Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
You're missing the point. Luongo could be a starter on many other NHL teams, he wouldn't have to ride the bench because there would be dozens other suitors vying for his services, therefore, he won't be dead-cap. He would be if there's a GM stupid enough to let him rot on the bench but there isn't
Sure. Unless he gets outplayed by a backup on the other team - then he becomes dead cap once more.
That the inherent risk of giving a long-term contract to a goalie - if they stop being your best, they're not helping the team.
I agree with most of what you say but I think it needs to be made clear that the risk cuts both ways. To simply throw Luongo off without looking at all of the options on the table is bad asset management.
Yes, risk cuts both ways. It always does. There is a LOT more risk for the team taking on Luongo and his contract. I don't expect Vancouver to throw him away without looking at the options. I think they have been looking at the options for a year now. I don't see any other options.
Leafs should look at other options than Vancouver for a goalie. Then all this flaming and hot air stops.
im sure they already are, maybe canuck fans should stop proposing luongo for 5th ov or gardiner, because it was orginally the vancouver media and their fans who brought out the rumor of luongo to toronto and and according to them "burke's job is on the line" so to make the playoffs he'll trade either one of gardiner or 5th overall if not both for lu just to save his job because getting luongo "guarantees playoffs"
No, Luongo can help a team more than Komisarek can. But Komisarek's salary is much easier to swallow for the Leafs than Luongos is for the Vancouvers.
I don't argee....this is all relative to the cap going up or not. If it does like they say having 10 million wrapped up in goaltending won't kill the Canucks. It's not traditional, but that does not mean it cannot be done, nor that it shouldn't.
You don't throw an asset like Luongo out for nothing...I know you would like that but Vancouver does not have to go down this road for at least one more year.
Sure. Unless he gets outplayed by a backup on the other team - then he becomes dead cap once more.
That the inherent risk of giving a long-term contract to a goalie - if they stop being your best, they're not helping the team.
Ok, this whole thing about Schneider outplaying Luongo is getting completely blown out of proportion. Schneider has outplayed Luongo in like 35 games in his entire career, that doesn't make him infinitely better than Luongo and it doesn't make Luongo a bad goalie.
All things equal, most fans would rather keep Schneider. Luongo was jeered non-stop by Vancouver fans on here and in real life, media in Vancouver and around the continent, and even his own coach decided against him in the most important games of the year. Luongo has also publicly stated he wants out and the GM has made it clear he is looking for offers. Hell, he used to be captain and he got within one game of winning the Stanley Cup and his fan-base still hates him.
If Luongo is still on Vancouver next year, I feel very bad for both him and the team.
Uhhhhhh .... NO!
A very small minority hate him. He is a great goalie, and is a big part of the reason Vancouver won back to back PT. He was one win away from probably getting the Vezina.
He hasn't publically stated he wants out - rather he said he would waive his NTC if it whats best for the team. His attitude has been professional and great. I suspect that he is not interested in being a back up; but I think reality is if we keep both that Luongo plays 35 + games, and cory plays 40+ .... but it really will depend on who's hot. In other words the only way Luongo plays less than 30 games is if Cory is leading the league in SVP again and the Canucks are leading the standings again.
I am going to be as bold as to say Luo is coming to Toronto this year. So why don't you tell us what you as Canuck fans think
he is worth at this point, and please be sensible and consider all
factors involved.
Colborne is the selling point of the deal for Vancouver, he's big and maybe he can flourish into their #3C. Holzer is also a nice piece to have, the prospect pool for the nucks is terrible.
@ JFsilverstick. I didn't call you specifically a hater, they know who they are. How do the Leafs not gain from those trades? First they get a franchise goalie and second they remove one of LACK. And regarding Luongo's contract, the Leafs get in likelihood 6 years of excellent play and then Luongo will likely retire. But I can't see in the future and that's a risk the Leafs have to take and that's what happens in every a trade, a risk. Burke is known to take these risks and I damn well think he'd be willing to risk for a player of Luongo's caliber. And do you honestly think Vancouver's intention is to only get rid of Luongo? It's more along the lines of upgrading the team from a point of strength now that Schneider has outplayed Luongo (and in NO way is this a determent to Luongo, just Schneider playing like a demon). Teams trade from points of strength to address weaknesses and that's whats going to happen if Luongo goes to Toronto.
There's been many excellent posts regarding Luongo's contract, I suggest you read into how the contract works and how the Leafs can reap the benefits of the contract.
Ive read into the contract. And all the outs that people claim it has mean nothing if the CBA changes (which we KNOW it will in some ways this summer, and probably once again before Luongos contract ends) or if Luongo wants to keep playing, or if Luongo plays at backup level for the next 10 years. Burke doesn't seem to mind reclamation projects, but this isn't a reclamation project. This is a how-long-do-we-have-before-this-screws-us project.
We don't know how Luongo would play on the Leafs. We don't know how much longer he will play. We don't know if he will retire. We don't know how the CBA will change, or if we can rid ourselves of that cap hit once Luongo is finished. Etc. There are too many unknowns to start sending over significant assets on our part to obtain this risk.
For all the people saying we have guaranteed 6 years, how do you know that? How do you even know that we would have one good game out of him, with how much goalies change from team to team? Especially since everybody keeps telling us how much our defence stinks. For every goalie that lasts until they are 40, many more burn out in their mid-30s, where Luongo is entering right now.
Komisarek received a 5 year contract with the Maple Leafs. He signed for 4.5M per and plays like a #6 on a good night. He's pretty much dead-cap. Seriously guys?
He signed 3 years ago, so he is only signed for 2 more. He has played 154 games for the Leafs in those 3 years. He is overpaid, but he is still an NHL player, and was once an all-star before Ron Wilson. His cap hit isn't dead weight like a goalie who isn't playing would be.
Yes, risk cuts both ways. It always does. There is a LOT more risk for the team taking on Luongo and his contract. I don't expect Vancouver to throw him away without looking at the options. I think they have been looking at the options for a year now. I don't see any other options.
I'm sure Chicago and San Jose have called among others...Toronto needs a goalie so the media focuses on the Leafs as the most ideal trading partner for Vancouver. Regardless, even if there is no market for Luongo now that's ok. All it takes is one injury or poor start and suddenly there is a market.
Really the worst case scenario is moving Luongo to the minors and going forward with Schneider/Lack...or trading Schneider and having a Luongo/Lack tandem.
Colborne is the selling point of the deal for Vancouver, he's big and maybe he can flourish into their #3C. Holzer is also a nice piece to have, the prospect pool for the nucks is terrible.
Despite what HF says, our prospect pool isn't as terrible as perceived though it could definitely be better (that's the price of being a cup contender). And to the trade, Komiserak is a huge no go. If the Canucks are taking cap back, they're only taking a 1 year contract.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKsilverstick
He signed 3 years ago, so he is only signed for 2 more. He has played 154 games for the Leafs in those 3 years. He is overpaid, but he is still an NHL player, and was once an all-star before Ron Wilson. His cap hit isn't dead weight like a goalie who isn't playing would be.
No way... You're really clinging onto loose threads. Luongo, if traded, will play 60+ games. If he's note, he's gonna be splitting 50/50 with Schneider. In those 41 games Luongo plays, he's CONSIDERABLY better than Komiserak. I can't believe what I'm reading. I know what you're saying, it's just mind-boggling to think you're actually reaching THAT far to put down Luongo.
A very small minority hate him. He is a great goalie, and is a big part of the reason Vancouver won back to back PT. He was one win away from probably getting the Vezina.
He hasn't publically stated he wants out - rather he said he would waive his NTC if it whats best for the team. His attitude has been professional and great. I suspect that he is not interested in being a back up; but I think reality is if we keep both that Luongo plays 35 + games, and cory plays 40+ .... but it really will depend on who's hot. In other words the only way Luongo plays less than 30 games is if Cory is leading the league in SVP again and the Canucks are leading the standings again.
Vezina has nothing to do with the Playoffs. You have to ask yourself if Schneider would like to play the next 10 years of his life playing 40 games every season.
If you want to try and keep both, go ahead. Leafs arent going to pay more just because Vancouver has the option of crippling their team by spending 10 million on their goalies over the next 10 years, while they already have an AHL goalie who is close to ready.
Also, if you think a lot of people don't hate Luongo, take a look around these forums or the real world sometime.
Despite what HF says, our prospect pool isn't as terrible as perceived though it could definitely be better (that's the price of being a cup contender). And to the trade, Komiserak is a huge no go. If the Canucks are taking cap back, they're only taking a 1 year contract.
Hence the reason my offer includes Connoly(1 year dump) and a slew of prospects and a 2nd rounder in 2013.
Hence the reason my offer includes Connoly(1 year dump) and a slew of prospects and a 2nd rounder in 2013.
Do you have any suggestions from the Canuck side?
I've already made a few proposals but my reply was to the poster who put in Komiserak. I'm a fan of adding Connolly as the Leafs dump.
For the record, the trade offer was: Schenn + Colborne + Connolly + pick for Luongo + pick. The team needs help now and the future is a second priority.
I'm sure Chicago and San Jose have called among others...Toronto needs a goalie so the media focuses on the Leafs as the most ideal trading partner for Vancouver. Regardless, even if there is no market for Luongo now that's ok. All it takes is one injury or poor start and suddenly there is a market.
Really the worst case scenario is moving Luongo to the minors and going forward with Schneider/Lack...or trading Schneider and having a Luongo/Lack tandem.
Luongo to Chicago? Really, do people not think? Do people not watch the playoffs? No way this happens in a million years.
San Jose was talked about, and many San Jose fans came in and said 0 interest. They wouldn't trade for Luongo while they still have Niemi. And if they trade Niemi, they are very high on Greiss.
THERE IS NO MARKET. For somebody to trade for Luongo, they would have to have the cap space, the actual money, no number 1 goalie now, no potential number 1 goalie in the system for the next half-decade at least, and be willing to take on a huge risk. Oh, and you expect them to pay handsomely for it too. Good luck with that.
There is a real possibility that if you don't trade Luongo this year, you will never be able to trade him, especially if you plan to only have him start 35 games next year.
I've already made a few proposals but my reply was to the poster who put in Komiserak. I'm a fan of adding Connolly as the Leafs dump.
For the record, the trade offer was: Schenn + Colborne + Connolly + pick for Luongo + pick. The team needs help now and the future is a second priority.
Thanks for reposting your proposal, I like it minus the addition of Colborne unless you're sending back a 1st next year and accepting a 3rd from us both picks in 2013.
Despite what HF says, our prospect pool isn't as terrible as perceived though it could definitely be better (that's the price of being a cup contender). And to the trade, Komiserak is a huge no go. If the Canucks are taking cap back, they're only taking a 1 year contract.
No way... You're really clinging onto loose threads. Luongo, if traded, will play 60+ games. If he's note, he's gonna be splitting 50/50 with Schneider. In those 41 games Luongo plays, he's CONSIDERABLY better than Komiserak. I can't believe what I'm reading. I know what you're saying, it's just mind-boggling to think you're actually reaching THAT far to put down Luongo.
We aren't talking about next year. We are talking about when Schneider or whoever goalie either demands or deserves to play #1 goalie time.
Also, I agree that Vancouver wouldn't want Komisarek back. Not sure how that even came up. Connolly, Armstrong, or Lombardi would be the likely return as a dump.
I've already made a few proposals but my reply was to the poster who put in Komiserak. I'm a fan of adding Connolly as the Leafs dump.
For the record, the trade offer was: Schenn + Colborne + Connolly + pick for Luongo + pick. The team needs help now and the future is a second priority.
No one can take your trade seriously until you actually specify what pick it is that you want. Counter offer.
Colborne is the selling point of the deal for Vancouver, he's big and maybe he can flourish into their #3C. Holzer is also a nice piece to have, the prospect pool for the nucks is terrible.
The Nucks cant take Komisarek's salary without sending Ballard the other way otherwise they would have like 10mil in cap space devoted to their 3rd pairing.
Luongo to Chicago? Really, do people not think? Do people not watch the playoffs? No way this happens in a million years.
San Jose was talked about, and many San Jose fans came in and said 0 interest. They wouldn't trade for Luongo while they still have Niemi. And if they trade Niemi, they are very high on Greiss.
THERE IS NO MARKET. For somebody to trade for Luongo, they would have to have the cap space, the actual money, no number 1 goalie now, no potential number 1 goalie in the system for the next half-decade at least, and be willing to take on a huge risk. Oh, and you expect them to pay handsomely for it too. Good luck with that.
There is a real possibility that if you don't trade Luongo this year, you will never be able to trade him, especially if you plan to only have him start 35 games next year.
Just because Chicago called does not mean its going to happen and what San Jose fans would like is not what informs their management team to make decisions.
There is a market, otherwise we would not be having this conversation. NHL insiders have all said there is a market...what Luongo's value is, now that is the point of disagreement. You are not an insider, you do not know whats going on behind the scenes, so please stop talking as if you do. You also underrate Luongo to the point its really not worth having a rational discussion with you.
Vancouver is not moving Luongo for nothing...I don't understand why that bothers you so much...If Toronto is not a good fit thats fine, go get another goalie.
Just because Chicago called does not mean its going to happen and what San Jose fans would like is not what informs their management team to make decisions.
There is a market, otherwise we would not be having this conversation. NHL insiders have all said there is a market...what Luongo's value is, now that is the point of disagreement. You are not an insider, you do not know whats going on behind the scenes, so please stop talking as if you do. You also underrate Luongo to the point its really not worth having a rational discussion with you.
Vancouver is not moving Luongo for nothing...I don't understand why that bothers you so much...If Toronto is not a good fit thats fine, go get another goalie.
Just because Chicago called? What? Luongo is not going to Chicago because of the history between them. It is ridiculous to suggest Chicago as a reasonable destination. Its like Batman going to live with the Joker. Great sitcom. Terrible for a team game.
Fine, ignore the San Jose fans who know more about their team. Listen to logic. They have Niemi signed for 3.8 million for the next 3 years. They cant afford to take on Luongo without getting rid of Niemi, even forgetting about Greiss. They would be in the same situation Vancouver is now.
Actually, pretty much all NHL insiders have said there is no market for Luongo. I am not underrating Luongo. Luongo is a good goalie, now, and while on Vancouver. That doesn't mean hes going to be a good goalie on Toronto or in the future.
Toronto is not acquiring Luongo for anything significant. I don't understand why that bothers you so much. Luongo isn't really a good fit, and we probably will get another goalie. In which case, since this thread is about Toronto's goaltending situation and not Luongo, you should go talk about Luongo in the Luongo thread.
Just because Chicago called? What? Luongo is not going to Chicago because of the history between them. It is ridiculous to suggest Chicago as a reasonable destination. Its like Batman going to live with the Joker. Great sitcom. Terrible for a team game.
Fine, ignore the San Jose fans who know more about their team. Listen to logic. They have Niemi signed for 3.8 million for the next 3 years. They cant afford to take on Luongo without getting rid of Niemi, even forgetting about Greiss. They would be in the same situation Vancouver is now.
Actually, pretty much all NHL insiders have said there is no market for Luongo. I am not underrating Luongo. Luongo is a good goalie, now, and while on Vancouver. That doesn't mean hes going to be a good goalie on Toronto or in the future.
Toronto is not acquiring Luongo for anything significant. I don't understand why that bothers you so much. Luongo isn't really a good fit, and we probably will get another goalie. In which case, since this thread is about Toronto's goaltending situation and not Luongo, you should go talk about Luongo in the Luongo thread.
It's not the market that is in question...it is Luongo's value.
Says an article written on April 26th, and it is not like 4 potentials is a big market. Things have changed since then, and there is no reason to think even that article was anything but baseless speculation.
Tampa has their goaltender now, and stated Luongo wasn't of interest to them. Florida will 100% NOT be trading for Luongo with Markstrom in the wings. That leaves Toronto and Chicago, and we have already been over the problem with Chicago, not to mention they already have 3.8 million tied up in goaltenders next season, and Crawford beyond that. The article itself mentions problems with Chicago, and with Toronto, they bring up Komisarek as a return.
