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2012 NHL Entry Draft: Rounds 2-7 - Saturday @ 7am. Sharks picked F Tomas Hertl @ #17

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06-23-2012, 03:01 AM
  #876
WantonAbandon
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Originally Posted by endy View Post
oilers made it to the finals rt before their half decade trip to the cellar, and given their loaded roster, i would not be surprised to see them back there before us. the pens/blackhawks model works pretty well if you just want one cup.

but fine, since 05 the stanley cup winning la kings have 7 first rounders still with that team - kopitar, bernier, lewis, hickey, doughboy, forbort, and pearson. 7 guys in 7 years.

regardless, as for your original question about finding just one team that has more than 1/2 their first round picks during the past X years, there are plenty of teams that fit that bill.

not the sharks tho. sharks have since 1999 3 first rounders - couture, petreki, and hertl. 3 in 13 years.
Ah the kings... They had quite a stock pile of picks... when was it again... The year they traded Camallari during their fairly recent rebuild

Anyway how many first round picks have the Sharks had since 07?

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06-23-2012, 03:02 AM
  #877
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The **** is up with all this Hertl hate? It would have been nice to have a dynamic "sexy" guy like Teravainen in the pool, but it's not like Hertl's a complete scrub. For all the under-sized guys that get overlooked, and then become good players (Giroux, Little, Parise...), you're going to have your fair share of duds as well (Schremp, Bourret, McArdle...). Not trying to imply Teravainen will fall in the second category, but there should be healthy skepticism for a guy who wasn't on a lot of people's radars until mid-season.
I don't absolutely hate the pick....am glad they drafted outside of NA and he does seem to have a lot of upside...just liked the idea of Teravainen when he was still available...still, no one is offering me a GM job anytime soon...haha

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06-23-2012, 03:03 AM
  #878
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Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
Getzlaf and even Perrty to an extent.

The Sharks also lost a lot when Strelow died. That was a great draft-pick-maker; draft the goalies, train them, then trade them for draft assets...
Pavelski's improvement should not be credited entirely to the Sharks. He independently hired a freelance lady in the South Bay to work on his skating stride over the summers. The Sharks should really look into her as she works on all skating types. Hockey, figures and speed. And she is well-informed on the kinesiology of the changes that need to be made for improvements.

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06-23-2012, 03:04 AM
  #879
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Originally Posted by param View Post
The **** is up with all this Hertl hate? It would have been nice to have a dynamic "sexy" guy like Teravainen in the pool, but it's not like Hertl's a complete scrub. For all the under-sized guys that get overlooked, and then become good players (Giroux, Little, Parise...), you're going to have your fair share of duds as well (Schremp, Bourret, McArdle...). Not trying to imply Teravainen will fall in the second category, but there should be healthy skepticism for a guy who wasn't on a lot of people's radars until mid-season.
i'm meh but don't hate but only time will tell if this was a good pick or bad. sometimes dw proves us wrong (coyle), sometimes everyone is happy (couture), sometimes there's disapointments all around (petrecki, kaspar) and sometimes the pitchfork fanbase is right (seto over kopitar). in a few years we can see if this was another dw gem or another dw failure.

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06-23-2012, 03:05 AM
  #880
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Pavelski's improvement should not be credited entirely to the Sharks. He independently hired a freelance lady in the South Bay to work on his skating stride over the summers. The Sharks should really look into her as she works on all skating types. Hockey, figures and speed. And she is well-informed on the kinesiology of the changes that need to be made for improvements.
I think Pavelski's referral may be all she needs

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06-23-2012, 03:07 AM
  #881
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Hertl is sort of my sleeper heading into draft weekend. I think he has huge potential to be one of those guys who opens a lot of eyes when he makes it to the NHL.

Here's our take on him:

Quote:
He is a big, strong body that gets up and down the wing well with good straight line speed. His balance is strong and he also has some good agility. He has a good stick and can carry the puck as well as protect it using his frame and quick hands. He has strong playmaking abilities such as vision and a soft touch, but is surely more of a finisher than a passer. He has a very effective shot that is quick off his stick and has some good velocity behind it. He keeps his head up and always checks off his options as he moves around with the puck, keeping his top target fixed on the net.
More: http://futureconsiderations.ca/shark...-17th-overall/

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06-23-2012, 03:08 AM
  #882
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Originally Posted by endy View Post
i'm meh but don't hate but only time will tell if this was a good pick or bad. sometimes dw proves us wrong (coyle), sometimes everyone is happy (couture), sometimes there's disapointments all around (petrecki, kaspar) and sometimes the pitchfork fanbase is right (seto over kopitar). in a few years we can see if this was another dw gem or another dw failure.
It is way too early to be definitive on Coyle either way. I am far less optimistic for him than almost everyone here, but I still see the possibility to be surprised.

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06-23-2012, 03:10 AM
  #883
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The problem is, that you don't typically draft players like Boyle and Burns with a late-round pick.

It does seem to be a developmental issue, not an issue with identifying talent.

The failure is ameliorated somewhat, because Goc turned into a very good player elsewhere, and Wishart was traded whilst he was still valuable, but certainly Kaspar and Bernier sting. Though part of that may be DW shooting for the fences because he needed that type of player.
Goc's problem was that he could never stay healthy with the Sharks. He actually was a good player for the Sharks when he was healthy

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06-23-2012, 03:20 AM
  #884
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Ah the kings... They had quite a stock pile of picks... when was it again... The year they traded Camallari during their fairly recent rebuild

Anyway how many first round picks have the Sharks had since 07?
well obviously 3, which is still a league low, i think only van and philly has as little as us (as they also throw away picks like candy).

calgs: 4
bos: 4
det: 4
van: 3
phil: 3

shrug it's not a surprise that our prospect pool is rated worst in the league, followed closely by the nucks and the flames. other good teams:

chi: 7(!)
nash: 5
pens: 4

by even your metric of 2007 (which maximizes the sharks numbers), we are league low tied with 2 other teams also infamous for dealing picks and players like no tomorrow. other good teams have 1 more (which is significant given 3 to 4 and in only 5 years). many teams have 2+ more.

to be honest, everyone gets a freebee for 2012, so the real numbers shuold be one less for every team in one less year. thus sharks are 2/4, while most teams are 3/4 and 4/4 and some even higher.

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06-23-2012, 03:28 AM
  #885
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Originally Posted by endy View Post
i'm meh but don't hate but only time will tell if this was a good pick or bad. sometimes dw proves us wrong (coyle), sometimes everyone is happy (couture), sometimes there's disapointments all around (petrecki, kaspar) and sometimes the pitchfork fanbase is right (seto over kopitar). in a few years we can see if this was another dw gem or another dw failure.
Everyone wasn't happy with Couture. There were some grumblings that it was just another middling offensive player who was a poor skater. Honestly, the last Shark pick I remember people being fairly universally happy with was Petrecki. and before that? You've got me.

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06-23-2012, 03:36 AM
  #886
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Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
The problem is, that you don't typically draft players like Boyle and Burns with a late-round pick.

It does seem to be a developmental issue, not an issue with identifying talent.

The failure is ameliorated somewhat, because Goc turned into a very good player elsewhere, and Wishart was traded whilst he was still valuable, but certainly Kaspar and Bernier sting. Though part of that may be DW shooting for the fences because he needed that type of player.
They've had their opportunities to draft good defensemen over the years. They passed on Suter for Michalek. They passed on Burns himself for Bernier...although I won't give them much flak for that because Burns was a forward then. They passed on Weber for Carle. And many teams find a gem in the later rounds that they turn into a prized defenseman...except the Sharks.

As for Goc, he is a serviceable 3rd line player elsewhere. But he had more potential than that and the Sharks messed that up. But my bar for these picks are higher than third line or bottom pairing defensemen. If they held on to Wishart, just like if they hold on to Petrecki, his value will diminish naturally.

They are due for a lot of changes, both with their benchmarks for these picks and how they develop them. There's only so long that they can rely on late-round gems working out for them.

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Originally Posted by WantonAbandon View Post
Goc's problem was that he could never stay healthy with the Sharks. He actually was a good player for the Sharks when he was healthy
There was more problems for Goc on this team than injuries. Coaching and developing at this level was a huge issue especially under Ron Wilson. Goc should have been a second line player but was consistently relegated rather than given the time to learn.

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06-23-2012, 03:54 AM
  #887
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Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
Everyone wasn't happy with Couture. There were some grumblings that it was just another middling offensive player who was a poor skater. Honestly, the last Shark pick I remember people being fairly universally happy with was Petrecki. and before that? You've got me.
Yeah, and look at where Petrecki and Couture are right now. I think with Couture, folks weren't fully sold on him until that 09-10 season (despite having a solid season in the OHL the year prior). Not fully sure, but wasn't there at one point a Sharks Board prospect poll that had Petrecki ahead of Couture? Or maybe it was hockeysfuture.com? Maybe it wasn't even Petrecki, but I remember Couture being like 3rd or 4th? I don't know.

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06-23-2012, 04:04 AM
  #888
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Well 1st round is over..I.wonder what the rest of the draft holds. Guys I would like to see the Sharks nab.....

Troy Bourke-Small, quick creative player out of the dub, plays bigger than his size so durability may be an issue.

Phil Di Giuseppe-Good size/speed combo guy. Needs to bulk up to fully utilize his game. Plays for a strong program (Michigan Wolverines).

Lukas Sutter-Son of Rich, plays a hard game and could be that third line center the Sharks can't seem to find.

Jake McCabe-Seems to be a solid in all areas type of dman. Plays at Wisconsin.

Just a few I've been reading up on since I can't sleep.

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06-23-2012, 04:34 AM
  #889
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Lukas Sutter-Son of Rich, plays a hard game and could be that third line center the Sharks can't seem to find.
Carolina are picking at #38 and #47 and Pittsburgh is picking at #52, so I just don't think Sutter will be avaliable when the Sharks pick... unless they trade up.

Those are all very intriguing prospects, though.

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06-23-2012, 04:41 AM
  #890
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Carolina are picking at #38 and #47 and Pittsburgh is picking at #52, so I just don't think Sutter will be avaliable when the Sharks pick... unless they trade up.

Those are all very intriguing prospects, though.
Doug Murray to the Canes for the 38th pick. Yeah I don't expect the Sharks to pick any of these guys just wishful thinking. The prospect pool could really use a sandpapery 2/3rd line guy. Colton Sissons is another guy I like.

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06-23-2012, 06:44 AM
  #891
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Everyone wasn't happy with Couture. There were some grumblings that it was just another middling offensive player who was a poor skater. Honestly, the last Shark pick I remember people being fairly universally happy with was Petrecki. and before that? You've got me.
Many people were also happy with Kaspar because the team was breaking the habit of choosing "safe" two way players and going with someone who had potential to be a first line goal scorer.

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06-23-2012, 09:55 AM
  #892
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You guys are really underrating Hertl IMO. He's not a big name and nobody ever heard of him a year ago. He flew up the charts and he has become a great player. I don't think you'll be disappointed.

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06-23-2012, 10:01 AM
  #893
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Alright, day two.

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06-23-2012, 10:06 AM
  #894
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Come on DW trade up for Colberg!

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06-23-2012, 10:08 AM
  #895
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Trade the Islanders Doug Murray!

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06-23-2012, 10:09 AM
  #896
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Collberg is gone.

To MTL

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06-23-2012, 10:09 AM
  #897
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Nooooo! Montreal took him.

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06-23-2012, 10:11 AM
  #898
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Finn is gone too now.

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06-23-2012, 10:14 AM
  #899
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Di GiuSeppe is gone too.

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06-23-2012, 10:14 AM
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Di Giuseppe to Car

Sutter to Winn

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