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Should the Wild Trade for Jordan Staal?

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06-21-2012, 11:36 AM
  #1
forthewild
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Should the Wild Trade for Jordan Staal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GopherState View Post
Only issue I have with the Cuma pick was that given who was around him there was no need to trade up one spot. Dougie got played so bad on that one.
DR wanted to make a splash, it's just thr his version of a splash is a 30 foot belly flop.

What would you guys say to

7th
Seto to pit


Staal
Pit 1st to Minnesota

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06-21-2012, 11:38 AM
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How many times can I pass before being accused of being a narc?

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06-21-2012, 11:43 AM
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How many times can I pass before being accused of being a narc?
Three max.

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06-21-2012, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by GopherState View Post
How many times can I pass before being accused of being a narc?
If you buy that GMCF trades based on history staal is as good as ours.

I just want it to be Friday

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06-21-2012, 11:51 AM
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D U M B A
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
DR wanted to make a splash, it's just thr his version of a splash is a 30 foot belly flop.

What would you guys say to

7th
Seto to pit


Staal
Pit 1st to Minnesota
Yes, if Staal was extended. That's it, I wouldn't want to take the chance otherwise. But I do think he would garner a bidding war and we probably wouldn't be getting their first back in the trade.

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06-21-2012, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forthewild View Post
If you buy that GMCF trades based on history staal is as good as ours.

I just want it to be Friday
Don't get me wrong, I can see Fletcher being interested in Staal (and Bobby Ryan for that matter) based on past history. That's just a bad trade short and long term for Minnesota. At best Jordan Staal is a #2C signed long-term at a lot more money than Setoguchi and at worst the Wild missed out on a top-ten pick, have more holes in the top-six and saw Staal walk away after a year. Even if Staal plays the one year in St. Paul, how much better is the team with him instead of Setoguchi?

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06-21-2012, 11:56 AM
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If it's just Seto + 7th it's not so bad for Staal + 22nd even if it's a one year left thing. Seto is gone in two years anyway, so you only lose a year on his deal. Yeah moving down would suck but to get a better player that makes your team better it would be worth it IMO.

Staal wouldn't be a #2C "at best", he'd be the 1B to Mikko's 1A. I compared their stats before and they are INCREDIBLY close, with Mikko being a bit more of a playmaker and Staal being a bit more of a power forward.

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06-21-2012, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
If it's just Seto + 7th it's not so bad for Staal + 22nd even if it's a one year left thing. Seto is gone in two years anyway, so you only lose a year on his deal. Yeah moving down would suck but to get a better player that makes your team better it would be worth it IMO.

Staal wouldn't be a #2C "at best", he'd be the 1B to Mikko's 1A. I compared their stats before and they are INCREDIBLY close, with Mikko being a bit more of a playmaker and Staal being a bit more of a power forward.
It's not big enough of a difference to give up 15 picks in this year's first round. That's a move a team makes if the window's closing and with Minnesota the pie is still in the oven.

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06-21-2012, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GopherState View Post
It's not big enough of a difference to give up 15 picks in this year's first round. That's a move a team makes if the window's closing and with Minnesota the pie is still in the oven.
True but would you do the trade if Staal was extended?

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06-21-2012, 12:15 PM
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No way does PIT bite on that, unless they are completely desperate.

To whoever said trade back for TBL's two picks. I agree, but Skjei at 20? Why not just trade back with the number twenty pick and pick up a second round if their heart is set on him.

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06-21-2012, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
If it's just Seto + 7th it's not so bad for Staal + 22nd even if it's a one year left thing. Seto is gone in two years anyway, so you only lose a year on his deal. Yeah moving down would suck but to get a better player that makes your team better it would be worth it IMO.

Staal wouldn't be a #2C "at best", he'd be the 1B to Mikko's 1A. I compared their stats before and they are INCREDIBLY close, with Mikko being a bit more of a playmaker and Staal being a bit more of a power forward.
I'd only make that trade if we could have a new LTC agreed to in principle with Staal before the pulling the trigger.

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06-21-2012, 12:17 PM
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Staals spend some of their summers here, so I'm sure he wouldn't totally appose the idea of Minnesota.

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06-21-2012, 12:18 PM
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The only way I make that trade is if we can talk to Staal and work out an extension before pulling the trigger, otherwise he's just a rental for this year, and I don't see us making cup runs for at least another two years.

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06-21-2012, 12:19 PM
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I can't find my other post, but here are the numbers the past three years.

Goals per 60 minutes TOI / Points per 60 minutes TOI
(quality of competition / forward rank on the team)

5v5

2011-12
Koivu 0.50 / 1.58 (0.028 / 5th)
Staal 0.99 / 2.30 (0.061 / 2nd)

2010-11
Koivu 0.49 / 2.19 (0.031 / 3rd)
Staal 0.68 / 1.84 (0.031 / 4th)

2009-10
Koivu 0.68 / 2.09 (0.007 / 7th)
Staal 0.92 / 2.11 (0.044 / 3rd)


5v4

2011-12
Koivu 0.67 / 3.70
Staal 1.98 / 2.96

2010-11
Koivu 1.41 / 5.06
Staal 0.93 / 2.33

2009-10
Koivu 1.61 / 5.74
Staal 0.40 / 1.19


It shows that Mikko is a better playmaker for sure but Staal is a slightly better goal scorer. Of course there are discrepancies with linemates. But you can also see Staal typically faced a little tougher competition as the third line center although Mikko did have strong matchups as well.

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06-21-2012, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avder View Post
The only way I make that trade is if we can talk to Staal and work out an extension before pulling the trigger, otherwise he's just a rental for this year, and I don't see us making cup runs for at least another two years.
That's why I like building around Seto in the trade. He's basically a two-year rental anyway.

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06-21-2012, 12:21 PM
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Sweet stats Jarick.

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06-21-2012, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
That's why I like building around Seto in the trade. He's basically a two-year rental anyway.
Honestly I want to see what Seto can do on a team that is not the worst offense in the league, and in a year where he's not recovering from getting hit by a car, before I start calling him a rental.

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06-21-2012, 12:24 PM
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Agreed. I don't wanna trade 30 goal scorers so easy.

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06-21-2012, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avder View Post
Honestly I want to see what Seto can do on a team that is not the worst offense in the league, and in a year where he's not recovering from getting hit by a car, before I start calling him a rental.
Here you go:

Year A) 20 goals, 16 assists, 36 points in 70 games
Year B) 22 goals, 19 assists, 41 points in 72 games

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06-21-2012, 12:27 PM
  #20
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Originally Posted by Utterly Disgusting View Post
True but would you do the trade if Staal was extended?
Not that exact trade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Victorious Secret View Post
No way does PIT bite on that, unless they are completely desperate.

To whoever said trade back for TBL's two picks. I agree, but Skjei at 20? Why not just trade back with the number twenty pick and pick up a second round if their heart is set on him.
Reminds me of something I never posted here. Future Wild play-by-play guy giving an homage to his predecessor and showing off his great Draft mind.

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06-21-2012, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Victorious Secret View Post
Agreed. I don't wanna trade 30 goal scorers so easy.
I'd call him a 20-goal scorer, and with Lats coming back and Granlund coming in, shouldn't be an issue.

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06-21-2012, 12:48 PM
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Since 2004, Jordan Staal is arguably better than every player drafted #6-10 (I'd argue Couture is the only one better, but all that's debatable). That's how weak the #7 pick really is.

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06-21-2012, 12:52 PM
  #23
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Definitely. Thats why they should keep the trading option open. I always forget how young Staal is, seems like he would be around for so long. He's only 23.

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06-21-2012, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
That's just ridiculous. One year of Brent Burns got Setoguchi + Coyle + move up in the draft. Staal is in that same tier of player.
Agreed. Remember there were some good debates about the value of a Burns-Staal straight up trade. It's just that the reasons for why San Jose would trade for a year of Burns are much different to Minnesota. Staal wouldn't be a final piece for the Wild to put them over the top and that's why I value the #7 pick more than him.

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06-21-2012, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GopherState View Post
Agreed. Remember there were some good debates about the value of a Burns-Staal straight up trade. It's just that the reasons for why San Jose would trade for a year of Burns are much different to Minnesota. Staal wouldn't be a final piece for the Wild to put them over the top and that's why I value the #7 pick more than him.
Value wise, I would normally say Staal for #7 is worth it.

But agreed, we aren't at the point yet and the #7 pick holds more value considering where the team is right now with the youth movement.

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