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Habs select Dalton Thrower - 51st overall

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Old
07-05-2012, 07:26 PM
  #251
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
[/B]

Dietz is 5 months older with a full year of hockey development on Thrower. Thrower was still picked to play ahead of Dietz in the lineup despite Dietz's experience advantage.

I am comparing apples to apples people. I like Dietz as a prospect but you would have a hard time finding scouts who prefer him over Thrower.
This.

Dietz is a fine prospect, I really like him... There is no doubt that Thrower is a head of him right now though, although you never know!

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07-05-2012, 10:45 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
[/B]

Dietz is 5 months older with a full year of hockey development on Thrower. Thrower was still picked to play ahead of Dietz in the lineup despite Dietz's experience advantage.

I am comparing apples to apples people. I like Dietz as a prospect but you would have a hard time finding scouts who prefer him over Thrower.
What can I say?



And by Hansel, I mean Thrower. I think I'd still take my chances with Dietz over Thrower right now, but we'll see.

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07-06-2012, 08:57 AM
  #253
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What can I say?



And by Hansel, I mean Thrower. I think I'd still take my chances with Dietz over Thrower right now, but we'll see.


Thrower is rockin' the Blue Steel

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07-06-2012, 09:18 AM
  #254
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I'll take the word of the scout Renegade_something, he saw them both play a lot and said they basicly play the same game except Thrower is better at everything.

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07-06-2012, 09:37 AM
  #255
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both are right shots, bonus.

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07-06-2012, 11:17 AM
  #256
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Who are those weirdos? These are the four horsemen:
Chris Hitchens god rest his soul. Martini anyone? Oops, well, not God, but may you rest in peace Chris.

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07-06-2012, 11:25 AM
  #257
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Reminds me of Chris Philips. From age 10 he had to look after his mother and father. His mother was paralyzed from the waist down and his father was blind.
Jeezuz. The guy should get an extra mill on his contracts to take care of them. That is brutal.

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07-06-2012, 08:40 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by ChoseLa View Post
I'll take the word of the scout Renegade_something, he saw them both play a lot and said they basicly play the same game except Thrower is better at everything.
Oh, I bet Thrower looked that way playing beside Siemens this year. When Dietz and Thrower played together, I thought Dietz looked better at everything. Granted, there has been some development time for both guys since then. But now I find that former 1st round draft pick Duncan Siemens makes Thrower look better than Dietz does playing beside a 5'9" offensive defenseman in undrafted Connor Cox... if you catch my drift. Think about how people viewed Komisarek vs Gorges defensively back in 2006, and think about how much Markov influenced the fact that many here would have considered Komisarek better than Gorges defensively at the time. Similar effect, imo, different players, roles, and team.

You can trust Renegade_(something)'s ability to keep that context in mind when watching the execution of plays either pairing attempts, or their decision-making, but I don't if that's what he said.

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07-06-2012, 09:15 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Oh, I bet Thrower looked that way playing beside Siemens this year. When Dietz and Thrower played together, I thought Dietz looked better at everything. Granted, there has been some development time for both guys since then. But now I find that former 1st round draft pick Duncan Siemens makes Thrower look better than Dietz does playing beside a 5'9" offensive defenseman in undrafted Connor Cox... if you catch my drift. Think about how people viewed Komisarek vs Gorges defensively back in 2006, and think about how much Markov influenced the fact that many here would have considered Komisarek better than Gorges defensively at the time. Similar effect, imo, different players, roles, and team.

You can trust Renegade_(something)'s ability to keep that context in mind when watching the execution of plays either pairing attempts, or their decision-making, but I don't if that's what he said.
I can't say much since i haven't see any of them play. Personnaly i don't care wich one of the two is better, as i have no preferences, as long as they are both good... and can fight!

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07-06-2012, 09:19 PM
  #260
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I'll take the word of the scout Renegade_something, he saw them both play a lot and said they basicly play the same game except Thrower is better at everything.
I don't believe Renegade Stylings is a scout. He's done some color commentary on some WHL games though.

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07-06-2012, 09:23 PM
  #261
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I don't believe Renegade Stylings is a scout. He's done some color commentary on some WHL games though.
He may not be a scout, but he more than likely watches them a ton.

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07-06-2012, 09:30 PM
  #262
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I have watched both Dietz and Thrower a couiple of time and I do think Thrower is slightly better than Dietz. One thing is for sure, Thrower is more physical than Dietz.

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07-06-2012, 09:50 PM
  #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
[/B]

Dietz is 5 months older with a full year of hockey development on Thrower. Thrower was still picked to play ahead of Dietz in the lineup despite Dietz's experience advantage.

I am comparing apples to apples people. I like Dietz as a prospect but you would have a hard time finding scouts who prefer him over Thrower.
Your argument is kinda flawed considering Thrower played 55 Games in 2009-2010 and Dietz played 8. So Dietz didn't have an experience advantage, Thrower did... And the following season Dietz put up better numbers. Although Thrower had better numbers this year.

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07-06-2012, 10:06 PM
  #264
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Originally Posted by Beendair Donedat View Post
Your argument is kinda flawed considering Thrower played 55 Games in 2009-2010 and Dietz played 8. So Dietz didn't have an experience advantage, Thrower did... And the following season Dietz put up better numbers. Although Thrower had better numbers this year.
Which, again, I think can be "explained" (not quite the right word) by reviewing the timing of suspensions and injuries on that team (leaving them with only 5 defensemen dressed for plenty of games) leading to the resultant pairings and roles that got doled out, and how Thrower rose to the occasion and seemed more than capable of a role that not many could have anticipated him having just a season earlier, really. And then what I suggested in my previous post is in there as well.

I dunno. I'm just going to stick with my eye and my projections for a bit longer before I concede that Thrower is more likely to excel in the NHL (or perhaps whether or not he HAS excelled more, depending on my stubborness, lol!)

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07-06-2012, 11:23 PM
  #265
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Originally Posted by JustAHabFan View Post
I have watched both Dietz and Thrower a couiple of time and I do think Thrower is slightly better than Dietz. One thing is for sure, Thrower is more physical than Dietz.
I only saw Thrower play twice, once in the dub and once at the CHL prospects game, so I can't really say who's better since at the time I saw them play together he wasn't a Hab yet so I didn't pay close attention, but I would think that they are very close in terms of rankings. Both put up some impressive numbers as well as racking up the pims. Will be interesting to see how they do this season but for me I'll really be waiting to see them the following year when both hit the AHL at the same time.

I really like what i've seen and read about Dietz, so if Thrower is anything close to that then good for us.

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07-07-2012, 11:25 AM
  #266
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Originally Posted by Mr. Hab View Post
Comparisons (didn't read every page here but here are a few comparisons I found here):

Wiz (I like this comparison).
Bieksa (someone wrote this...but Bieksa is way bigger/taller, but other than that I like the comparison).




Any other dmen that Thrower is compared to? (he might end up 6'0 or 6'1, no? right now he's 5'11 and approx 185-190lbs, but there's still time to grow...and what's really important is the size of his heart).




Very very happy with this pick
If Thrower had the offensive upside of Wiz or Biesksa I think he would've gone in the 1st-round.

He reminds me of another tough as nails smallish defenceman from the Saskatoon Blades: Barret Jackman.

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07-07-2012, 01:38 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by projexns View Post
If Thrower had the offensive upside of Wiz or Biesksa I think he would've gone in the 1st-round.

He reminds me of another tough as nails smallish defenceman from the Saskatoon Blades: Barret Jackman.
I don't like to compare NHLers to prospects but Thrower if you look at what the Wiz did when he was in the OHL, Thrower had a much better draft year stats wise. Since Biesksa played in the NCAA i'll leave him out.

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07-07-2012, 02:03 PM
  #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by projexns View Post
If Thrower had the offensive upside of Wiz or Biesksa I think he would've gone in the 1st-round.

He reminds me of another tough as nails smallish defenceman from the Saskatoon Blades: Barret Jackman.
If you mean Bieksa or Wiz now, sure they'd go higher. But on draft day, both Bieksa and Wiz went in the 150s while Thrower was picked much higher, in the 50s.

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07-07-2012, 02:42 PM
  #269
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Kevin Bieksa isn't very big.

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07-07-2012, 03:13 PM
  #270
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Really don't see the Jackman comparison. They're both smaller, tough D, but play opposite styles.

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07-07-2012, 04:00 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by projexns View Post
If Thrower had the offensive upside of Wiz or Biesksa I think he would've gone in the 1st-round.

He reminds me of another tough as nails smallish defenceman from the Saskatoon Blades: Barret Jackman.
Neither Wiz, nor Bieksa were first round picks themselves. I'm not saying I agree with the comparison, but just saying.

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07-07-2012, 07:48 PM
  #272
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Neither Wiz, nor Bieksa were first round picks themselves. I'm not saying I agree with the comparison, but just saying.
I'm not trying to compare them based on draft position but rather what type of d-men they project to become. Bieksa and Wiz have become 0.5 ppg defencemen in the NHL whereas Jackman has become a nice heart and soul type with a 20-25 point ceiling offensively.

There's nothing wrong with that, especially from a 2nd-round pick where there's only a 25-30% hit-rate at becoming a regular NHLer.

The high-end possibilities are there but they don't often materialize. In Chicago we have Hjalmarsson who Scotty Bowman mysteriously compared to Nik Lidstrom.......a nice d-man to have but well short of whatever his offensive potential was thought to be for a time.

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07-07-2012, 09:17 PM
  #273
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Originally Posted by projexns View Post
I'm not trying to compare them based on draft position but rather what type of d-men they project to become. Bieksa and Wiz have become 0.5 ppg defencemen in the NHL whereas Jackman has become a nice heart and soul type with a 20-25 point ceiling offensively.

There's nothing wrong with that, especially from a 2nd-round pick where there's only a 25-30% hit-rate at becoming a regular NHLer.

The high-end possibilities are there but they don't often materialize. In Chicago we have Hjalmarsson who Scotty Bowman mysteriously compared to Nik Lidstrom.......a nice d-man to have but well short of whatever his offensive potential was thought to be for a time.
Yeah but, first you were speaking about "offensive upside," and now you're talking about percentage of people who achieve their upside. Those are two different things.

He may, or may not have that upside, regardless of his draft ranking. For example, you could say that Collberg doesn't have first line upside, because he wasn't drafted in the 1st round. Having seen Collberg live, and at the U18's and U20's, I can assure you, he has 1st line upside. I haven't seen thrower live yet, however, so I can't say whether I think he has Wiz's offensive upside or not, yet. But it was the reasoning of your first post that didn't really sit well with me.

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07-07-2012, 09:37 PM
  #274
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This thread will be moot when the guy picked 2 picks before Thrower ends up being the Giroux of 2012 draft and we all burn Timmins and MB on the cross wondering how in the hell did they miss that one.

Coulda, shoulda, woulda,. I'm hopeful of our draft load, but everyone is saying we did so well, this is making me think maybe we didn't do so good really because it never works out so obviously. I just hope we get one hotshot and that's Gally. I'm not going to get to excited about Thrower and maybe I'll just be surprised down the road and then again maybe not.

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07-07-2012, 09:38 PM
  #275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by projexns View Post
I'm not trying to compare them based on draft position but rather what type of d-men they project to become. Bieksa and Wiz have become 0.5 ppg defencemen in the NHL whereas Jackman has become a nice heart and soul type with a 20-25 point ceiling offensively.

There's nothing wrong with that, especially from a 2nd-round pick where there's only a 25-30% hit-rate at becoming a regular NHLer.

The high-end possibilities are there but they don't often materialize. In Chicago we have Hjalmarsson who Scotty Bowman mysteriously compared to Nik Lidstrom.......a nice d-man to have but well short of whatever his offensive potential was thought to be for a time.
The offensive potential of Thrower is high enough to believe he can potentially become a Wizniewski type of player... Plain and simple. Will he reach that potential? Chances are he won't, but it's not impossible at all.

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