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06-13-2012, 12:16 AM
  #1
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Matt Carkner

Hi all,
On the Habs forum we are arguing over a Senators player, Matt Carkner. I'm guessing no one is better placed than some Senators fans to give us an idea of how good he is.

Is he a capable NHL-defenseman?
Is he a ****ing crap?
How's his game?

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06-13-2012, 12:21 AM
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Kekumba
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Is he a capable NHL-defenseman? - Yes.
Is he a ****ing crap? - No, he serves a purpose.
How's his game? - 7th D. Good fighter obviously.

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06-13-2012, 12:24 AM
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Nabokov20
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6/7 defenseman who drops the gloves. nothing more, nothing less. not very fleet of foot (he was improved though) and although he wins/won the Senators hardest shot comp, he can't shoot (slap, snap or wrister) the puck in game situations (i.e., awkward wind up). can play the pk. takes bonehead penalties from time-to-time (usually because of his lack of speed/ability to pivot at high speed). can pass the puck out of the zone, but better off just banging it off the glass.

just my 2 cents.

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06-13-2012, 12:26 AM
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#6/#7 Defenceman who can play spot PK time and is one of the better fighters in the league. I'd say most Sens fans are pretty happy with him overall, but we wouldn't want to see him in a bigger role than he already has.

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06-13-2012, 12:27 AM
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Well hes a pretty good fighter. Basically an enforcer. Not a terrible defensemen but hes out there for the other sides 4th line.

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06-13-2012, 12:57 AM
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Someone said that:
"I can say he isn't a capable NHL d-man because he sucks at defence."

Is this person right?

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06-13-2012, 01:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EnforcerWeNeed View Post
Someone said that:
"I can say he isn't a capable NHL d-man because he sucks at defence."

Is this person right?
That would be false.
That doesn't mean he belongs in your top-four or anything, but he plays his role well on a bottom pairing.

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06-13-2012, 04:29 AM
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Carkner is an able bottom pairing defenseman but shouldn't be used as anything more than that.

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06-13-2012, 05:16 AM
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Carkner is a below average 7th dman.

Basically he's not the kind of player anyone should be excited about, other than when he's standing up for the skilled guys.

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06-13-2012, 07:21 AM
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BonkTastic
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7th defenceman on a good team, who is passable as your #6 guy if you have no other real option. Obviously the guy brings toughness, so if you value enforcers, he's more valuable than that "#6/7 slot". I'm not much for enforcers, though.

The guy needed his minutes HEAVILY managed this year, though part of that might have been the knee injury. In 2010-11, he managed to fill the role of #4-5 defenceman, though by the end of the season we were playing Francis Lessard and Marek Svatos just in order to ice 20 healthy skaters, and ended up finishing 5th last in the league, so don't read too much into that. Carkner actually looked good as a #4/5 guy in 2009-10, although I haven't seen that Matt Carkner in 2 years, so take that for what it's worth.

He has a REALLY hard time pivoting these days, and can get burned bad by guys with speed. Excels when he keeps his game simple, and when he's paired with a mobile defensive partner that allows him to take risks by laying the body. Hits big, though not as big lately (again, probably the knee). Don't expect any offence from him whatsoever: his OT winning goal against the Pens represents not only a career highlight for him, but also represents 1/5th of his TOTAL goals scored for us over the past 3 years. Has a good, low, HARD slapshot, but needs time and space to set it up, which he is rarely afforded anywhere but practice and the Sens skills competition. Without pressure, looks like a pretty good puck handler; under pressure, at times will look like he's trying to hit a grenade with a pointed stick. He's not the guy you'd pick to make crisp breakout passes, but as someone else noted, is good at making the clean chip-up off the boards. Makes some head-scratchingly bonehead plays at times, mostly due to him being out of position (either because he put himself out of position chasing a hit, or because he's just not that fleet-of-foot). The guy is a BIG locker-room add, though. One of the nicest players you'll ever meet, and HUGELY liked in the dressing room by pretty much the entire team. He's also probably a top-3 fighter in the league, but if you're looking for a pure enforcer, then you probably don't care much about his actual hockey skills.

If he can recover from his knee injury 100%, he MIGHT be able to get back to being a bad #5 guy/ decent #6 option who can fight a ton. Right now he's a bad #6 guy who had trouble holding off both Brian Lee AND Matt Gilroy for the #6 spot. Again, knee injury played some part in that, but he's going to have to prove in my eyes that he can be the same player we saw for most of 2009-10.

If you think your team needs grit, he's a guy who could help. The gamble is whether he can contribute as a regular defenceman, like he did in 2009-10, or not.


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06-13-2012, 09:26 AM
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Do you see that small circle down at the bottom there, under such defensive studs such as Nikita Filatov, David Rundblad, and Zenon Konopka?

That's how protected Carkner had to be this year. He's a 7th defenseman. He's pretty good at fighting, but he can't really stickhandle or pass the puck quickly and on target (you usually get one of these two each time), because he needs to take extra time to settle the puck down whenever he gets it.

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06-13-2012, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrePetersson View Post


Do you see that small circle down at the bottom there, under such defensive studs such as Nikita Filatov, David Rundblad, and Zenon Konopka?

That's how protected Carkner had to be this year. He's a 7th defenseman. He's pretty good at fighting, but he can't really stickhandle or pass the puck quickly and on target (you usually get one of these two each time), because he needs to take extra time to settle the puck down whenever he gets it.
Glad someone else brought that chart up.

I was going to, but I've been flamed enough over the past year for my criticisms of Carkner, I didn't feel like taking the heat yet again.

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06-13-2012, 09:47 AM
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Last year Carkner struggled with his knee injury and coming back from it. He has zero room to lose any speed from his stride and it isn't clear if post-injury he is even up to the speed he had before.

If he has his speed back, 6/7 guy like has been posted. He does well with his positioning but the lack of speed is apparent.

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06-13-2012, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrePetersson View Post


Do you see that small circle down at the bottom there, under such defensive studs such as Nikita Filatov, David Rundblad, and Zenon Konopka?

That's how protected Carkner had to be this year. He's a 7th defenseman. He's pretty good at fighting, but he can't really stickhandle or pass the puck quickly and on target (you usually get one of these two each time), because he needs to take extra time to settle the puck down whenever he gets it.
What is that chart?

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06-13-2012, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Carkner is an able bottom pairing defenseman but shouldn't be used as anything more than that.
He knows his role and his limitations. He almost always makes the smartest play possible given those limitations. He can even sneak in on a pinch at times if it is the right time for him to do so.

He has a great sense of when to fight and when to play rough. Lime Neil. He is unlike say Konopka, who will fight anytime just for the sake of fighting. The minors Carkner takes are for being intentionally rough... For the point of protecting or lifting the team... Or to break up a play he might have been too slow to break up legally. For a true top heavyweight he actually is not that mean. He doesnt hit as much as you would expect (slow, cant take himself out if play to make hit and recover fast enough). But if he is in a position to have to be physical he is a top echlon fighter, tough guy.

He is said to be ampng the hardest workers and best locker room guys. I'd guess he has a future career in coaching.

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06-13-2012, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sens Rule View Post
He knows his role and his limitations. He almost always makes the smartest play possible given those limitations. He can even sneak in on a pinch at times if it is the right time for him to do so.

He has a great sense of when to fight and when to play rough. Like Neil. He is unlike say Konopka, who will fight anytime just for the sake of fighting. The minors Carkner takes are for being intentionally rough... For the point of protecting or lifting the team... Or to break up a play he might have been too slow to break up legally. For a true top heavyweight he actually is not that mean. He doesnt hit as much as you would expect (slow, cant take himself out if play to make hit and recover fast enough). But if he is in a position to have to be physical he is a top echlon fighter, tough guy.

He is said to be ampng the hardest workers and best locker room guys. I'd guess he has a future career in coaching.
QFT
Carkner really knows what is expected from him and has no illusions about what he can provide. 6/7 dman who is a top 5 fighter in the league. Great team guy.

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06-13-2012, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EnforcerWeNeed View Post
Someone said that:
"I can say he isn't a capable NHL d-man because he sucks at defence."

Is this person right?
Just a bit of ignorance, you can find a lot of that on these boards. Carkner is a decent NHL D-man defensively, struggled a bit last year because of his injury, that's all. That being sais, he is not a 15 years career D-man, more like 5 or 6 years

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06-13-2012, 01:34 PM
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He isn't great, but he actually played pretty well when he was brought in during the playoffs.

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06-13-2012, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EnforcerWeNeed View Post
Someone said that:
"I can say he isn't a capable NHL d-man because he sucks at defence."

Is this person right?
Got the wrong "Matt", that's Matt Gilroy.

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06-13-2012, 02:06 PM
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i'd agree with most of whats been said here. he's a quality human being and a very good teammate who can play a role for a team. one thing i notice whenever i am up close with the sens at training camp or at an open practice- he seems to be a VERY popular guy. always upbeat, laughing, joking with the guys.

as for his skill on the ice he's definitely a super-heavyweight. he can fight with anyone in the league and hold his own, and he can crush most middleweights. the fact that he can do that AND actually play a fairly regular shift makes him valuable. he can be your goon but not have to be stapled to the bench for all but 4 mins of a game. he keeps it simple defensively and can be a physical presence and crease-clearer. you wouldn't want him matching up regularly against top offensive forwards with a lot of speed because he couldnt handle it. next to no offensive skill. can kill penalties.

my big fear with him is his knee. he battled with it all year and if it's something thats chronic, it might take him right out of the league speed-wise. a fully healthy carkner just barely makes it over the threshold of NHL skaters, a gimpy carkner couldnt skate in this league.

if our management is confident he's 100% healthy and if he agrees to a very reasonable contract in the $650-750K range, i can see him being resigned by us as a pinch no.6/no.7 defenceman. a team would be INSANE to give him a longer term deal for $1mil or more to try to play regularly in their top 6 for a few years going forward.

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06-13-2012, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sens Rule View Post
He knows his role and his limitations. He almost always makes the smartest play possible given those limitations. He can even sneak in on a pinch at times if it is the right time for him to do so.

He has a great sense of when to fight and when to play rough. Lime Neil. He is unlike say Konopka, who will fight anytime just for the sake of fighting. The minors Carkner takes are for being intentionally rough... For the point of protecting or lifting the team... Or to break up a play he might have been too slow to break up legally. For a true top heavyweight he actually is not that mean. He doesnt hit as much as you would expect (slow, cant take himself out if play to make hit and recover fast enough). But if he is in a position to have to be physical he is a top echlon fighter, tough guy.

He is said to be ampng the hardest workers and best locker room guys. I'd guess he has a future career in coaching.
This.

And I want him back in that 7th D role.

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06-13-2012, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by koreaboy View Post
my big fear with him is his knee. he battled with it all year and if it's something thats chronic, it might take him right out of the league speed-wise. a fully healthy carkner just barely makes it over the threshold of NHL skaters, a gimpy carkner couldnt skate in this league.

if our management is confident he's 100% healthy and if he agrees to a very reasonable contract in the $650-750K range, i can see him being resigned by us as a pinch no.6/no.7 defenceman. a team would be INSANE to give him a longer term deal for $1mil or more to try to play regularly in their top 6 for a few years going forward.
Bingo. If he isn't re-signed I would assume it is because the Sens know his knee is not likely to hold up.

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06-13-2012, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Killerguitar101* View Post
What is that chart?
Y axis is QualComp (quality of competition.) In that regard, Carkner was the lowest on the list (i.e., played against the worst players.)

X axis is offensive zone start %. So, roughly 50% of Carkner's starts came in the offensive zone.

Circle around the name, I think, refers to shots for vs. shots against. A bigger circle indicates a bigger average separation between the two, while a coloured circle indicates that the difference was in your team's favour. Carkner's circle, being small and white, indicates that while he was on the ice, the opposing team got a few more shots than the Sens, on average.

Not sure about the purple names, even though I know I read it somewhere. The upshot of the graph is that Carkner was very heavily sheltered, though.

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06-13-2012, 03:57 PM
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Not sure about the purple names
Purple is just to indicate that he plays D.

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06-13-2012, 03:59 PM
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Purple is just to indicate that he plays D.
Duh, too obvious. Not sure how I missed that, thanks!

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