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2012 NHL Draft Thread IV (June 22-23)

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06-21-2012, 05:06 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
When has moving down EVER worked? Answer me that.
New Jersey moved back, allowing Calgary to take Trevor Kidd while they were stuck with some guy named Brodeur.

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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Relax buddy. That was in response to your Huselius for MTL #3rd overall pick. As in dont be ridiculous about trading players that arent even close. Fact is, no one knows what EDM's asking so until you do, dont criticize what other people propose. K Thx
Several sources have reported that Edmonton is asking for an obscene amount for #1, and that includes simply to go from #2 to #1.

So I'll ask you again...if it meant that it wasn't "a 2nd and Methot", but was "Savard and Moore", or "Atkinson and Jenner", or "a 2nd and the 2013 1st-rounder"...is it STILL a sign of "lack of effort" to not do one of those deals? We're not talking about going from Kirk Muller to Mario Lemieux here, we're talking about half-steps from the big logjam up to Yakupov.

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06-21-2012, 05:08 PM
  #52
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Maybe this is just me, and I've said this before, but I don't get why Howson doesn't just stand pat and take Galchenyuk at #2. IMO, he's the 2nd best player in the draft as of today, and will be one of the 2 best players that emerges from this draft when you look back on it in 10 years. It's clear he doesn't want Galchenyuk if he wants to trade down, because there's no way he gets past #3 (and if the team they are mulling over a trade with is Montreal, or Toronto, he's gone at #2).

I feel for you guys, I really do. I remember how mad I was when our inept ownership traded away Joe Thornton, who at that point was a top 5ish player in the league (he had 125 points the year he was traded) for a bunch of stiffs. The only decent guy we got was Marco Sturm, and one year he'd score 25-30 goals, and the next year he'd be on the shelf for the entire year.
This.

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06-21-2012, 05:08 PM
  #53
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2010 Draft
Florida-Los Angeles
Traded 2010 first round pick (#15-Derek Forbort) to Kings for 2010 first round pick (#19-Nick Bjugstad), 2010 second round pick (#59-Jason Zucker) on 2010-06-25

Montreal-Phoenix
Traded 2010 first round pick (#27-Mark Visentin), 2010 second round pick (#57-Oscar Lindberg) to Coytes for 2010 first round pick (#22-Jarred Tinordi), 2010 fourth round pick (#113-Mark MacMillan) on 2010-06-25

2009 Draft
NY Isles-Minnesota
Traded 2009 first round pick (#16-Nick Leddy), 2009 third round pick (#77-Matthew Hackett), 2009 seventh round pick (#181-Erik Haula) to Wild for 2009 first round pick (#12-Calvin de Haan) on 2009-06-26

Anaheim-Columbus
Traded 2009 first round pick (#26-Kyle Palmieri), 2009 second round pick (#37-Mat Clark) to Ducks for 2009 first round pick (#21-John Moore) on 2009-06-26

2008 Draft
Toronto-NY Isles
Traded 2008 first round pick (#7-Colin Wilson), Islanders choice of either 2008 second round pick (not exercied) and 2009 third round pick (not exercised), or 2008 third round pick (#68-Shawn Lalonde) and 2009 second round pick (#37-Mat Clark) to Islanders for 2008 first round pick (#5-Luke Schenn) on 2008-06-20

2007 Draft
Columbus-Dallas
Traded three 2007 fifth round picks (#128-Austin Smith) (#129-Jamie Benn) (#149-Michael Neal) to Stars for 2007 fourth round pick (#94-Maksim Mayorov) on 2007-06-23
Can't help but notice that most of these are outside of the lottery.

We all remember how well the Nash trade worked out for Florida...

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06-21-2012, 05:08 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Still...the number of times that they dont work out far outweighs the times they do.
It doesn't happen very often at all. Most pre-2005 trades involving draft picks also had players involved, and it's impossible to know how the players are valued.

And most of the post-2005 involve the late rounds.

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06-21-2012, 05:10 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
New Jersey moved back, allowing Calgary to take Trevor Kidd while they were stuck with some guy named Brodeur.



Several sources have reported that Edmonton is asking for an obscene amount for #1, and that includes simply to go from #2 to #1.

So I'll ask you again...if it meant that it wasn't "a 2nd and Methot", but was "Savard and Moore", or "Atkinson and Jenner", or "a 2nd and the 2013 1st-rounder"...is it STILL a sign of "lack of effort" to not do one of those deals? We're not talking about going from Kirk Muller to Mario Lemieux here, we're talking about half-steps from the big logjam up to Yakupov.
Your picking parts of my posts and scrutinizing them to convey your opinion to make it sound like Im being ridiculous. Yes, if they dont want Methot and a 2nd, they can have Yakupov. Somehow I just dont really trust the decision making and overall ideas of our GM. Maybe its from past ideas that Mason and two AHL goalies would be okay for a season.

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06-21-2012, 05:13 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnCornelius View Post
Can't help but notice that most of these are outside of the lottery.

We all remember how well the Nash trade worked out for Florida...
There really aren't many examples of trading down in the lottery. I was merely responding to his bat**** crazy assertion that trading down has never worked.

And remember, Florida won the lottery with their pick, not with Columbus'.

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06-21-2012, 05:14 PM
  #57
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It doesn't happen very often at all. Most pre-2005 trades involving draft picks also had players involved, and it's impossible to know how the players are valued.

And most of the post-2005 involve the late rounds.
Captain does make a very good point that Samkow did not post one trade that was in the lottery. Except for Schenn one...that was top 5. Not really lottery. I just think of how badly that deal worked out for FLA and shutter to think it could happen the same to us. Sorry if I'm coming on a tad strong but I think I got my point across. Take Galchenyuk. Trade Nash to SJ.

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06-21-2012, 05:15 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Your picking parts of my posts and scrutinizing them to convey your opinion to make it sound like Im being ridiculous.
How about that.

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06-21-2012, 05:17 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Captain does make a very good point that Samkow did not post one trade that was in the lottery. Except for Schenn one...that was top 5. Not really lottery. I just think of how badly that deal worked out for FLA and shutter to think it could happen the same to us. Sorry if I'm coming on a tad strong but I think I got my point across. Take Galchenyuk. Trade Nash to SJ.
It didn't work out for Florida because it turned out that Bouwmeester wasn't a franchise defenseman after all. He was their target all along. I give MacLean credit for being (justifiably) paranoid enough to be afraid that Atlanta would move out of #2, letting someone else get Nash and leaving the CBJ holding the bag.

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06-21-2012, 05:19 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
Captain does make a very good point that Samkow did not post one trade that was in the lottery. Except for Schenn one...that was top 5. Not really lottery. I just think of how badly that deal worked out for FLA and shutter to think it could happen the same to us. Sorry if I'm coming on a tad strong but I think I got my point across. Take Galchenyuk. Trade Nash to SJ.
If you want CapCorn to argue for you, you'll probably have to cough up a retainer.

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06-21-2012, 05:20 PM
  #61
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https://twitter.com/Aportzline/statu...31573793587202

Quote:
RT @cmasisak22: Galchenyuk had a meeting Wed. (either w ‪#CBJ‬ or ‪#Canes‬) right after Yakupov, who told him "Be ready. They were pretty mean."
Now we're harassing top prospects? This management team makes me sick. Fire Howson.

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06-21-2012, 05:23 PM
  #62
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If you want CapCorn to argue for you, you'll probably have to cough up a retainer.
Evidence of creditworthiness is sufficient. Just have to be able to pay my hourly rate.

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06-21-2012, 05:25 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Samkow View Post
https://twitter.com/Aportzline/statu...31573793587202

Now we're harassing top prospects? This management team makes me sick. Fire Howson.
When Branch Rickey was considering signing Jackie Robinson, he called Robinson into his office and then spent 20 minutes subjecting the second baseman to every type of insult (racial and otherwise) that could possibly be conjured up.

Or just look at a couple of years ago, where Dez Bryant took umbrage at something that was asked during a pre-draft interview. Half the people who took a stance said that the Dolphins were being ridiculous, and the other half thought Bryant was being a crybaby.

There have been times when I was coaching where I'd have to talk to a player. Maybe he was giving a poor effort. Maybe he had a situation going on outside of football. Maybe his play had suffered lately. Maybe his dad was bugging me about playing time. But I'd do pretty much whatever it took to get through to him. That could involve telling a story, or asking questions, or maybe trying to provoke him to see what happened.

Didn't anyone ever see Lee Marvin in "The Dirty Dozen"?


Last edited by Mayor Bee: 06-21-2012 at 05:33 PM.
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06-21-2012, 05:25 PM
  #64
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Pretty sure if they want to move down then Forsberg is the guy they want.
Which I would be okay with, since he is the guy I want. Really though, there are 5 guys in this draft I would be okay with us getting. I can understand why posters want the other guys. I just like Forsberg the most.

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06-21-2012, 05:26 PM
  #65
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Evidence of creditworthiness is sufficient. Just have to be able to pay my hourly rate.
Well, I'm screwed both ways.

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06-21-2012, 05:27 PM
  #66
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If you want CapCorn to argue for you, you'll probably have to cough up a retainer.
Funny.

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Old
06-21-2012, 05:31 PM
  #67
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When Branch Rickey was considering signing Jackie Robinson, he called Robinson into his office and then spent 20 minutes subjecting the second baseman to every type of insult (racial and otherwise) that could possibly be conjured up.

Or just look at a couple of years ago, where Dez Bryant took umbrage at something that was asked during a pre-draft interview. Half the people who took a stance said that the Dolphins were being ridiculous, and the other half thought Bryant was being a crybaby.
Hooray for extreme circumstances and bad management circumstances!

1) Jackie Robinson was about to be the first black MLB player in a time and place where whites and black were not able to use the same water fountain. Rickey did that so he was sure Jackie could handle intense racial occurrences that could/would happen to him.

2) The Dolphins are a horrible football team led by incompetent management. That's like saying we should pinch pennies because that's what the Bengals do.

No franchise, or business, in their right mind would treat players badly before they hire/sign/draft them. None. For one, it gives you a bad reputation around the league by the players you draft, it makes players not want to play for you, and it makes your job much harder and honestly, you can find a person's ability to handle things with background checks and a basic personality test.

It's stupid, no matter how you do it. I'm sick of these teams acting like joining their franchise should be as hard as getting into the CIA. You are a sports team, it's not that hard to check the mentality of a player in this modern age.

And I'm not even saying that the CBJ do it. This is universal, teams should not act like this. End of story.

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06-21-2012, 05:38 PM
  #68
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No franchise, or business, in their right mind would treat players badly before they hire/sign/draft them. None. For one, it gives you a bad reputation around the league by the players you draft, it makes players not want to play for you, and it makes your job much harder and honestly, you can find a person's ability to handle things with background checks and a basic personality test.

It's stupid, no matter how you do it. I'm sick of these teams acting like joining their franchise should be as hard as getting into the CIA. You are a sports team, it's not that hard to check the mentality of a player in this modern age.

And I'm not even saying that the CBJ do it. This is universal, teams should not act like this. End of story.
I think we've finally hit rock bottom here. People have now taken one comment, said from one teammate to another, WITH NO CONTEXT, and are running with it.

This could have been sarcastic. It could have been said with a laugh. It could have been serious. It could have been after talking to Carolina, NOT Columbus!

But no...one single comment with no inflection or context MUST mean that Columbus is verbally abusing and berating potential players.

Holy ****ing hell on a ****ing popsicle stick. This is ****ing pathetic.

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06-21-2012, 05:40 PM
  #69
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I think we've finally hit rock bottom here. People have now taken one comment, said from one teammate to another, WITH NO CONTEXT, and are running with it.

This could have been sarcastic. It could have been said with a laugh. It could have been serious. It could have been after talking to Carolina, NOT Columbus!

But no...one single comment with no inflection or context MUST mean that Columbus is verbally abusing and berating potential players.

Holy ****ing hell on a ****ing popsicle stick. This is ****ing pathetic.
I want them to be mean. We need to turn into real SOB's to play against. If they cant handle being insulted, dont think about drafting them.

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06-21-2012, 05:52 PM
  #70
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I want them to be mean. We need to turn into real SOB's to play against. If they cant handle being insulted, dont think about drafting them.

(Hey, we've already got DSL's bunny for the organization; apparently we need one for the fanbase now as well. )

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06-21-2012, 05:53 PM
  #71
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06-21-2012, 05:54 PM
  #72
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https://twitter.com/Aportzline/statu...31573793587202



Now we're harassing top prospects? This management team makes me sick. Fire Howson.
If someone had twitted that Howson ate eggs for breakfast the people over here would have used it as another reason to demand his firing.
Cmon, 18 years old kids possibly are joking around.
What if Yakupov said to Gally: "They were very friendly"? Someone probably would have came up with a statement that management has to be changed cause they take those Russians too easy. Don't be absurd here.


Last edited by bizzz*: 06-21-2012 at 06:00 PM. Reason: I didn't read the posts after the one I quoted... Have to agree with MB...these boards are getting absurd
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06-21-2012, 05:59 PM
  #73
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If someone had twitted that Howson ate eggs for breakfast someone would have used it as another reason to demand his firing.
Cmon, 18 years old kids possibly are joking around.
What if Yakupov said to Gally: "They were very friendly"? Someone probably would have came up with a statement that management has to be changed cause they take those Russians too easy. Don't be absurd here.
To say nothing of the fact it might have been Carolina and not Columbus at all.

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06-21-2012, 06:00 PM
  #74
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If someone had twitted that Howson ate eggs for breakfast someone would have used it as another reason to demand his firing.
Cmon, 18 years old kids possibly are joking around.
What if Yakupov said to Gally: "They were very friendly"? Someone probably would have came up with a statement that management has to be changed cause they take those Russians too easy. Don't be absurd here.
Porty tweeted that Murray said Columbus was pretty hard on him at the Combine. I bet it was us, and Im kinda happy it could be.

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06-21-2012, 06:01 PM
  #75
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If someone had twitted that Howson ate eggs for breakfast someone would have used it as another reason to demand his firing.
"Holy crap! Everyone KNOWS that you have to have complex carbohydrates for breakfast; it helps with satiety and also provides a slow release of energy throughout the day! Typical Howson, just NEEDING to go against conventional logic like always!!!!!"

(Am I doing this right?)

Quote:
Cmon, 18 years old kids possibly are joking around.
"Huh huh huh, the only joke is what we've become. I'm so clever."

(Am I doing that right?)

Quote:
What if Yakupov said to Gally: "They were very friendly"? Someone probably would have came up with a statement that management has to be changed cause they take those Russians too easy. Don't be absurd here.
Ask tough questions: too mean on 18-year-olds.
Don't ask too tough of questions: Nikita Filatov ends up happening, and why the hell wouldn't you want to see the mental makeup of an 18-year-old?

I think everyone's cracking up...and I don't mean with laughter.

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