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Offseason moves part 2

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Old
06-12-2012, 02:41 PM
  #226
Stewie Griffin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
We actually have $20 million and 7 positions to fill. 2 of those 7 positions are Backlund and Comeau who will sign for less than $2.5 million combined. Another of those positions is for Baertschi and his cap hit is below 1.5 million.

So that leaves $16 million for 4 spots.

Those spots being the blank spaces in this roster:

Tanguay - ______ - Iginla
Cammalleri - Stajan - Glencross
Baertschi - Backlund - Cervenka
Bouma - Jones - Jackman
______ - ______

Bouwmeester - Butler
Giordano - ______
Brodie - Babchuk
Smith

Kiprusoff
Karlsson

do you really think it will cost $16 million to fill those 4 holes? Even if we push other players down in the lineup this team should easily have $5 million in cap space heading into camp
I'm actually starting to think that the Flames won't be adding anybody on July 1, bring up Aliu and Wilson to fill out the forwards / defense, and see a lineup that looks a lot like this:

Tanguay - Stajan - Iginla
Cammalleri - Cervenka- Glencross
Baertschi - Backlund - Aliu
Bouma - Jones - Jackman
Kolanos

Bouwmeester - Butler
Giordano - Brodie
Smith - Wilson/Babchuk

Kiprusoff / Irving

With oodles of cap space for July 1, 2013


Last edited by Stewie Griffin: 06-12-2012 at 02:47 PM.
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06-12-2012, 03:03 PM
  #227
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So are you guys giving up on Moss?

How would you describe him as a player, strengths/weaknesses?

He just plain sucks isn't enough

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06-12-2012, 03:06 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by Stewie Griffin View Post
I'm actually starting to think that the Flames won't be adding anybody on July 1, bring up Aliu and Wilson to fill out the forwards / defense, and see a lineup that looks a lot like this:

Tanguay - Stajan - Iginla
Cammalleri - Cervenka- Glencross
Baertschi - Backlund - Aliu
Bouma - Jones - Jackman
Kolanos

Bouwmeester - Butler
Giordano - Brodie
Smith - Wilson/Babchuk

Kiprusoff / Irving

With oodles of cap space for July 1, 2013
I'm not expecting anything big to happen July 1st. Maybe a few minor signings but don't see a big shake up happening.

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06-12-2012, 03:16 PM
  #229
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Originally Posted by Stewie Griffin View Post
I'm actually starting to think that the Flames won't be adding anybody on July 1, bring up Aliu and Wilson to fill out the forwards / defense, and see a lineup that looks a lot like this:

Tanguay - Stajan - Iginla
Cammalleri - Cervenka- Glencross
Baertschi - Backlund - Aliu
Bouma - Jones - Jackman
Kolanos

Bouwmeester - Butler
Giordano - Brodie
Smith - Wilson/Babchuk

Kiprusoff / Irving

With oodles of cap space for July 1, 2013
I think Olli returns and we sign a defenseman, I think it will be Kubina even though he isn't really top 4 anymore. Then a depth guy that can win faceoffs, maybe Konopka

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06-12-2012, 03:35 PM
  #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
I think Olli returns and we sign a defenseman, I think it will be Kubina even though he isn't really top 4 anymore. Then a depth guy that can win faceoffs, maybe Konopka
Nah, Jokinen is as good as gone man! Haven't you heard all of the insider information from his neighbour / random internet guy / friends of the owner of a mini-storage & furniture moving operation?

I'd be fine with re-upping Jokinen (and/or Stempniak) for the right cap hits, but I have a gut feeling both will be looking for too much term/money for the Flames to commit at this point.

As for defensemen, I think Brodie played his way into the top four by the end of the season. I don't think we really need to see anyone else brought in, unless it's a big-ish name.

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06-12-2012, 03:36 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by SmellOfVictory View Post
Flames aren't going to compete next season anyway,
Why do you say that? Flames were part of the race for 8th last year, meaning they DID compete, even after a horrid start.

Next season the Flames have Baertschi (an impact player in his limited games last year), a full year of Cammalleri, a new coach, an unknown from Europe, and any other changes that may happen before the season starts.

It's way too premature for anyone to say that the Flames won't compete next year; especially a fan.

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06-12-2012, 03:37 PM
  #232
SmellOfVictory
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
We actually have $20 million and 7 positions to fill. 2 of those 7 positions are Backlund and Comeau who will sign for less than $2.5 million combined. Another of those positions is for Baertschi and his cap hit is below 1.5 million.

So that leaves $16 million for 4 spots.

Those spots being the blank spaces in this roster:

Tanguay - ______ - Iginla
Cammalleri - Stajan - Glencross
Baertschi - Backlund - Cervenka
Bouma - Jones - Jackman
______ - ______

Bouwmeester - Butler
Giordano - ______
Brodie - Babchuk
Smith

Kiprusoff
Karlsson

do you really think it will cost $16 million to fill those 4 holes? Even if we push other players down in the lineup this team should easily have $5 million in cap space heading into camp
Fair enough; I think Backlund/Comeau (or Stempniak) will be more than that, but it does still leave ample cap space for the remaining positions, since only two of them are in a position of real consequence (top 9 fwd, top 4 d).

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06-12-2012, 03:41 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by SmellOfVictory View Post
Fair enough; I think Backlund/Comeau (or Stempniak) will be more than that, but it does still leave ample cap space for the remaining positions, since only two of them are in a position of real consequence (top 9 fwd, top 4 d).
I really doubt Comeau or Stempniak return

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06-12-2012, 03:42 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
I really doubt Comeau or Stempniak return
I could see one returning, but not both. I think the edge would have to go to Comeau based on age and he has more size than Stempniak. The team already has too many undersized forwards.

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06-12-2012, 03:44 PM
  #235
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
I really doubt Comeau or Stempniak return
I can see maybe Stempniak if either of them. But I think you're right. Comeau is gone for sure.

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06-12-2012, 04:00 PM
  #236
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Moss is a fast skater but little to no agility. Does fine physically and defensively, not to be mistaken for nan actual defensive forward though. He doesn't exactly muck it out either, I'd consider him a complementary top six player. Will do for pucks in corners and around the net just fine.
Thanks for the response. Sounds like an interesting player who would do well in the Rangers system. The injuries worry me, of course, as they should anybody. It also sounds like if we're expecting him to be a 3rd liner with the occasional step-in up in the top-6, that's the perfect role for him.

What about Stempniak? Same questions. Speed, physicality, defense, grind vs finesse?

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06-12-2012, 04:05 PM
  #237
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Moss is a great guy to park in front of the net on a powerplay. Give him that role all year and you might get 25 goals out of him.

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06-12-2012, 04:09 PM
  #238
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Thanks for the response. Sounds like an interesting player who would do well in the Rangers system. The injuries worry me, of course, as they should anybody. It also sounds like if we're expecting him to be a 3rd liner with the occasional step-in up in the top-6, that's the perfect role for him.

What about Stempniak? Same questions. Speed, physicality, defense, grind vs finesse?
Fast, decent dangler for a middle 6 forward, and good defensively. He was also very effective on the cycle. Won't hit everything that moves, but he's effective.

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06-12-2012, 04:10 PM
  #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Thanks for the response. Sounds like an interesting player who would do well in the Rangers system. The injuries worry me, of course, as they should anybody. It also sounds like if we're expecting him to be a 3rd liner with the occasional step-in up in the top-6, that's the perfect role for him.

What about Stempniak? Same questions. Speed, physicality, defense, grind vs finesse?
Stempniak > Moss from a skill standpoint. There's a reason you find a few Stempniak highlight compilations on youtube, but none for Moss. Stemps did a few things that were eyebrow raising this year, but he was injured for a good part of it as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NightBlazer View Post
Moss is a great guy to park in front of the net on a powerplay. Give him that role all year and you might get 25 goals out of him.
Or you wind up breaking off his right leg at the knee with a slap shot.

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06-12-2012, 04:15 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Thanks for the response. Sounds like an interesting player who would do well in the Rangers system. The injuries worry me, of course, as they should anybody. It also sounds like if we're expecting him to be a 3rd liner with the occasional step-in up in the top-6, that's the perfect role for him.

What about Stempniak? Same questions. Speed, physicality, defense, grind vs finesse?
Stempniak has some speed, has some hands and works pretty hard. There is a reason he scored 20 goals repeatedly in the NHL. Reminds me of Chris Higgins when he played for Calgary. Worked hard but no puck luck. He is a streaky player, but as a 2nd/3rd line tweener he isnt bad.

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06-12-2012, 04:22 PM
  #241
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Thanks everyone for the responses. At this point, for me it's a toss up. Moss has injury issues that concern me, but I like his size. Stempniak is a bit on the small side, but his skill intrigues me given that the Rangers could use more on that third line. Either player would be an upgrade over what we have (our RW depth goes: Gaborik-Callahan-------Prust. Big gap between Callahan and Prust, who I love but is not a 3rd liner). Anyway, thanks again for the insight. Definitely helpful.

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06-12-2012, 04:43 PM
  #242
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Stemps is the much better of the two players. He works harder and has more skill. In fact I would actually want to keep him in fact. Outside of size I can't think of anything moss has over him otherwise.

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06-12-2012, 05:26 PM
  #243
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I would definitely keep Stempniak over Moss, and it's not even close. Moss is an overachieving forward that can play on almost every line. He's a max effort guy every night, and he can chip in a few goals. However, he has very limited playmaking skills, his hockey sense isn't great, and he has a really bad sense of tunnel vision (i.e., he doesn't see the ice very well).

Stempniak may be smaller, but he's by far the better offensive player of the two and he's pretty good defensively. His playmaking skills are decent, and he has a very good shot.

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06-12-2012, 05:53 PM
  #244
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Stemps is the much better of the two players. He works harder and has more skill. In fact I would actually want to keep him in fact. Outside of size I can't think of anything moss has over him otherwise.
I can't say I would agree with that.

Moss works his ass off night in night out. When he is healthy and being utilized properly by the head coach he is the better all around player in my opinion. It seems as if I am in the minority here, but I personally don't see the effort everyone is clamoring about in regards to Stempniak. He is probably one of the streakiest player's I have ever seen, and if he is not scoring he disappears into mediocrity in all facets of his game.

Moss is the better forechecker, drives to the net far more often, and is better defensively in my opinion. He also comes with the added benefit of being able to play all three forward positions relatively well.

At this point, I think we are best served injecting some new faces throughout our lineup, but If I were to bring one of the players back it would be Moss (Injury concerns or not).

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06-12-2012, 05:57 PM
  #245
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I can't say I would agree with that.

Moss works his ass off night in night out. When he is healthy and being utilized properly by the head coach he is the better all around player in my opinion. It seems as if I am in the minority here, but I personally don't see the effort everyone is clamoring about in regards to Stempniak. He is probably one of the streakiest player's I have ever seen, and if he is not scoring he disappears into mediocrity in all facets of his game.

Moss is the better forechecker, drives to the net far more often, and is better defensively in my opinion. He also comes with the added benefit of being able to play all three forward positions relatively well.

At this point, I think we are best served injecting some new faces throughout our lineup, but If I were to bring one of the players back it would be Moss (Injury concerns or not).
Agreed, some games I couldn't even recognize Stemps was out there. Five games later he would scores 3 goals in 3 different games, but then he would drift off for about the next 10 games.

Moss is a good "get in your face" type of player. He drives hard to the net, which I didn't see Stempniak do too much. IMO, I think Stempniak is a softer player, which we already have enough of.

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06-12-2012, 07:10 PM
  #246
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He doesn't NEED to be on the PP. He simply excels on the PP and can bury pucks. He's a great contributor when he's going and a big tough guy in front of the net.

Like I said, if we can land bigger fish in FA then great. But I'm betting we are looking at something like the list below. Keep in mimd their are multiple options for players at each position, I'm simply inserting the name I like the most

1) bottom six FO specialist (Konopka)
2) 1 of the top 4 defenders in FA (Garrison, I think his game compliments Bouw well)
3) Defensive depth and grit (At least I'm hoping Feaster address' this, Carkner)

We still have lots of cap space after that, and I hope Feaster realizes that a guy like Comeau has more question marks than answers. Which is why I suggest creating some low risk competition by signing a guy like Latendresse. He has huge potential, but is also an injury risk. At this point, the flames need to swing for the fences without giving up assets. This is a good fit for the current teams direction.

Tanguay-Cammy-Iginla
Cervenka-Stajan-Glencross
Bartschi-Backlund-Latendresse
Bouma-Konopka-Comeau
Jackman (plug him into the 4th line RW spot when you need him)

If Nemisz can outplay Comeau or Latendresse then awesome. Let him play as both Comeau and Latendresse will be on 1 year contracts. Let those 3 compete for positions, take the best fit and run with it.

The more I look at our forwards I start to hope Feaster can find someone willing to give up a young top 9 centre for Cammy. It's probably wishful thinking, but getting a more established version of Backlund would be awesome. Especially if we find Cervenka can handle top 6 centre duties.
Of Latendresse's 137 points 21% are pp points (29 points)

Of Comeau's 136 points 19% are pp points (26 points)

Latendresse has played 540 pp minutes

Comeau has played 404 pp minutes

Had Comeau played Lat's pp time he would have had 35 points.

So who excels on the pp?

Again Comeau can play the pk Lat cannot. Comeau>Lat

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06-12-2012, 09:19 PM
  #247
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My guess is the Flames finish 8th-10th. Iggys older....Kippers older too.
I dont see anywhere they improve...(improve enough to help them be a sure bet for the playoffs).

They should trade away their stars like Iggy and Kipper...oh and Cammy too. Trade at the deadline so that they can get a CRAP load of good young prospects and talent.

IMO Buter Brodie Smith Wilson..these guys...just arnt good enough.

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06-12-2012, 09:39 PM
  #248
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I can't say I would agree with that.

Moss works his ass off night in night out. When he is healthy and being utilized properly by the head coach he is the better all around player in my opinion. It seems as if I am in the minority here, but I personally don't see the effort everyone is clamoring about in regards to Stempniak. He is probably one of the streakiest player's I have ever seen, and if he is not scoring he disappears into mediocrity in all facets of his game.

Moss is the better forechecker, drives to the net far more often, and is better defensively in my opinion. He also comes with the added benefit of being able to play all three forward positions relatively well.

At this point, I think we are best served injecting some new faces throughout our lineup, but If I were to bring one of the players back it would be Moss (Injury concerns or not).
I think due to his size, and because he doesn't play a "big" game, unless he scores, his effort isn't as evident. But I often see him do the little things like moving his feet on the backcheck and looking to cover the point. So I do think the effort is there.

Moss on the other hand works hard and as Flames mentions is more of an "in your face" effort player. But on that note, if AA works out, then he effectively replaces Moss in that aspect anyways.

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06-12-2012, 10:08 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by DopitaToDemitra View Post
My guess is the Flames finish 8th-10th. Iggys older....Kippers older too.
I dont see anywhere they improve...(improve enough to help them be a sure bet for the playoffs).

They should trade away their stars like Iggy and Kipper...oh and Cammy too. Trade at the deadline so that they can get a CRAP load of good young prospects and talent.

IMO Buter Brodie Smith Wilson..these guys...just arnt good enough.
The AHL defenseman is the reason we can't make the playoffs? Jesus he must SUCK.

Brodie The 22 year old rookie who put up 14 points in 54 games and was a +3 on team that only had 6 + regular players

Butler The 24 year old top 4 defensive defenseman

Smith The number 6/7 defenseman

IMO you picked the 4 players that have the least to do with us missing the playoffs, please do not return troll.

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06-13-2012, 09:40 AM
  #250
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Of Latendresse's 137 points 21% are pp points (29 points)

Of Comeau's 136 points 19% are pp points (26 points)

Latendresse has played 540 pp minutes

Comeau has played 404 pp minutes

Had Comeau played Lat's pp time he would have had 35 points.

So who excels on the pp?

Again Comeau can play the pk Lat cannot. Comeau>Lat
I don't see your reasoning to be sound at all. Your are looking at their entire career's and not recent success. Latendresse really started to become a dynamic player when he was in MIN. He can burn people with skill, but can also make big body plays to overcome strong defense. From what I've seen he would be worth the risk of cheap 1 year contract to see if he can regain that form. We have no idea if either Latendresse or Comeau will put up solid numbers and contribute. But their contract demands will be minimal, and the risk low. You simply role the dice with better odds, because you have both guys.

Create competition for 2nd/3rd line RW spots. Nemisz/Comeau/Latendresse, keep in mind we've alreayd seen how useful Comeau is on the 4th line. I'd rather him on the 4th line then Jackman, unless you need him to drop the gloves.

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