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Old
06-17-2012, 08:38 PM
  #876
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Agree. We already have 3 defensemen that are better than him (Prospect wise). Despres, Morrow, and Harrington.
He's at least as good as Morrow and hes a much better prospect than the other 2. He's also about 2 years development ahead of Morrow. Schultz would be an amazing sign for the Pens if it were able to happen. There will be a TON of interest in him though and I dont think the Pens will be the winner in the battle unfortunately.

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06-17-2012, 08:42 PM
  #877
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I know nothing about Shultz beyond what I just read here, but if he is even close to Despres, Morrow and Harrington then it seems silly not to at least try to pick him up for nothing.

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06-17-2012, 08:44 PM
  #878
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
First of all, if you get a chance to acquire a top prospect for nothing, it's just good asset management to do it. In theory, we could sign him, have him play on our team for a year or two -- because Morrow and Harrington are not seeing the NHL in the next 2 years -- and then trade Schultz if the other two guys were really better and made him expendible (which I'm not necessarily convinced of). Conversely, if Schultz proved to be so good, he could make one of those other players expendible in a trade to bring in a high quality young forward or goaltender.

Second, it's debateable as to whether any of the 3 players you mentioned are better prospects than Schultz overall, at this point; and of the 3, only Morrow comes close to having the offensive upside. It is, however, quite certain that Schultz is more NHL ready than Morrow & Harrington, and possibly even Despres.

Third, I believe Schultz would bring an element that the Pens could really use organizationally, and especially so immediately: a legit PP quarterback Dman after Letang. We all know that Martin blows in this role, and while Niskanen was better and Despres showed some promise, none of them look to be able to replace what Gonchar or Goligoski brought to this team. Having Letang is amazing, but I would ideally like to see two offensive Dmen on this team RIGHT NOW.

Fourth, Schultz not only provides a needed offensive element, but he brings it in a right-handed package. All 3 of the prospects you mentioned are lefties.

And if Schultz was so good on this team that we wanted to keep him long-term, having that asset may enable us to trade a good young D prospect for good young forward or goalie prospect down the line (i.e. look how trading Rundblad netted Tarasenko).

As for why he would want to come here: it may not be Canada, but I couldn't think of a more exciting team to play for and have a career with than the Penguins as they are currently assembled. Opportunity to play with the 2 best players in the world and compete for the Cup every year for the next 10+ years.
Exactly this post. I dont know why anyone wouldnt want him or would say we dont need him because we have some good dmen on the way. Its a free agent and available for free. If you dont want/take free assets then you arent that smart. Schultz is a TOP prospect as well. Better than all of ours with the possible exception of Morrow. I would bet he could fit right in with our team next year and not miss a beat. Probably would be a top 4 dman for us by seasons end.

If there is any way the Pens can get him they should do whatever possible.

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06-17-2012, 08:48 PM
  #879
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
First of all, if you get a chance to acquire a top prospect for nothing, it's just good asset management to do it. In theory, we could sign him, have him play on our team for a year or two -- because Morrow and Harrington are not seeing the NHL in the next 2 years -- and then trade Schultz if the other two guys were really better and made him expendible (which I'm not necessarily convinced of). Conversely, if Schultz proved to be so good, he could make one of those other players expendible in a trade to bring in a high quality young forward or goaltender.

Second, it's debateable as to whether any of the 3 players you mentioned are better prospects than Schultz overall, at this point; and of the 3, only Morrow comes close to having the offensive upside. It is, however, quite certain that Schultz is more NHL ready than Morrow & Harrington, and possibly even Despres.

Third, I believe Schultz would bring an element that the Pens could really use organizationally, and especially so immediately: a legit PP quarterback Dman after Letang. We all know that Martin blows in this role, and while Niskanen was better and Despres showed some promise, none of them look to be able to replace what Gonchar or Goligoski brought to this team. Having Letang is amazing, but I would ideally like to see two offensive Dmen on this team RIGHT NOW.

Fourth, Schultz not only provides a needed offensive element, but he brings it in a right-handed package. All 3 of the prospects you mentioned are lefties.

And if Schultz was so good on this team that we wanted to keep him long-term, having that asset may enable us to trade a good young D prospect for good young forward or goalie prospect down the line (i.e. look how trading Rundblad netted Tarasenko).

As for why he would want to come here: it may not be Canada, but I couldn't think of a more exciting team to play for and have a career with than the Penguins as they are currently assembled. Opportunity to play with the 2 best players in the world and compete for the Cup every year for the next 10+ years.
Pretty much dead on with my thoughts on the matter. Adding him, would add a playing chip to our side of the table in a few fashions. It is never bad to have another high end prospect, even if there is already a log jam in that prospect pool.

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06-17-2012, 08:54 PM
  #880
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OT: How's Beau Bennett coming along? I'm not so curious for this season but rather next season for Eric Tangradi's sake. IMO, if we had as good forward prospects and we did on defense, we'd be moving Tangradi now while he still has trade value.

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06-17-2012, 08:56 PM
  #881
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Originally Posted by TravisUlrich View Post
OT: How's Beau Bennett coming along? I'm not so curious for this season but rather next season for Eric Tangradi's sake. IMO, if we had as good forward prospects and we did on defense, we'd be moving Tangradi now while he still has trade value.
I haven't seen him play, but he has put on some solid mass it seems. Being undersized shouldn't be a problem for him.

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06-17-2012, 08:59 PM
  #882
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I still think we need to take a shot on Brad Boyes. I see him as a low-mid risk signing that could have a lot of reward if playing beside one of our 3 centers could bring him back to his previous play. He had a near 30 goal season in 05-06, a 33 goal season in 08-09, and a 43 goal season in 07-08. He has an upside that while may have diminished more than likely has not gone away completely. Even if he only plays up to a 20-25 goal level he still adds an element to the team that for the likely salary it would take to sign him is worth.

He could most likely be signed in the 2-2.5M dollar range on a 1-2 year contract. Getting a chance to play in Pittsburgh with our centers makes for a perfect environment for him to both get a cup and possibly restart his career properly. I wouldn't take him for a term or dollar more than mentioned above. But 2 years a 2M or 1 year a 2.5M are both acceptable contracts for someone who could be a nice reclamation project. He also ads a RHS to the roster we almost always seem to need, and if he is even moderately successful as a reclaim on that merit alone he makes a notable impact to the roster.

Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Dupuis - Crosby - Boyes
Cooke - Staal - Sullivan/Kennedy

Thats the top 3 lines I would role with assuming that signing, and I like it. Just food for thought, your thoughts?

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06-17-2012, 09:04 PM
  #883
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Originally Posted by Fictionzero View Post
I still think we need to take a shot on Brad Boyes. I see him as a low-mid risk signing that could have a lot of reward if playing beside one of our 3 centers could bring him back to his previous play. He had a near 30 goal season in 05-06, a 33 goal season in 08-09, and a 43 goal season in 07-08. He has an upside that while may have diminished more than likely has not gone away completely. Even if he only plays up to a 20-25 goal level he still adds an element to the team that for the likely salary it would take to sign him is worth.

He could most likely be signed in the 2-2.5M dollar range on a 1-2 year contract. Getting a chance to play in Pittsburgh with our centers makes for a perfect environment for him to both get a cup and possibly restart his career properly. I wouldn't take him for a term or dollar more than mentioned above. But 2 years a 2M or 1 year a 2.5M are both acceptable contracts for someone who could be a nice reclamation project. He also ads a RHS to the roster we almost always seem to need, and if he is even moderately successful as a reclaim on that merit alone he makes a notable impact to the roster.

Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Dupuis - Crosby - Boyes
Cooke - Staal - Sullivan/Kennedy

Thats the top 3 lines I would role with assuming that signing, and I like it. Just food for thought, your thoughts?
I don't like him as anything but a backup backup plan if we can't get anybody we want or Sully. I wouldn't want both him and Sully for sure. If we sign two top 6 guys and he's the second one, maybe I can see it. But he is not the answer to our top 6 hole.

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06-17-2012, 09:06 PM
  #884
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Originally Posted by Fictionzero View Post
I still think we need to take a shot on Brad Boyes. I see him as a low-mid risk signing that could have a lot of reward if playing beside one of our 3 centers could bring him back to his previous play. He had a near 30 goal season in 05-06, a 33 goal season in 08-09, and a 43 goal season in 07-08. He has an upside that while may have diminished more than likely has not gone away completely. Even if he only plays up to a 20-25 goal level he still adds an element to the team that for the likely salary it would take to sign him is worth.

He could most likely be signed in the 2-2.5M dollar range on a 1-2 year contract. Getting a chance to play in Pittsburgh with our centers makes for a perfect environment for him to both get a cup and possibly restart his career properly. I wouldn't take him for a term or dollar more than mentioned above. But 2 years a 2M or 1 year a 2.5M are both acceptable contracts for someone who could be a nice reclamation project. He also ads a RHS to the roster we almost always seem to need, and if he is even moderately successful as a reclaim on that merit alone he makes a notable impact to the roster.

Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Dupuis - Crosby - Boyes
Cooke - Staal - Sullivan/Kennedy

Thats the top 3 lines I would role with assuming that signing, and I like it. Just food for thought, your thoughts?
IMO, Dupuis is not a top 6 player. I would rather try and land E. Kane, Whiteny, or someone like that... Dupuis is a great 3rd line player on this team.

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06-17-2012, 09:08 PM
  #885
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Originally Posted by Aarow View Post
IMO, Dupuis is not a top 6 player. I would rather try and land E. Kane, Whiteny, or someone like that... Dupuis is a great 3rd line player on this team.
ya also that. I really want two guys. Boyes shouldn't be the better of the two certainly. I'm not even sure he'll be better than Dupuis.

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06-17-2012, 09:12 PM
  #886
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
First of all, if you get a chance to acquire a top prospect for nothing, it's just good asset management to do it. In theory, we could sign him, have him play on our team for a year or two -- because Morrow and Harrington are not seeing the NHL in the next 2 years -- and then trade Schultz if the other two guys were really better and made him expendible (which I'm not necessarily convinced of). Conversely, if Schultz proved to be so good, he could make one of those other players expendible in a trade to bring in a high quality young forward or goaltender.

Second, it's debateable as to whether any of the 3 players you mentioned are better prospects than Schultz overall, at this point; and of the 3, only Morrow comes close to having the offensive upside. It is, however, quite certain that Schultz is more NHL ready than Morrow & Harrington, and possibly even Despres.

Third, I believe Schultz would bring an element that the Pens could really use organizationally, and especially so immediately: a legit PP quarterback Dman after Letang. We all know that Martin blows in this role, and while Niskanen was better and Despres showed some promise, none of them look to be able to replace what Gonchar or Goligoski brought to this team. Having Letang is amazing, but I would ideally like to see two offensive Dmen on this team RIGHT NOW.

Fourth, Schultz not only provides a needed offensive element, but he brings it in a right-handed package. All 3 of the prospects you mentioned are lefties.

And if Schultz was so good on this team that we wanted to keep him long-term, having that asset may enable us to trade a good young D prospect for good young forward or goalie prospect down the line (i.e. look how trading Rundblad netted Tarasenko).

As for why he would want to come here: it may not be Canada, but I couldn't think of a more exciting team to play for and have a career with than the Penguins as they are currently assembled. Opportunity to play with the 2 best players in the world and compete for the Cup every year for the next 10+ years.
I agree that this would be a good situation for anyone, IF they get on the NHL roster. You have to look at it from his perspective though. Yeah, he's a great prospect, but he sees 7 NHL defensemen returning, and knows full well that 3-4 defensive prospects are going to be battling for NHL spots soon. Sure he could come here because of the situation to win, but why when he can probably get on another team without the depth on the blueline, get a better contract, and not have to worry about battling for ice time?

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06-17-2012, 09:15 PM
  #887
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ya also that. I really want two guys. Boyes shouldn't be the better of the two certainly. I'm not even sure he'll be better than Dupuis.
Agreed. I would rather see proven talent. Someone reliable, and if its not to much to ask a long term proven winger for sid.

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06-17-2012, 09:17 PM
  #888
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Just posting something I read and thought it would create conversation. U Dont gotta be a dbag burgundy
First of all I'm not being a dbag, I'm actually doing you a favor. Second of all the only discussion it creates is people tearing apart Eklunds idiotic posts and prove he knows nothing. If you have to preface your post with "I know its Eklund but" then you probably already know this to he true.

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06-17-2012, 09:17 PM
  #889
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OT: How's Beau Bennett coming along? I'm not so curious for this season but rather next season for Eric Tangradi's sake. IMO, if we had as good forward prospects and we did on defense, we'd be moving Tangradi now while he still has trade value.

I cannot go into much detail, but I can tell you that Bennett has been involved in intense training with one of the best people on the planet in that regard. I think he's going to show up at camp in tremendous shape and may really surprise a lot of people this year.

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06-17-2012, 09:19 PM
  #890
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As for Schultz being a top prospect.... I haven't seen him. Partly because he hasn't been in international competitions and partly because his college team made no real noise come post-season. Is he a McDonaugh or a Gilroy? Hard to say before he plays pros. Sneep was great in college.
But I DO like getting genuine assets for nothing.... who knows, maybe he worships Sid and models his game after Letang . If our scouts truly see him as ready, he could take Niskanen's spot. But that's a gamble for sure.


Last edited by Tender Rip: 06-17-2012 at 11:28 PM. Reason: Wah.... posting on a mobile phone
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06-17-2012, 09:21 PM
  #891
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Originally Posted by Fictionzero View Post
I still think we need to take a shot on Brad Boyes. I see him as a low-mid risk signing that could have a lot of reward if playing beside one of our 3 centers could bring him back to his previous play. He had a near 30 goal season in 05-06, a 33 goal season in 08-09, and a 43 goal season in 07-08. He has an upside that while may have diminished more than likely has not gone away completely. Even if he only plays up to a 20-25 goal level he still adds an element to the team that for the likely salary it would take to sign him is worth.

He could most likely be signed in the 2-2.5M dollar range on a 1-2 year contract. Getting a chance to play in Pittsburgh with our centers makes for a perfect environment for him to both get a cup and possibly restart his career properly. I wouldn't take him for a term or dollar more than mentioned above. But 2 years a 2M or 1 year a 2.5M are both acceptable contracts for someone who could be a nice reclamation project. He also ads a RHS to the roster we almost always seem to need, and if he is even moderately successful as a reclaim on that merit alone he makes a notable impact to the roster.

Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Dupuis - Crosby - Boyes
Cooke - Staal - Sullivan/Kennedy

Thats the top 3 lines I would role with assuming that signing, and I like it. Just food for thought, your thoughts?
If we don't land Whitney, Boyes would be a great guy to take a flier on. RH shot with a history of production, 30 years old, and only a year removed from scoring 55 points.

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06-17-2012, 09:32 PM
  #892
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If we don't land Whitney, Boyes would be a great guy to take a flier on. RH shot with a history of production, 30 years old, and only a year removed from scoring 55 points.
If we bring in Boyes, I really think we need to bring in someone else too. For how cheap he'll likely be there's really no good reason not to. Boyes would be a lot easier to swallow as a piece of our top 6 upgrade than he would as the whole thing. Martin for Malone or something along those lines would still be nice. The nice thing of Boyes is that he'd be cheap. We could have quite a bit of cap space left over. Enough to bring in a really good deadline guy or two. I'm talking like, Jarome Iginla cap space at the deadline.


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06-17-2012, 09:38 PM
  #893
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All I want is someone who can create some space for Sid. Battle in the corners. And have some level of top 6 skill. Dupuis is a fine third wheel but we need some more size on that line if we want Sid effective at ES in the postseason.

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06-17-2012, 09:39 PM
  #894
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All I want is someone who can create some space for Sid. Battle in the corners. And have some level of top 6 skill. Dupuis is a fine third wheel but we need some more size on that line if we want Sid effective at ES in the postseason.
I think he'd be OK with an average sized scorer as long as he also has Kunitz back. I don't want someone small AND Dupuis though.

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06-17-2012, 09:40 PM
  #895
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If we bring in Boyes, I really think we need to bring in someone else too. For how cheap he'll likely be there's really no good reason not to.

If that was the case I would rather see the Pens spend the money on a vet Dman (if the pens are going with a younger core). I dont see Boyes being the problem or the solution. Low risk though. I still think a guy like Tangradi who is already in the system could produce just was much as a Boyes at a lower cap hit.

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06-17-2012, 09:43 PM
  #896
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If that was the case I would rather see the Pens spend the money on a vet Dman (if the pens are going with a younger core). I dont see Boyes being the problem or the solution. Low risk though. I still think a guy like Tangradi who is already in the system could produce just was much as a Boyes at a lower cap hit.
I don't think we need a Vet D. We already have to move out 2 D just to get down to 8.

As for Tangradi, I just don't agree. He can get there but he isn't there yet. I like him on the third line. As the season goes, maybe he can pass him up. And then we have Boyes on the third line. Not terrible.

Boyes wouldn't be my first choice, but I'd rather him than Tangradi in that spot certainly.

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06-17-2012, 09:44 PM
  #897
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I think he'd be OK with an average sized scorer as long as he also has Kunitz back. I don't want someone small AND Dupuis though.
It's not ideal, but I'd be alright with Boyes if Kuni is back with Sid. But that leaves another hole on Malkin's LW. I'd rather us explore a hell of alot more options via trade before we go that route.

We're in win now mode, move some assets to set Sid/Geno up to dominate come postseason.

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06-17-2012, 09:45 PM
  #898
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It's not ideal, but I'd be alright with Boyes if Kuni is back with Sid. But that leaves another hole on Malkin's LW. I'd rather us explore a hell of alot more options via trade before we go that route.

We're in win now mode, move some assets to set Sid/Geno up to dominate come postseason.
I agree. I actually said I'd only want Boyes as a backup plan kind of option. He'd be better than not signing anybody for that spot though. As far as the averaged sized scorers go, what would you think about Whitney? Assuming we had that LW for Geno which is the much more important spot to fill in my opinion. Kunitz needs to be back with Sid.

As far as post-season, Boyes actually helps there. He saves us enough cap that we could afford pretty much any player available cap-wise.

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06-17-2012, 09:51 PM
  #899
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Anyone else want to see Arron Asham back in a Penguins jersey next year? Always thought he was a perfect fit for the Bylsma system. Gritty enforcer that forechecks and seems to be a good fit for the locker room.

If not him, then who would play the enforcer role on this team?

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06-17-2012, 09:52 PM
  #900
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
If we bring in Boyes, I really think we need to bring in someone else too. For how cheap he'll likely be there's really no good reason not to. Boyes would be a lot easier to swallow as a piece of our top 6 upgrade than he would as the whole thing. Martin for Malone or something along those lines would still be nice. The nice thing of Boyes is that he'd be cheap. We could have quite a bit of cap space left over. Enough to bring in a really good deadline guy or two. I'm talking like, Jarome Iginla cap space at the deadline.
Yeah, it'd be nice to bring in a more physical complement to flesh out the top 6 if we did sign Boyes.

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I agree. I actually said I'd only want Boyes as a backup plan kind of option. He'd be better than not signing anybody for that spot though. As far as the averaged sized scorers go, what would you think about Whitney? Assuming we had that LW for Geno which is the much more important spot to fill in my opinion. Kunitz needs to be back with Sid.

As far as post-season, Boyes actually helps there. He saves us enough cap that we could afford pretty much any player available cap-wise.
I think Geno needs a physical, hardhat type guy like Kunitz opposite Neal to make the most of that line.

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