HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Who is the best 3C now that J Staal is a 2C?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-26-2012, 12:54 PM
  #101
YogiCanucks
Registered User
 
YogiCanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Vancouver BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,631
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hell Zeon View Post
Henrique AINEC
LOL! No.

Isn't Henrique already 1C in NJ?

also.. best first response to thread I've seen in a while.

YogiCanucks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 12:57 PM
  #102
Dylonus
Registered User
 
Dylonus's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 10,781
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by eklunds source View Post
Staal had more even strength ice time per game than Crosby. Meaning, that accounts for players missing time, by dividing their total even strength ice time by their total games played.

Now, let's assume that's because they eased Crosby back into the lineup. How does that explain Staal getting more ESTOI than James Neal?

How about the last season where Malkin, Crosby, and Staal were all healthy?

In '09-'10, Crosby played 81 games, Malkin 67, and Staal all 82. That's close enough.

Here's the Penguins forwards for that year, arranged by average TOI/g at even strength:
1) Crosby, 16:03/game
2) Malkin, 15:38/game
3) Staal, 14:08/game
4) Kunitz, 13:54/game
5) Guerin, 13:06/game
6) Fedotenko, 12:55/game

It seems to me that if a player is top-3 among all forwards on his team for ice time, he's not really a 3rd liner. Hey, that's just me and numbers though, maybe you have a different idea.
I'm not sure why I have to explain this - but okay.

Crosby was finally coming back from the most severe injury in sports. Did you expect Pittsburgh to rush him back into the line-up? Plus why is Staal getting slightly more ES time than Neal such a big deal? I'm missing the point you're trying to make here.

And the last season you're referring to... Staal is 3rd among the centers. He does not get PP time... they do. They lose time off of ES so they're ready for the PP. Instead of the PP, Staal gets put on the PK for that time.

Not sure why that had to be explained, but there it is.

Dylonus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 01:16 PM
  #103
SMantzas
Swoon
 
SMantzas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Henrique AINEC

SMantzas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 01:31 PM
  #104
domaug*
Flahr Pahr
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Archbald, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 5,123
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMantzas View Post
Henrique AINEC
this is asking for the best 3C, not someone playing 1/2C who started as a 3C.

i'd probably say O'Reilly, Bolland, or Sutter.

domaug* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 01:35 PM
  #105
Ed Wood
Registered User
 
Ed Wood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,147
vCash: 500
One of the Colorado guys for sure, probably Ryan O'Reilly. I don't think he's been mentioned yet but Shawn Horcoff is a pretty decent, albeit overpaid, third liner.

Ed Wood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 02:56 PM
  #106
WarriorofTime
Registered User
 
WarriorofTime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 12,114
vCash: 500
Why is Horcoff being mentioned? He is the face of the Oilers futility in my eyes. Team Captain with huge salary, tons of ice time, playing in all situations, asked to shut down the other team's best players..... and has failed miserable doing so. -23 last year, easily the worst on Edmonton.

WarriorofTime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 03:04 PM
  #107
SkiesOfArcadia
Legends
 
SkiesOfArcadia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The Shark Tank
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,892
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by billybudd View Post
Agreed and that's a shame.


I'd say Couturier, if left as a 3C (which he shouldn't be) will be the best at that role by a fair margin very quickly.
Does this mean he'll join Couture since similar names?

SkiesOfArcadia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 03:07 PM
  #108
Crabovski*
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 742
vCash: 500
Last season Bolland, Boyle, Carter/Richards
Brayden Schenn/Couturier or Johansson(Now that the caps have Riberio) for next season

how the **** did I forget O'rielly FFS I know people who know him IRL


Last edited by Crabovski*: 06-26-2012 at 03:46 PM.
Crabovski* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 03:32 PM
  #109
Holocene
Registered User
 
Holocene's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Toms River, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 8,421
vCash: 500
Dave Bolland is a perfect 3C.

Holocene is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 04:04 PM
  #110
ponder
Registered User
 
ponder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,064
vCash: 500
Lots of good options, but I'll go with Colorado's 3C. I expect Duchene to have a bounce back year, Stastny is consistently very good, and ROR seems to have really broken out last year. You're looking at 3 guys who, when they're playing well, are anywhere from high end #2 Cs to decent #1 Cs, that's pretty excellent. In terms of offensive output, Duchene put up 67 in 2010/11 (as a 19 year old), Stastny has put up over 70 in 3 of his 6 seasons (53 last year), and ROR put up 55 last year, these are 3 guys with the ability to really produce, and all play strong 2-way games too.

SJ could have the best 3C if they wanted to play it like that, as Thornton, Couture and Pavelski are all excellent centers, and Marleau has actually played plenty of center throughout his career as well. They seem to like plays Marleau and Pavelski on the wings, though, I think it's more likely that Handzus will be the 3C, and he's not really in the conversation. Pavelski should still take plenty of faceoffs though, cause he's a stud faceoff man.

If Colorado can finally stay healthy and have a year where they really gel and develop chemistry, I expect them to be pretty good. Young team that's starting to come into its own, very good center rotation, plenty of good wingers (Landeskog, Mueller, Hejduk, Jones, Downie, McGinn, etc.), decent dmen (EJ, Hejda, Elliott, Barrie, O'Byrne, SOB, Wilson, etc.), and a pretty damn talented young goalie in Varlamov. Could use 1 more strong 2 way dman, but otherwise I like how their team is coming together, just need to stay healthy and develop chemistry.


Last edited by ponder: 06-26-2012 at 04:15 PM.
ponder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 04:43 PM
  #111
Parise9Crosby87
Registered User
 
Parise9Crosby87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: boca raton florida
Country: United States
Posts: 2,573
vCash: 500
sean coutuier or oreiley

Parise9Crosby87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 05:00 PM
  #112
SMantzas
Swoon
 
SMantzas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parise9Crosby87 View Post
sean coutuier or oreiley
How is Couturier better than Henrique, Elias or Zajac?

SMantzas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 05:02 PM
  #113
Homegrown Kings
Registered User
 
Homegrown Kings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: PNW
Country: United States
Posts: 2,676
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMantzas View Post
How is Couturier better than Henrique, Elias or Zajac?
Those guys are third liners?

Homegrown Kings is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 05:36 PM
  #114
ImNotPoorImPoirier
Registered User
 
ImNotPoorImPoirier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Victoria BC
Posts: 804
vCash: 50
Well seing Roberio is in wash its either him or Johnsson would be the best 3rd line center or hell Brooks Liach

ImNotPoorImPoirier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 06:23 PM
  #115
SMantzas
Swoon
 
SMantzas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fan Of Every Anton View Post
Those guys are third liners?
One of them has to be. They are our top 3 centers

SMantzas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 07:47 PM
  #116
Crabovski*
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 742
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMantzas View Post
One of them has to be. They are our top 3 centers
Pretty sure Josefson plays 3C for you guys and Elias (sometimes Henrique) moves to wing..

Crabovski* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 08:08 PM
  #117
Subnordi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: New Brunswick
Country: Canada
Posts: 271
vCash: 500
PK Subban

Subnordi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-26-2012, 08:54 PM
  #118
Saaltr
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 57
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subnordi View Post
PK Subban
holy **** your funny

Saaltr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 06:09 AM
  #119
Ilkka Pikachu
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: Portugal
Posts: 4,350
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by YogiCanucks View Post
LOL! No.

Isn't Henrique already 1C in NJ?

also.. best first response to thread I've seen in a while.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabovski View Post
Pretty sure Josefson plays 3C for you guys and Elias (sometimes Henrique) moves to wing..
Quote:
Originally Posted by psupens View Post
this is asking for the best 3C, not someone playing 1/2C who started as a 3C.

i'd probably say O'Reilly, Bolland, or Sutter.
Let's not start adapting and work on pure centers here:

Parise-Zajac-Zubrus
Sykora-Elias-Kovalchuk
Tedenby/Ponikarovsky-Henrique-Clarkson
Carter-Josefson-Bernier

u wot m8

Ilkka Pikachu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 06:59 AM
  #120
phillyflyerfan1992
@ahthorne
 
phillyflyerfan1992's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Vancover Island
Country: Canada
Posts: 363
vCash: 500
Henrique, Couturier, Bolland, Stoll, Kelly, B. Sutter, and Boyle are all solid. Darkhorses include Zack Smith, Kyle Brodziak, whoever Buffalo throws as 3rd line C (Roy? Hodgson? Ennis? Grigorenko? ), whoever Washington throws on the 3rd line (Laich/Johansson?), and whoever is Colorado's 3rd line C.

Lots of good centers in the league nowadays. Hard to believe some teams only have 1 or 2 decent ones when the Penguins, Flyers, Kings, Bruins, etc. all have 3+ studs down the middle.

phillyflyerfan1992 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 07:02 AM
  #121
Paxon
⚔Z E M G U S⚔
 
Paxon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: corfu, ny
Country: United States
Posts: 22,827
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to Paxon
Quote:
Originally Posted by eklunds source View Post
Staal had more even strength ice time per game than Crosby. Meaning, that accounts for players missing time, by dividing their total even strength ice time by their total games played.

Now, let's assume that's because they eased Crosby back into the lineup. How does that explain Staal getting more ESTOI than James Neal?

How about the last season where Malkin, Crosby, and Staal were all healthy?

In '09-'10, Crosby played 81 games, Malkin 67, and Staal all 82. That's close enough.

Here's the Penguins forwards for that year, arranged by average TOI/g at even strength:
1) Crosby, 16:03/game
2) Malkin, 15:38/game
3) Staal, 14:08/game
4) Kunitz, 13:54/game
5) Guerin, 13:06/game
6) Fedotenko, 12:55/game

It seems to me that if a player is top-3 among all forwards on his team for ice time, he's not really a 3rd liner. Hey, that's just me and numbers though, maybe you have a different idea.

For comparison, here's the top-3 ESTOI/g forwards from other teams that year:

Chicago - Toews, Kane, Hossa
Vancouver - Sedin, Sedin, Kesler
Philadelphia - Richards, Carter, Gagne
Boston - Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen
Washington - Ovechkin, Backstrom, Semin
San Jose - Heatley, Thornton, Marleau

Yep, chock full of 3rd liners..
I can't help but notice he is... 3rd in ice time among centers. Making him the 3rd center. Making him the 3rd line center.

The definitions being used in this thread are pretty much useless. I see someone argue that Player X can't be a shutdown center because of his ice time. That makes literally no sense.

This thread should be clearer whether it means "shutdown/defensive center", "3rd center on a team", or "3rd line center by common role definition"

For best shutdown center I think I'll go with Bolland.

For best center who is the 3rd center on his team, I'll go with O'Reilly.

Paxon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 07:09 AM
  #122
Ivan13
Avs/Habs fan
 
Ivan13's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Zagreb
Country: Croatia
Posts: 13,874
vCash: 0
If O'Reilly is considered to be a 3rd line center it's him and not Dave Bolland.

Ivan13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 07:20 AM
  #123
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
 
Ogrezilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 37,882
vCash: 500
It's whichever of Colorado's three guys end up on the 3rd line.

Ogrezilla is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 09:25 AM
  #124
Toastman
Registered User
 
Toastman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,061
vCash: 500
Scott Gomez

Toastman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-27-2012, 09:37 AM
  #125
SteelFish87*
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 4,279
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by drewskiv View Post
Well seing Roberio is in wash its either him or Johnsson would be the best 3rd line center or hell Brooks Liach
best on the caps? wrong thread

SteelFish87* is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:58 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.