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Offseason Discussion VII: Never Go Full-Rossi (Contract chart/FA list in Post #1)

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Old
06-27-2012, 03:13 PM
  #876
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what time exactly does FA begin sunday? noon? or midnight?
I believe that I saw someone say noon.

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06-27-2012, 03:17 PM
  #877
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FA on a Sunday. Weird.

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06-27-2012, 03:19 PM
  #878
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Yeah I wish it was on a workday...

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06-27-2012, 03:20 PM
  #879
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So with Wideman signing for $5.25 per for five years, does it make you wonder if we pulled the trigger on Michalek too soon and could have gotten quite a bit more?

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06-27-2012, 03:21 PM
  #880
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in light of the Wideman deal, and what Carle/Garrison will command (+$5m AAV, probably 5-6 yrs apiece), Martin @ 3 more years, $15m looks awfully good in comparison. it's becoming more and more likely that he'll be back, imo.

absent Suter, I wonder if we might take another run at Yandle. unfortunately, I think we've already played our best card there (Z), and Bennett is too far away to really fulfill their forward need.

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06-27-2012, 03:22 PM
  #881
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
So with Wideman signing for $5.25 per for five years, does it make you wonder if we pulled the trigger on Michalek too soon and could have gotten quite a bit more?
But that would mean taking on salary, no?

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06-27-2012, 03:23 PM
  #882
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Does that mean that the cap is definitely going to be that, or that the cap will definitely not be higher than that?
I assume it means the cap is set at $70.2m, that is all the tweet said though.

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06-27-2012, 03:23 PM
  #883
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Originally Posted by eXile59 View Post
FA on a Sunday. Weird.
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Originally Posted by GoGuins8711 View Post
Yeah I wish it was on a workday...
Agreed. I should be happy that is on the weekend but it feels... wrong

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06-27-2012, 03:28 PM
  #884
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
Does that mean that the cap is definitely going to be that, or that the cap will definitely not be higher than that?
Upper-limit and cap are definitely redundant, so who knows. It seems that the salary cap is talked about as an entity (floor, upper-limit) rather than just the upper-limit, so I'm inclined to think that the cap is set at 70.2. Who knows, though.

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06-27-2012, 03:28 PM
  #885
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
So with Wideman signing for $5.25 per for five years, does it make you wonder if we pulled the trigger on Michalek too soon and could have gotten quite a bit more?
Absolutely... but luckily we have a bird in hand with Martin.

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06-27-2012, 03:31 PM
  #886
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
So with Wideman signing for $5.25 per for five years, does it make you wonder if we pulled the trigger on Michalek too soon and could have gotten quite a bit more?
I think it was more important that it was handled professionally as opposed to return. Other players will see that even if things don't work the GM is willing to work with them & not just ship them off with out their consideration in mind.

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06-27-2012, 03:34 PM
  #887
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I think it was more important that it was handled professionally as opposed to return. Other players will see that even if things don't work the GM is willing to work with them & not just ship them off with out their consideration in mind.
I think so. We get a lot of players to take discounts to stay here, and many say that they signed for less because of the organization. Contrast that with Philly.

As for Martin, if the cap indeed is going to 70.2 million, that is a 8.9% increase from last year. Meaning in effect as a percetage of the cap his salary went in one year from $5 million to what in effect would have been $4.55 million. With every cap strapped team suddenly with $6.2 million of monopoly money in their pockets. If we wanted to move him we certainly good, and for a good return. Not just for Martin, but FA prices in general are going to suprise people I think.

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06-27-2012, 03:35 PM
  #888
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Originally Posted by Dr Frasier Crane View Post
Upper-limit and cap are definitely redundant, so who knows. It seems that the salary cap is talked about as an entity (floor, upper-limit) rather than just the upper-limit, so I'm inclined to think that the cap is set at 70.2. Who knows, though.
Yup, that's correct. The terminology does get redundant. I think the proper terms used verbatim in the CBA are "upper limit" and "lower limit" -- the cap/ceiling/etc and the floor.

So yes, the "cap" is set at $70.2 million ... for a couple of months, at least, until they negotiate a new CBA.

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06-27-2012, 03:35 PM
  #889
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I do wonder at what point if we miss out on Parise, Doan etc. does Alex Semin become a good option. He certainly has flaws but he also has a right shot and ridiculous skill. Sid or Geno can easily turn him into a 40 goal guy again, imo. I just don't think I'd be comfortable offering more than 3-4 years and James Neal type of money. He'll probably be able to get more than that from another club.
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
Semin was much more "in line" than Ovi this year. We might not like him, and he is probably going to be overpaid, but the guy is a hell of a hockey player. When looking for a wing upgrade I don't think you can just totally dismiss the option of bringing in the most productive player on the market.

http://hockeyanalysis.com/2012/06/15...ed-free-agent/

The dude can play. And despite what we like to think, he usually does it very well. I still think he'll get payed more than we want to offer him, but he's the 2nd best UFA forward out there.
I’m with these guys 100%. Knowing that he’ll get $$$ thrown at him almost seems to make us bitter because it’s almost an afterthought that’d he’d be a realistic option for the Penguins, but you can’t scoff at the guy’s skill level. There’s no doubt he would snipe 30+ and the space he would create for Malkin and Crosby on the PP, with teams having to respect that backdoor/point bomb, would just make for some very fun puck movement and snipage.

It really is a shame the year the market looks to be the one of the thinnest is the market in which the Penguins seem to be targeting. Meanwhile in 2013 there’s:

Iginla, Elias, Perry, Getzlaf, Ribeiro, McDonald, Lupul, Timonen, Visnovsky, Streit, Hartnell, Fisher, Streit, Roy, Zidlicky, Horton, Zajac, Koivu, Enstrom, Cullen, Ryder, Scuderi, Zubrus, Edler, Vlasic, Weiss, Filpulla, Clarkson, Brouwer, Smid, Burrows, Hejduk…

Unless somehow that thinking backfires and non-contending teams think, “let’s wait a year to get more players on cheaper contracts” but that seems much less likely to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shureshot66 View Post
Perhaps he'd like to adjust that Suter figure...
5.5m? Seriously? I was “low-balling” when I put together a cap schedule with Suter at 6.5m! 5.5m is outrageous.

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Old
06-27-2012, 03:42 PM
  #890
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Any interest in Garrison or Carle?

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06-27-2012, 03:44 PM
  #891
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Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik View Post
Any interest in Garrison or Carle?
I have interest in both players; just probably won't like their contracts. I was thinking we could get Carle on a 3-year deal, but it looks like he'll get something 5+. Which, I suppose, isn't the worst thing.

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06-27-2012, 03:45 PM
  #892
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Originally Posted by Rocket of Russia View Post
It really is a shame the year the market looks to be the one of the thinnest is the market in which the Penguins seem to be targeting. Meanwhile in 2013 there’s:

Iginla, Elias, Perry, Getzlaf, Ribeiro, McDonald, Lupul, Timonen, Visnovsky, Streit, Hartnell, Fisher, Streit, Roy, Zidlicky, Horton, Zajac, Koivu, Enstrom, Cullen, Ryder, Scuderi, Zubrus, Edler, Vlasic, Weiss, Filpulla, Clarkson, Brouwer, Smid, Burrows, Hejduk…
I hate when people say things like this. Every year it's the same thing, then people start getting signed and then it's "OMG it's a weak FA class this year, wait till next year" all over again.

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06-27-2012, 03:47 PM
  #893
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocket of Russia View Post
It really is a shame the year the market looks to be the one of the thinnest is the market in which the Penguins seem to be targeting. Meanwhile in 2013 there’s:

Iginla, Elias, Perry, Getzlaf, Ribeiro, McDonald, Lupul, Timonen, Visnovsky, Streit, Hartnell, Fisher, Streit, Roy, Zidlicky, Horton, Zajac, Koivu, Enstrom, Cullen, Ryder, Scuderi, Zubrus, Edler, Vlasic, Weiss, Filpulla, Clarkson, Brouwer, Smid, Burrows, Hejduk…
Sure there's some quality players in there. But it's not like Parise or Suter wouldn't be headlining that list either - it just means they'd have some company up there. I also doubt their price would be any different. You might see guys like Burrows or Ryder get more when they are leading a weak FA class, but it really means nothing to the elite players. All the competitive teams will ask that they take a slight discount (say 6.5-7.5m over 8m). Which is fine if the player is looking to win a cup. Hard to surround a player when you can't afford linemates.

That FA class is also another reason why I'd be focused on Suter this summer, while finding fill in's, and then looking at some of the quality FA wingers next year - Iggy, Perry, Lupul, Horton, Ryder, Clarkson, Burrows, etc. Of which only Perry would command the 7m mark. The rest would likely be 4-5.5m.

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Old
06-27-2012, 03:47 PM
  #894
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Originally Posted by Dr Frasier Crane View Post
I have interest in both players; just probably won't like their contracts. I was thinking we could get Carle on a 3-year deal, but it looks like he'll get something 5+. Which, I suppose, isn't the worst thing.
My question is, are both of them an upgrade over Martin to be getting paid more than him and if so, how much of an upgrade are they? I would prefer Garrison over Carle, but I heard he might get close to $6M on the market!

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Old
06-27-2012, 03:54 PM
  #895
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Any interest in Garrison or Carle?
Both a little bit more offensively inclined than Martin but worse defensively at around the same price. No thanks.

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06-27-2012, 03:54 PM
  #896
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Originally Posted by Shady Machine View Post
If I'm Shero, I call Parise first and give him 10 years 7.5 mil (maybe 8). Then my next call is Suter 10 years 7 mil.

On second thought, while it sounds really fun, I really don't envy Shero's position. He's a smart guy so I'm sure he doesn't panic like I would, but damn would I be tempted to overpay.
This is why you have two cellphones and say,

"Hello Sir (this way you don't have to say one name, or the other), I'm just calling to offer you 10 years at 7 million, lets make a deal!"

Two birds, one stone.

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06-27-2012, 03:56 PM
  #897
Ugene Malkin
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This is why you have two cellphones and say,

"Hello Sir (this way you don't have to say one name, or the other), I'm just calling to offer you 10 years at 7 million, lets make a deal!"

Two birds, one stone.
They work multiple phones on July 1st.

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06-27-2012, 04:02 PM
  #898
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I guess that the playermanagement hast several phones too. So here's my guess, how it goes:

Option A: Playermanagement calls GM, asks for a specivic term - deal or no deal. If that means no deal, see option B.

Option B: The PM waits like 30 min till he can be sure that everybody has made their bids. If he likes a place more than another, he might call them to ask for an improved offer, if the answer is no, he swichtces to another team and gets a deal done.

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06-27-2012, 04:12 PM
  #899
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Could this week take any longer?

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06-27-2012, 04:14 PM
  #900
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
So with Wideman signing for $5.25 per for five years, does it make you wonder if we pulled the trigger on Michalek too soon and could have gotten quite a bit more?
Wideman, as atrocious as he is in critical situations and in his own end in general, has the numbers and is coming off a big year. Michalek is coming off a horrendous year by his standards, capped off by brutal play in the playoffs.

Either we had to bite the bullet and hope he ups his value next year, or we had to make a quick decision on Michalek. With our depth, I think we chose the right path.

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