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The Oilers WON'T trade the 1st overall pick

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Old
06-16-2012, 11:37 AM
  #76
Hardyvan123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renegade Stylings View Post
I'm a big Ryan Murray fan, but if they take him 1st overall, they are making a big mistake. There are likely 25+ teams that would want Yakupov first overall and the Oilers are missing a chance to move back, gain assets and still get a great franchise D.
While I agree that 25 other teams would probably take Yakupov 1st, it doesn't mean that it's the best thing for the Oilers to do.

While trading out of the 1st pick is rare it might be a way out to actually make the Oilers a better team in the long run.

A successful NHL team needs a balanced lineup and the Oilers are woefully lacking on the back end and the reality is that it's not the 1st choice for top free agent Dmen.

But maybe they draft Nail, tank it in their back end and get 1st for Jones next year? (No doubt this will be some hairbrained thread showing up next season but wait their will be better forwards once again hype).

While Nail would be the number 1 pick for most teams, and guys on HF, it's not totally out of the question that Murray or Grigorenko have huge impacts on their NHL teams in their careers.

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06-16-2012, 12:06 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by boredmale View Post
What if Columbus is high on Forsberg, what use do they have trading up? If I am Columbus and Edmonton comes to me wanting to trade the pick I would tell them we are picking Murray with it then offer a 7th rounder
What exactly is a 7th rounder supposed to do?

I can see Tambellini trying to sell that to Edmonton fans.....

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06-16-2012, 12:14 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Yakupov will be as good as Hall/Seguin/Landeskog/RNH/etc. and is ready to contribute significantly to the Oilers right away next year, moreso than Murray who's probably going to need 2-3 years to get to the point where he actually makes a difference in wins/losses.
Sure Yakupov can step in on the top line when hall gets injured and fantasy guys will jump for joy. The Oilers need some serious help on the back end and Murray is ready to do that along with great breakout skills, he would have more of an impact on the win/loss column than Yakupov would next year.

The Oilers need to seriously sign a couple of rock solid Defensive Dman free agents to groom there young talent along as well.

Quote:
What's Columbus going to realistically offer to move up? A bag of Doritos? Some token picks? Forget it. The Oilers are going to want Johanson for Gagner on top of the Columbus pick and I don't think the Jackets can make that deal.
Just like the previous post of the 7th rounder was ridiculous the same applies with Johanson for Gagner (clearly an Oiler pipe dream if I have ever seen one).

I have no idea on what Columbus might even do on draft day, alot will depend on the Nash situation as well.

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06-16-2012, 12:47 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Sure Yakupov can step in on the top line when hall gets injured and fantasy guys will jump for joy. The Oilers need some serious help on the back end and Murray is ready to do that along with great breakout skills, he would have more of an impact on the win/loss column than Yakupov would next year.

The Oilers need to seriously sign a couple of rock solid Defensive Dman free agents to groom there young talent along as well.
So let's say that the Oilers go out and sign those two rock solid dmen for next year. Probably not so easy to do without giving them term and money but so be it. They now have XXX, YYY Smid, Petry, Whitney, and Schultz. This does not seem to leave a lot of options for Murray to be that impact dman next year does it. Even without the two rock solid vets (and almost every Oiler fan wants at least one) Murray will most likely be a bottom pairing dman next year so the chance that he will have a significant impact is pretty minimal.

On the other hand, Yakupov has a very good chance of playing top 6 minutes with a lot of pp time. At worst he is looking at Gagner and Hemsky on the second line, but could possibly end up playing with Hall/Eberle or RNH. This makes the Oilers much less of a one line attack.

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06-16-2012, 01:03 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
While I agree that 25 other teams would probably take Yakupov 1st, it doesn't mean that it's the best thing for the Oilers to do.

While trading out of the 1st pick is rare it might be a way out to actually make the Oilers a better team in the long run.

A successful NHL team needs a balanced lineup and the Oilers are woefully lacking on the back end and the reality is that it's not the 1st choice for top free agent Dmen.

But maybe they draft Nail, tank it in their back end and get 1st for Jones next year? (No doubt this will be some hairbrained thread showing up next season but wait their will be better forwards once again hype).

While Nail would be the number 1 pick for most teams, and guys on HF, it's not totally out of the question that Murray or Grigorenko have huge impacts on their NHL teams in their careers.
1) At the top of the draft, especially at 1st overall, good franchises ALWAYS draft BPA (or trade down to recoup the value of the pick). 100% of the time. In any draft sport. Period. There are numerous reasons for doing so.
2) The Oilers forward prospect pool is actually a lot worse than the defensive prospect pool now that RNH/etc.. have graduated. The Oilers aren't some offensive powerhouse. We could desperately use Nail.

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06-16-2012, 02:37 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
1) At the top of the draft, especially at 1st overall, good franchises ALWAYS draft BPA (or trade down to recoup the value of the pick). 100% of the time. In any draft sport. Period. There are numerous reasons for doing so.
2) The Oilers forward prospect pool is actually a lot worse than the defensive prospect pool now that RNH/etc.. have graduated. The Oilers aren't some offensive powerhouse. We could desperately use Nail.
I'm very high on Murray, but I hope the Oilers brass keeps this in mind when making the pick.

At the end of the day, the name of the game is to score goals and there's a general consensus that Yakupov will do that in spades.

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06-16-2012, 03:42 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
What exactly is a 7th rounder supposed to do?
It's a nice way of not flipping the bird to Edmonton but letting them get the idea you aren't interested

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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
At the end of the day, the name of the game is to score goals and there's a general consensus that Yakupov will do that in spades.
I would argue the name of the game is to get more goals then the other team

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06-16-2012, 04:59 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Sure Yakupov can step in on the top line when hall gets injured and fantasy guys will jump for joy. The Oilers need some serious help on the back end and Murray is ready to do that along with great breakout skills, he would have more of an impact on the win/loss column than Yakupov would next year.

The Oilers need to seriously sign a couple of rock solid Defensive Dman free agents to groom there young talent along as well.



Just like the previous post of the 7th rounder was ridiculous the same applies with Johanson for Gagner (clearly an Oiler pipe dream if I have ever seen one).

I have no idea on what Columbus might even do on draft day, alot will depend on the Nash situation as well.
No 18/19 year old is going to make a lick of difference on the back end. At best maybe they can be a no.4 D who probably craps the bed every third game (because they're young and that's going to happen).

Drafting for need is stupid. If you want help on the blueline go get some defencemen that can actually grow facial hair.

A Bryan Allen type UFA signing will help the Oilers far more of the backend than a rookie.

Columbus can do whatever they want. The Oilers are the one's with the no.1 pick and they're the ones holding the cards, not Columbus. If Columbus wants to move up, then the onus is on them to present a very attractive package.

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06-16-2012, 05:00 PM
  #84
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From Twitter
@nielson1260: Oilers could end up drafting Yakupov, Murray or Reinhart. Heard they are at least discussing Griff at 1.

Can you imagine the meltdown that would ensue if Edmonton took Reinhart first overall?

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06-16-2012, 05:03 PM
  #85
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06-16-2012, 05:06 PM
  #86
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Can you tell me the last time a rookie D won the Norris?
So...defensemen are only useful when they win the Norris? I'm confused.

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06-16-2012, 05:10 PM
  #87
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As others have said, you can't draft by organizational need that high. No 18 year old, other than a generational talent, which Murray is not, can fill an organizational need by himself. Murray is not going to be the 1D that we've been looking for, for the next couple years. Take Yakupov, and if comes down to it, trade one of quartet to get that defenseman. That defenseman that would be acquired by trading one of the quartet would be better than Murray.

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06-16-2012, 05:10 PM
  #88
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06-16-2012, 05:14 PM
  #89
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Why do Oilers fans care who makes the most impact NEXT year....you should be looking for the guy who makes the most impact in 3+ years...

Oilers aren't winning anything next year no matter how good the offense is or how improved the defense gets....

I personally think you always go BPA especially at #1....so Yak sounds pretty easy to me, but meh.

Also, if need be Hall/Eberle/Yak can be moved for a defenseman in a few years, look at the Kings rebuild. DL went the opposite and loved defensemen, when the time came, he moved one of them for the scorer he needed. Oilers just need to do the opposite.

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06-16-2012, 05:14 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckJet View Post
From Twitter
@nielson1260: Oilers could end up drafting Yakupov, Murray or Reinhart. Heard they are at least discussing Griff at 1.

Can you imagine the meltdown that would ensue if Edmonton took Reinhart first overall?
Why?

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06-16-2012, 05:16 PM
  #91
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Why?
Passing on Yakupov, Grigorenko, Murray, Galchenyuk...I don't know. Back in December I would get jumped for suggesting that if the Oil pick second they should pass on Grigorenko for Murray. Back then I was an idiot. Now analysts think Murray over Yakupov would be a good idea and could happen. But you should've seen how many arguments erupted over me thinking Edmonton's defense was more important than adding a center. Now they've got a shot at Yakupov or Murray...I get Reinhart would play the local boy angle, but I still think people would rage and the hockey world would go crazy.

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06-16-2012, 05:20 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by DuckJet View Post
Passing on Yakupov, Grigorenko, Murray, Galchenyuk...I don't know. Back in December I would get jumped for suggesting that if the Oil pick second they should pass on Grigorenko for Murray. Back then I was an idiot. Now analysts think Murray over Yakupov would be a good idea and could happen. But you should've seen how many arguments erupted over me thinking Edmonton's defense was more important than adding a center. Now they've got a shot at Yakupov or Murray...I get Reinhart would play the local boy angle, but I still think people would rage and the hockey world would go crazy.
I think anybody over Yakupov is a stupid move. Yakupov is consensus #1 and with the 1st overall selection you select the consensus #1. Putting anyone else into the discussion as a better choice than Yakupov right now is simply spin by the media to generate ratings for their tv/radio shows. It's pretty clear that scouts league wide think Yakupov is the top player so the Oilers should draft the top player.

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06-16-2012, 05:21 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Sure Yakupov can step in on the top line when hall gets injured and fantasy guys will jump for joy. The Oilers need some serious help on the back end and Murray is ready to do that along with great breakout skills, he would have more of an impact on the win/loss column than Yakupov would next year.

The Oilers need to seriously sign a couple of rock solid Defensive Dman free agents to groom there young talent along as well.



Just like the previous post of the 7th rounder was ridiculous the same applies with Johanson for Gagner (clearly an Oiler pipe dream if I have ever seen one).

I have no idea on what Columbus might even do on draft day, alot will depend on the Nash situation as well.
No 18/19 year old is going to make a lick of difference on the back end. At best maybe they can be a no.4 D.

Drafting for need is stupid. If you want help on the blueline go get some defencemen that can actually grow facial hair.

A Bryan Allen type UFA signing will help the Oilers far more of the backend than a rookie.

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06-16-2012, 05:23 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckJet View Post
Passing on Yakupov, Grigorenko, Murray, Galchenyuk...I don't know. Back in December I would get jumped for suggesting that if the Oil pick second they should pass on Grigorenko for Murray. Back then I was an idiot. Now analysts think Murray over Yakupov would be a good idea and could happen. But you should've seen how many arguments erupted over me thinking Edmonton's defense was more important than adding a center. Now they've got a shot at Yakupov or Murray...I get Reinhart would play the local boy angle, but I still think people would rage and the hockey world would go crazy.
People that dont have a handle on Reinhart's game maybe.

I think Reinhart has a very good chance of being a better nhl dman than Murray.

I hope that the Oilers take Yakupov, but I can see why they are high on Reinhart.

The way people are acting on the Oiler board in particular shows me they really dont have much of a clue about Reinhart. Which is sad considering how he plays right in their own back yard.

After Yakupov, I think Reinhart lines up pretty favourably with anybody.

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06-16-2012, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
No 18/19 year old is going to make a lick of difference on the back end. At best maybe they can be a no.4 D.

Drafting for need is stupid. If you want help on the blueline go get some defencemen that can actually grow facial hair.

A Bryan Allen type UFA signing will help the Oilers far more of the backend than a rookie.
The Oilers also have other prospects/roster players and additional draft picks that they can move for immediate help on the back end without trading the #1 pick. Yakupov has been gift wrapped for us, by drafting him we'll have the scariest top 6 in the west really soon. Draft the Yak!

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06-16-2012, 05:25 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
People that dont have a handle on Reinhart's game maybe.

I think Reinhart has a very good chance of being a better nhl dman than Murray.

I hope that the Oilers take Yakupov, but I can see why they are high on Reinhart.

The way people are acting on the Oiler board in particular shows me they really dont have much of a clue about Reinhart. Which is sad considering how he plays right in their own back yard.

After Yakupov, I think Reinhart lines up pretty favourably with anybody.
The argument isn't Murray vs Reinhart though. I can understand your point about the merits of Reinhart and how familiar the Oilers are with him. But the question is do you take him over Yakupov and imo the answer is simply no. If the Oilers want Reinhart that badly then package some players/additional picks/prospects to Toronto or NYI and see if Reinhart is still available on June 22.

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06-16-2012, 05:28 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
People that dont have a handle on Reinhart's game maybe.

I think Reinhart has a very good chance of being a better nhl dman than Murray.

I hope that the Oilers take Yakupov, but I can see why they are high on Reinhart.

The way people are acting on the Oiler board in particular shows me they really dont have much of a clue about Reinhart. Which is sad considering how he plays right in their own back yard.

After Yakupov, I think Reinhart lines up pretty favourably with anybody.
All that may be true but most fans won't know that. Either way they'll get upset that they didn't trade down.

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06-16-2012, 05:28 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
No 18/19 year old is going to make a lick of difference on the back end. At best maybe they can be a no.4 D.

Drafting for need is stupid. If you want help on the blueline go get some defencemen that can actually grow facial hair.

A Bryan Allen type UFA signing will help the Oilers far more of the backend than a rookie.
Not that it is the same, but DD stepped in and was the #1 D for the Kings. (though he was somewhat sheltered)

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06-16-2012, 05:34 PM
  #99
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The argument isn't Murray vs Reinhart though. I can understand your point about the merits of Reinhart and how familiar the Oilers are with him. But the question is do you take him over Yakupov and imo the answer is simply no. If the Oilers want Reinhart that badly then package some players/additional picks/prospects to Toronto or NYI and see if Reinhart is still available on June 22.
It isnt beyond reason that he could be better than Yakupov five years down the road.

This is a kid who could turn into a dominating 6'5" 225lb dman at both ends of the rink with a cannon from the point. Playing 30min a night in all situations, pp, pk, against the opposition's best players. And excelling. Those kind of players are few and far between and they are priceless.

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06-16-2012, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
It isnt beyond reason that he could be better than Yakupov five years down the road.

This is a kid who could turn into a dominating 6'5" 225lb dman at both ends of the rink with a cannon from the point. Playing 30min a night in all situations, pp, pk, against the opposition's best players. And excelling. Those kind of players are few and far between and they are priceless.
Agreed. Nick Lidstrom was a 2nd round pick if I'm not mistaken so it isn't beyond reason Reinhart could be great. But you can also argue that Yakupov could turn into a 50 goal scorer with a guy like RNH feeding him the puck for a decade then it becomes a dilemma who you take. That's the problem with the draft, you're dealing with unknowns. What we do know is that Yakupov is the clear #1. I'm all for moving some pieces and drafting Reinhart or even Murray, but not at the expense of Yakupov.

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