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Parenteau & Garrison- Habs

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06-26-2012, 04:43 PM
  #1
habs03
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Parenteau & Garrison- Habs

What do you think of Habs signing Parenteau and Garrison on July 1st

Parenteau 4 years at 18M- 4.5M cap hit

Garrison 3 years 15M- 5 M cap hit

July 1st pricing

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole

Bourque-Plekanec-Parenteau

Moen-Eller-Gionta

IMO that is a strong top 9, possible another strong top 9 LW, and bump Bourque to the 3rd line, and Moen to the 4th.

On D

Markov-Gorges

Garrison-Subban

Kaberle-Emelin

Daiz/Weber

MTL would have the cap tone of cap space just in case you think they can't afford it, even with Price and Subban re-signed.

Garrison provides a good stay at home d-men, perfect pairing for Subban, his offensive numbers aren't really needed, but the guy can play 20 plus mintues in a shutdown role.

Parenteau would not only help MTL offense, but would be huge in shootouts, MTL had a bad record this year in them, only guy that was scoring was Gionta, and with Parenteau signed that would give MTL 3 good shootout guys in Parenteau, Gionta, and Bourque who is good in them also.

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06-26-2012, 04:46 PM
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N o o d l e s
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Not bad if you can swing those two deals for that amount. 5 mil seems really high for Garrison, but the consensus is that that's what it will take. He'd look nice on the PP next to Subban.

Parenteau probably won't be worth 4.5 mil in the long run, but the Habs need goal scorers. I don't know how much longer you can rely on Cole to score 30 g. With him your top 6 isn't quite there yet, but it's better.

Trying to put my self in the shoes of a Habs fan, I wouldn't be too pissed if you were able to make those deals work.

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06-26-2012, 04:52 PM
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habs03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N O O D L E S View Post
Not bad if you can swing those two deals for that amount. 5 mil seems really high for Garrison, but the consensus is that that's what it will take. He'd look nice on the PP next to Subban.

Parenteau probably won't be worth 4.5 mil in the long run, but the Habs need goal scorers. I don't know how much longer you can rely on Cole to score 30 g. With him your top 6 isn't quite there yet, but it's better.

Trying to put my self in the shoes of a Habs fan, I wouldn't be too pissed if you were able to make those deals work.
I think MTL would be ok with 5M for Garrison on a 3 year deal, we got some D-men that should be ready for top mintues in about 3 years, so that's my logic for giving him a bit more money on a shorter team.

As for Parenteau, I think with the lack of top talent, MTL would kinda create 3 scoring lines that can all score rather than a the classic top 6, for example, Gionta who is a 25-30 goal scorer would kinda be on the "3rd line" on paper atleast.

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06-26-2012, 04:55 PM
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Don't want either.

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06-26-2012, 04:56 PM
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a 2nd line LW and a 3rd line winger would be a must for that team.

I assume when every one is resigned they'll have +/- 10M cap space with 2-3 open spot and their Defense is pretty much set

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06-26-2012, 04:57 PM
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Habs fan here, and I wouldn't want the Habs to sign Garrison at 5 mill per.

He's a good defenseman however I'd rather stick with our current defensive core.
Don't want Garrison at 5 mill taking up a future spot of Beaulieu, Tinordi or Ellis.

As for Parenteau... he scares me. I have this feeling of "Bust" with him.

I mean he's a playmaking winger more than a goal scoring winger.
He's a good player and all, but he lacks size.

I don't see a second line consisting of Gionta - Plecs - Parenteau. Too small.
And there is no way I see Gionta playing on the 3rd line behind Bourque.

All these people saying Gionta will or should play on the 3rd line and Bourque oon the second are either stupid or insane.

There are some defenseman out there that can be had for less.
Shultz for example.

And I rather see the Habs sign someone with size to play on our second alongside Plecs and Gio or get someone with super talent such as Parise... but that's a pipe dream.

But don't get me wrong... if Gionta or Plecs had size, then I would have no problem with them signing Parenteau.

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06-26-2012, 05:00 PM
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Parenteau is not a goal scorer, his strong suit is his playmaking ability. He's one of those types that'll give you maybe 15-20 goals depending on his ice time, but the majority of his points are on assists. He's good on the PP. He's used to playing with finishers (Moulson and Tavares) so if the Habs get him, it would be wise to put him on a line with some guys who can bury the biscuit.

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06-26-2012, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahleezer View Post
Habs fan here, and I wouldn't want the Habs to sign Garrison at 5 mill per.

He's a good defenseman however I'd rather stick with our current defensive core.
Don't want Garrison at 5 mill taking up a future spot of Beaulieu, Tinordi or Ellis.

As for Parenteau... he scares me. I have this feeling of "Bust" with him.

I mean he's a playmaking winger more than a goeal scoring winger.
He's a good player and all but he lacks size.

I don't see a second line consisting of Gionta - Plecs - Parenteau. Too small.
And there is no way I see Gionta playing on the 3rd line behind Bourque.

All these people saying Gionta will or should play on the 3rd line are insane.

There are some defenseman out there that can be had for less.
Shultz for example.

And I rather see the Habs sign someone with size to play on our second alongside Plecs and Gio or get someone with super talent such as Parise... but that's a pipe dream.

But don't get me wrong... if Gionta or Plecs had size, then I would have no problem with them signing Parenteau.
First that in regards to Garrison, I stated that it would be for no longer than 3 years, that gives time for Tinrodi to be ready to replace him, stay at home d-men take time to be top 4 guys, and Bealieau should be ready in about about 2 years, in time to replace Kaberle when his contract is up at the same time. So I don't see how that signings effects our D-men that are coming up, IMO it actually sets them up better, no need to rush them.

In regards to PA, I don't think he is small, 6' around 197, throws his weight around a bit, works the boards, had about 100 hits last season.

In regards to Gionta on the 3rd line, the reason for that is becasue Gionta and PA are both RW, they can't be put on the same line, so one would go on the 2nd line the other on the 3rd line, you can change them, but I'm just giving out examples.

IMO Pleck can shot an pass, and bourque is a shooter, so PA who is a player maker would hit perfect, as oppossed to a shoot first Gionta, would be good with the a player maker like Eller.

would you have size on every line, Patches and Cole with DD
Bourqu-Plek- PA average at around 6' 200
Moen and Eller size with the small Gionta.

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06-26-2012, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PWJunior View Post
Parenteau is not a goal scorer, his strong suit is his playmaking ability. He's one of those types that'll give you maybe 15-20 goals depending on his ice time, but the majority of his points are on assists. He's good on the PP. He's used to playing with finishers (Moulson and Tavares) so if the Habs get him, it would be wise to put him on a line with some guys who can bury the biscuit.
Exactly, Plek can score, and Bourque has a good shot. Our PP was horrible last year, and also a key thing he brings is he is good in shootouts.

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06-26-2012, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
Exactly, Plek can score, and Bourque has a good shot. Our PP was horrible last year, and also a key thing he brings is he is good in shootouts.
Haha, forgot about his SO ability. Yes, he's pretty money in the SO. He's not automatic like Frans Nielsen (with his ONE move), but he was far and away the 2nd best on the team in that regard.

I'm sad to see Parenteau go from the Isles (it's inevitable), but I wish him well. Yes, he does have flaws and he's not sexy... but the guy busts his nuggets and you'll never question his compete level. Expecting him to grind in the corners and you'll be very disappointed. Give him some time and space paired with guys who can finish, then he can be extremely useful.

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06-26-2012, 05:15 PM
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Parenteau probably won't score the same points elsewhere unless he has good team-mates. Paying him $4.5m is risky.

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06-26-2012, 05:17 PM
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That may actually net you both (maybe a bit more for Parenteau), but I don't think that's where the Montreal Canadiens should be going.

They should try the Ottawa route, and they did a good job of that at this past draft.

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06-26-2012, 06:15 PM
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Wow, I never noticed how terrible the Habs offence is, now I see why you desperately needed Gally.

You guys have one mediocre Top line player on your team (Patches), that's like 2 2nd lines and 2 4th lines.

Signing Parenteau would help you guys out a lot, and Garrison would bring some more goal scoring from the blue line.

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06-26-2012, 06:16 PM
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5 million for garrison im still shocked to see those two statements in the same sentence. He is a good undervalued defensemen but not that good.

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06-26-2012, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FishManSam View Post
Wow, I never noticed how terrible the Habs offence is, now I see why you desperately needed Gally.

You guys have one mediocre Top line player on your team (Patches), that's like 2 2nd lines and 2 4th lines.

Signing Parenteau would help you guys out a lot, and Garrison would bring some more goal scoring from the blue line.
didn't know pacioretty with his 33 goals as as a 23 year old and Coles 35 goals - both in the top 15 in a league of 600+ players was mediocre. good to know. thanks for the insight

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06-26-2012, 06:46 PM
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Pass, rather go after short term veteran help and continue amassing high quality prospects. Neither player has proven much long-term and were in pretty favourable positions with their teams. The proposed band-aid approach is very much in line with the Gainey-Gauthier era thinking and isn't conducive to long term success.

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06-26-2012, 06:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
What do you think of Habs signing Parenteau and Garrison on July 1st

Parenteau 4 years at 18M- 4.5M cap hit

Garrison 3 years 15M- 5 M cap hit

July 1st pricing

Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole

Bourque-Plekanec-Parenteau

Moen-Eller-Gionta

IMO that is a strong top 9, possible another strong top 9 LW, and bump Bourque to the 3rd line, and Moen to the 4th.

On D

Markov-Gorges

Garrison-Subban

Kaberle-Emelin

Daiz/Weber

MTL would have the cap tone of cap space just in case you think they can't afford it, even with Price and Subban re-signed.

Garrison provides a good stay at home d-men, perfect pairing for Subban, his offensive numbers aren't really needed, but the guy can play 20 plus mintues in a shutdown role.

Parenteau would not only help MTL offense, but would be huge in shootouts, MTL had a bad record this year in them, only guy that was scoring was Gionta, and with Parenteau signed that would give MTL 3 good shootout guys in Parenteau, Gionta, and Bourque who is good in them also.
Sweet Jesus i hope we don't.

Garrison 3 years 15M- 5 M cap hit is a huge overpayment and
Parenteau 4 years at 18M- 4.5M cap hit.no

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06-26-2012, 07:06 PM
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I like the idea of getting Parenteau for 4.5 a year. That sounds fair for his level of production combined with the fact he's an UFA, so he's going to command a degree of overpayment.

My only issue with Parenteau is that we need snipers more than we need playmakers, imo. So he wouldn't be my first choice - my first choice would probably be Semin. But if Semin fell through, Parenteau would probably be my next option.


As for Garrison, that's a bit rich for him, and we need shutdown D more than offensive D, imo. We already have Subban, Markov, Kaberle, Diaz, and Weber. I'd like to add some real sandpaper to that D moreso than another offensive defenseman.

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06-26-2012, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habs03 View Post
First that in regards to Garrison, I stated that it would be for no longer than 3 years, that gives time for Tinrodi to be ready to replace him, stay at home d-men take time to be top 4 guys, and Bealieau should be ready in about about 2 years, in time to replace Kaberle when his contract is up at the same time. So I don't see how that signings effects our D-men that are coming up, IMO it actually sets them up better, no need to rush them.

In regards to PA, I don't think he is small, 6' around 197, throws his weight around a bit, works the boards, had about 100 hits last season.

In regards to Gionta on the 3rd line, the reason for that is becasue Gionta and PA are both RW, they can't be put on the same line, so one would go on the 2nd line the other on the 3rd line, you can change them, but I'm just giving out examples.

IMO Pleck can shot an pass, and bourque is a shooter, so PA who is a player maker would hit perfect, as oppossed to a shoot first Gionta, would be good with the a player maker like Eller.

would you have size on every line, Patches and Cole with DD
Bourqu-Plek- PA average at around 6' 200
Moen and Eller size with the small Gionta.
As A Habs fan I really like this, good solid guys. Who will fill spots. The young guys can take there time, be worked in during injuries. The only problem I can think of, is most players want long contracts now a days. During a free agent frenzy these 2 may be offered them. Go Habs GO.

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06-26-2012, 10:47 PM
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PWJunior
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It has been rumored that Parenteau is looking for 6 years at $4M+. Ouch. It does make sense considering there were some reports that money was not the issue, it was all about the term.

He's not getting 6 years IMO, but that's negotiation. You have to shoot for the moon in your initial proposal.

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06-26-2012, 11:06 PM
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They sound like relatively "fair" contract values anyway (at least, given the projected UFA market).

But I don't know... I wouldn't have these as the first two contract choices on my list, anyway. Parenteau is risky. Garrison less so IMHO, but at the same time he may command 4-5 years as well.

Then again, the Habs do have clear need of a top-6 forward and top-4 d-man. Beggars may not be able to be too choosy here, and the options are few. I would like to get a short-term guy in the top-6 forward slot if there isn't a clear alternative (short term deals to risky guys like Latendresse, Kostitsyn, etc would be more interesting to me than a great big contract to a risky guy like Parenteau). On D, I'd like a stay-at-home banger most of all. Not much to look at there either... Bryan Allen, maybe.

At the same time, if you told me we were going to deep-six the Bourque and Kaberle contracts somehow, then that's maybe enough high-salary risk removed to make it acceptable to bring in more - but on better players. Not that the Habs need the cap space... they could afford to just sign Parenteau and Garrison to those contracts without subtracting. Just saying I'd feel like it would be preferable from an overall roster management perspective to go at it that way.

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06-26-2012, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PWJunior View Post
It has been rumored that Parenteau is looking for 6 years at $4M+. Ouch. It does make sense considering there were some reports that money was not the issue, it was all about the term.

He's not getting 6 years IMO, but that's negotiation. You have to shoot for the moon in your initial proposal.
IMO the Habs really can't go more than 4 years on PA, and 3 years for Garrison, for the simply reason that we have some prospect coming up on RW, and on D. That is why I figured it would take more money and less years to sign a guy like Garrison.

I actually see Garrison getting a 4-5 year deal for less money, but I don't think MTL would want it that long, so hence a the higher cap hit.

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06-26-2012, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
They sound like relatively "fair" contract values anyway (at least, given the projected UFA market).

But I don't know... I wouldn't have these as the first two contract choices on my list, anyway. Parenteau is risky. Garrison less so IMHO, but at the same time he may command 4-5 years as well.

Then again, the Habs do have clear need of a top-6 forward and top-4 d-man. Beggars may not be able to be too choosy here, and the options are few. I would like to get a short-term guy in the top-6 forward slot if there isn't a clear alternative (short term deals to risky guys like Latendresse, Kostitsyn, etc would be more interesting to me than a great big contract to a risky guy like Parenteau). On D, I'd like a stay-at-home banger most of all. Not much to look at there either... Bryan Allen, maybe.

At the same time, if you told me we were going to deep-six the Bourque and Kaberle contracts somehow, then that's maybe enough high-salary risk removed to make it acceptable to bring in more - but on better players. Not that the Habs need the cap space... they could afford to just sign Parenteau and Garrison to those contracts without subtracting. Just saying I'd feel like it would be preferable from an overall roster management perspective to go at it that way.
Good points, I really like the Bryan Allen idea, but I just don't think he can play the mintues that Garrison can play, Garrison was playing 25+ minutes in the playoffs, and around 23 mintues in the regular season, really good shutdown D-men that would be perfect on the left side of Subban.


Last edited by habs03: 06-27-2012 at 12:06 AM.
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06-27-2012, 07:48 AM
  #24
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Parenteau probably won't score the same points elsewhere unless he has good team-mates. Paying him $4.5m is risky.
I don't think its that risky...of course he would score less with less ice time and lower quality linemates. But I think he would still be good for 55 points or so, which isn't a bad deal for $4.5M.

To me, it is a team that goes above $5-5.5M that would be taking a huge risk.

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06-27-2012, 07:56 AM
  #25
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Markov will be lucky if he manages to play half the season this year. Is there a more injury prone player in the league?

Getting another d should be a priority for Montreal, but I'm not sure whats out there on the free agent market that would really make sense.

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