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Luongo X - The GM Who Loved Me (Mod warning in OP)

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:02 PM
  #251
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
To Leafs fans proposing Carter Ashton, Cody Franson and a deuce ...

I think thats a very fair deal. I'd accept.
Is the deuce Mike Komisarek?

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06-09-2012, 04:04 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
To Leafs fans proposing Carter Ashton, Cody Franson and a deuce ...

I think thats a very fair deal. I'd accept.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

None of those players/picks are likely to contribute anything to our roster.

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06-09-2012, 04:10 PM
  #253
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

None of those players/picks are likely to contribute anything to our roster.

Gillis wants to get bigger and younger. This trade does exactly that.

Franson is 6'5, 215 and Ashton is 6'3, 215.

The deuce is basically a late first. Potential to trade up from #26 is there.

All in all, I think its reasonable.

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06-09-2012, 04:13 PM
  #254
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Originally Posted by Cuckoo4Canucks View Post
Bah. This Canucks fan, for one, doesn't really want Luongo traded at all.

We all know how things went in the 2011 finals. That being said, I would rather keep Lu between the pipes and ransom off Schneider to the highest bidder.
As a Flames fan I whole heartedly agree.

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06-09-2012, 04:16 PM
  #255
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Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
Gillis wants to get bigger and younger. This trade does exactly that.
He meant players on the ice not AHL prospects or 6/7th defensemen.

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Old
06-09-2012, 04:23 PM
  #256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
Gillis wants to get bigger and younger. This trade does exactly that.

Franson is 6'5, 215 and Ashton is 6'3, 215.

The deuce is basically a late first. Potential to trade up from #26 is there.

All in all, I think its reasonable.
We accept a player that may never see the light of day in our system (think a bigger, meaner Parent) and a solid prospect...that we have in our system already (from what I've seen) in Jensen. Ashton might be better, I can't say I'd be the one the evenly rate the two, but where is the improvement to our roster? At least if it was Kadri or Colborne, the prospect in question would give us something we don't have in our pool.

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06-09-2012, 04:29 PM
  #257
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Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
We accept a player that may never see the light of day in our system (think a bigger, meaner Parent) and a solid prospect...that we have in our system already (from what I've seen) in Jensen. Ashton might be better, I can't say I'd be the one the evenly rate the two, but where is the improvement to our roster? At least if it was Kadri or Colborne, the prospect in question would give us something we don't have in our pool.
Seeing as the Leafs don't have a quality centre on their roster, I figured Kadri would be out of play. And Colbourne, I just have a feeling he'll be a disappointment.

I'm big on power forward prospects, and wanted us to take Ashton in his draft year. I've always been high on him. And Fransons package is a great one to have. He needs a bit of polishing, but I think he'd be a good fit here.

Just my $0.02, But I think this is fair value given Luongos age.

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06-09-2012, 04:33 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
Seeing as the Leafs don't have a quality centre on their roster, I figured Kadri would be out of play. And Colbourne, I just have a feeling he'll be a disappointment.

I'm big on power forward prospects, and wanted us to take Ashton in his draft year. I've always been high on him. And Fransons package is a great one to have. He needs a bit of polishing, but I think he'd be a good fit here.

Just my $0.02, But I think this is fair value given Luongos age.
If they draft a centre with the 5th, they don't need Kadri. And goalies have a longer shelf life than skaters. And I honestly see this as a bag of pucks. Quite literally no one cracks our roster. I'd take Jensen and Kassian before Ashton. I'd much rather a centre prospect, as I am not sold on Schroeder at the moment.

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06-09-2012, 04:37 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
Seeing as the Leafs don't have a quality centre on their roster, I figured Kadri would be out of play. And Colbourne, I just have a feeling he'll be a disappointment.

I'm big on power forward prospects, and wanted us to take Ashton in his draft year. I've always been high on him. And Fransons package is a great one to have. He needs a bit of polishing, but I think he'd be a good fit here.

Just my $0.02, But I think this is fair value given Luongos age.
Can't get with out a little give. I hardly consider the promise of Ashton a sure thing compared to Colborne (who is at least a large center who could be retrained as a Boyle-type defensive specialist if his offense doesn't continue to improve). I'm not saying I'd jump on this if it was Colborne or Kadri either, but they would fill more of a void then Ashton would versus Jensen/Kassian.

I like Franson, I really do, but we have prospects with a higher ceiling then he seems to have, and he's not cracking our roster with his current skill set. I don't see the value there for us either.

His age is a concern now? Yeessh. Agree to disagree there.

DJOpus brought this up a few pages back:

2 of Colborne, Ashton, or Kadri (Leafs choice) + Lombardi (dump) + 2013 1st + 2nd for Luongo (+Malholtra - if he is willing to waive his NTC).

This is one Canucks fan paraphrasing another. If we're talking futures, this is what I'd be looking at, +/-. Pop in any of LACK in Lombardi's place, my preference would be Armstrong. Honestly, I could live without the 2nd round pick as well if it came down to it, but obviously prefer to have it in there.

Again, I stress we don't make good trading partners, but there it is.

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06-09-2012, 04:37 PM
  #260
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Luongo for Kulemin + Schenn

Could see that happening.. both seem like reclamation projects and anybody who knows Gillis knows he likes those type of players. Kulemin is only 1 season removed from a 30 goal season and is quite big at 225 lbs. Schenn adds size as well. Both can have an immediate impact.

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Old
06-09-2012, 05:00 PM
  #261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Can't get with out a little give. I hardly consider the promise of Ashton a sure thing compared to Colborne (who is at least a large center who could be retrained as a Boyle-type defensive specialist if his offense doesn't continue to improve). I'm not saying I'd jump on this if it was Colborne or Kadri either, but they would fill more of a void then Ashton would versus Jensen/Kassian.

I like Franson, I really do, but we have prospects with a higher ceiling then he seems to have, and he's not cracking our roster with his current skill set. I don't see the value there for us either.

His age is a concern now? Yeessh. Agree to disagree there.

DJOpus brought this up a few pages back:

2 of Colborne, Ashton, or Kadri (Leafs choice) + Lombardi (dump) + 2013 1st + 2nd for Luongo (+Malholtra - if he is willing to waive his NTC).

This is one Canucks fan paraphrasing another. If we're talking futures, this is what I'd be looking at, +/-. Pop in any of LACK in Lombardi's place, my preference would be Armstrong. Honestly, I could live without the 2nd round pick as well if it came down to it, but obviously prefer to have it in there.

Again, I stress we don't make good trading partners, but there it is.
What I meant with his age is he has likely 3-4 more years of top shelf performance in him. To get 2 young players with 10+ years left in them and the 34th pick (potential to upgrade from 26th) isn't a bad return.

I'm frequently wrong about which prospects will boom or bust. It's just a feeling I have about Colbourne.

If we can get more for Luongo, that's fantastic. But realistically, I think this is the type of return we're looking at and I'll take it.

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06-09-2012, 05:03 PM
  #262
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
Can't get with out a little give. I hardly consider the promise of Ashton a sure thing compared to Colborne (who is at least a large center who could be retrained as a Boyle-type defensive specialist if his offense doesn't continue to improve). I'm not saying I'd jump on this if it was Colborne or Kadri either, but they would fill more of a void then Ashton would versus Jensen/Kassian.

I like Franson, I really do, but we have prospects with a higher ceiling then he seems to have, and he's not cracking our roster with his current skill set. I don't see the value there for us either.

His age is a concern now? Yeessh. Agree to disagree there.

DJOpus brought this up a few pages back:

2 of Colborne, Ashton, or Kadri (Leafs choice) + Lombardi (dump) + 2013 1st + 2nd for Luongo (+Malholtra - if he is willing to waive his NTC).

This is one Canucks fan paraphrasing another. If we're talking futures, this is what I'd be looking at, +/-. Pop in any of LACK in Lombardi's place, my preference would be Armstrong. Honestly, I could live without the 2nd round pick as well if it came down to it, but obviously prefer to have it in there.

Again, I stress we don't make good trading partners, but there it is.
I watch a lot of Leafs games as my room-mate is from Toronto. I really think Franson would thrive in our system. He just always looks sold in his own end and is not a bad puck mover at all.

I would be into something around Colbourne, Ashton, Franson, Lombardi(cap dump), 2012 2nd for Luongo, Malhotra. I am not really high on Kadri myself, just don't see him panning out.

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06-09-2012, 05:10 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by arshonagon View Post
I watch a lot of Leafs games as my room-mate is from Toronto. I really think Franson would thrive in our system. He just always looks sold in his own end and is not a bad puck mover at all.

I would be into something around Colbourne, Ashton, Franson, Lombardi(cap dump), 2012 2nd for Luongo, Malhotra. I am not really high on Kadri myself, just don't see him panning out.
Dont think you will be netting to of our top prospects.

Ashton to us is Jensen to you.
Colborne to us is probably a notch or a bit lower than Hodgson was when he came in.
Franson is probably akin to a 2nd, and another 2nd, and only a one year cap dump in lombo?

Ill pass.

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06-09-2012, 05:45 PM
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
To Leafs fans proposing Carter Ashton, Cody Franson and a deuce ...

I think thats a very fair deal. I'd accept.
Well I see that things have gone down hill since I agreed to a deal with Leafs fans...thanks for screwing us over as Canucks fans.

I had agreed two of Ashton, Colborne, or Kadri (Leafs choice) + Lombardi (dump) + 2012 2nd + 2013 1st (top 5 protected for one year) for Luongo + Malholtra (if Malholtra agrees to waive NTC, if not, Raymond or nobody - their choice).

Quote:
Originally Posted by KlattNazty View Post
Dont think you will be netting to of our top prospects.

Ashton to us is Jensen to you.
Colborne to us is probably a notch or a bit lower than Hodgson was when he came in.
Franson is probably akin to a 2nd, and another 2nd, and only a one year cap dump in lombo?

Ill pass.
That's certainly an option.

I don't see the Canucks giving up a recent Veizna finalist on a $5.3M deal for scraps regardless of what Bob MacKenzie says.

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06-09-2012, 07:34 PM
  #265
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Wow, Canucks fans you guys are epic fail. You've been owned and played so badly by Leafs fans, a lot of you guys are willing to settle for a bunch of scraps. Yes. Bunch of scraps. Just because a bunch of them think Luongo to them is only worth something little like Colburne, a 2nd pick and a defencemen, doesn't mean Mike Gillis thinks this way. I applaud you Leafs fans, for dictating the value of Roberto Luongo. I can't believe some CAnucks fans are falling for this. Also love the way you guys hyped Jake Gardiner. He is a young decent defencemen, hyped so badly, that now a lot of Canucks like him. For what reason? I have no clue. Good job Leafs fans.

Going to say it right now, Canucks fans and Leafs, are all off on Luongo's value. Just one sentence, Gillis to Burke.

"(Insert gms first name), you gotta do better then this, I have 4 other teams interested in him. "

That's all it takes. Mike Gillis can say, "(insert hockey team) has offered (insert package). Can you do better then this."?

That's all it takes guys. Something garbage like this. A bid war happens, and he will chose from the best package.

Franson 2nd and Colburne, will not even get accepted even if Toronto makes the only offer. You Leafs fans have to really stop dreaming, and stop thinking that the Canucks are screwed if they don't trade Luongo to the Leafs. You guys also have to stop thinking only Toronto is in play. There will be at least 6 teams interested in Luongo, what makes you think you guys can lowball MIke Gillis offering spare parts for an all star goalie? We defencemens that can already perform better then Franson, the Canucks can also survive without Colbune, and that 2nd round pick might not even help us for 5 years. What is this? Some sort of bad joke? It won't work this way, it won't happen. The Leafs will have to offer something that they are not willing to give up, wether you Leafs fans like it or not. You guys think, hes worth Komaserek and a 2nd round pick?? you guys are just laughable as these CAnucks fans who think Luongo is only worth a Luke Schenn, or not even worth a Jake Gardiner.

Lets put it this way. Leafs fans..

1. I gaurantee this one thing, Toronto is the only interested team in Luongo. Leafs will be competing against other teams for Luongo.
2. Vancouver have the rights to request for any players on the Leafs.
Brian Burke of course have every right to reject.
3. Vancouver Canucks will not be screwed if they have Luongo and Schneider starting next season. Even if we sign Schneider. That's one of the plans already.
4. MIke Gillis is not interested in any Toronto Maple Leafs players. Down the list. ONe reason why Cody HOdgson was not offered to the Laffs. There are no players Mike Gillis is interested in.
5. Mike Gillis will not make a trade just for the sake of doing it.
6. The Toronto Maple Leafs have players that might improve the Canucks bottom pairing dman, or their bottom 6 fowards.
7.

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06-09-2012, 07:50 PM
  #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lawrence View Post
Wow, Canucks fans you guys are epic fail. You've been owned and played so badly by Leafs fans, a lot of you guys are willing to settle for a bunch of scraps. Yes. Bunch of scraps. Just because a bunch of them think Luongo to them is only worth something little like Colburne, a 2nd pick and a defencemen, doesn't mean Mike Gillis thinks this way. I applaud you Leafs fans, for dictating the value of Roberto Luongo. I can't believe some CAnucks fans are falling for this. Also love the way you guys hyped Jake Gardiner. He is a young decent defencemen, hyped so badly, that now a lot of Canucks like him. For what reason? I have no clue. Good job Leafs fans.

Going to say it right now, Canucks fans and Leafs, are all off on Luongo's value. Just one sentence, Gillis to Burke.

"(Insert gms first name), you gotta do better then this, I have 4 other teams interested in him. "

That's all it takes. Mike Gillis can say, "(insert hockey team) has offered (insert package). Can you do better then this."?

That's all it takes guys. Something garbage like this. A bid war happens, and he will chose from the best package.

Franson 2nd and Colburne, will not even get accepted even if Toronto makes the only offer. You Leafs fans have to really stop dreaming, and stop thinking that the Canucks are screwed if they don't trade Luongo to the Leafs. You guys also have to stop thinking only Toronto is in play. There will be at least 6 teams interested in Luongo, what makes you think you guys can lowball MIke Gillis offering spare parts for an all star goalie? We defencemens that can already perform better then Franson, the Canucks can also survive without Colbune, and that 2nd round pick might not even help us for 5 years. What is this? Some sort of bad joke? It won't work this way, it won't happen. The Leafs will have to offer something that they are not willing to give up, wether you Leafs fans like it or not. You guys think, hes worth Komaserek and a 2nd round pick?? you guys are just laughable as these CAnucks fans who think Luongo is only worth a Luke Schenn, or not even worth a Jake Gardiner.

Lets put it this way. Leafs fans..

1. I gaurantee this one thing, Toronto is the only interested team in Luongo. Leafs will be competing against other teams for Luongo.
2. Vancouver have the rights to request for any players on the Leafs.
Brian Burke of course have every right to reject.
3. Vancouver Canucks will not be screwed if they have Luongo and Schneider starting next season. Even if we sign Schneider. That's one of the plans already.
4. MIke Gillis is not interested in any Toronto Maple Leafs players. Down the list. ONe reason why Cody HOdgson was not offered to the Laffs. There are no players Mike Gillis is interested in.
5. Mike Gillis will not make a trade just for the sake of doing it.
6. The Toronto Maple Leafs have players that might improve the Canucks bottom pairing dman, or their bottom 6 fowards.
7.
Well all...God has spoken....shut her down!!!!

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06-09-2012, 07:55 PM
  #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lawrence View Post
Wow, Canucks fans you guys are epic fail. You've been owned and played so badly by Leafs fans, a lot of you guys are willing to settle for a bunch of scraps. Yes. Bunch of scraps. Just because a bunch of them think Luongo to them is only worth something little like Colburne, a 2nd pick and a defencemen, doesn't mean Mike Gillis thinks this way. I applaud you Leafs fans, for dictating the value of Roberto Luongo. I can't believe some CAnucks fans are falling for this. Also love the way you guys hyped Jake Gardiner. He is a young decent defencemen, hyped so badly, that now a lot of Canucks like him. For what reason? I have no clue. Good job Leafs fans.


Going to say it right now, Canucks fans and Leafs, are all off on Luongo's value. Just one sentence, Gillis to Burke.

"(Insert gms first name), you gotta do better then this, I have 4 other teams interested in him. "

That's all it takes. Mike Gillis can say, "(insert hockey team) has offered (insert package). Can you do better then this."?

That's all it takes guys. Something garbage like this. A bid war happens, and he will chose from the best package.

Franson 2nd and Colburne, will not even get accepted even if Toronto makes the only offer. You Leafs fans have to really stop dreaming, and stop thinking that the Canucks are screwed if they don't trade Luongo to the Leafs. You guys also have to stop thinking only Toronto is in play. There will be at least 6 teams interested in Luongo, what makes you think you guys can lowball MIke Gillis offering spare parts for an all star goalie? We defencemens that can already perform better then Franson, the Canucks can also survive without Colbune, and that 2nd round pick might not even help us for 5 years. What is this? Some sort of bad joke? It won't work this way, it won't happen. The Leafs will have to offer something that they are not willing to give up, wether you Leafs fans like it or not. You guys think, hes worth Komaserek and a 2nd round pick?? you guys are just laughable as these CAnucks fans who think Luongo is only worth a Luke Schenn, or not even worth a Jake Gardiner.

Lets put it this way. Leafs fans..

1. I gaurantee this one thing, Toronto is the only interested team in Luongo. Leafs will be competing against other teams for Luongo.
2. Vancouver have the rights to request for any players on the Leafs.
Brian Burke of course have every right to reject.
3. Vancouver Canucks will not be screwed if they have Luongo and Schneider starting next season. Even if we sign Schneider. That's one of the plans already.
4. MIke Gillis is not interested in any Toronto Maple Leafs players. Down the list. ONe reason why Cody HOdgson was not offered to the Laffs. There are no players Mike Gillis is interested in.
5. Mike Gillis will not make a trade just for the sake of doing it.
6. The Toronto Maple Leafs have players that might improve the Canucks bottom pairing dman, or their bottom 6 fowards.
7.
Obviously your new here because there has been pages of actual discussion (amongst all the trolling and biased proposals).

Luongo is an elite goalie and it is true that we could go into next year with two goalies, but that is not ideal. This could lead to trouble signing Schnieder long term. His contract is a burden, but most likely will not be a huge issue since it practically is legally able to circumvent the cap. IT IS still a risk regardless and it will hurt his value.

The consensus seems to be

Ashton/Colborne + Franson + 2nd for Luongo

There has been slight variations but this to me seems like a midpoint and although it took several, seemingly endless amount threads it seems that a majority of people have given up on pipe dream proposals that make a mockery out of both our fanbases. Colborne and Ashton are both very good prospects (which we need) and add depth and youth to our organization. Gillis has made it clear that he wants to get bigger and younger.

This proposals helps us next year because Franson gives us size and a competent, young RH defenseman and Colborne and the 2nd will help us in the future, hell you never know with Kesler's injury if he could see legitimate ice time this year (competing with Schroeder and will most likely take his spot). Ashton will probably have a slightly harder time because of competition with Jensen and Kassian.

No way that Gillis can manipulate Burke so easily, and they are not forced to take Luongo as Harding could tandem next year and Scrivens is coming up but that is a huge risk and it could turn out another missed playoffs.

P.S. Unfortunate Calder Cup finish for you Leaf fans (just saw the tail end of the last game but was following it throughout). Still valuable experience for the younger players.


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06-09-2012, 08:00 PM
  #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
Obviously your new here because there has been pages of actual discussion (amongst all the trolling and biased proposals).

Luongo is an elite goalie and it is true that we could go into next year with two goalies, but that is not ideal. This could lead to trouble signing Schnieder long term. His contract is a burden, but most likely will not be a huge issue since it practically is legally able to circumvent the cap. IT IS still a risk regardless and it will hurt his value.

The consensus seems to be

Ashton/Colborne + Franson + 2nd for Luongo

There has been slight variations but this to me seems like a midpoint and although it took several, seemingly endless amount threads it seems that a majority of people have given up on pipe dream proposals that make a mockery out of both our fanbases. Colborne and Ashton are both very good prospects (which we need) and add depth and youth to our organization. Gillis has made it clear that he wants to get bigger and younger.

This proposals helps us next year because Franson gives us size and a competent, young RH defenseman and Colborne and the 2nd will help us in the future, hell you never know with Kesler's injury if he could see legitimate ice time this year (competing with Schroeder).

P.S. Unfortunate Calder Cup finish for you Leaf fans (just saw the tail end of the last game but was following it throughout). Still valuable experience for the younger players.
Whoa that most certainly is not the consensus for a trade.
I was fine with Luongo +Raymond/Malhotra for Kadri + Ashton/Colborne + 2nd + 2013 1st + Lombardi.

Colborne/Ashton, Franson, and a second is awful in my opinion.

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06-09-2012, 08:04 PM
  #269
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Roberto Luongo is by far the best overall goaltender in Canuck franchise history. He's on a cap-circumvention contract and it's reasonable to assume he's got another 6 good years left in him (unless he retires in 4 years like Bob Mckenzie seems to think).

It's laughable to say he gets traded for scraps like Colborne/Ashton/Kadri/Shenn.

Seriously laughable.

How laughable?

This laughable:

Seriously!

Lou/Schneids + Booth... for... Nash.

.
EDIT: please don't say my suggestion is "laughable".


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06-09-2012, 08:30 PM
  #270
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Whoa that most certainly is not the consensus for a trade.
I was fine with Luongo +Raymond/Malhotra for Kadri + Ashton/Colborne + 2nd + 2013 1st + Lombardi.

Colborne/Ashton, Franson, and a second is awful in my opinion.
I'm not a huge fan of Kadri, but he is still very valuable to the Leafs. Why do we want Lambardi????
Plus Malhotra has to waive his NTC and why would the Leafs want him? His leadership makes him more of an asset to us then Toronto, but realistically one really wants a fourth liner making that much.
Raymond will likely go unqualified, so is value is very low.
The main difference in our deals is the 2013 1st and Kadri instead of Franson which is not fair for Tor imo and it doesnt help our defense (which needs help). We can't bank on magically sign Weber or Schultz.

BTW my point from the previous post is that it has gotten away from Gardiner + 5th overall and Komi + 5th round

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06-09-2012, 08:37 PM
  #271
Lucbourdon
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Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
Roberto Luongo is by far the best overall goaltender in Canuck franchise history. He's on a cap-circumvention contract and it's reasonable to assume he's got another 6 good years left in him (unless he retires in 4 years like Bob Mckenzie seems to think).

It's laughable to say he gets traded for scraps like Colborne/Ashton/Kadri/Shenn.

Seriously laughable.

How laughable?

This laughable:

Seriously!

Lou/Schneids + Booth... for... Nash.

.
EDIT: please don't say my suggestion is "laughable".
kadri and schenn are not scraps.


Last edited by Lucbourdon: 06-09-2012 at 08:50 PM.
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06-09-2012, 08:39 PM
  #272
Vankiller Whale
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I'm not a huge fan of Kadri, but he is still very valuable to the Leafs. Why do we want Lambardi????
Plus Malhotra has to waive his NTC and why would the Leafs want him? His leadership makes him more of an asset to us then Toronto, but realistically one really wants a fourth liner making that much.
Raymond will likely go unqualified, so is value is very low.
The main difference in our deals is the 2013 1st and Kadri instead of Franson which is not fair for Tor imo and it doesnt help our defense (which needs help). We can't bank on magically sign Weber or Schultz.

BTW my point from the previous post is that it has gotten away from Gardiner + 5th overall and Komi + 5th round
I only meant it wasn't a consensus, and two other people above agreed with me.

We don't want Lombardi, obviously, he's a cap dump. And Franson doesn't crack our roster. We have a decent chance of signing Schultz and/or Garrison, as well as Salo. This does not in any way make us better.

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Old
06-09-2012, 08:43 PM
  #273
Cogburn
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Originally Posted by Finnish Your Czechs View Post
What I meant with his age is he has likely 3-4 more years of top shelf performance in him. To get 2 young players with 10+ years left in them and the 34th pick (potential to upgrade from 26th) isn't a bad return.

I'm frequently wrong about which prospects will boom or bust. It's just a feeling I have about Colbourne.

If we can get more for Luongo, that's fantastic. But realistically, I think this is the type of return we're looking at and I'll take it.
That's just it though, these younger players haven't even made a potential lottery team yet, and we're expecting them to pan out value wise. Potential is valued far to highly on this board. There is a reason that it takes multiple prospects and picks to get top players at the deadline, or draft. It's not because these players traded are worth what each prospect could be, combined.

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Originally Posted by arshonagon View Post
I watch a lot of Leafs games as my room-mate is from Toronto. I really think Franson would thrive in our system. He just always looks sold in his own end and is not a bad puck mover at all.

I would be into something around Colbourne, Ashton, Franson, Lombardi(cap dump), 2012 2nd for Luongo, Malhotra. I am not really high on Kadri myself, just don't see him panning out.
He's not terrible, but for puck movers in our bottom pairing/riding pine, we have Tanev, Ballard and Gragnani. For physicality, we have Ballard, Alberts and Rome. For defensive play, we have Tanev, Alberts and Rome. For mobility, we have Tanev, Ballard, Rome and Gragnani...even subbing Rome out, we don't have room.

Quote:
Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
Obviously your new here because there has been pages of actual discussion (amongst all the trolling and biased proposals).

Luongo is an elite goalie and it is true that we could go into next year with two goalies, but that is not ideal. This could lead to trouble signing Schnieder long term. His contract is a burden, but most likely will not be a huge issue since it practically is legally able to circumvent the cap. IT IS still a risk regardless and it will hurt his value.

The consensus seems to be

Ashton/Colborne + Franson + 2nd for Luongo


There has been slight variations but this to me seems like a midpoint and although it took several, seemingly endless amount threads it seems that a majority of people have given up on pipe dream proposals that make a mockery out of both our fanbases. Colborne and Ashton are both very good prospects (which we need) and add depth and youth to our organization. Gillis has made it clear that he wants to get bigger and younger.

This proposals helps us next year because Franson gives us size and a competent, young RH defenseman and Colborne and the 2nd will help us in the future, hell you never know with Kesler's injury if he could see legitimate ice time this year (competing with Schroeder and will most likely take his spot). Ashton will probably have a slightly harder time because of competition with Jensen and Kassian.

No way that Gillis can manipulate Burke so easily, and they are not forced to take Luongo as Harding could tandem next year and Scrivens is coming up but that is a huge risk and it could turn out another missed playoffs.

P.S. Unfortunate Calder Cup finish for you Leaf fans (just saw the tail end of the last game but was following it throughout). Still valuable experience for the younger players.
Umm...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Whoa that most certainly is not the consensus for a trade.
I was fine with Luongo +Raymond/Malhotra for Kadri + Ashton/Colborne + 2nd + 2013 1st + Lombardi.

Colborne/Ashton, Franson, and a second is awful in my opinion.
...yeah, seconded. That is awful value, and in no way has a consensus been formed on this side. Horrible. Which side are you on again? The risk to reward isn't good at all there, and again, while I have nothing against Franson, he isn't an improvement on what we have if we're talking about losing Lu. Ashton and Colborne could make the NHL and be impact players, yes, but really...that doesn't help us yet. Colborne would be more attractive short term as a centre with Kesler out, but man...we have Schroeder and just move our top prospect Hodgson for a couple of high risk prospects (not that I don't see Kassian panning out at the NHL level, but I don't see him as a "Hodgson calibre player"). We need more.

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06-09-2012, 08:46 PM
  #274
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Originally Posted by KlattNazty View Post
Dont think you will be netting to of our top prospects.

Ashton to us is Jensen to you.
Colborne to us is probably a notch or a bit lower than Hodgson was when he came in.
Franson is probably akin to a 2nd, and another 2nd, and only a one year cap dump in lombo?

Ill pass.
And that is the error in logic.

A couple of things to point out.

1. The Vancouver prospect pool is not really that deep
2. Players who can't break into the roster of one of the worst teams in the league are unlikely to be on the roster for one of the best teams.
3. Just because someone is in the top 4 defence or top 6 forwards on one of the worst teams in the league... it doesn't necessarily mean they will slot into that spot on one of the best.

That isn't slagging off Toronto, it is just talking sense... just because someone is YOUR top prospect, doesn't make them an elite prospect.

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06-09-2012, 08:48 PM
  #275
Strangelove
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
kadri and schenn is not scraps.
Now y'see, that's where you're wrong.

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