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The 2013 Draft Thread: Not Winnin' For #(??)...

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Old
12-17-2012, 12:50 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Part of the reason I'm hoping there's a season is so that we can move some assets for more picks. One needn't look further than the haul Jonny Oduya brought the Jets (2013 2nd, 2013 3rd) to understand that Leopold would have serious value at the deadline. If there's no season, that's a wasted asset. Ditto for Regehr--who I think would pull a very nice package given that he has a playoff air about him--if the team decides it isn't going to re-sign him. Now, Leo won't net a 1st rounder, and I don't know if Regehr would, either--much would depend on how he played to that point--but they'd be nice assets to put on the market.

To your point, CBJ has three 1st rounders in the upcoming draft: their own, LA's, and NYR's. Based on the draft formula in the event of a cancelled season, CBJ would have a 10% chance at getting the #1 pick. If there's a fanbase who may be rooting for a cancelled season, it may be Columbus' considering both NYR and LA would likely be picking in the 20's if there's a season. Then again, with Columbus' draft lottery luck, or lack thereof, they'd probably have three picks late in the 1st round.
I have to think we would also draw a late first, but maybe we get lucky.

Yeah it would suck if we werent able to move those two guys for assets, especially if they arent going to be re-signed.

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12-17-2012, 01:43 PM
  #152
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I have to think we would also draw a late first, but maybe we get lucky.

Yeah it would suck if we werent able to move those two guys for assets, especially if they arent going to be re-signed.
What makes me kind of upset is that this team would not be contending this year if there was/is a season. We would most likely be picking in the top 10 of an Extremely deep draft. But now if there is no season we will be subject to a random lottery in which we only have one ball.(Most likely picking in the late 20s, or equivalent to making a deep run in the playoffs)

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12-18-2012, 10:19 AM
  #153
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https://www.isshockey.com/scouting/news?news_id=67

Quote:
Rank Name Position Birthdate Shot Height Weight Team League
1 MacKinnon, Nathan C 9/1/95 R 6.00* 182 Halifax QMJHL
2 Jones, Seth RD 10/3/94 R 6.03.5* 208 Portland WHL
3 Barkov, Sasha F 9/2/95 L 6.03 209 Tappara FinE
4 Drouin, Jonathan C 3/27/95 L 5.10.75* 185 Halifax QMJHL
5 Monahan, Sean C 10/12/94 L 6.02* 186 Ottawa OHL
Nothing really shocking in the ISS Top 5 for December.

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12-18-2012, 10:56 AM
  #154
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Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
https://www.isshockey.com/scouting/news?news_id=67



Nothing really shocking in the ISS Top 5 for December.
I want dem. All of dem.

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12-18-2012, 11:01 AM
  #155
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Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
https://www.isshockey.com/scouting/news?news_id=67



Nothing really shocking in the ISS Top 5 for December.
Even the 6-10 of Lindholm-Nichushkin-Shinkaruk-Nurse-Ristolainen is impressive.

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12-18-2012, 11:09 AM
  #156
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What do people know about this Nikita Zadorov fellow playing for the London Knights, besides that he's big (6'5'', 230)?

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12-18-2012, 01:45 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
What do people know about this Nikita Zadorov fellow playing for the London Knights, besides that he's big (6'5'', 230)?
I haven't seen London lately, so I'll defer to this... Sunday Top 10 OHL Eligibles - Preliminary Media Top 10 for 2013:
Quote:
3. Nikita Zadorov - London Knights
Received Votes From: 8/8
Highest Placement/Lowest Placement: 2nd (1x)/8th (1x)

Comments: One of the faster rising players of this young OHL season, Zadorov has met and exceeded the hype he entered the league with. He's created quite the battle between him and Darnell Nurse for the title of top OHL defenseman available. Ironically, they play similar, which makes separating them hard. "At this point, I'm not sure which one I prefer. Can I have them both?" says one contributor. The common word used by all contributors, "potential." "Sure he has been impressive keeping attackers pinned to the boards, swatting away pucks with his long reach and laying some destructive hits, even dropping the glove a couple times early in the year, but his pro upside is what has many excited. He has a great frame to build upon, and he skates well for a man his size and possesses a strong physical presence to him. He has the ability to skate with the puck and make some solid passes as well leading me to believe he could add some offensive elements to his game going forward as well." Another contributor goes a step further. "His offensive game took off in November. I saw him flat out dominate a couple of games at both ends of the ice. He's the complete package." Some contributors aren't quite jumping the gun yet though, "Haven't moved him as high as some have - yet. No question he's the premier shut down defenseman available. He's starting to feel more comfortable after an adjustment to North America and it's showing in his offensive game. No place to go but up for Zadorov from here on out."

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Old
12-21-2012, 11:34 AM
  #158
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watching a lot of Quebec this year to follow Grigorenko.... my eyes are set on Erne in 2013.

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12-23-2012, 09:11 AM
  #159
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watching a lot of Quebec this year to follow Grigorenko.... my eyes are set on Erne in 2013.
What is your scouting report on Erne?

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12-23-2012, 11:05 AM
  #160
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
Even the 6-10 of Lindholm-Nichushkin-Shinkaruk-Nurse-Ristolainen is impressive.
I'd take Pulock ahead of Nurse easily. But the fact that guys like Nurse and Erne are likely 10-20 picks really speaks to how much high-quality talent is available in this draft.

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12-26-2012, 11:56 AM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Superhero View Post
What is your scouting report on Erne?
- Size/Speed combo is NHL ready
- Powerful stride
- NHL level shot. Hard shot. It's heavy and his release is quicker than it was last year. He might have the best shot in amateur North America.
- The kid oozes heart/maturity. He's gonna wear a letter.
- With all his skill, he still goes to the net and scores the dirty goals.
- He does it all, in all zones.
- You see the hunger... Did I mention Heart?

He's going top 5. If he's not the 3rd forward drafted, someone effed up.

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Old
12-26-2012, 12:08 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
- Size/Speed combo is NHL ready
- Powerful stride
- NHL level shot. Hard shot. It's heavy and his release is quicker than it was last year. He might have the best shot in amateur North America.
- The kid oozes heart/maturity. He's gonna wear a letter.
- With all his skill, he still goes to the net and scores the dirty goals.
- He does it all, in all zones.
- You see the hunger... Did I mention Heart?

He's going top 5. If he's not the 3rd forward drafted, someone effed up.
TJ Oshie-ish in my eyes.

Way too much talent for him to go top 5 IMO though. MacKinnon, Drouin, Lindholm, Barkov, Monahan, Shinkaruk still a step ahead in my eyes (for forwards). You could make an argument for him over all the rest (Domi, Nichushkin, Lazar, etc).


Last edited by Buffalo87: 12-26-2012 at 01:11 PM.
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Old
12-26-2012, 12:16 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
- Size/Speed combo is NHL ready
- Powerful stride
- NHL level shot. Hard shot. It's heavy and his release is quicker than it was last year. He might have the best shot in amateur North America.
- The kid oozes heart/maturity. He's gonna wear a letter.
- With all his skill, he still goes to the net and scores the dirty goals.
- He does it all, in all zones.
- You see the hunger... Did I mention Heart?

He's going top 5. If he's not the 3rd forward drafted, someone effed up.
I assume you believe the forwards preceding him will be MacKinnon and...Barkov? I can't envision a scenario where Erne's drafted before centers like Lindholm and Monahan, or even wingers like Drouin and Shinkaruk. Then he's still in a battle with guys like Nicushkin, Lazar, et al.

If Quebec plays deep into the playoffs, I could see him improving upon his current #19 rank, but I think top-5 and third forward off the board is a bit ambitious.

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12-26-2012, 01:59 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Buffalo87 View Post
TJ Oshie-ish in my eyes.

Way too much talent for him to go top 5 IMO though. MacKinnon, Drouin, Lindholm, Barkov, Monahan, Shinkaruk still a step ahead in my eyes (for forwards). You could make an argument for him over all the rest (Domi, Nichushkin, Lazar, etc).
Oshie is a very good comparable for Erne. He's a very good two-way player who plays with a lot of energy, and has pretty soft hands to boot. I don't see how he would crack the top 10 this year though. There's just so much talent...

Seems like Pulock doesn't get enough love in terms of draft eligibles. Very strong at both ends of the ice, good leadership qualities. He's probably my 2nd favorite defenseman in this year's draft after Jones, though Ristolainen seems to have a lot of talent as well.

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12-26-2012, 02:41 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I assume you believe the forwards preceding him will be MacKinnon and...Barkov? I can't envision a scenario where Erne's drafted before centers like Lindholm and Monahan, or even wingers like Drouin and Shinkaruk. Then he's still in a battle with guys like Nicushkin, Lazar, et al.

If Quebec plays deep into the playoffs, I could see him improving upon his current #19 rank, but I think top-5 and third forward off the board is a bit ambitious.
Forwards
1. Mackinnon
2. Monahan
3. Erne
4. Barkov
5. Shinkaruk
6. Lindholm
7. Nichushkin
8. Drouin
9. Domi
10. Gauthier

I'm also biased by having watched significantly more of Erne and the Q, than other top prospects/other leagues (Also very high on Gauthier and not as high on Drouin as most). Erne is also "my" type of player, which furthers my bias.

Also, did I mention he's from my hometown? (homer)

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Old
12-26-2012, 09:10 PM
  #166
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What do you guys think of Frederick Gauthier and Anthony Mantha? What are your scouting reports on these 2 prospects?

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Old
12-27-2012, 05:16 AM
  #167
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Forwards
1. Mackinnon
2. Monahan
3. Erne
4. Barkov
5. Shinkaruk
6. Lindholm
7. Nichushkin
8. Drouin
9. Domi
10. Gauthier

I'm also biased by having watched significantly more of Erne and the Q, than other top prospects/other leagues (Also very high on Gauthier and not as high on Drouin as most). Erne is also "my" type of player, which furthers my bias.

Also, did I mention he's from my hometown? (homer)
How can you mostly follow the Q and still have a player like Nichushkin over Drouin?
They're at completely opposite ends of the hockey sense spectrum.
I don't think I'll ever understand the Nichushkin hype, though..

Quote:
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What do you guys think of Frederick Gauthier and Anthony Mantha? What are your scouting reports on these 2 prospects?
Gauthier is huge and can still skate (the most intriguing thing for me is his agility, which is rare amongst players his size).
He's not overly skilled offensively, but I still think he has a decent amount of offensive upside as he has the hockey sense to find holes and the size that makes it hard for anyone to stop him from getting to those areas.
He'll never really be known for his offense but he's incredibly intelligent on the defensive side of the puck and that's where his value really is.
If he was more physical in the hitting sense I think he'd be held in higher regard, but I don't think he really needs to be a banger since he uses his size in different ways.

Mantha is very much a boom-or-bust prospect and reminds me of Armia as his skill set is very Euro-esque, but Mantha is a better skater.
He has very good offensive hockey sense and loves to lurk and pounce when he has a chance.
His shot is pretty deadly because of his quick, deceptive release and his ability to shoot in stride and disguise his intentions.
He's not good defensively though and has the tools to play a power game but often doesn't.
He's basically a perfect fit around the bottom third of the first round for teams that can afford to take a risk on skill and there's the added plus that he can be brought into an organization one year after he's drafted because of his late birthday.

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Old
12-27-2012, 08:33 AM
  #168
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How can you mostly follow the Q and still have a player like Nichushkin over Drouin?
They're at completely opposite ends of the hockey sense spectrum.
I don't think I'll ever understand the Nichushkin hype, though..
I would agree that Nichushkin lacks hockey sense, is soft when the game gets physical (although I impressed with improvements in that area), and doesn't demonstrate many playmaking tendencies in terms of being aware of his linemates.



BUT

The skills he does have, are elite. He is arguably the best skater in the draft. He handles the puck with ease, and his ability to attack from the outside translates well to the pro game. High ceiling... High bust factor
Still, his size, speed, power combo is very enticing to me.

Drouin's size+lack of upper end skating concerns me. He is quick, but not explosive. He is a much more complete player than Nich, but I prefer players that have an elite skill or 2 at the top of the draft. While Drouin stands out in his own right, I am still keenly aware of his play before he got on the Mackinnon line before last year's post season.

Drouin is the safe top 10 pick. You know he's gonna be a player. At worst, you get a pesty/skill 3rd line 20/20 guy. Or maybe he's the next Jeff Skinner...

If I had to choose between the 2... it would be difficult.

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12-27-2012, 09:49 AM
  #169
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Originally Posted by jfb392 View Post
Gauthier is huge and can still skate (the most intriguing thing for me is his agility, which is rare amongst players his size).
He's not overly skilled offensively, but I still think he has a decent amount of offensive upside as he has the hockey sense to find holes and the size that makes it hard for anyone to stop him from getting to those areas.
He'll never really be known for his offense but he's incredibly intelligent on the defensive side of the puck and that's where his value really is.
If he was more physical in the hitting sense I think he'd be held in higher regard, but I don't think he really needs to be a banger since he uses his size in different ways.
Is Danny Paille a decent comparison? Then again Paille is probably too small to really fit the comparison, but in terms of style.

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12-27-2012, 10:17 AM
  #170
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Barkov is easily a top 2 or 3 forward, his play has really impressed me. I'm waiting for after the world juniors to speak more about all of the prospects. Erne is impressive but to me there are at least 3 or 4 better forwards

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12-27-2012, 10:31 AM
  #171
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Is Danny Paille a decent comparison? Then again Paille is probably too small to really fit the comparison, but in terms of style.
I think Paille has more jam to his game while Gauthier is bigger and smoother, more finesse.

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12-27-2012, 10:55 AM
  #172
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I think Paille has more jam to his game while Gauthier is bigger and smoother, more finesse.
Gauthier reminds me of less accomplished Taylor Pyatt... AS A PROSPECT!

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12-27-2012, 03:16 PM
  #173
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Gauthier reminds me of less accomplished Taylor Pyatt... AS A PROSPECT!
Taylor Pyatt . . . . . .

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12-27-2012, 05:23 PM
  #174
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I would agree that Nichushkin lacks hockey sense, is soft when the game gets physical (although I impressed with improvements in that area), and doesn't demonstrate many playmaking tendencies in terms of being aware of his linemates.



BUT

The skills he does have, are elite. He is arguably the best skater in the draft. He handles the puck with ease, and his ability to attack from the outside translates well to the pro game. High ceiling... High bust factor
Still, his size, speed, power combo is very enticing to me.
I'd agree he has some very intriguing tools, but since I look at hockey sense above pretty much everything else, he's a no-go for me.
The hockey sense seems to be mind blowingly low for an NHL prospect and it looks like he hasn't ever learned how to actually play hockey.
He wants to play one way and that's his robotic style that involves powering through everyone and cutting inside, which would be more intriguing if he showed more finish, a more dangerous shot, and went harder to the net than he does.
He looks like a manchild playing peewee or bantam that does everything himself, which is how many elite players look at that age because they are clearly better, but he should be years beyond that.
It also makes you wonder about how coachable he is, as some coach has to have gotten tired of him by now.

Some say Rick Nash, but he looks more like Viktor Stålberg or his teammate, Maxim Shalunov.

Quote:
Drouin's size+lack of upper end skating concerns me. He is quick, but not explosive. He is a much more complete player than Nich, but I prefer players that have an elite skill or 2 at the top of the draft. While Drouin stands out in his own right, I am still keenly aware of his play before he got on the Mackinnon line before last year's post season.

Drouin is the safe top 10 pick. You know he's gonna be a player. At worst, you get a pesty/skill 3rd line 20/20 guy. Or maybe he's the next Jeff Skinner...

If I had to choose between the 2... it would be difficult.
He doesn't really have to be explosive since he's quick and agile and is so intelligent.
As for his skills, I'd say his puck skills and sense/vision are pretty elite.
His intangibles like competitiveness and clutch ability are up there too if you buy into those things even though they're hard to measure.
He's not just an offensive player either, as I think he reads the game very well all over the ice and uses his stick so well, whether it's stealing the puck or getting a piece of a pass to break it up.
His hand-eye is very good also.

As for his play prior to lining up with MacKinnon, it was still at a high level.
He was making things happen but was still getting used to the league.
It was a difficult time to transition because he came in right around when the intensity starts to ramp up and the games start to matter, plus he was coming off a groin injury and wasn't as strong then.
Even then, he still produced like an elite player, albeit in a shortened season.
They complement each other so well, but neither is a product of the other.
They're both elite in their own right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrigsAndGirgs View Post
Is Danny Paille a decent comparison? Then again Paille is probably too small to really fit the comparison, but in terms of style.
No because he isn't as adept at finding himself on a breakaway as Paille is, which is a huge part of his game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Gauthier reminds me of less accomplished Taylor Pyatt... AS A PROSPECT!
This is a pretty good comparison, but it will be taken negatively around here.

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12-27-2012, 05:38 PM
  #175
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Re: Erne

In my opinion, playoffs are going to be the biggest factor in his case. He stepped it up when he was needed earlier this year, but had a thougher (kind of) stretch afterward. In the former, he has shown to be a top 10 forward... in the latter, more of a 15-25 winger. Is it about being clutch or is it about being «streaky»? (not the usual streaky, he doesn't reach terrible lows, but his play was much better for a stretch than the following games... I really want to make sure I don't carry a false message because of poor wording) Or maybe it is simply a developmental thing.

Obviously, playoffs play a big role for pretty much all draft eligible players... I just think they're going to be especially important for Erne. Same could possibly be said of Drouin, Duclair and Mantha... as a counter-example, MacKinnon's and Gauthier's draft rankings are going to be less affected by those games (all other things kept equal), in my humble opinion, simply because of style.

Q fan, if you hadn't noticed

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