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08-09-2012, 03:15 PM
  #326
JimEIV
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Diluted market, recessed economy, extremely expensive per game price and small interest in the sport..

Marketing cannot overcome those things

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08-09-2012, 03:22 PM
  #327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Diluted market, recessed economy, extremely expensive per game price and small interest in the sport..

Marketing cannot overcome those things
All signs point to things (attendance) looking better in the next 5-10 years with the huge amount of young fans that we have that, by then, will be able to go to more games and even buy season tix. At least we all hope that's true.

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08-09-2012, 03:34 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
But that's the thing...I see more tv, radio and print ads for Devils tickets than I ever have...not to mention social media and email/internet campaigns.

The devils marketing is probably at an all time high in the history of the franchise right now and strictly from attendance it doesn't seem to be making much of a difference.
There just aren't that many hockey fans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Diluted market, recessed economy, extremely expensive per game price and small interest in the sport..

Marketing cannot overcome those things
Agree with all the bolded.

The Devils ticket folks constantly overreach and overextend this team with unrealistic expectations and unnecessary greed, to the detriment of the team's present, and the team's future.

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08-09-2012, 03:37 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
The Devils ticket folks constantly overreach and overextend this team with unrealistic expectations and unnecessary greed, to the detriment of the team's present, and the team's future.
Could you explain this a bit further? I'm not saying I agree or disagree, I'm just curious why you think this.

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08-09-2012, 03:38 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by BigBlueAndRed View Post
Could you explain this a bit further? I'm not saying I agree or disagree, I'm just curious why you think this.
Basically he is saying ticket prices are high.

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08-09-2012, 03:47 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by njdevsfn95 View Post
Basically he is saying ticket prices are high.
Exactly.

But it's even a bit more than that too.

Every time the sun does shine on the Devils, instead of attempting to capitalize on that fortune and grow the base organically, the Devils increase prices even further in an attempt to squeeze every last drop out of the "increased demand lemon". It often backfires.

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08-09-2012, 03:52 PM
  #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Exactly.

But it's even a bit more than that too.

Every time the sun does shine on the Devils, instead of attempting to capitalize on that fortune and grow the base organically, the Devils increase prices even further in an attempt to squeeze every last drop out of the "increased demand lemon". It often backfires.
Yup...all those sellouts during the playoffs sure seems like it backfired!

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:02 PM
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILSEBO View Post
Not the solution but one of the many problems that have led to this. Like I've said a thousand times. Great job on the ice but this is the worst run organization in pro sports off the ice. With the amount of success this team's had if they even attempted to market this team, look out. But Lou's philosophy of "if you build it they will come" has prevailed for his entire tenure and has cost the team tens of millions. I still reference that Saturday afternoon at the Meadowlands when over 6k showed up for the draft party after the strike and the line was around the arena. The fans have always been here.
This is some absurd hyperbole. Yes, Lou doesn't market the team like he could or should, but the Devils are hardly the worst about this.

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:05 PM
  #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Exactly.

But it's even a bit more than that too.

Every time the sun does shine on the Devils, instead of attempting to capitalize on that fortune and grow the base organically, the Devils increase prices even further in an attempt to squeeze every last drop out of the "increased demand lemon". It often backfires.
True to single game prices, but STH pricing has remained flat or decreased in some areas in the last 3 seasons.

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:22 PM
  #335
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The Devils have had nearly 2000 new season ticket holders in each of the last two seasons and they've somehow stagnated?

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08-09-2012, 04:22 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
The Devils have had nearly 2000 new season ticket holders in each of the last two seasons and they've somehow stagnated?
That just means NEW season ticket holders. Not additional season ticket holders.

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:25 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by kyle evs48 View Post
That just means NEW season ticket holders. Not additional season ticket holders.
Huh? New and additional mean the same thing, no? Someone that wasn't buying seasons before that is now.

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08-09-2012, 04:26 PM
  #338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Huh? New and additional mean the same thing, no?
not really, because you have people who might not have renewed

it doesnt mean we had 5,000 last year and now have 7,000, for example

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:28 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Huh? New and additional mean the same thing, no?
For example, i stopped being a STH.

But they still added 2000 new holders.

Its a language trick. The renewal rate was probably 90-95%.

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:29 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Huh? New and additional mean the same thing, no? Someone that wasn't buying seasons before that is now.
2,000 new people purchase season tickets
2,000 season ticket holders don't renew

2,000 NEW season ticket holders

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:29 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by Zajacs Bowl Cut View Post
not really, because you have people who might not have renewed

it doesnt mean we had 5,000 last year and now have 7,000, for example
Well that's fair but I somehow doubt we also dropped the same number of season ticket holders the last two seasons. Maybe a bunch dropped after last year, but I doubt very many dropped after this year. Even if 1500 people dropped seasons in the last two years, that's still a net gain of around 2000.

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Old
08-09-2012, 04:31 PM
  #342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by njdevsfn95 View Post
For example, i stopped being a STH.

But they still added 2000 new holders.

Its a language trick. The renewal rate was probably 90-95%.
They did say the renewal rate was about 85-90% last year. If you had say, 7000 sth's before, that means 700-1000 dropped. Considering they supposedly had 2200 new ones that's like a 1200-1500 net gain. I don't know if they have final numbers for this year but so far they have 1600 new ones.


Last edited by NJDevs26: 08-09-2012 at 04:38 PM.
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Old
08-09-2012, 05:05 PM
  #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj225 View Post
Yup...all those sellouts during the playoffs sure seems like it backfired!
Playoffs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle evs48 View Post
2,000 new people purchase season tickets
2,000 season ticket holders don't renew

2,000 NEW season ticket holders
lol, kindof, yeah.

I mean, there's no doubt the Devils are moving numerically in the right direction with STH growth, but some of the above is true too.

As others have pointed out, it not possible to release "OMG teh best numberz evurz" year after year after year, and somehow as we've noted the STH base doesn't seem drastically higher. It's a bit higher, but nobody will confuse the Devils for a team with a healthy STH base. I dont envy their job, as I'm sure it must be pretty tough growing this team's base. It also remains to be seen whether the $22 cheapies will stay a fixture, because I think people are kidding themselves if they think that area isnt key to a big chunk of the STH growth the last few years.


Last edited by BenedictGomez: 08-09-2012 at 05:16 PM.
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Old
08-09-2012, 05:39 PM
  #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
Playoffs?



lol, kindof, yeah.

I mean, there's no doubt the Devils are moving numerically in the right direction with STH growth, but some of the above is true too.

As others have pointed out, it not possible to release "OMG teh best numberz evurz" year after year after year, and somehow as we've noted the STH base doesn't seem drastically higher. It's a bit higher, but nobody will confuse the Devils for a team with a healthy STH base. I dont envy their job, as I'm sure it must be pretty tough growing this team's base. It also remains to be seen whether the $22 cheapies will stay a fixture, because I think people are kidding themselves if they think that area isnt key to a big chunk of the STH growth the last few years.
They need to tier the pricing in the upper 200 level and lower the end corners (209, 232, 215, 226) or even designate them for day of game walkup for college students for $20 for every game.

They had trouble moving those seats last reg season for most games and on some nights they were the only sections that were mostly empty.

I agree with you that if they lowered their single game ticket pricing in most sections, it would help build the base for the long haul.

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08-09-2012, 05:53 PM
  #345
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Most of the kids coming with their parents to the Brendan Bryne arena for the Detroit series don't even have disposable income yet. What I mean by this is that our on-ice success has attracted young fans that came with their parents to watch games, I'm sure of it.

But if the team is expected to have some sort of significant rise in their season ticket purchases because of it, it will be when these same "kids" can afford it. I foresee a scenario where our STH base will skyrocket in the next 5 to 10 years as the kids during the cup runs start to get jobs themselves, and start attending games. Provided, of course, that the team doesn't start to suck in the meanwhile.

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Old
08-09-2012, 06:00 PM
  #346
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Originally Posted by Rockie View Post
Most of the kids coming with their parents to the Brendan Bryne arena for the Detroit series don't even have disposable income yet. What I mean by this is that our on-ice success has attracted young fans that came with their parents to watch games, I'm sure of it.

But if the team is expected to have some sort of significant rise in their season ticket purchases because of it, it will be when these same "kids" can afford it. I foresee a scenario where our STH base will skyrocket in the next 5 to 10 years as the kids during the cup runs start to get jobs themselves, and start attending games. Provided, of course, that the team doesn't start to suck in the meanwhile.
That's basically how it is for me and the Devils fans that I know in my age group (mid 20s).
Now that I'm making more than an entry level salary, I get to enjoy a lot more games.

I averaged about 2 games each season since high school.
But, last season I went to 10 games (plus 2 playoff games).

And unlike high school, I was lucky to be able to get a ticket for 1 friend. Now, I have 3 or 4 people each game looking to buy tickets with me, as well.

The fanbase will be fine once it matures. Unfortunately that won't do anything for the now.

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Old
08-09-2012, 06:39 PM
  #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
The Devils have had nearly 2000 new season ticket holders in each of the last two seasons and they've somehow stagnated?
Supposed renewal rate last year was 80ish%, and 95% this year.



So assuming we did not have 10K season ticket holders 3 years ago, there should not be a stagnation.

Will be interesting to see if the actual attendance will have benefited from the playoff run.

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Old
08-09-2012, 06:44 PM
  #348
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Originally Posted by BenedictGomez View Post
It also remains to be seen whether the $22 cheapies will stay a fixture, because I think people are kidding themselves if they think that area isnt key to a big chunk of the STH growth the last few years.
I don't disagree with this at all, but sold tickets are better than unsold tickets at least.

You have to think they know there's only so much they can up those seats since it was a ghost town at $39 per the previous year, and the $28's in the attacking zone didn't exactly sell out last year (maybe it'll be close to filled this year with all the new sth's though). They did creep a few of the $22 rows up to $24 but still kept the back rows at $22 for now.

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Old
08-09-2012, 06:50 PM
  #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Diluted market, recessed economy, extremely expensive per game price and small interest in the sport..

Marketing cannot overcome those things
Diluted Market? No doubt. The other issues can certainly be overcome as evidenced by Rangers(and aside from the last other NY market teams).

Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
If the fans have always been there, why the need to market? Sounds like Lou's philosphy of "build it and they will come" was correct if "The fans have always been there.

What do you expect them to do? I have seen more Devils marketing in the last 5 years than I have jets, giants and net combined and In my opinion it is a waste of resources and money. The pool of fans we are slecting from is tiny. Not only is it a tiny pool, but on top of that it is highly competitive....That is the nature of being the 4th sometimes 5th sport in the region. Market until the cows come home hockey will still be a niche sport.
Devils market more then Giants Jets and Nets combined? Not even close. I doubt devils market any where near the two football teams. Hard to say with the Nets being lame duck last 2 years, but they will certainly outspend the Devils going into this season.

If marketing didn't work then we would not see so many companies spending $$$ on it.

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Old
08-09-2012, 06:52 PM
  #350
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Originally Posted by Scottyk9 View Post
A advance is not a loan.
Why do guys attack the wording without responding to the issue?

Is another advance an option?

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