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Offseason moves part 2

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Old
06-11-2012, 08:19 PM
  #176
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He is worth at most a second right now and we are extremely weak at center I don't move him unless we get a better centermen that is nhl ready now.
and here I was thinking that Cervenka would be the one that could replace him

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06-11-2012, 08:21 PM
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and here I was thinking that Cervenka would be the one that could replace him
O god NO! I think people need to realize he was more of a winger than a centerman in khl.

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06-11-2012, 08:23 PM
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O god NO! I think people need to realize he was more of a winger than a centerman in khl.
Oh I am well aware and if he is going to play in the top 6 I would want him as a winger. But in a 3rd line role I would be willing to try him as a centerman, but that is the only center role I am willing to try him in.

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06-11-2012, 08:25 PM
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Oh I am well aware and if he is going to play in the top 6 I would want him as a winger. But in a 3rd line role I would be willing to try him as a centerman, but that is the only center role I am willing to try him in.
Depends are we going to use the third line as checking or scoring if scoring than yea give him a try if checking then god no.

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06-11-2012, 08:32 PM
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Depends are we going to use the third line as checking or scoring if scoring than yea give him a try if checking then god no.
definitely scoring line. I was thinking something along the lines of (assuming we don't sign a UFA forward other than Jokinen of course)......

Tanguay - Stajan - Iginla
Glencross - Jokinen - Cammalleri
Baertschi - Cervenka - Comeau/Aliu/Nemisz

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06-11-2012, 08:36 PM
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definitely scoring line. I was thinking something along the lines of (assuming we don't sign a UFA forward other than Jokinen of course)......

Tanguay - Stajan - Iginla
Glencross - Jokinen - Cammalleri
Baertschi - Cervenka - Comeau/Aliu/Nemisz
Not bad would prefer

Baertschi - Backlund - Cervenka

As Sven and Backlund have had some chemistry before.

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06-11-2012, 08:46 PM
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Not bad would prefer

Baertschi - Backlund - Cervenka

As Sven and Backlund have had some chemistry before.
keep in mind the chemistry came in the pre-season facing much lesser competition. And I am not opposed to that line, I just really think we should get something for Backlund while we can, I do believe he will reach full bust status soon.

But if we do hold onto him, I hope he proves me wrong.

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06-11-2012, 08:47 PM
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keep in mind the chemistry came in the pre-season facing much lesser competition. And I am not opposed to that line, I just really think we should get something for Backlund while we can, I do believe he will reach full bust status soon.

But if we do hold onto him, I hope he proves me wrong.
At worst he is a 3rd liner I don't think we need to move him to be honest.

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06-11-2012, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
At worst he is a 3rd liner I don't think we need to move him to be honest.
If we are going to have a 3rd line center that's not going to put up points then I would prefer one that can be a faceoff specialist who is exceptional defensively and on the PK. IMO right now Backlund is poor on faceoffs, an okay penalty killer and good defensively.

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06-11-2012, 09:05 PM
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If we are going to have a 3rd line center that's not going to put up points then I would prefer one that can be a faceoff specialist who is exceptional defensively and on the PK. IMO right now Backlund is poor on faceoffs, an okay penalty killer and good defensively.
He put yup 25 points on the 4th line 2 years ago I think he will be fine if healthy.

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06-11-2012, 09:31 PM
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He put yup 25 points on the 4th line 2 years ago I think he will be fine if healthy.
he didn't play much time on the 4th line at all, I am so tired of that being skewed by Flames fans to make Backlund look better than he is. He never played on the 4th line until after He was a healthy scratch and Moss played his way off the line (about 1/3 of the way through January) and then Backlund was off the 4th line when Sutter buried Stajan there (which I think was late February).

In the stretch where Backlund played 4th line minutes regularly he only put up 5 points in 23 games. Then he put up 10 points in the final 2 months (17 games) where he regularly played with Iginla who was scorching hot.

It's also interesting to note 9 or 10 of his points that year came against the bottom feeding Oilers and Avalanche.

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06-11-2012, 09:33 PM
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he didn't play much time on the 4th line at all, I am so tired of that being skewed by Flames fans to make Backlund look better than he is. He never played on the 4th line until after He was a healthy scratch and Moss played his way off the line (about 1/3 of the way through January) and then Backlund was off the 4th line when Sutter buried Stajan there (which I think was late February).

In the stretch where Backlund played 4th line minutes regularly he only put up 5 points in 23 games. Then he put up 10 points in the final 2 months (17 games) where he regularly played with Iginla who was scorching hot.

It's also interesting to note 9 or 10 of his points that year came against the bottom feeding Oilers and Avalanche.
He averaged 13th time on ice his most played linemates where Jackman and TKO he played the most of that season on the 4th line.

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06-11-2012, 10:00 PM
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Interesting. Comeau is also a right handed forward.
I get that Comeau is a RWer, and I also understand his game could come around. But Latendresse was producing at a decent clip until his injury issues. He could be a steal on a cheap contract, if healthy. For the last year Comeau has not been a solid point producer. To be honest I would sign them both if cheap and on short term. Competition would be good for the 2nd/3rd line RW spots.

I am going off the assumption Latendresse can play off wing. I think he can IIRC.

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06-11-2012, 10:04 PM
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I get that Comeau is a RWer, and I also understand his game could come around. But Latendresse was producing at a decent clip until his injury issues. He could be a steal on a cheap contract, if healthy. For the last year Comeau has not been a solid point producer. To be honest I would sign them both if cheap and on short term. Competition would be good for the 2nd/3rd line RW spots.

I am going off the assumption Latendresse can play off wing. I think he can IIRC.
same ppg in their career Lat plays an average of 2 minutes on the pp Comeau plays 30 seconds Comeau plays an average of 2 minutes of pk Lat plays 0. Comeau is a much better all around player I feel like going after Lat is because he is different even if not better. I don't see an argument for Lat over Comeau especially when we are talking about paying Lat more.

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06-11-2012, 10:04 PM
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He averaged 13th time on ice his most played linemates where Jackman and TKO he played the most of that season on the 4th line.
He has been given chances in larger roles, but has been misused overall. Playing him on the 4th line so much was so ****ing stupid.

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06-11-2012, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
same ppg in their career Lat plays an average of 2 minutes on the pp Comeau plays 30 seconds Comeau plays an average of 2 minutes of pk Lat plays 0. Comeau is a much better all around player I feel like going after Lat is because he is different even if not better. I don't see an argument for Lat over Comeau especially when we are talking about paying Lat more.
Don't really see how Comeau is a better all around player. When Latendresse started having success he was a game changer up until his injuries. Guy has a pretty good all around game, he did survive the defensive demands of the Wild and was a productive player for them (while he played).If we can land higher quality FA targets then awesome. I'm just trying to think of all possibilities and have an open mind come July.

I also do not think Jokinen is coming back. After seeing the money people are spending I'm betting he goes to FA. It is in his best interest in terms of $$$, and the guy is the best center available.

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06-11-2012, 10:38 PM
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Don't really see how Comeau is a better all around player. When Latendresse started having success he was a game changer up until his injuries. Guy has a pretty good all around game, he did survive the defensive demands of the Wild and was a productive player for them (while he played).If we can land higher quality FA targets then awesome. I'm just trying to think of all possibilities and have an open mind come July.

I also do not think Jokinen is coming back. After seeing the money people are spending I'm betting he goes to FA. It is in his best interest in terms of $$$, and the guy is the best center available.
He can't pk unlike Comeau and needs to be on the power play to be effective I don't see the need for him at all.

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06-11-2012, 10:41 PM
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He averaged 13th time on ice his most played linemates where Jackman and TKO he played the most of that season on the 4th line.
he averaged 3rd line minutes until January, where he started to consistently play 4th line minutes (less than 10 per night). Then on March 1st his time increased and he even went a stretch where he was seeing 18+ minutes per night because he was getting PP time too.

If his most played linemateswere Jackman and Kostopolous it would only be because the 4th line was the only line that wasn't juggled by Sutter

Lets look at all his points that year and who he produced with (I also added the number of goals for by the Flames in those games as I thought I was seeing a trend part way through).
  • Oct-21 vs Red Wings : Backlund (Glencross, Sarich) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Sarich, Morrison, Backlund, Glencross and the Flames scored 2 goals this game
  • Oct-21 vs Red Wings : Backlund (Morrison, Glencross) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Morrison, Backlund, Glencross, Staios and the Flames scored 2 goals this game
  • Oct-22 vs Blue Jackets : SH - Bourque (Backlund, Regehr) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Backlund, Bourque, Regehr and the Flames scored 6 goals this game
  • Oct-26 vs Oilers : Glencross (Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Morrison, Backlund, Glencross, Staios and the Flames scored 5 goals this game
  • Nov-09 vs Avalanche : Backlund (Hagman, Moss) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Sarich, Hagman, Backlund, Moss and the Flames scored 4 goals this game
  • Dec-07 vs Lightning : Bourque (Glencross, Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Sarich, Backlund, Bourque, Glencross and the Flames scored 4 goals this game
  • Dec-13 vs Blue Jackets : Iginla (Backlund, Giordano) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Pardy, Backlund, Iginla, Babchuk, Tanguay and the Flames scored 3 goals this game
  • Dec-16 vs Maple Leafs : Backlund (Morrison) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Pardy, Morrison, Backlund, Kotalik, Babchuk and the Flames scored 5 goals this game
  • Jan-05 vs Canucks : Jackman (Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Pardy, Backlund, Jackman, Kostopoulos, Babchuk and the Flames scored 1 goals this game
  • Jan-21 vs Stars : Backlund (Jackman, Pardy) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Pardy, Backlund, Jackman, Bourque, Babchuk and the Flames scored 7 goals this game
  • Jan-22 vs Canucks : Jackman (Pardy, Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Pardy, Backlund, Jackman, Kostopoulos, Babchuk and the Flames scored 4 goals this game
  • Feb-03 vs Thrashers : Backlund (Unassisted) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Backlund, Iginla, Kostopoulos, Regehr and the Flames scored 4 goals this game
  • Feb-07 vs Blackhawks : Backlund (Bouma, Pardy) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Pardy, Backlund, Kostopoulos, Babchuk, Bouma and the Flames scored 3 goals this game
  • Feb-14 vs Avalanche : Iginla (Backlund, Staios) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Backlund, Iginla, Staios, Regehr, Tanguay and the Flames scored 9 goals this game
  • Feb-16 vs Stars : Sarich (Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Sarich, Hagman, Backlund, Kostopoulos and the Flames scored 4 goals this game
  • Mar-01 vs Blues : Hagman (Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Hagman, Backlund, Kostopoulos, Staios, Babchuk and the Flames scored 6 goals this game
  • Mar-09 vs Stars : Kostopoulos (Jackman, Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Sarich, Backlund, Jackman, Kostopoulos and the Flames scored 4 goals this game
  • Mar-12 vs Canucks : Backlund (Unassisted) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Sarich, Hagman, Backlund, Bouma and the Flames scored 3 goals this game
  • Mar-15 vs Coyotes : Backlund (Giordano, Iginla) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Backlund, Iginla, Glencross, Babchuk and the Flames scored 3 goals this game
  • Mar-17 vs Avalanche : Bourque (Kostopoulos, Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Giordano, Backlund, Kostopoulos, Bourque and the Flames scored 5 goals this game
  • Mar-26 vs Oilers : PP - Iginla (Giordano, Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Backlund, Iginla, Kostopoulos, Tanguay and the Flames scored 5 goals this game
  • Apr-06 vs Oilers : Iginla (Backlund, Babchuk) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Sarich, Backlund, Iginla, Babchuk, Tanguay and the Flames scored 6 goals this game
  • Apr-06 vs Oilers : PP - Iginla (Tanguay, Backlund) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Backlund, Iginla, Jackman, Tanguay and the Flames scored 6 goals this game
  • Apr-06 vs Oilers : Tanguay (Backlund, Iginla) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Bouwmeester, Backlund, Iginla, Regehr, Tanguay and the Flames scored 6 goals this game
  • Apr-09 vs Canucks : PP - Backlund (Giordano) and the Flames on the ice for the goal were Giordano, Backlund, Iginla, Kostopoulos, Tanguay and the Flames scored 2 goals this game

of his 25 points 12 came with at least one of Jackman or Kostopoulos on the ice, but of those 12 Iginla was still on the ice for 4 of them (3 of the 4 were PP goals).

of his 25 points 9 came with Iginla on the ice.

of the 22 games that Backlund recorded a point, the FLames scored at least 4 goals in 15 of them

take what you will from those figures, but the last one is a bit alarming to me, it was like he only produced when the team as a whole was producing.

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06-11-2012, 10:44 PM
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Ok fair enough shall we call it 3rd line then? Either way my point is he has produced 25 points at 22 on the 3rd line I don't see why he can't put up 30 as a 24 year old with better linemates.

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06-11-2012, 10:47 PM
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also should add that while he was 13th in average ice time, of the guys ahead of him, 1 was a mid-season acquisition (Kostopoulos) and the stats on NHL.com are combined between the teams, and 2 other played minimal games (Kotalik, 26 and Langkow 4)

so Backlund was more like 10th in average ice-time, and since guys like Moss and Morrison also lost large chunks of time, backlund still put up 3rd line minutes.

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06-11-2012, 10:48 PM
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Ok fair enough shall we call it 3rd line then? Either way my point is he has produced 25 points at 22 on the 3rd line I don't see why he can't put up 30 as a 24 year old with better linemates.
and my point is his production has declined (in terms of points per game), which is not a good sign for a 23 year old.

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06-11-2012, 10:49 PM
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and my point is his production has declined (in terms of points per game), which is not a good sign for a 23 year old.
lol oops, replied too soon, I meant the points per game has declined each year.

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06-11-2012, 10:50 PM
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and my point is his production has declined (in terms of points per game), which is not a good sign for a 23 year old.
Declined when not playing with as good players, that seems rather obvious no? I see what you are saying but I am willing to write off this year to injuries and give him another chance as he isn't worth alot to trade.

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06-11-2012, 10:53 PM
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Declined when not playing with as good players, that seems rather obvious no? I see what you are saying but I am willing to write off this year to injuries and give him another chance as he isn't worth alot to trade.
so he played with less player this past season than he did as a 3rd liner the year before? I hardly think so. and in the year before when he was 21, he got his points actually playing on the 4th line.

his points per game has been declining as he takes on a bigger role, which means tougher defensemen to play against.

simply put I don't feel his offensive game is developing at all.

but then again he was playing under Sutter who slayed offense like it was a dragon

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06-11-2012, 10:58 PM
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so he played with less player this past season than he did as a 3rd liner the year before? I hardly think so. and in the year before when he was 21, he got his points actually playing on the 4th line.

his points per game has been declining as he takes on a bigger role, which means tougher defensemen to play against.

simply put I don't feel his offensive game is developing at all.

but then again he was playing under Sutter who slayed offense like it was a dragon
Idk I mean he played with the top line early in the year and lately they haven't done much early (ask Stajan ) I feel that at a young age chemistry is huge in building confidence and offense and he simply has not been given much consistency in linemates. When he did have constant linemates (Tko and Jackman) he did well. I feel like he should be given an entire year with the same linemates before we decide what to do with him. 24 year old defensively sound centermen are useful but aren't valued highly lets see if we can get something more out of him.

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