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Offseason Discussion IX: Is it Sunday yet? (Contract/FA charts in Post #1)

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06-30-2012, 10:53 PM
  #351
Jaded-Fan
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
If we miss out on Parise, Shero better have a hell of a backup plan. We need two legit top six options if we miss out on him IMO. Especially on a post-Staal team.

I'm sure not gonna be pissed if we sign Suter and trade for struggling top 6 options that fit the system.


Oh, silly rabbit. Betcha thought I was gonna take Forsberg, didn't you? You guys are so cute.

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06-30-2012, 10:53 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
If we miss out on Parise, Shero better have a hell of a backup plan. We need two legit top six options if we miss out on him IMO. Especially on a post-Staal team.

I'm sure not gonna be pissed if we sign Suter and trade for struggling top 6 options that fit the system.
He's not stupid.... I'm sure he has a plan B, C, D, and E

of course, we may not like his backup options and everyone will probably be a little upset if we miss out on Parise, but for the most part, if they offer him between $7-8 million per season for 7 to 10 years and he turns it down, how angry can you be at Shero? What more could he have done?

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06-30-2012, 10:57 PM
  #353
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Dennis Bernstein ‏@DennisTFP
Text just received from NHL agent (not Newport Sports) saying Kings will be all in on Zach Parise 'want him very badly'. We'll see.

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06-30-2012, 10:58 PM
  #354
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Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
If we're seriously considering 8 mill per for Parise, depending on the package we'd have to give up for Nash, I'd feel much less worse about acquiring him if we missed on the Parise boat.

Nash and Geno would be lethal together. Slide Neal on to Sids wing. A lot of people talk about Nash being the franchise player of a losing franchise, but I don't think it says much on Nash. They've never surrounded him with legit talent. If he came to us, he'd be worth his cap.

I'm hoping we sign Parise for around 7.5. Isn't that what we offered Hossa? I'm not totally comfortable with signing him to 8 though. He's an outstanding player, but let's keep things in perspective.

Excluding his season two years ago where he only played 13 games, he's averaged 67 points. He'll be 28 once the season starts. He's an amazing player that fits our system and Sids game to the T, but he's not worth 8 million dollars, imo. Signing him to anything more than 7.5 would be a mistake, imo.
if you're willing to pay Parise $7.5 million and he says nope, but $8 million gets it done you say "okay $8 million it is, Zach".

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06-30-2012, 11:10 PM
  #355
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Well I'm off to bed with visions of Parise dancing in my head. #nohomo

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06-30-2012, 11:15 PM
  #356
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Originally Posted by ColePens View Post
I think you are being sarcastic, but this is the over reaction I expect tomorrow. Shero will be in on Parise. If he doesn't sign, people will pull the ******** defense card.
July 1 is almost always ugly. Chocked full of regrets and disappointment, no matter which team you follow.

I'm trying to back down on my excitement level for it, knowing full well that I'll be *****ing about something 24 hours from now.

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06-30-2012, 11:19 PM
  #357
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If the Pens are giving out a retirement contract tomorrow to Suter or Parise, I think we should go with Suter. As much as I'd like to see Sid have an elite winger on his line for the foreseeable future, I don't think its worth the risk of giving Parise 7.5 to 8 per year on an 8 to 10 year deal. 5 to 7 years at that cap hit? Hell yeah! I just think Parise is going to start slowing down in his mid 30's due to his style of play. I don't know if RS is going to take the risk on that much term at the thought of paying Parise 8 mil for 50 to 60 points a year near the end of a 10 year deal. Even though I'd be happy with either, but I think Suter will be able to keep a higher level of play in the long run.

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06-30-2012, 11:24 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Dennis Bernstein ‏@DennisTFP
Text just received from NHL agent (not Newport Sports) saying Kings will be all in on Zach Parise 'want him very badly'. We'll see.
Imagine how Devils fans will feel if that happens..

And where is LA getting all this cap space? Brown, Kopitar, Richards, Carter, Stoll, Gagne, Williams, Doughty, Quick.

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06-30-2012, 11:27 PM
  #359
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Originally Posted by electricsleep View Post
If the Pens are giving out a retirement contract tomorrow to Suter or Parise, I think we should go with Suter. As much as I'd like to see Sid have an elite winger on his line for the foreseeable future, I don't think its worth the risk of giving Parise 7.5 to 8 per year on an 8 to 10 year deal. 5 to 7 years at that cap hit? Hell yeah! I just think Parise is going to start slowing down in his mid 30's due to his style of play. I don't know if RS is going to take the risk on that much term at the thought of paying Parise 8 mil for 50 to 60 points a year near the end of a 10 year deal. Even though I'd be happy with either, but I think Suter will be able to keep a higher level of play in the long run.
I disagree. We have a pipeline full of defensemen and we already have a Norris-caliber d-man in Letang. We also have a great line (Malkin, Neal and Kunitz) but we have no one to play full time with Sid. Parisé might be a "bigger" risk, but he is also more of a need.

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06-30-2012, 11:31 PM
  #360
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Originally Posted by Harv View Post
Imagine how Devils fans will feel if that happens..

And where is LA getting all this cap space? Brown, Kopitar, Richards, Carter, Stoll, Gagne, Williams, Doughty, Quick.
What do you mean? They have just as much space as we do. Did you forget the deals Carter and Richards signed?

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06-30-2012, 11:31 PM
  #361
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Originally Posted by Harv View Post
Imagine how Devils fans will feel if that happens..

And where is LA getting all this cap space? Brown, Kopitar, Richards, Carter, Stoll, Gagne, Williams, Doughty, Quick.
Imagine it? We lived it with Hossa!!!

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06-30-2012, 11:33 PM
  #362
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Dennis Bernstein ‏@DennisTFP
Text just received from NHL agent (not Newport Sports) saying Kings will be all in on Zach Parise 'want him very badly'. We'll see.
I honestly think it'll be between us. Would be funny for LA to narrowly miss out on a big free agent again.

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06-30-2012, 11:40 PM
  #363
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Originally Posted by AgentM View Post
Imagine it? We lived it with Hossa!!!
No ****, Thats just what i was thinking. I rather get Parise than sutter.

1st reason is we have alot of young d ready and we have letang hopefully orpik is back to normal ect.

The other reason. Crosby took 8.7 m again. Reward the man with someone he can actually play with.

Another reason imo Zp > sutter for us is What if Crosby goes down ? Staal is gone. We would need ZP badly if Crosby were to get hurt again.

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06-30-2012, 11:43 PM
  #364
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Originally Posted by AgentM View Post
Imagine it? We lived it with Hossa!!!
Well, Hossa wasn't our captain, we didn't draft him and he was only here for 3 months. The only similarity is that both players lost in the SCF before hitting free agency.

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06-30-2012, 11:43 PM
  #365
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Cap wise, we're better off surrounding Sid/Geno with cheap top 6 talent and signing Suter.

But if you factor in needs longterm, Parise all day.

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06-30-2012, 11:45 PM
  #366
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
Cap wise, we're better off surrounding Sid/Geno with cheap top 6 talent and signing Suter.

But if you factor in needs longterm, Parise all day.
and you can factor in rewarding your star player and captain with a stud winger, something he deserves after taking paycuts to help bring in better talent

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06-30-2012, 11:50 PM
  #367
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Originally Posted by mgd525 View Post
No ****, Thats just what i was thinking. I rather get Parise than sutter.

1st reason is we have alot of young d ready and we have letang hopefully orpik is back to normal ect.

The other reason. Crosby took 8.7 m again. Reward the man with someone he can actually play with.

Another reason imo Zp > sutter for us is What if Crosby goes down ? Staal is gone. We would need ZP badly if Crosby were to get hurt again.
Yes, Parise >>> Suter for me too and I can't agree more with rewarded Sid as you said. Now if Shero goes balls out for him and doesn't get him, then that's okay. But if he just wants Suter and some second tier wingers I'll be pretty bummed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanStaal#1Fan View Post
Well, Hossa wasn't our captain, we didn't draft him and he was only here for 3 months. The only similarity is that both players lost in the SCF before hitting free agency.
I understand what you're saying, but that's a pretty darned big coincidence. How often do superstars sign with the team they lost to in the Cup final a month later?

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06-30-2012, 11:53 PM
  #368
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Originally Posted by Jaded-Fan View Post
You know Shero. Bright shiny wing for Crosby available, perfect fit, but OMG, lookie at the defenseman. He can not help himself.

Anyone who did not see this coming from ten miles away was just fooling themselves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
It never ends. Hey lets draft tons of defensemen, take the time to develop them for multiple seasons in junior and then in the AHL, then right when they are ready to break into the NHL we'll sign already proven and very expensive defensemen to play in front of them!
That's just it. BRIGHT and SHINY. Defense and depth wins cups. When was the last high powered offensive team to win a cup? LA won with allowing sweet **** all for goals. They have great forward depth, but it was the D and G that won.

Suter and some so so winger options makes this a better team than Parise and keeping the D as is (or even signing Allen for the 2nd pairing with Martin).

As for our young D who are NHL ready (so Despres, Strait, Bort, and perhaps Morrow and Dumoulin), who other than perhaps Despres have top pairing potential? And how soon? The chance of any of them being a top 2 is slim. Despres might. Strait/Bort likely are not more than 4-6 guys. Morrow/Pouliout will likely be more of a #3 PPQB type. Dumoulin/Harrington 2nd pairing shutdown types. Not sure about Maatta. However most of those guys are at least 3 years away from being regular/impact players. Those D also have a lot of value for trades.

If we want a top pairing D, it's either sign Suter, or try and trade for one as it's unlikely we have one in the system. If you want to give the rookies space, move Engelland. That instantly free's up a 3rd pairing spot and we could run with 2 rookies there (Despres, Strait/Bort). I love him, but he's currently at his top potential.

Sign Suter and a couple so so project wingers. Leave Parise for someone who wants to overpay. Our team last year was one of the top scoring teams in the league - without Crosby. Sure we've lost Staal, but Crosby is back. As much as getting Crosby a winger is the sexy thing to do (and it would be nice for Crosby to have a talented winger), it's not what we need to do. Shero knows this. I think a lot of you will be disappointed when we don't get Parise.

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06-30-2012, 11:55 PM
  #369
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Originally Posted by AgentM View Post
Yes, Parise >>> Suter for me too and I can't agree more with rewarded Sid as you said. Now if Shero goes balls out for him and doesn't get him, then that's okay. But if he just wants Suter and some second tier wingers I'll be pretty bummed.



I understand what you're saying, but that's a pretty darned big coincidence. How often do superstars sign with the team they lost to in the Cup final a month later?
Well, if he signs with the Kings... then yeah, the comparaison is pretty sweet, hehe. Would be sweet to see him sign a 1-year deal with LA in hopes of winning a Cup just to lose to the Devils. Then in the off-season, he could sign a long-term deal with us

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06-30-2012, 11:58 PM
  #370
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Originally Posted by JordanStaal#1Fan View Post
I disagree. We have a pipeline full of defensemen and we already have a Norris-caliber d-man in Letang. We also have a great line (Malkin, Neal and Kunitz) but we have no one to play full time with Sid. Parisé might be a "bigger" risk, but he is also more of a need.
Even though the D prospects in the system have pedigree we don't know for sure whether any of them will be a top pairing defensemen in the future. Even if any of them do we won't see it for another 3+ years. If we got Suter, we'd be able to throw him and Letang out there for 25 to 30 minutes a night against any line in the league and in any situation. Plus we'd be able to dump Martin to make room for Despres or one of the other young guys to start working their way up the pairings.

I agree that getting a winger for Sid is a big need but I don't think he needs a guy as high priced on a long term deal as Parise even though they would be perfect together. I think you could find 2 guys on shorter term deals for around 9 mil total via FA or trade. Guys like Ryan, Doan, Whitney, Semin, Setoguchi and Stewart and you'd get just as much production with less of a risk in the future. An added bonus would be putting Dupius on the 3rd line with Cooke and Sutter. Don't get me wrong I'd love Parise at 8 mil for 5 years but I don't know if that's gonna get it done.

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07-01-2012, 12:01 AM
  #371
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Well said Electricsleep. Not a popular opinion, but I agree completely.

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07-01-2012, 12:10 AM
  #372
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Originally Posted by JordanStaal#1Fan View Post
Well, if he signs with the Kings... then yeah, the comparaison is pretty sweet, hehe. Would be sweet to see him sign a 1-year deal with LA in hopes of winning a Cup just to lose to the Devils. Then in the off-season, he could sign a long-term deal with us
If we could guarantee that would happen I'd be willing to wait a year for him

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07-01-2012, 12:11 AM
  #373
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You don't pass up on Parise and Suter if they want to sign here. You make it work. But I can see both sides. I just see Parise signing here.

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07-01-2012, 12:16 AM
  #374
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You don't pass up on Parise and Suter if they want to sign here. You make it work. But I can see both sides. I just see Parise signing here.
At 7m+ for 10 years, yes you do. However if they want to talk less salary, or less term, then fine - consider it. But signing both makes for some tough choices for Shero when it comes time to extend Letang.

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07-01-2012, 12:18 AM
  #375
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Even though the D prospects in the system have pedigree we don't know for sure whether any of them will be a top pairing defensemen in the future. Even if any of them do we won't see it for another 3+ years. If we got Suter, we'd be able to throw him and Letang out there for 25 to 30 minutes a night against any line in the league and in any situation. Plus we'd be able to dump Martin to make room for Despres or one of the other young guys to start working their way up the pairings.

I agree that getting a winger for Sid is a big need but I don't think he needs a guy as high priced on a long term deal as Parise even though they would be perfect together. I think you could find 2 guys on shorter term deals for around 9 mil total via FA or trade. Guys like Ryan, Doan, Whitney, Semin, Setoguchi and Stewart and you'd get just as much production with less of a risk in the future. An added bonus would be putting Dupius on the 3rd line with Cooke and Sutter. Don't get me wrong I'd love Parise at 8 mil for 5 years but I don't know if that's gonna get it done.
I really want ZP for Crosby as u said 8m for 5 years is perfect. Anything more and he's not worth it imo. Who the hell knows though with Guastad making 3.25 and LOL wideman over 5 million.

I can say the same for sure about sutter.


The wings you listed either resigned or mould be ALTEAST 10m for a pair of them with the overpayments about to begin.

Semin- i want no part of, no heart and will go to highest bider.

Ryan makes 5.5? and we would have to give up alot.

Every person that drools over Setoguchi makes me laugh. He has tons of talent but for christ sakes he had 65 points 4 years ago and has broke 40 once since then. He's an enigma or a one hit wonder, who knows which.

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