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Chris Stewart to Detroit

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Old
06-08-2012, 10:17 PM
  #51
DatsyukToZetterberg
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Originally Posted by CarvinSigX View Post
That doesn't mean we want Quincey...Because we don't.
But you guys are looking for a #1 dman I swear Quincey is that...Pinky Promise...

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Old
06-08-2012, 10:20 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by DatsyukToZetterberg View Post
But you guys are looking for a #1 dman I swear Quincey is that...Pinky Promise...
Well, we wouldn't want to deprive you of Lidstrom's replacement then...

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Old
06-09-2012, 02:20 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by ZetterBurger View Post
Instead of arguing over who is worth more or what needs to be added, why can't we all just realize that the Detroit Red Wings and St. Louis Blues will not be making any trades with each other? There is no sense in giving your rival anybody that could make them better.
If only someone would have told that to Toronto before they made all those trades with Boston

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06-09-2012, 03:14 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Multimoodia View Post
Of course you do.

Likely also a very fair offer for Perron, seeing as how DP57 just came off a long injury this past year.
Don't put words in my mouth. Perron for Quincey isn't even close. Getting a top 4 dman for a guy who struggled all season, has had problems with consistency and intensity isn't a bad offer. I'm not saying there isn't an incentive for St.Louis not to do the deal, as obviously they can hope Stewart rebounds but at the current moment it is a reasonable offer. I find it odd how before the playoffs started Penner was worth nothing after one bad season, yet Stewart has retained all/most of his worth still. Seems like a double standard.

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Old
06-09-2012, 03:33 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
Don't put words in my mouth. Perron for Quincey isn't even close.
Perron not enough then? This is getting awfully, awfully steep.

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Old
06-09-2012, 03:34 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
Getting a top 4 dman for a guy who struggled all season, has had problems with consistency and intensity isn't a bad offer. I'm not saying there isn't an incentive for St.Louis not to do the deal, as obviously they can hope Stewart rebounds but at the current moment it is a reasonable offer. I find it odd how before the playoffs started Penner was worth nothing after one bad season, yet Stewart has retained all/most of his worth still. Seems like a double standard.
I find it odd you refer to Quincey as a top 4 without snickering.

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Old
06-09-2012, 03:35 PM
  #57
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I'd rather keep Quincey..

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06-09-2012, 04:03 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
Don't put words in my mouth. Perron for Quincey isn't even close.
Well, you're right about that, at least... it would take a lot more than Kyle Quincey for the Blues to even entertain the possibility of moving Perron, especially to a division rival.

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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
Getting a top 4 dman for a guy who struggled all season, has had problems with consistency and intensity isn't a bad offer.
In the first place, Quincey is not necessarily a "top 4 d-man" on the Blues. The only way he'd play on the first pairing with Pietrangelo would be if he came to camp and completely outshone Ian Cole, in whom the Blues have invested a first-round selection and several years of development time.

The Toronto Star website actually lists Quincey fifth on the Wings' depth chart, behind Kronwall, Stuart, Ericsson and White.

Send a real left-shooting "top 4 d-man" the Blues' way, and we'll talk. Problem is, the Wings really don't have a spare left-shooting defenseman that would be a good fit as Pietrangelo's partner, and that is better than anything the Blues already have.

Kronwall is about the only left-shooting defenseman the Wings have that would be anything close to a fit in the Blues' top four, and the Wings aren't likely to be trading him.

Secondly, as to Stewart's consistency, what do you not understand about the fact that Stewart is best in a run-and-gun type of offense with a playmaking center at his side, and that the Blues do not play a run-and-gun style of offense, nor do they have a real playmaking center to play alongside Stewart?

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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
I find it odd how before the playoffs started Penner was worth nothing after one bad season, yet Stewart has retained all/most of his worth still. Seems like a double standard.
You're comparing apples to oranges here.

And show me one post, by anyone with more than two brain cells to rub together, who directly stated that Penner was "worth nothing" before the start of the playoffs.

Smart fans -- and certainly, NHL general managers -- know that one substandard season does not necessarily establish a player's value. Especially a young player who was a first-round draft pick not so long ago, and who scored 28 goals in back-to-back seasons while playing in a system that was better suited to maximize his strengths than the system the Blues are currently employing.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:05 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
Don't put words in my mouth. Perron for Quincey isn't even close. Getting a top 4 dman for a guy who struggled all season, has had problems with consistency and intensity isn't a bad offer. I'm not saying there isn't an incentive for St.Louis not to do the deal, as obviously they can hope Stewart rebounds but at the current moment it is a reasonable offer. I find it odd how before the playoffs started Penner was worth nothing after one bad season, yet Stewart has retained all/most of his worth still. Seems like a double standard.
Agreed, the Blues hang up faster than the speed of light.

Quincey isn't near enough to get one of our most talented forwards.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:06 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by PocketNines View Post
Do you mean "bring up Kronwall" in the sense that he said all of us know there's no way such a deal would happen with that? How the *** can a poster be taken seriously that no deal would happen ... so you're saying a deal would happen? Wow then maybe we should consider this Kronwall thing
Huh? I'm saying the suggestion that Kronwall has anything to do with a Stewart proposal is absurd. If i was in a Ryan Jones/Sam Gagner proposal with Detroit i wouldn't bring up Kronwall, because it isn't even close to in the cards. Just because he wrote i know it would never happen, doesn't make the suggestion any less absurd. I'm more than well aware he wasn't proposing a deal, but what was the purpose of his comment? Enlighten me please.

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The Blues have very particular, very specific needs. In the places where there is no need, the Blues are totally set and don't need other types of pieces back. We wouldn't want Kyle Quincey basically if he were just lying around to pick up for a reasonable free agent deal. And the reason is we're covered there. What, the Blues should just execute a trade for a redundant piece (setting aside having zero interest in Quincey specifically) because how dare we think we can address the actual needs we have? That's stupid and it's a worse option than keeping our own asset until a different option is available somewhere.
I'm not advocating a Quincey Stewart swap for anybody, i'm saying in a vacume the value is fair. That is all. To believe that it's an unreasonable proposal seems to be either overrating Stewart or underrating Quincey. Stewart struggled and his value is at a low.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:08 PM
  #61
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Since the Avs had both Quincey and Stewart, I can tell you, its not even close. Blues need to hang on to Stewart and not make any rash decisions.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:09 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Are you seriously comparing Jones to Stewart? LOL
No how do you figure i did? I compared a scenario not two particular players. Nice straw man.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:10 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Multimoodia View Post
Perron not enough then? This is getting awfully, awfully steep.
I'm going to assume this is a joke... I obviously believe Perron to be the superior asset.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:10 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Pure View Post
Since the Avs had both Quincey and Stewart, I can tell you, its not even close. Blues need to hang on to Stewart and not make any rash decisions.
Agreed. Stewart has the potential to be MUCH better than Quincey.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:11 PM
  #65
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I love how this is a Blues-Wings thread, and it's an Oilers fan that is getting people aggravated. Every sensible Blues and Wings fan knows that no deal between these two teams of any significance will ever happen.

BTW, thanks for Oates and Unger.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:14 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Eskimo44 View Post
I'm not advocating a Quincey Stewart swap for anybody, i'm saying in a vacume the value is fair. That is all. To believe that it's an unreasonable proposal seems to be either overrating Stewart or underrating Quincey.
In an effort to keep the lines of communication open and to ensure misunderstandings are kept to the bare minimum, I went through the Red Wings' roster as well as their prospects.
I could not find the player "Quincey" that would be a fair value swap.

Could you kindly inform me which player you would be referring to?

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:16 PM
  #67
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Stewart isn't going to make your offense tougher. Sure, he's a tough guy who no one should fight, but he doesn't work hard enough. The Wings need some guys who are going to close on opposing defensemen quick and make them pay. Stewart won't bring that consistently. He's one of the most night and day kind of guy I've seen. He had stretches where he looked like a 40 goal player in the making, but all of a sudden looked like a career AHLer.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:18 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by BlueDream View Post
You need to stop talking. Ryan Jones has not accomplished near what Stewart has in their short careers.
That's not my point. If you don't understand what i'm saying i can't help you unless you ask me to extrapolate. Perhaps instead of deciding i said something different than what i did because of the ambiguity of my statement made it too hard for you to grasp my point (which is fair) you could just ask what i meant. I never called Jones Stewarts equal. Although Jones did outscore him this year, and that was in a checking role so he's probably closer in worth that you believe. Still i do believe Stewart to be the much more valuable player.

Quote:
Honestly, how many times have you seen Blues fans make proposals involving Stewart on this board? I'll answer it for you: Very rarely. Notice how it's usually ALWAYS another team asking for him to get him a change of scenery? Yeah. We could move him if we get a good offer like a d-man to play with Pietrangelo (not Quincey) but never have we acted like he could get us some superstar. The Blues will likely keep Stewart though and give him another chance.
So just because Edmonton fans don't try and move lets say Nick Schultz, it means we can ask for unrealistic returns or insinuate they are the only ways we would move such a player? We can determine fair value on here, it's not like it results in a real trade. I never said Blues fans were expecting a superstar in a 1 for 1 trade, but bringing up Kronwall isn't that far off from establishing such a ridiculos motive.

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Nobody was proposing Stewart for Kronwall. He was saying Kronwall is their only defenseman we would want.
So if somebody offers a proposal for Sam Gagner, lets say Nashville. Is it reasonable for me to say only Suter or Weber would suffice? Of course not. If you want Kronwall how does this have anything to do with a guy who scored 30 ****ing points. Do you not realize how good Kronwall is? That's absurd to even bring it up. Kronwall is far from the only player/defenseman on Detroit that provides value for Stewart. St.Louis fans can hope all they want that they recieve the player they desire, but Kronwall is not going to be had in a deal for Stewart or any asset resembling him. It's absurd to bring up Kronwall in a Stewart proposal. Even if you qualify it with comment, "i know it would never happen".

Quote:
Learn to read, your credibility is just awful.
Why because you don't like my comments? When did i say that he proposed a Kronwall for Stewart trade? I didn't. Your claims of comments i made are greatly exaggerated. I was insinuating the suggestion of Kronwall being the only asset worthy of moving Stewart was absurd, as is bringing him up in a Stewart proposal. Perhaps you are the one who should learn how to read, or at least ask me to extrapolate before putting words in my mouth...

What is this talk about "credibility" for? Do you, the consensus, or anybody else on this forum define what "credible" is? How much "credibility" does anybody have on a ****ing trade forum? Should credibility not be determined on a case by case basis, or is it appropriate to you to establish a bias against those who disagree? Is this forum about "credibility", or is it about displaying your honest evaluations and opinions? If your attempted perogative in your statements is to be "credible" in the eyes of your fellow posters perhaps you should concern yourself less with the perceptions of others and more on making your own honest evaluations (that can be in concert with the evaluations of others, but should not be limited by them either). Perspective is something i cannot offer beyond my own, why should i sacrifice it in order to be more "credible" to someone such as yourself? Affability or aggreeability does not make someone more "credible" in the true sense of the word, but that is clearly your expectation for me to become more "credible" to you. One's own perspective and that of others will not always coincide, nor will one validate the other. On top of that worring about being "credible" to people who cannot establish much in terms of credibility is rather foolish for two reasons. 1. You can't control the perceptions of others; 2. The perceptions of others are irrelevant to one's own, with exception only to how their critical evaluations can enhance one's own considerations, as they should not define them. So you'r claims of credibilty and it's apparent importance i would counter-claim are rather overstated and irrelevant to the determinations of validity in my comments. Clearly to me it seems your issue is that you misunderstand/can't read, or you are not happy with the affability of my statements. That is an issue far different than one relating to "credibility".

In saying this i wrote all of this before i realized you were the delightful poster to call another fellow a "moron". So stay classy there bud. Had i realized that before i may not have wasted my time, as a person who responds with such repugnance probably isn't the most considerate of fellows.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:19 PM
  #69
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Chris Stewart is a too good fighter to play for Detroit

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06-09-2012, 04:20 PM
  #70
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Eskimo is the only one who cares about this.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:21 PM
  #71
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Well this thread just got a whole lot more entertaining.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:24 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
I love how this is a Blues-Wings thread, and it's an Oilers fan that is getting people aggravated. Every sensible Blues and Wings fan knows that no deal between these two teams of any significance will ever happen.

BTW, thanks for Oates and Unger.
I don't know we must not have a lot of sensible fans you would be amazed how much this guys name is brought up over on the wings board even though it will never happen.

As for the last line, why go there?

Worst trade in Wings history.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:24 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
I love how this is a Blues-Wings thread, and it's an Oilers fan that is getting people aggravated. Every sensible Blues and Wings fan knows that no deal between these two teams of any significance will ever happen.

BTW, thanks for Oates and Unger.
You do know that i called a deal between the two teams unlikely in either my 1st or 2nd post right?lol

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:25 PM
  #74
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Eskimo is the only one who cares about this.
It's rather odd that for somebody who doesn't care you would resort to insulting someone by calling them a moron.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:26 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
I don't know we must not have a lot of sensible fans you would be amazed how much this guys name is brought up over on the wings board even though it will never happen.

As for the last line, why go there?

Worst trade in Wings history.
Really, lol.

As I was writing how our teams' will never make a trade of significance, those 2 names popped in my head, I couldn't resist lol.

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