush league move. Even if everything they said is 100% true, that is the kind of thing that should be kept behind closed doors, there is no need in a professional league for these kind of things to be said to the media. I'm not saying Schultz was right for not signing with the Ducks, but the way that organization has handled the situation isn't ideal in my opinion.
We season ticket holders have a right to know what's going on with our team. Our annual investment makes having this team possible. It was behind closed doors, that was a private event. We just happen to want to the world to know this kid is a joke.

What could Murray have done instead? This kid isn't telling them what he wants so how can they do anything any different?

TheJoeMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:51 AM
  #589
FiveAndGame
Registered User
 
FiveAndGame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,465
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DPyro View Post
Leafs can offer that too. The off chance he needs time in the AHL, it's a short distance to the Marlies. This is how the Leafs got Bozak, Gustavsson, Scrivens, Rynnas, Owuya etc.

I think the important part is that Burke believes that Canada's top 20 can "kick the ****" out of the United States top 20.

FiveAndGame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:54 AM
  #590
Unagi
Registered User
 
Unagi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,185
vCash: 500
[QUOTE=TheJoeMan;50762073...[/QUOTE]


Nailed it.

Unagi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:55 AM
  #591
Krazy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,835
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveAndGame View Post
I think the important part is that Burke believes that Canada's top 20 can "kick the ****" out of the United States top 20.
Well who wouldnt believe that?

Krazy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 11:59 AM
  #592
Provost
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 276
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
Why do people not understand. You can only offer him the max ELC contract.
Why do you not understand that a maximum ELC contract pays him well over $3 million including bonuses.

Provost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:02 PM
  #593
Krazy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,835
vCash: 500
Bottom line is... We don't know his reasoning. We can't speculate at this time. Maybe there is something about murray he doesn't like... Who knows, maybe he made inappropriate comments, maybe there is someone in the organization he has a history with, maybe he is gay and someone made homophobic comments so he wants to play for burke because he knows he will be accepted. We don't know what changed for him. On the leafs there were rumors that corson had an affair with mogilny's wife, something similar could have happened here. I have no inside information, I have no idea, but the key is, neither does anyone else here.

Look at all the crazy things that have happened in hockey, graham james, mike danton...... We don't know his reasoning, you never know, he might have a really good one....

Krazy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:04 PM
  #594
Vipers31
Moderator
Advanced Stagnostic
 
Vipers31's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Bergisch Gladbach
Country: Germany
Posts: 10,067
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Provost View Post
Why do you not understand that a maximum ELC contract pays him well over $3 million including bonuses.
If he reaches all those bonuses, yes, it does pay him that. That's entirely unlikely, so those bonuses will mainly refer to cap hit rather than to actually paid dollars. And I think he does understand that, and most do. It's just considered pretty safe to assume that the majority of teams will offer him the maximum amount of bonuses. No team will beat anyone out by paying more here.

Vipers31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:07 PM
  #595
Vipers31
Moderator
Advanced Stagnostic
 
Vipers31's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Bergisch Gladbach
Country: Germany
Posts: 10,067
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krazy View Post
Bottom line is... We don't know his reasoning. We can't speculate at this time. Maybe there is something about murray he doesn't like... Who knows, maybe he made inappropriate comments, maybe there is someone in the organization he has a history with, maybe he is gay and someone made homophobic comments so he wants to play for burke because he knows he will be accepted. We don't know what changed for him. On the leafs there were rumors that corson had an affair with mogilny's wife, something similar could have happened here. I have no inside information, I have no idea, but the key is, neither does anyone else here.
It's fair to regard those possibilities, I suppose, but in order to give him a pass on these actions, the obligation to provide really is on him. And he has had chances constantly and refuses to. His silence in the lights of the facts we do have doesn't really make me want to award him the benefit of the doubt (for being in the moral right as well as being within his formal rights).

Vipers31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:10 PM
  #596
Spongolium*
Potato Magician
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bridgend,UK
Country: Wales
Posts: 8,653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Provost View Post
Why do you not understand that a maximum ELC contract pays him well over $3 million including bonuses.
Those bonuses have to be met, and there are certain rules on what you can offer him.

Spongolium* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:13 PM
  #597
Homesick
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Homesick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,961
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Based on what? They feel betrayed by a kid they drafted with a 2nd round pick, which is a valuble currency in the league.
Not that valuable if they gave up one for Andrew Cogliano.

I think I'll just dig up all the arguments from Duck fans for as to why Chris Pronger wasn't a POS for what he pulled. He didn't just say he was committed to the Oilers....he signed a ****ing contract and then went public 3 days after the SC final and demanded a trade. I'm sure Duck fans will have some lame ass excuse as to why its a different situation. "it was Prongers right, and Schultz is just an evil dick"

Homesick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:20 PM
  #598
Provost
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 276
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
If he reaches all those bonuses, yes, it does pay him that. That's entirely unlikely, so those bonuses will mainly refer to cap hit rather than to actually paid dollars. And I think he does understand that, and most do. It's just considered pretty safe to assume that the majority of teams will offer him the maximum amount of bonuses. No team will beat anyone out by paying more here.
Yes... hence my original comment. The only that is almost certain is that some idiot GM is going to pay him $3 million dollars.

Provost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:23 PM
  #599
nbducksfan19
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 703
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krazy View Post
Bottom line is... We don't know his reasoning. We can't speculate at this time. Maybe there is something about murray he doesn't like... Who knows, maybe he made inappropriate comments, maybe there is someone in the organization he has a history with, maybe he is gay and someone made homophobic comments so he wants to play for burke because he knows he will be accepted. We don't know what changed for him. On the leafs there were rumors that corson had an affair with mogilny's wife, something similar could have happened here. I have no inside information, I have no idea, but the key is, neither does anyone else here.

Look at all the crazy things that have happened in hockey, graham james, mike danton...... We don't know his reasoning, you never know, he might have a really good one....
And that is fine - I assume he does have a reason and perhaps it is a very good one. The problem is there was a plethora of avenues he could have gone down to get what he wanted that would have been much more appropriate - instead he decided to lie and hide while he screwed the team that drafted and believed in him.

nbducksfan19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-11-2012, 12:35 PM
  #600
zeus3007*
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Red Deer, Alberta
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheJoeMan View Post
We season ticket holders have a right to know what's going on with our team. Our annual investment makes having this team possible. It was behind closed doors, that was a private event. We just happen to want to the world to know this kid is a joke.

What could Murray have done instead? This kid isn't telling them what he wants so how can they do anything any different?
Talk about a sense of entitlement. Season ticket holders have a right to watch the games that you pay for, like any other fan who is supporting the team. You could just as easily say that large sponsors have a right to know what's going on, because according to your logic, their annual investment makes having a team possible. Buying season tickets doesn't make you entitled to behind the scenes knowledge. The Ducks certainly look like the victim here, but dragging the kid through the mud is very unprofessional. I have no problem with Murray making public statements, but insinuating that he is a liar and attacking him is a b.s. move. It makes Murray sound like a bitter ex-girlfriend, not the leader of a professional hockey team.

zeus3007* is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:41 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.