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Perry and Getzlaf: UFA's in 2013

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Old
06-14-2012, 10:06 AM
  #76
ALine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KapG View Post
Getzlaf, Perry, Richards and Carter also came out of what is looked at as one of, if not the deepest drafts in NHL history.

Phaneuf (9) and Kessel (5) and Lupul (7) are all top 10 picks currently playing in the NHL for us. Not once did I say they weren't elite talent. My point is that we lack top end talent in our prospect pipeline.
I don't understand this. You value elite blue chip prospects more than elite established NHL players?

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06-14-2012, 10:07 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Burke's connection to past players always gets some fans excited.

Perhaps when Burke was giving his speeches about his less that 5 year plan back to competitiveness for our Leafs when he first arrived, he was counting on the Sedin twins hitting UFA market to accomplish that. He even flew to Sweden and was in their home country on July 1st.

I know some fans were drooling over that possibility back then.

Perry and Getzlaf are the now the new false hope warriors, fueled by unbridled optimism, based on links to Burke in the past that fuels threads like this one. Neither is likely to make it to free agency, and if unsigned, they likely would be dealt at the trade deadline prior to them walking away for free which would change the situation again.
Are fans not supposed to get excited? What is the point of being a fan of a team when all you do is predict the worst? In fact some so-called fans here hope for the worst. I really do not understand.
You are absolutely correct that in all likelihood they will not hit the UFA market but why that has to turn into another cheap shot at Burke?

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06-14-2012, 10:08 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
They play for the Leafs.
Thanks champ! Didn't know those players played for our team!

Note I said we lack elite talent in our prospect pipeline. I never said anything about us not having a few elite players on our squad currently.

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06-14-2012, 10:09 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by KapG View Post
Thanks champ! Didn't know those players played for our team!

Note I said we lack elite talent in our prospect pipeline. I never said anything about us not having a few elite players on our squad currently.
So Gardiner was a flash in the pan and Percy and Biggs are already busts?

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06-14-2012, 10:10 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALine View Post
I don't understand this. You value elite blue chip prospects more than elite established NHL players?
I never said that? Show me where I said I value elite blue chip prospects more than elite established NHL players?

I never once said I would take blue chip prospects over Phaneuf, Kessel or Lupul. Don't be an idiot.

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06-14-2012, 10:13 AM
  #81
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So Edm is intentionally losing because they're developing there young players instead of trading the picks they were acquired with for immeadiate help like we did ? Edm in fact wanted to win and that's why they offer sheeted Penner . The team feel apart after Pronger wanted out and that's why they went with a draft rebuild and not because they intentially wanted to lose .

You don't blow your long term assets for a slight bump and the goal is a cup not just to avoid a bottom 5 finish . Just because a GM doesn't use every long term asset he has to try to improve as quickly as posssible doen't mean he's intentially tanking .

Anyway we are off topic so i'll let it go .
Agreed. Aside from Penner, they also tried to poach Vanek from the Sabres. The Oilers also had Katz (owner) fly out to Heatley in an attempt to get him to go to Edmonton. They tried to sign Nylander but he bolted to Washington. All moves that probably weren't worth it to begin with but trying to lose and losing because you stink are two different things. What else did people want them to do?

It's not like the Leafs have been lighting it up the past few seasons, what's Toronto's excuse for the excessive amount of losing?

Anyhoo, definitely off topic... I apologize. Getting somewhat back on topic, cap space isn't the be-all and end-all of signing free agents. The teams who are looking like they might to do some damage in the 2013/14 season are probably the teams with highest odds of getting a marquee free agent.

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06-14-2012, 10:14 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Northern Dancer View Post
So Gardiner was a flash in the pan and Percy and Biggs are already busts?
go read back a few posts and you will see I already mentioned that Kadri and Gardiner are the only guys I think that have high end elite talent.

Not sold on Biggs. Think there were players with higher upside available where we took him.

Percy I think will be a good 2nd pairing guy. Not sure I see top pairing potential in him.

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06-14-2012, 10:17 AM
  #83
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I'm not trying to be an idiot, but thanks for the compliments. Just trying to follow your posts and asking for clarification, in what i thought was respectful enough fashion not to warrant personal attacks. I guess its too hard for some people to resist.

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06-14-2012, 10:19 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Burke's connection to past players always gets some fans excited.

Perhaps when Burke was giving his speeches about his less that 5 year plan back to competitiveness for our Leafs when he first arrived, he was counting on the Sedin twins hitting UFA market to accomplish that. He even flew to Sweden and was in their home country on July 1st.

I know some fans were drooling over that possibility back then.

Perry and Getzlaf are the now the new false hope warriors, fueled by unbridled optimism, based on links to Burke in the past that fuels threads like this one. Neither is likely to make it to free agency, and if unsigned, they likely would be dealt at the trade deadline prior to them walking away for free which would change the situation again.
Yes, Leaf fans are stupid as you never tire of reminding us. But where is this unbridled optimism of which you refer to?

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06-14-2012, 10:20 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by ALine View Post
I'm not trying to be an idiot, but thanks for the compliments. Just trying to follow your posts and asking for clarification, in what i thought was respectful enough fashion not to warrant personal attacks. I guess its too hard for some people to resist.
I said don't be an idiot lol.

Did that really hurt your feelings so much that you had to make a post about it? Grow some thicker skin.


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06-14-2012, 10:30 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Are you suggesting Burke has been planning to use older free agents on short term contracts that expire at the same time as some of the Leafs ELC players would be NHL ready and a number of high end free agents may be available for teams with cap space?

Huh...go figure.
Food for thought..

Burke's own contract itself also expires in a couple more seasons with many of his own player contracts.

Coincidence, or by intended design to "clear the slate" possibility for the next GM should things not work out as planned !!! .. huh .. go figure.

In fact this is a huge year for Burke ahead and he needs to show vast improvement as his own livelihood depends on it, on the Leafs performance.. Getzlaf and Perry potentially becoming UFA in summer 2013 is not going to help him make it through next season regardless of their player status then.

People are counting on Burke's connection to lure the Anaheim boys to Toronto, when it fact its a possibility that Burke hits free agency before they do if things continue to unravel like they have for him so far.

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Old
06-14-2012, 10:38 AM
  #87
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Landing two of the biggest free agents in 2013 won't help his cause?

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06-14-2012, 10:46 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by mooseOAK View Post
Yes, Leaf fans are stupid as you never tire of reminding us. But where is this unbridled optimism of which you refer to?
Isn't any discussion itself hoping for Perry and Getzlaf to join the Leafs, after becoming potentially UFAs in summer 2013 considered unbridled optimism at this point, over a year from the event even possibly occurring?

I never said anything about fan intelligence, as optimism is hope based not fact based. Besides you yourself by your own posts this thread, don't seem to be relying on Perry and Getzalf to be on the way as UFAs any time soon, so you wouldn't even qualify to be accused of optimism at this stage.

However there are Leaf fans hoping this all comes fruition, and are already praising Burke for stealing and robbing Anaheim of their players 1 by 1, of events that take place in the future.


Last edited by Mess: 06-14-2012 at 10:54 AM.
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06-14-2012, 10:48 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
Landing two of the biggest free agents in 2013 won't help his cause?
Not with Toronto if he's not here anymore, which I believe is what he was getting at.

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06-14-2012, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Isn't any discussion itself hoping for Perry and Getzlaf to join the Leafs, after becoming potentially UFAs in summer 2013 considered unbridled optimism at this point over a year from the event even possibly occurring?
So one person starts a dumb thread and doesn't post in it again and that is equated to the entire fan base of the Leafs counting on Getzlaf and Perry coming to Toronto.

That is something that I would expect a troll to do and not a Leaf fan.

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06-14-2012, 10:54 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by achtungbaby View Post
Not with Toronto if he's not here anymore, which I believe is what he was getting at.
Some people are convinced Burke won't be here based on only results and some people know that's not the truth and believe this is just part of the master plan.

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06-14-2012, 11:15 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by KapG View Post
I said don't be an idiot lol.

Did that really hurt your feelings so much that you had to make a post about it? Grow some thicker skin.

Yeah, that was an unnecessary response, my apologies. I hadn't had my coffee yet.



On, topic,

I don't think its at foolish or hoplessly optimistic to believe that some players may actually want to play in Toronto. Perry from Peterborough may very much like the idea of playing in his "hometown", and all the glory it would bring if he can be successful.

And hockey is all about connections, who you know, who you are comfortable playing for. Look at Brad Richards, signed in NY due to his connections with the coach. Look at all the young goalies who want to come here because the direction Allaire will give them (debatable results though). Having people Perry and Getzlaf are comfortable with in the organization can only help the leafs cause, and should not be just dismissed as irrelevant. Now, the chances of both or even one signing with the leafs is very slim, but as Lloyd Christmas said, "So your saying theres a chance..."


Last edited by ALine: 06-14-2012 at 11:20 AM.
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06-14-2012, 11:19 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post

People are counting on Burke's connection to lure the Anaheim boys to Toronto, when it fact its a possibility that Burke hits free agency before they do if things continue to unravel like they have for him so far.
Only an unpatient fan would say things here are or have unraveled. Show some patience Mess, and truly live with the consequences of playing the kids.

Schenn, Grabs, Kulemin
Monster, Gunnar, Bozak, Hanson
Aulie, Reimer
Gardiner, Frattin
Kadri, Colborne, Scrivens, Ashton

That's 15 kids who have been cutting their teeth for Brian Bourke's Toronto Maple Leafs.

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06-14-2012, 11:33 AM
  #94
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I'd rather just concentrate on stealing Schultz first.

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06-14-2012, 11:35 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by middletoe View Post
I'd rather just concentrate on stealing Schultz first.
I think that's pretty much out of Bourke's hands at this point. It's a quick conversation and contract signing when the time comes, for whoever he's going to sign with.

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06-14-2012, 11:40 AM
  #96
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Would be nice, but

IMO, niether Perry or Getzlaf will be available just like Crosby will not be available.
One can hope and dream though because at this point it is all Leaf's fans have.

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06-14-2012, 11:44 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by smoke meat pete View Post
Only an unpatient fan would say things here are or have unraveled. Show some patience Mess, and truly live with the consequences of playing the kids.

Schenn, Grabs, Kulemin
Monster, Gunnar, Bozak, Hanson
Aulie, Reimer
Gardiner, Frattin
Kadri, Colborne, Scrivens, Ashton

That's 15 kids who have been cutting their teeth for Brian Bourke's Toronto Maple Leafs.
An inpatient Leaf fan???? Leaf fans have got to be the most patient in the whole world of professional sport!!! So yea play the all the kids, us fans got all the time in the world.

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06-14-2012, 11:51 AM
  #98
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An inpatient Leaf fan???? Leaf fans have got to be the most patient in the whole world of professional sport!!! So yea play the all the kids, us fans got all the time in the world.
Actually, I think it's impatient. But, alas, no, we are loyal, but we (generally speaking) are not patient. I am patient, but guys like Mess and his playoffs or bust philosophy are not.

The true test of patience is accepting the results of a young team, knowing they will in fact have ups and downs. It's ok to be disappointed with last years collapse, but it's also ok to be patient and not hope for drastic changes at the expense of our future, just to make the playoffs.

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06-14-2012, 12:17 PM
  #99
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An inpatient Leaf fan???? Leaf fans have got to be the most patient in the whole world of professional sport!!! So yea play the all the kids, us fans got all the time in the world.
Coveting future potential UFAs like Perry and Getzlaf instead of building internally, through drafting and developing your own talent, is the classic definition of impatient fans desires to fuel future success.

Building your team through UFA signings and trades to gain instant gratification and results = Impatient Fans

While

Building your team through strong drafting and developing and "playing the kids" = Patient Fans.

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06-14-2012, 12:25 PM
  #100
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Coveting future potential UFAs like Perry and Getzlaf instead of building internally, through drafting and developing your own talent, is the classic definition of impatient fans desires to fuel future success.
Theres more than one way to skin a cat. And theres more than one way to build a team. Where would NJ be if they built internally without signing Kovalchuk. Boston without Chara, Hawks without Hossa. This is a little ridiculous to say that to sign big ticket free agents is impatient. Most teams in the league built their core around both internally developed players and free agents. Thats just how it goes. Why would wanting the signing of Perry and Getzaf be a sign of impatience? Because it would make the team better?

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