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Old
06-09-2012, 10:47 AM
  #1
SSoH
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Clb - tor



- Phil Kessel ( To replace Nash as the franchise player )
- 5th Overall
- James Reimer or 35th Overall ( To challenge Mason, unless CLB wants a veteran )
- Jesse Blacker ( Good PMD prospect )



- Nash
- 2nd Overall

Fair? would CLB or TOR do this just gauging value.

EDIT: This trade assumes TOR, gets a veteran goalie as well, through trade or UFA.


Last edited by SSoH: 06-09-2012 at 10:56 AM.
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Old
06-09-2012, 10:57 AM
  #2
internetdotcom
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CLB says eff no. Even if you equate Nash and Kessel if you include contracts, the other pieces are not enough to get you up to 2nd overall. Reimer is not the established #1 CLB needs, and Blacker holds little value outside of Toronto.

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Old
06-09-2012, 10:58 AM
  #3
Reverend Salty
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I would like you to share what you are smoking!

To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:02 AM
  #4
GardinerExpressway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSoH View Post


- Phil Kessel ( To replace Nash as the franchise player )
- 5th Overall
- James Reimer ( To challenge Mason, unless CLB wants a veteran )
- Jesse Blacker ( Good PMD prospect )



- Nash
- 2nd Overall

Fair? would CLB or TOR do this just gauging value.

EDIT: This trade assumes TOR, gets a veteran goalie as well, through trade or UFA.
The second overall doesn't help us that much. Once Yak is drafted the skillsets of the following four players are relatively indiscernable. Given that, Kessel is younger and has produced better seasons than Nash has already. I don't see why we would make this trade while also adding two strong young players in addition to the four main pieces.

Personally I wouldn't even do just Kessel+5th for Nash+2nd but I know I may be in the minority there due to the playing style upgrade between Kess and Nash (style, not production/talent).

The lopsidedness of the OP feels like borderline trolling but I'm unsure if it's intentional so I'm trying to reply earnestly.


Last edited by GardinerExpressway: 06-09-2012 at 11:07 AM. Reason: Grammar/Spelling errors
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Old
06-09-2012, 11:08 AM
  #5
internetdotcom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I would like you to share what you are smoking!

To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013
Clearly what you are smoking is much, MUCH stronger.

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:10 AM
  #6
Avs44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I would like you to share what you are smoking!

To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013
I would also like to see what YOUR smoking. Absolutely brutal

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:10 AM
  #7
GardinerExpressway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I would like you to share what you are smoking!

To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013
I'll agree with 'internetdotcom' that this is even more ridiculous and if not meant in irony, makes our fanbase look foolish.


Last edited by GardinerExpressway: 06-09-2012 at 11:12 AM. Reason: Spelling ... Damn iPhone!
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Old
06-09-2012, 11:11 AM
  #8
The Podium
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Kessel > Nash IMHO, and the difference between the 2nd overall and 5th overall is negligible this season so no chance.

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:15 AM
  #9
SIDGENO8771
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Add Johnasen and Kadri

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:29 AM
  #10
CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I would like you to share what you are smoking!

To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013
Wow.And you mocked someone else's homer proposal?

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:32 AM
  #11
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Kessel has more value than Nash. Regardless, 5th overall + 34th overall + Blacker is more than enough to move up three spots - especially considering that their is no clear order on who's going 2nd-5th.

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:36 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SSoH View Post


- Phil Kessel ( To replace Nash as the franchise player )
- 5th Overall
- James Reimer or 35th Overall ( To challenge Mason, unless CLB wants a veteran )
- Jesse Blacker ( Good PMD prospect )



- Nash
- 2nd Overall

Fair? would CLB or TOR do this just gauging value.

EDIT: This trade assumes TOR, gets a veteran goalie as well, through trade or UFA.
There isn't much difference between 2-5 in the draft. #5 could easily be better than #2. In many mocks these picks are reversed Murry, Forsberg, Galy, Grigo -- all going anywhere.

Kessel > Nash. So no.

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:50 AM
  #13
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Nope, I'd much rather have the much superior Nash than Kessel, and we aren't trading from 2 to 5 for junk.

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:52 AM
  #14
The Podium
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug61 View Post
Nope, I'd much rather have the much superior Nash than Kessel, and we aren't trading from 2 to 5 for junk.
1 has scored 80+ points the other has not, 1 is 4 years younger on a much more cap friendly contract, i fail to see how Nash is much superior.

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:57 AM
  #15
Johnny Bravo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I would like you to share what you are smoking!

To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013

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Old
06-09-2012, 11:59 AM
  #16
Rare Jewel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug61 View Post
Nope, I'd much rather have the much superior Nash than Kessel, and we aren't trading from 2 to 5 for junk.
Well Nash over Kessel is your opinion(one I don't share)And I don't think Blacker and Reimer are enough to get up to the #2 pick, But if you think they're "junk", Then you're sorely misguided.



As for the trade I wouldn't even bother with it.

Kessel>>>Nash(IMO)

#2>>#5

But the difference in prospects at #2 and #5 isn't much, If any.

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Old
06-09-2012, 12:06 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rare Jewel View Post
Well Nash over Kessel is your opinion(one I don't share)And I don't think Blacker and Reimer are enough to get up to the #2 pick, But if you think they're "junk", Then you're sorely misguided.



As for the trade I wouldn't even bother with it.

Kessel>>>Nash(IMO)

#2>>#5

But the difference in prospects at #2 and #5 isn't much, If any.
Agreed, especially not in this draft. Sure the #2 pick is much more valuable, you get to pick the player you want instead of just hoping he falls to you to #5, but i kind of compare this draft to the one in 2006. Erik Johnson was expected to go first but wasn't a lock, and after that pick the next four players are all great players. Sure Toews and Backstrom are better than the other two, but Staal and Kessel are very, very valuable to their team. Any player picked between #2 and #5 could easily be the best of the 4 picks following #1.

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Old
06-09-2012, 12:10 PM
  #18
bobbyflex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisx101 View Post
Kessel > Nash IMHO, and the difference between the 2nd overall and 5th overall is negligible this season so no chance.
THIS

Kessel + 5th overall + something minor
for
Nash + 2nd overall

is fair value imo

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Old
06-09-2012, 12:24 PM
  #19
Reverend Salty
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I will happily take the commentary. The proof of the matter, while some of the players mentioned may not be exactly right, Rick Nash will most likely not be sold for as much as he should be. He has asked for a trade and that automatically lessens the value that Columbus will get.

The return will be a good draft pick (Toronto 5th or 35th), a good prospect, a fine young player and a larger contract for cap reasons. That is also the reason for throwing in Mason. He is also done in Columbus.

I don't usually make trade proposals, so don't just give your opinion or be an internet tough guy, modify it and start a discussion.

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Old
06-09-2012, 12:39 PM
  #20
CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I will happily take the commentary. The proof of the matter, while some of the players mentioned may not be exactly right, Rick Nash will most likely not be sold for as much as he should be. He has asked for a trade and that automatically lessens the value that Columbus will get.

The return will be a good draft pick (Toronto 5th or 35th), a good prospect, a fine young player and a larger contract for cap reasons. That is also the reason for throwing in Mason. He is also done in Columbus.

I don't usually make trade proposals, so don't just give your opinion or be an internet tough guy, modify it and start a discussion.
There is a huge difference in the 5th overall and the 35th overall picks.

In your proposal you offered up a lot of spare parts, for someone else's star player.

You offered up-
the Leafs 2nd rounder
a 2008 prospect who's been unable to stick and produce in the nhl(Kadri)
a good,young defenseman(Gunnerson)
a salary dump(Komisarek,Connelly or MacArthur) none whom have any trade value.

Below is what the press says is the Rangers offer,which Columbus rejected..

Dubinsky,Erixon and the 1st rounder alone beat out your offer.That does not even include Miller or Thomas.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...G4UrJTPv9MxcVN
GM Scott Howson rejected what is believed a Rangers' final offer of Dubinsky, 21-year-old defenseman Tim Erixon, 2011 first-rounder J.T. Miller, 2010 second-rounder Christian Thomas and a first-round selection in this June's Entry Draft.


Last edited by CREW99AW: 06-09-2012 at 12:46 PM.
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Old
06-09-2012, 12:48 PM
  #21
GardinerExpressway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
There is a huge difference in the 5th overall and the 35th overall picks.

In your proposal you offered up a lot of spare parts, for someone else's star player.

You offered up-
the Leafs 2nd rounder
a 2008 prospect who's been unable to stick and produce in the nhl(Kadri)
a good,young defenseman(Gunnerson)
a salary dump(Komisarek,Connelly or MacArthur) none whom have any trade value.
I've already expressed my disapproval for the poster you're replying to's proposal but I will also object to your undervaluing of Kadri (who's only 20y/o) and MacArthur (who is an affordable top six winger that can be expected to put up 55-65 points). I'm happy to admit they aren't centre-pieces of any trade of this caliber, but to posit they don't have 'any trade value' is specious too.

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Old
06-09-2012, 01:00 PM
  #22
CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GardinerExpressway View Post
I've already expressed my disapproval for the poster you're replying to's proposal but I will also object to your undervaluing of Kadri (who's only 20y/o) and MacArthur (who is an affordable top six winger that can be expected to put up 55-65 points). I'm happy to admit they aren't centre-pieces of any trade of this caliber, but to posit they don't have 'any trade value' is specious too.
I didn't say Kadri had no trade value.I said he was a 2008 prospect who's been unable to stick and produce in the nhl.Did I get his draft yr wrong?

I think Komisarek,Connelly and MacArthur would all be salary dumps,awful bang for the buck.But,maybe Columbus does not think $3m for MacArthur's 20 goals would be bad value.He's had 1 season scoring over 43 pts.I think you are overly generous, saying he can be expected to put up 55-65 pt.

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Old
06-09-2012, 01:42 PM
  #23
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Nash is better than Kessel at every part of the game. No way they even consider this laughable proposal. Kessel wouldn't be able to do a thing in the Western Conference, he's better off staying on a team like the Leafs that just run and gun without worrying about defense, while a team like Columbus will be looking for strong defensive play from all players. Kessel is terrible, no reason to severely downgrade just to get rid of Nash.

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Old
06-09-2012, 02:24 PM
  #24
Blue Goose
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
To Tor
Rick Nash
Steve Mason

To Clb
Nazem Kadri
Carl Gunnarsson or Ben Scrivens
Mike Komisarek (if he waives no trade clause) or Tim Connelly or Clarke MacArthur
2nd round pick in 2012 or 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend Salty View Post
I will happily take the commentary. The proof of the matter, while some of the players mentioned may not be exactly right, Rick Nash will most likely not be sold for as much as he should be. He has asked for a trade and that automatically lessens the value that Columbus will get.

The return will be a good draft pick (Toronto 5th or 35th), a good prospect, a fine young player and a larger contract for cap reasons. That is also the reason for throwing in Mason. He is also done in Columbus.

I don't usually make trade proposals, so don't just give your opinion or be an internet tough guy, modify it and start a discussion.
I'll do my best to provide some commentary...

The Jackets don't need "larger contracts for cap reasons", so you don't need to include Connolly or Komisarek (honestly, NO ONE is going to take Komi off your hands). I think MacArthur could be a good fit, but a $3.25m salary on an expiring contract might not interest the Jackets, especially since he can just walk next summer. They are also loaded on D, especially LHD, so Gunnarsson doesn't hold much value to them (though I wouldn't mind having him in STL). I think Kadri could be a decent player, but he holds so much more value in TOR than he does anywhere else, and I'd much rather see him succeed there - besides, if he gets traded and has a great career somewhere else, Burke will get crucified.

I'd also have to respectfully disagree that Mason is "done in Columbus" - he's just not a true #1 goalie there, but he can certainly succeed as part of a tandem. Josh Harding would be a great fit if they sign him as a UFA, but I also think a Reimer/Mason tandem would work too, as they would both push each other. If TOR can land Luongo in a trade, then I can see including Reimer in a trade for Nash.

Howson seems to be asking for young NHL-ready talent, prospects, and a 1st round pick in exchange for Nash, so this is what I imagine it would take for the Leafs to successfully make the move:

TOR gets:
Rick Nash

CBJ gets:
James Reimer
Joe Colborne
Matt Frattin
TOR 2013 1st rd pick

CBJ gets their tandem goalie, a 1st, and two forward prospects; TOR gets their man without having to give up Gardiner or the #5 pick this year.

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Old
06-09-2012, 02:26 PM
  #25
Michael Gary Scott
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difference between kessel and nash is not equal to the difference between 2nd and 5th. Leafs say no.

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