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Trading Private (Bobby) Ryan? All Ryan Discussion Here. [Part IV]

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06-28-2012, 06:42 AM
  #301
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
Banking on prospects panning out is practically the only way to get a legit #1 center so it's kind of hard to argue with the man's reasoning.
This is true.

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06-28-2012, 06:55 AM
  #302
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Originally Posted by heartsabres View Post
Your GM has been listening to trade offers for 6 months now. It is apparent he is not getting the offers that he wants. He is a 30 goal scorer not jesus.
Wait, GM's don't listen to every trade offer they get for a player? News to me.

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06-28-2012, 07:04 AM
  #303
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Wait, GM's don't listen to every trade offer they get for a player? News to me.
What? This is exactly why Ryan is upset with the organization, this attitude, he is just their bargaining chip and he hates the uncertainty of his future. Trade me or don't trade me, make up your mind, the longer they keep waiting and listening to offers, the more pissed Ryan is gonna get. By this point the organization should've realized they aren't going to get the exact package they want.

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06-28-2012, 07:19 AM
  #304
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Originally Posted by ayshplaysh View Post
What? This is exactly why Ryan is upset with the organization, this attitude, he is just their bargaining chip and he hates the uncertainty of his future.
If it really was, it's idiotic beyond belief. The rumors make him uncomfortable. Well, it's part of his profession, so he needs to get over that, and maybe hang out on twitter a little less if confrontation with rumors bothers him too much. He can make rumors stop himself, by playing to a level that renders him untouchable, or earning an NTC on his next deal. Until then, reality will be for Ryan what it is for the vast majority of players in the league, and almost all players his age: rumors are part of the business.

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Originally Posted by ayshplaysh View Post
Trade me or don't trade me, make up your mind, the longer they keep waiting and listening to offers, the more pissed Ryan is gonna get.
Which is ridiculous. Ryan isn't being made aware of Anaheim listening to rumors by Anaheim. Every once in a while, he's made aware of rumors. That's two very different things, which can correlate, but don't have to. Also, he's in no different state than almost any other player in the league. GMs actually do listen to offers, even if there are no rumors out there.

If a player that doesn't like to hear rumors about him gets your GM to stop doing his job and listen to offers to make his team better, something is messed up in your organisation.

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06-28-2012, 07:26 AM
  #305
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Originally Posted by ayshplaysh View Post
What? This is exactly why Ryan is upset with the organization, this attitude, he is just their bargaining chip and he hates the uncertainty of his future. Trade me or don't trade me, make up your mind, the longer they keep waiting and listening to offers, the more pissed Ryan is gonna get. By this point the organization should've realized they aren't going to get the exact package they want.
What is wrong to listening to offers submitted to you for one of your players?

The reason Bobby is pissed is because of what has been said in the media that he's being shopped, available etc. There's a big difference between that, and listening to an offer someone submits for one of your players.

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06-28-2012, 07:27 AM
  #306
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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
Not a couple of prospect defensemen.
That's not an answer. What you won't accept has been made painfully clear: anything but a cheap quality scoring center coming off a good year or a blue-chip scoring center prospect.

What you would accept if that isn't available is the subject.

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06-28-2012, 07:36 AM
  #307
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Would it cost more to get Nash, or Ryan? Reading the proposals leads me to believe the former.

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06-28-2012, 07:37 AM
  #308
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
That's not an answer. What you won't accept has been made painfully clear: anything but a cheapquality scoring center coming off a good year or a blue-chip scoring center prospect.

What you would accept if that isn't available is the subject.
Hmm? You're adding a lot to the bill. I wouldn't call Colin Wilson getting benched in the playoffs coming off a good year. Yet, most Ducks fans are okay with him serving as the basis. Brayden Schenn had his share of injury setbacks this year, but you don't see us saying we won't take him if offered; relax Flyers fans, we know he hasn't.

When did 5.3 million or less become 'cheap'?

Also, if Sutter could be included in a deal where the principle trading piece had more leverage over his next destination than ours does, why wouldn't there be a destination with a center available?

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06-28-2012, 07:38 AM
  #309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
That's not an answer. What you won't accept has been made painfully clear: anything but a cheap quality scoring center coming off a good year or a blue-chip scoring center prospect.

What you would accept if that isn't available is the subject.
Actually, to give you the answer on what is the subject of your question correctly, I need to add that we don't only ask for that center you describe. It's just the center piece we need and apparently want.

To answer your question: basically the same thing with two great (rather) young players a notch below Ryan, one being a winger and one being a defenseman (who's not a one dimensional offensive guy), I suppose.

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06-28-2012, 07:42 AM
  #310
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Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Actually, to give you the answer on what is the subject of your question correctly, I need to add that we don't only ask for that center you describe. It's just the center piece we need and apparently want.

To answer your question: basically the same thing with two great (rather) young players a notch below Ryan, one being a winger and one being a defenseman (who's not a one dimensional offensive guy), I suppose.
It could even be a goaltender, I guess, if that's all that is available. I'm not sure how trading Ryan turned into us into beggars.

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06-28-2012, 07:55 AM
  #311
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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
It could even be a goaltender, I guess, if that's all that is available. I'm not sure how trading Ryan turned into us into beggars.
Trading Ryan will fetch Anahiem a very nice return. Your not beggars.

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06-28-2012, 07:56 AM
  #312
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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
It could even be a goaltender, I guess, if that's all that is available. I'm not sure how trading Ryan turned into us into beggars.
I certainly hasn't. I don't think we'll see him traded without that young center, but even without it, I think there could be a deal that still improves the team - I don't really see a chance for that with a goaltender in there. I really don't consider it likely, but I thought I'd just gave him his answer under that premise. It's not like that premise just starts turning into reality.

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06-28-2012, 07:59 AM
  #313
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Would something around Colin Wilson and Jon Blum work for Anaheim?

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06-28-2012, 08:02 AM
  #314
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Would something around Colin Wilson and Jon Blum work for Anaheim?
Yeah.

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06-28-2012, 08:03 AM
  #315
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Would something around Colin Wilson and Jon Blum work for Anaheim?
Personally, I'm not entirely sure, even though it's certainly not a bad fit, value and need-wise. Generally, fellow Ducks fans seem to like this better than most offers and are quite open to it.

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06-28-2012, 08:07 AM
  #316
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Personally, I'm not entirely sure, even though it's certainly not a bad fit, value and need-wise. Generally, fellow Ducks fans seem to like this better than most offers and are quite open to it.
I think it would be beneficial for both teams. Poile has always been a Bobby Ryan guy (well he likes most USA players) and guys like Colin Wilson and Jon Blum will be NHL starters (Wilson already is) and good ones at that. Wilson can be 50point + scorer and Blum can be a top 4 D starter with offensive ability. Bobby Ryan would give the Preds the kind of offensive talent we need on our top six and would maybe help persuade Suter to stay.

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06-28-2012, 08:17 AM
  #317
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Personally, I'm not entirely sure, even though it's certainly not a bad fit, value and need-wise.
If we end up moving Bobby, I don't think there's going to be any ideal situation. At some point you will have to take the good with the bad, and go with the option that's doing the most good. In any case, we're putting off our window for two to three years, while the new center carries inexperienced wingers through some teething pains.

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06-28-2012, 08:24 AM
  #318
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Would something around Colin Wilson and Jon Blum work for Anaheim?
This is very intriguing.

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06-28-2012, 08:31 AM
  #319
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Ok, with july 1st approaching, I have a few proposals to toss on the table:

Proposal 1 (after July 1st):

Resigned Roy (somwhere between 4((current)) and 5.5 (reasonable raise)
Andrej Sekera
Prospect/Pick

For:
Bobby Ryan

Roy will have already been extended at the time of the deal, no worries about you guys needing to sign him next year. He is your second line center, and is able to step in and play first line very well (can be a 1B option) in the event of a Getzlaf injury, proven to be a consistent producer, above average defensively, can shift to wing or be traded when Holland is ready to step in, in a year or two. Andrej Sekera. A defensemen that is very good in all situations. Can produce as a PMD quite well, and is even better as a defensive dman, depending on what the need is. Has also played wing in the NHL. Still very young, has improoved every year that he has played. Still not at his ceiling IMO.

Prospect/Pick....because you know, extra value, not giving a specific because I don't know the teams needs in the pipeline.



Proposal 2:
Tyler Ennis
Jordan Leopold
Prospect/Pick

For: Bobby Ryan

Tyler Ennis is an offensive sparkplug. He elevates the game of those playing around him. Just finished his second year in the league. Played mostly wing in the pros, but is a natural center. Was VERY impressive at center last year in his short stint at the position. Jordan Leopold is a very good vetran PMD. Fits in anywhere in the defensive lineup, and can be a minute mule in a pinch. Great guy to have around, especially come playoff time.

The prospect offered here would be along the lines of TJ brennan or Pysyk, a few of our better defensive prospects, as leopold is a FA after this year. They are both either NHL ready, or REALLY close. Which one would depend on your GM's view of Leopold.

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06-28-2012, 08:42 AM
  #320
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Originally Posted by HiddenInLight View Post
Ok, with july 1st approaching, I have a few proposals to toss on the table:

Proposal 1 (after July 1st):

Resigned Roy (somwhere between 4((current)) and 5.5 (reasonable raise)
Andrej Sekera
Prospect/Pick

For:
Bobby Ryan

Roy will have already been extended at the time of the deal, no worries about you guys needing to sign him next year. He is your second line center, and is able to step in and play first line very well (can be a 1B option) in the event of a Getzlaf injury, proven to be a consistent producer, above average defensively, can shift to wing or be traded when Holland is ready to step in, in a year or two. Andrej Sekera. A defensemen that is very good in all situations. Can produce as a PMD quite well, and is even better as a defensive dman, depending on what the need is. Has also played wing in the NHL. Still very young, has improoved every year that he has played. Still not at his ceiling IMO.

Prospect/Pick....because you know, extra value, not giving a specific because I don't know the teams needs in the pipeline.



Proposal 2:
Tyler Ennis
Jordan Leopold
Prospect/Pick

For: Bobby Ryan

Tyler Ennis is an offensive sparkplug. He elevates the game of those playing around him. Just finished his second year in the league. Played mostly wing in the pros, but is a natural center. Was VERY impressive at center last year in his short stint at the position. Jordan Leopold is a very good vetran PMD. Fits in anywhere in the defensive lineup, and can be a minute mule in a pinch. Great guy to have around, especially come playoff time.

The prospect offered here would be along the lines of TJ brennan or Pysyk, a few of our better defensive prospects, as leopold is a FA after this year. They are both either NHL ready, or REALLY close. Which one would depend on your GM's view of Leopold.
Any chance at Ennis instead of Sekera?

Roy extended
Ennis

I am just assuming Bob makes a run at a defender and signs one, which probably wont happen but if it did then we wouldnt have room for Sekera.

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06-28-2012, 08:44 AM
  #321
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Originally Posted by gliff View Post
Any chance at Ennis instead of Sekera?

Roy extended
Ennis

I am just assuming Bob makes a run at a defender and signs one, which probably wont happen but if it did then we wouldnt have room for Sekera.
I think for Roy AND Ennis you guys would have to add a bit.....If we trade both, our center depth is pretty shot for this season....would be currently Hodgeson, Leino, McCormick, Ellis......yikes.

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06-28-2012, 08:59 AM
  #322
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I think for Roy AND Ennis you guys would have to add a bit.....If we trade both, our center depth is pretty shot for this season....would be currently Hodgeson, Leino, McCormick, Ellis......yikes.
Well the only Forwards I am really interested in are Roy Hodgson and Ennis.... So ya that sucks lol

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06-28-2012, 09:05 AM
  #323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gliff View Post
Any chance at Ennis instead of Sekera?

Roy extended
Ennis

I am just assuming Bob makes a run at a defender and signs one, which probably wont happen but if it did then we wouldnt have room for Sekera.
The value is fair (at least with Roy's current deal having 1 year remaining) but I personally don't want to package Ennis for Ryan or another winger who isn't an absolute gamechanger. Don't mistake this for homerism as I don't believe Ennis has near Ryan's value or any such thing. Clearly proper value is Ennis+ for Ryan -- Ennis+Roy sounds about right objectively; I can't speak to the specific needs of Anaheim but I reckon it matches up well.

I view Ennis as part of a core of center depth that is now developing long-term with Girgorenko, Hodgson, and Girgensons (plus Sundher, Catenacci, blah blah). While he will ultimately end up back at wing if Grig+Hodg+Girg work out, we're looking at the center position potentially being a strength for the first time since Pat LaFontaine was playing. I'd prefer to roll the dice on Ennis becoming Briere-like in his development, big game ability, and ability to slide between wing and center as needed. That's not to say it'll happen but if it doesn't, he'll still be a good player. And frankly I just like the kid. I don't really want to move any of those first 3 either until they're on the team and we get a feel for how it all comes together.

Plenty of folks on our board are very willing to trade Ennis for Ryan and some prefer trading Hodgson for Ryan. I'd rather pass on the whole concept as I doubt what I'd be game for is anything near acceptable to Anaheim fans.

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06-28-2012, 09:08 AM
  #324
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The value is fair (at least with Roy's current deal having 1 year remaining) but I personally don't want to package Ennis for Ryan or another winger who isn't an absolute gamechanger. Don't mistake this for homerism as I don't believe Ennis has near Ryan's value or any such thing. Clearly proper value is Ennis+ for Ryan -- Ennis+Roy sounds about right objectively; I can't speak to the specific needs of Anaheim but I reckon it matches up well.

I view Ennis as part of a core of center depth that is now developing long-term with Girgorenko, Hodgson, and Girgensons (plus Sundher, Catenacci, blah blah). While he will ultimately end up back at wing if Grig+Hodg+Girg work out, we're looking at the center position potentially being a strength for the first time since Pat LaFontaine was playing. I'd prefer to roll the dice on Ennis becoming Briere-like in his development, big game ability, and ability to slide between wing and center as needed. That's not to say it'll happen but if it doesn't, he'll still be a good player. And frankly I just like the kid. I don't really want to move any of those first 3 either until they're on the team and we get a feel for how it all comes together.

Plenty of folks on our board are very willing to trade Ennis for Ryan and some prefer trading Hodgson for Ryan. I'd rather pass on the whole concept as I doubt what I'd be game for is anything near acceptable to Anaheim fans.
What are you expecting? What winger will you get in a trade that is better then Bobby right now? Nash? Is he that much better? Not worth the extra 3 mil a year.

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06-28-2012, 09:11 AM
  #325
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What are you expecting? What winger will you get in a trade that is better then Bobby right now? Nash? Is he that much better?
I don't think he's saying that any winger available is that gamechanger. I didn't find his statement to be unfair, at all, generally. Like him, most GMs will have some reservations about giving up what it would take to acquire Ryan, for one or another reason.

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