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Does getting the G-men assure that Roy stays?

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Old
06-23-2012, 09:47 AM
  #51
Dixon Ward
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i am inclined to think that roy will be in buffalo until the trade deadline.

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06-23-2012, 10:14 AM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Oh, I forgot, a center learning the NHL game on the wing is the worst thing in the world for the player's development.



A one-year apprenticeship isn't going to kill Grigs. I know we all want to put our shiny new toy at center, but it's alright if he plays some wing his rookie year while he learns everyone's responsibilities.
Its amazing how clueless some posters are about young centers starting off on the wing. Its fairly common thing thats done to help them break into the league.


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Old
06-23-2012, 10:18 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Rhett4 View Post
They can move Roy if they bring back a bigger third line center to help take the pressure off Ennis and Hodgson. Stoll would have been nice but he's not going to be available now that he resigned. Still, they could still move Roy, but they would definitely need an NHL-ready center (preferably with defensive chops).

I'm still interested in the other Foligno for the third line.
A 3rd line center will not take pressure off of Ennis/Hodgson to be top 6 centers. Only another top 6 center can. Thats why I've been against the likes of Kelly, Stoll, etc. They can't handle top 6 minutes and would not be able to pick up the slack if those two struggled.

You need a setup like the end of last season. This way they aren't even asked to carry the load as top 6 centers from the get go.

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06-23-2012, 10:50 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Roy is currently their best faceoff guy. He can play against higher level competition and take on defensive zone starts. Have to keep him at center. Break in Grigs slowly. No need to rush him. Baby steps, guys.
Playing him with pommers and Roy would be baby steps. Pommers would be covering the back end while teaching 2 way play and his leadership abilities. Roy can handle d zone faceoffs and still center a pk/pp unit. Roy and pommers would be relied on for scoring. This leaves Grigs able to focus on figuring out how to play center at the NHL lvl. It also makes Roy's lackluster play less damaging as Grigs will be taking the center responsibility.

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06-23-2012, 11:39 AM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakon View Post
If anything I would think loading up on centers would assure that someones getting moved...
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
If you're Darcy, do you move Roy on the assumption that Grigs can step in immediately?
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Originally Posted by ZZamboni View Post
Prediction - he won't make the team out of camp. He'll see a game or two preseason. He'll be sprinkled in a few times in the regular season due to injuries. That's about it.

But I would be happy if he comes in to camp and blows everyone's mind too....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabres57 View Post
Grigorenko guarantees he'll make the team.
A prospect's self-confidence is one thing but it guarantees nothing other than effort. Everyone would be thrilled if he came to camp and wowed right off the bat (i.e. Myers) but the prudent way for the Sabres to proceed is to not bank on him doing so and plan accordingly as if Grigorenko won't be in the mix this season.

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Originally Posted by notHiro View Post
The easiest decision would be to keep Roy at least until the trade deadline.
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Originally Posted by kpatterson14206 View Post
So either
A) They move Roy
B) Grigs doesn't make the team
C) Grigs gets 4th line duties
D) They take risk and break up FES to move Ennis to wing
E) They take the risk and Hodgson doesn't get top 6 ice time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhett4 View Post
They can move Roy if they bring back a bigger third line center to help take the pressure off Ennis and Hodgson.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I don't think one has to do with the other in the short term. Grigorenko has a shot at making the team this year, but Roy is the only guy on the roster who can consistently win faceoffs, and play a high level of competition while frequently starting in his zone. Roy is only moved if he's replaced by an established NHL center.
I think Zip nailed another veruy likely - and logical - option for the Sabres. The odds of Regier dealing Roy outright without getting another NHL center back seem very remote, mainly because Grigorenko is not a sure-fire bet to be NHL ready in 3 months. Getting an NHL center to replace Roy, even if a lateral move of talent (i.e. Stastny, Pavelski), is a route I do expect (and pray) Regier pushes hard for this summer.

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Originally Posted by Rhett4 View Post
If they moved Roy, I'd love them to replace him with Dubinsky. The money washes out, you lose some offense, gain some size. It'd work out well.
While I'd be worried at the offensive production of a Hodgson-Ennis-Dubinsky trio down the middle, I wouldn't be unhappy in adding Dubinsky for some of the other intangibles he brings.

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Originally Posted by Timbo Slice View Post
I have a feeling Roy will be on the team at the start of the season.
Regier's a professed observer of team chemistry and sensitive to anything that poses risk to it on his team - for that reason, while Roy could still be around by training camp, I'd be surprised if Regier wants the Roy-Ruff relationship to fester and become a source of tension and distraction. Plus, Roy's pending free agent status will already be a catalyst for trade rumors all season.

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06-23-2012, 12:40 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
I think Zip nailed another veruy likely - and logical - option for the Sabres. The odds of Regier dealing Roy outright without getting another NHL center back seem very remote, mainly because Grigorenko is not a sure-fire bet to be NHL ready in 3 months. Getting an NHL center to replace Roy, even if a lateral move of talent (i.e. Stastny, Pavelski), is a route I do expect (and pray) Regier pushes hard for this summer.
I'm actually pretty convinced that this is highly unlikely. If you move Roy and get another NHL center back (presumably a top-2 center, if we're talking replacement), then what do you do in two years when you have 5 guys pushing for 2 center spots?

I think by infusing the pipeline with such talent, Regier puts himself in a position where he can't stock up any more top 2 centers unless they're just placeholders and will be out in a year or two. In which case, it makes just as much sense to keep Roy.

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06-23-2012, 12:41 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
I'm actually pretty convinced that this is highly unlikely. If you move Roy and get another NHL center back (presumably a top-2 center, if we're talking replacement), then what do you do in two years when you have 5 guys pushing for 2 center spots?
You worry about it then.

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06-23-2012, 12:44 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
I'm actually pretty convinced that this is highly unlikely. If you move Roy and get another NHL center back (presumably a top-2 center, if we're talking replacement), then what do you do in two years when you have 5 guys pushing for 2 center spots?
Rejoice that you have so much center depth and move some to the wings.

We have exactly ONE proven top 6 center on the roster, Roy. We only have two centers with at least 1 year under their belt in the NHL. Roy and Hodgson and Cody only has 1 full year.

Folks are getting WAY ahead of themselves with some of these roster predictions and wants for next season.

Why are so many posters afraid of having more than two top 6 centers on the roster in a few years? The mentality is just bizarre.

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06-23-2012, 12:47 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Rejoice that you have so much center depth and move some to the wings.

We have exactly ONE proven top 6 center on the roster, Roy. We only have two centers with at least 1 year under their belt in the NHL. Roy and Hodgson and Cody only has 1 full year.

Folks are getting WAY ahead of themselves with some of these roster predictions and wants for next season.

Why are so many posters afraid of having more than two top 6 centers on the roster in a few years? The mentality is just bizarre.
The SC champs had 3 (Kopitar, Richards, Carter), arguably 4 if you think Stoll is a borderline #2.

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06-24-2012, 01:59 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Sabres57 View Post
I want Dubinsky.
Roy for Dubinsky? That works for me.

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06-24-2012, 03:05 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Roy for Dubinsky? That works for me.
Done. Get Sather and Regier on the phone.

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06-24-2012, 03:33 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabres57 View Post
I want Dubinsky.
Is he even playing center anymore?

I thought they used Richards, AA and Stephan there?

I know this board is not in love with Roy and he had his brainfarts fur sure, but don't understand why it seems that evreyone wants to get rid of him now.

He played here on a hometown discount type contract when they had nobody else and then he gets injured and people want to drop him, that's not nice.

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06-24-2012, 05:26 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Reacher Gilt View Post
Is he even playing center anymore?

I thought they used Richards, AA and Stephan there?

I know this board is not in love with Roy and he had his brainfarts fur sure, but don't understand why it seems that evreyone wants to get rid of him now.

He played here on a hometown discount type contract when they had nobody else and then he gets injured and people want to drop him, that's not nice.
-Can play center or wing
-Physical
-Defensively skilled
-Good at face-offs
-Decent offensively ability (two-time 20-goal scorer)
-Three years of reasonably priced team control left vs. Roy's one

There's a lot to like in Dubinsky's game. The Sabres certainly aren't winning the Cup next season with Roy, so I'd happily trade him for three years of a younger player who could serve as a key cog as the new, young core - Myers, Hodgson, Ennis, Grigs, Girgs, Armia, Foligno, McNabb, Pysyk - rises to take control and turn the team into a real contender.

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06-24-2012, 06:56 AM
  #64
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Absolutely. In fact, without Roy we don't have any true centers on the team. Ennis, Leino, and Hodgson are all wingers. I know, I know, "Hodgson has played center his entire life and OMG he's a center!". No, he isn't. At the NHL level he's going to find that his lack of acceleration is going to make him a winger. Great shot, good hockey sense, has some crafty moves off the RW boards....you do the math. He's like Luke Adam but better. Both are wingers. Leino is a winger. Ennis is a winger but he's one who has got the tools to be a decent center.

So now we got a couple of high end prospects, that's great. but they are gonna need time so Roy has to play out this final year.

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06-24-2012, 07:25 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by haseoke39 View Post
Think about it: the G-men are both a couple years away, and now it makes little sense to try and acquire another young center to replace Roy - that would leave us with 5 potential top 2 centers in the system in a year or two (Ennis, Hodgson, G, G, and whoever you bring in to replace Roy in the short term). A potential jam.

So either Darcy decides to go into next year with two guys with about 100 games of NHL center experience between them, or he holds onto Roy at least until one of the G's show they can make the leap.
Roy is not staying if Darcy can help it. He wants him gone

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06-24-2012, 09:33 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Play4Miracles View Post
Absolutely. In fact, without Roy we don't have any true centers on the team. Ennis, Leino, and Hodgson are all wingers. I know, I know, "Hodgson has played center his entire life and OMG he's a center!". No, he isn't. At the NHL level he's going to find that his lack of acceleration is going to make him a winger. Great shot, good hockey sense, has some crafty moves off the RW boards....you do the math. He's like Luke Adam but better. Both are wingers. Leino is a winger. Ennis is a winger but he's one who has got the tools to be a decent center.

So now we got a couple of high end prospects, that's great. but they are gonna need time so Roy has to play out this final year.
Hodgson isn't a winger, he's a center. He was even tried there for a bit in Vancouver and it didn't work. he doesn't like playing wing.

I'm guessing your anger/disappointment over Kassian leaving still hasn't diminished and its clouded your ability to fairly evaluate Hodgson.

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06-24-2012, 09:40 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by LoveDaSwords View Post
You worry about it then.
Now we have someone with an idea!!!!!

You worry about that then. It is fantastic that we now a pipeline on guys up the middle, FINALLY! We(the Sabres) are in win it all this year mode. We did not make all of those moves last year to be content with the guys up the middle we have to win it all. We have not been able to get it done with Roy. A lateral move in talent, ie Roy-Stastny to some might be none productive stats wise, but Stastny is far more of a leader than Roy is and ever will be, which is what this team needs more than anything. Having a log jam at C's in two years is a better problem to have than having holes at that position. Seems to have worked well with Pittsburgh. They used it, and then dealt with it.

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06-24-2012, 09:48 AM
  #68
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I can see Roy being trade, and a solid 2/3 veteran center added.

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06-24-2012, 09:59 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Play4Miracles View Post
Absolutely. In fact, without Roy we don't have any true centers on the team. Ennis, Leino, and Hodgson are all wingers. I know, I know, "Hodgson has played center his entire life and OMG he's a center!". No, he isn't. At the NHL level he's going to find that his lack of acceleration is going to make him a winger. Great shot, good hockey sense, has some crafty moves off the RW boards....you do the math. He's like Luke Adam but better. Both are wingers. Leino is a winger. Ennis is a winger but he's one who has got the tools to be a decent center.

So now we got a couple of high end prospects, that's great. but they are gonna need time so Roy has to play out this final year.
Ennis was drafted as a center. Ennis and Hodgson are both most useful at center because that's where their playmaking skills shine. Hodgson's skating can (and probably will) improve.

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06-24-2012, 10:13 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Play4Miracles View Post
Absolutely. In fact, without Roy we don't have any true centers on the team. Ennis, Leino, and Hodgson are all wingers. I know, I know, "Hodgson has played center his entire life and OMG he's a center!". No, he isn't. At the NHL level he's going to find that his lack of acceleration is going to make him a winger. Great shot, good hockey sense, has some crafty moves off the RW boards....you do the math. He's like Luke Adam but better. Both are wingers. Leino is a winger. Ennis is a winger but he's one who has got the tools to be a decent center.

So now we got a couple of high end prospects, that's great. but they are gonna need time so Roy has to play out this final year.
we get it, you didn't like the trade move on. Hodgson is a center

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06-24-2012, 10:41 AM
  #71
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not to derail the thread but I think the bigger question is where does this leave Luke Adam? Do they move him to the wing, does he make the team this year?

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06-24-2012, 10:51 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by DixonWard15 View Post
not to derail the thread but I think the bigger question is where does this leave Luke Adam? Do they move him to the wing, does he make the team this year?
I certainly don't think they've given up on him. I also don't think they'd be opposed to moving him, and wouldn't be surprised if he's a part of trade offers. I think this weekend's draft is further evidence that they don't envision Luke being an NHL center.

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06-24-2012, 11:04 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
A 3rd line center will not take pressure off of Ennis/Hodgson to be top 6 centers. Only another top 6 center can. Thats why I've been against the likes of Kelly, Stoll, etc. They can't handle top 6 minutes and would not be able to pick up the slack if those two struggled.

You need a setup like the end of last season. This way they aren't even asked to carry the load as top 6 centers from the get go.
It would really only affect Hodgson and would increase his offensive responsibilities while giving him better linemates. It's a risk, but perhaps one worth taking, depending on who that third line center is, and whether we can get a good deal on a fourth line guy as well. A strong bottom six taking the vast majority of the defensively oriented shifts wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

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06-24-2012, 11:54 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by DixonWard15 View Post
not to derail the thread but I think the bigger question is where does this leave Luke Adam? Do they move him to the wing, does he make the team this year?
I actually think this is good for Adam. He can find his game and confidnece in the AHL with little pressure to make the big club.

I have a feeling he will start at wing but could bounce back and forth a bit. In the AHL that is. He has very good shot that he can get off quickly and in traffic. Thats the one aspect of his game thats higher end. His defensive issues along with better options will likely end the chances he plays center in the NHL. But if he can develop into a reliable scorer with that shot. He could maybe become a secondary scoring winger in the NHL or at least a nice offensive depth option in the organization.

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06-24-2012, 11:55 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by DixonWard15 View Post
not to derail the thread but I think the bigger question is where does this leave Luke Adam? Do they move him to the wing, does he make the team this year?
Good ole Luke "Flames draft picks" Adam, someone start makin calls.

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