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Old
09-19-2012, 07:39 PM
  #601
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
Why is a 12.5% rollback in a 7% drop from the players? Just weird ****ing math... that's all.
Dude, are you serious?

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09-19-2012, 07:58 PM
  #602
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That entire article is nothing but propaganda trying to make it look like the players are somehow in the right here. They get a bigger slice of the revenues than in any of the other NA pro sports. The only thing I will ever agree with the players on this subject is that salary rollbacks are unacceptable. Retroactively changing the salary or term of a signed contract is simply wrong. Regarding everything else though, the players are out of touch with the real world.
The article is definitely slanted, but makes a couple of very valid points. No other sport has rushed to lock out their players the way the NHL has. The NFL is the strongest organization of the big 4, and has not had a single game cancelled due to a labour disagreement. They've continued to work through their negotiations and got the contract settled before games were missed. They understood the value of public opinion/fans and the amount of money they risked losing.

What advantage did the NHL have by locking players out as training camps were about to start? As a matter of fact, teams make money on pre-season games because they technically don't pay players during that period of time, so it's even more shortsighted to cancel these games.

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09-19-2012, 08:12 PM
  #603
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Luxury tax and everyone is happy.

edit: I want my pre lockout Flyers back
^^^ the amount of money they make on pre-season games must be minuscule. Around here (ottawa) they give the tickets out most of the time. 10-20$ if you pay. They still have to staff the arenas and **** so...


Last edited by Viller: 09-19-2012 at 08:18 PM.
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09-19-2012, 09:24 PM
  #604
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Luxury tax and everyone is happy.

edit: I want my pre lockout Flyers back
^^^ the amount of money they make on pre-season games must be minuscule. Around here (ottawa) they give the tickets out most of the time. 10-20$ if you pay. They still have to staff the arenas and **** so...
Never going to happen. The cap is here to stay and personally I like it that way.

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Old
09-19-2012, 11:42 PM
  #605
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Ovechkin inks KHL deal, won't rule out staying in Russia

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/...ss-league.html


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“As to the future, it will depend on what kind of conditions there will be in the NHL with the new CBA," Ovechkin told the Russian news agency RIA Novosti. "If our contracts get slashed, I will have to think whether to return there or not. I won’t rule out staying in the KHL, even past this season.

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09-19-2012, 11:50 PM
  #606
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
The article is definitely slanted, but makes a couple of very valid points. No other sport has rushed to lock out their players the way the NHL has. The NFL is the strongest organization of the big 4, and has not had a single game cancelled due to a labour disagreement. They've continued to work through their negotiations and got the contract settled before games were missed. They understood the value of public opinion/fans and the amount of money they risked losing.

What advantage did the NHL have by locking players out as training camps were about to start? As a matter of fact, teams make money on pre-season games because they technically don't pay players during that period of time, so it's even more shortsighted to cancel these games.
Part of the reason the NFL had no games lost was because their CBA ran out in March and the training camp/preseason started in August. The NHL's runs out in September and that's when training camp and preseason take place.

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He can't legally stay there since the KHL and NHL have a transfer agreement. If he stayed there illegally, he'd be ineligible for all international events

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Old
09-20-2012, 01:50 AM
  #607
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Won't happen. IIHF won't let him play in the Olympics, and that's what he wants the most.

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09-20-2012, 06:50 AM
  #608
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
He can't legally stay there since the KHL and NHL have a transfer agreement. If he stayed there illegally, he'd be ineligible for all international events
Isn't the agreement an informal one though? Like kind of just a handshake deal?

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09-20-2012, 08:12 AM
  #609
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Isn't the agreement an informal one though? Like kind of just a handshake deal?
No, there is an agreement between NHL and KHL to respect each others contracts, it was signed shortly after Radulov left Nashville for the KHL.

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09-20-2012, 08:29 AM
  #610
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Originally Posted by BringBackStevens View Post
Hockey players are paid what their skills demand. Period.
The "period" in this statement is very telling. You want that statement to stand alone. Unfortunately, it can't.

Player get paid according to the market that exists within the CBA.

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Old
09-20-2012, 09:07 AM
  #611
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He can't legally stay there since the KHL and NHL have a transfer agreement. If he stayed there illegally, he'd be ineligible for all international events
I'm not 100 percent certain, but one of the active posters (Mods?) over in the business thread suggested that neither Canadian nor American labor law would allow the NHL to force him back--that, in essence, the lockout provides the player the right to seek employment elsewhere and prohibits the employer from either punishing him for work after or forcing him to leave his (new) job.

Again, I have no idea if it is true, but it does sound plausible, and if that's the case, I don't believe the IIHF would interfere.

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09-20-2012, 01:27 PM
  #612
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alex is such a cry baby, this is an example of what these players are, greedy and care nothing about hockey, he's the one letting down the fans, the organization.

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09-20-2012, 01:31 PM
  #613
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
alex is such a cry baby, this is an example of what these players are, greedy and care nothing about hockey, he's the one letting down the fans, the organization.
Right. These people who have dedicated their lives to playing hockey don't care about hockey, that makes perfect sense.

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09-20-2012, 01:35 PM
  #614
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
alex is such a cry baby, this is an example of what these players are, greedy and care nothing about hockey, he's the one letting down the fans, the organization.
This is likely nothing more than posturing for the media. There is no way in hell he's going to walk away from $70 million or whatever it is.

However, if he does choose to stay in the KHL, he is definitely letting down the fans. The organization, however, has told him and his teammates that they're not allowed to play right now. While I would normally say he needs to fulfill the terms of the contract he signed with the Caps or he's a dick, if this lockout lasts the entire year, he'll have received no money and yet had one year of his agreed upon deal tick off the clock. If the Caps/NHL don't have to fulfill their end of the contract, why should he?

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09-20-2012, 01:49 PM
  #615
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stay classy Bettman and the NHL.

Scott Burnside ‏@ESPN_Burnside
Disgraceful to see NHL gouging it's own employees; 20% pay cut, forced four-day work week. Know how hard they work. Way to have their backs.

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but hey we can just blame the players for this too right?

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Originally Posted by Fish Invictus View Post
Right. These people who have dedicated their lives to playing hockey don't care about hockey, that makes perfect sense.
remember, AO is soft eurotrash.

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Old
09-20-2012, 02:04 PM
  #616
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If you like your job that means you should do it for a lot less money, right?

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09-20-2012, 02:14 PM
  #617
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People need to learn some basic economics before speaking on this issue.

Nothing wrong with the owners calling for a reduction of wages during a work stoppage.

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Old
09-20-2012, 02:25 PM
  #618
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Originally Posted by DownieFaceSoftener View Post
People need to learn some basic economics before speaking on this issue.

Nothing wrong with the owners calling for a reduction of wages during a work stoppage.
of course but at the same time nobody should be shocked by sharp critisism friom the NHLPA for asking them to take a paycut.
what they make is irrelevant. asking them to take a paycut. many of those contracts just signed days to just a few short months ago isnt going to met well with the NHLPA.
What if the NHLPA asked the owners to cut ticket prices, concessions, ect ect by 24 percent. How would that be met by the owners? I would be willing to bet that Bettman and the owners probably wouldnt like it.
I know its an unlikely request from the NHLPA but its the point.

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09-20-2012, 02:27 PM
  #619
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
alex is such a cry baby, this is an example of what these players are, greedy and care nothing about hockey, he's the one letting down the fans, the organization.
I could care less of AO ever comes back.

I'm not slighting his personality at all, either. The NHL PR machine has moved on from AO being the poster boy.

There are more dominating players now. The NHL doesn't need AO like they did years back.

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09-20-2012, 02:30 PM
  #620
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there's so much hate in the fans with this sport, you dont want to understand the business of things, you just want to take out on the owners even if the owners did agree to the current cba and next 5 years, teams go bankrupt and there's no hockey and of course you will blame the owners again, because the players are taking all the money which that makes everything ok and they got money but the fans have no hockey.

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09-20-2012, 02:31 PM
  #621
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
there's so much hate in the fans with this sport, you dont want to understand the business of things, you just want to take out on the owners even if the owners did agree to the current cba and next 5 years, teams go bankrupt and there's no hockey and of course you will blame the owners again, because the players are taking all the money which that makes everything ok and they got money but the fans have no hockey.
The players aren't robbing the owners blind against their will. The owners are willingly giving players their contracts, using the system forced upon the players against their wishes by the owners.

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09-20-2012, 02:34 PM
  #622
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What if the NHLPA asked the owners to cut ticket prices, concessions, ect ect by 24 percent. How would that be met by the owners? I would be willing to bet that Bettman and the owners probably wouldnt like it.
I know its an unlikely request from the NHLPA but its the point.
I understand what you're saying, but the owners are okay with hammering out deals. It's what they do for a living. They came in low for a reason. It's all about tactics and establishing making profits. The NHLPA could demand that and the owners would deal with it as they would any other offer that confronts them in business.

Everything needs to stay the same (ticket prices, etc) and the players salaries to come down, in order for them to begin to earn respectable returns on their investments. They would simply point that out and not budge, which is exactly what they are doing now.

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09-20-2012, 02:55 PM
  #623
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Originally Posted by toughfighter83 View Post
there's so much hate in the fans with this sport, you dont want to understand the business of things, you just want to take out on the owners even if the owners did agree to the current cba and next 5 years, teams go bankrupt and there's no hockey and of course you will blame the owners again, because the players are taking all the money which that makes everything ok and they got money but the fans have no hockey.
Oh, but we do understand the business side. Some owners have been irresponsible and now want the players to take pay cuts to help save the owners from themselves.

League revenues are higher than they've ever been - and yet NHL owners continue to cry the blues. Perhaps if the league wasn't hell bent on putting teams in non-traditional (read: money losing) cities, they wouldn't be in this spot. I heard a stat the other day that Phoenix has lost $50 million in the last three years. Every one of those dollars has come out of the NHL's pocket. Any sane business person would have moved the team years ago. So whose fault is it that the NHL as a whole isn't making money (a stat I find hard to believe, by the way)?

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09-20-2012, 02:57 PM
  #624
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Oh, but we do understand the business side. Some owners have been irresponsible and now want the players to take pay cuts to help save the owners from themselves.

League revenues are higher than they've ever been - and yet NHL owners continue to cry the blues. Perhaps if the league wasn't hell bent on putting teams in non-traditional (read: money losing) cities, they wouldn't be in this spot. I heard a stat the other day that Phoenix has lost $50 million in the last three years. Every one of those dollars has come out of the NHL's pocket. Any sane business person would have moved the team years ago. So whose fault is it that the NHL as a whole isn't making money (a stat I find hard to believe, by the way)?
Duh, the Players!

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09-20-2012, 03:02 PM
  #625
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I'm not 100 percent certain, but one of the active posters (Mods?) over in the business thread suggested that neither Canadian nor American labor law would allow the NHL to force him back--that, in essence, the lockout provides the player the right to seek employment elsewhere and prohibits the employer from either punishing him for work after or forcing him to leave his (new) job.

Again, I have no idea if it is true, but it does sound plausible, and if that's the case, I don't believe the IIHF would interfere.
It would have to do with the transfer agreement both leagues have. Plus, Ovechkin loves playing for the national team. If he was to stay in russia, he would not be able to play in any international tournaments

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stay classy Bettman and the NHL.

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but hey we can just blame the players for this too right?



remember, AO is soft eurotrash.
NHL is trying to cut costs to save money and that's bad?

Also did the NHL workers work 5 day work weeks? If so, that 4 day workweek and 20% cut makes more sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
of course but at the same time nobody should be shocked by sharp critisism friom the NHLPA for asking them to take a paycut.
what they make is irrelevant. asking them to take a paycut. many of those contracts just signed days to just a few short months ago isnt going to met well with the NHLPA.
What if the NHLPA asked the owners to cut ticket prices, concessions, ect ect by 24 percent. How would that be met by the owners? I would be willing to bet that Bettman and the owners probably wouldnt like it.
I know its an unlikely request from the NHLPA but its the point.
the players would never ask the owners to cut ticket prices, concessions, or anything that makes the league money because they would end up getting even less money. Not an intelligent negotiating tactic, is it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Oh, but we do understand the business side. Some owners have been irresponsible and now want the players to take pay cuts to help save the owners from themselves.

League revenues are higher than they've ever been - and yet NHL owners continue to cry the blues. Perhaps if the league wasn't hell bent on putting teams in non-traditional (read: money losing) cities, they wouldn't be in this spot. I heard a stat the other day that Phoenix has lost $50 million in the last three years. Every one of those dollars has come out of the NHL's pocket. Any sane business person would have moved the team years ago. So whose fault is it that the NHL as a whole isn't making money (a stat I find hard to believe, by the way)?
League having higher revenues than ever doesn't really matter when you have players making higher salaries than ever. As for Phoenix, the one person who wanted to buy and move the team, jim balsillie, is not on a good note with the owners or bettman after the way he tried to strong arm the league into selling and moving nashville in 2007.

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