Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
-18 (worst on the team) in 30 games for Portland. I mean +/- doesn't tell you the whole story, but that's telling. Rundblad hasn't shown ability to translate to the North American game, while Silfverberg likely won't have as much difficulty.
Sorry but Silfverberg >> Rundblad
No, actually im not really that sold on Rundblad. I just view both as prospects with loads of potential. And im not one of the posters on hfboards who thinks I can get star players in the nhl with a prospect.
No, actually im not really that sold on Rundblad. I just view both as prospects with loads of potential. And im not one of the posters on hfboards who thinks I can get star players in the nhl with a prospect.
Rundblad has tons of talent but has a huge chance of busting. He just doesn't get the NA game and I question his commitment to defense. It's only been one year so we'll see how it goes, but I'll stick with the safer Silfverberg.
Boedker and Murphy for Michalek I'd probably consider fairer value. But I'm horrible at this so take it FWIW. And Milan's 6 million salary in 13-14 would be toxic anyway and likely a non-starter.
I don't want to move Boedker though on the off chance he breaks out and we have us a cheap highly productive player.
Michalek for Rundblad isn't really fair value for Ottawa. Whatever the reasons (I'm not a Michalek fan) he scored 35 goals and 60 points last year which is pretty damn impressive.
Rundblad has a huge amount of potential, but his likelihood of reaching that potential has diminished in the last year when he was an absolute trainwreck defensively in Ottawa and didn't seem to improve much in Phoenix or their AHL affiliate based on his +/- which is of course a terrible stat, but I mean with respect to his teammates and in particular other defenseman where he was worst on the team with -18.
His point totals were also pretty low putting up 16 points in 30 games.
For those reasons, Michalek for Rundblad is pretty much off the table.
Silfverberg is a toughy...I haven't seen him play outside the playoffs but all accounts of him are that he's a very good player and dominated the SEL (sound familiar ). I think the value is close and that in any event 2nd round picks or later could be added on either side to balance the value exactly but I'm not sure Murray would make that trade because of the already "failed-attempt" with Rundblad (I use the term loosely).
In reality I think Ottawa is done with Rundblad, but I'd be happy to reverse the trade if I could today.
We already have a new RD prospect with arguably higher upside that we seem to be fairly high on. Not to mention bigger, better defensively and not so damn soft. I think we're good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeus3007
If they wanted something other than Rundblad, wouldn`t they have asked for that in the Turris trade?
They actually did. The rumour was they asked for MZ or our 1st before settling on Rundblad +2nd.
I am interested to continue the "family reunion" trend going on and get Michalek from you guys.
Funny, I was thinking the same thing about your Michalek.
Anyway, neither Murray nor Maloney wants to talk about trading Rundblad. Phoenix is in place to have the deepest D in the NHL in a few seasons, while Ottawa is very happy with Turris and don't want to give up their young assets for someone they just traded away.
The Rundblad experiment is done in Ottawa with Ceci in the pipeline.
I'm looking forward to Rundblad developing but I'm glad it is now for another team. He's a pleasure to watch but people think Karlsson was bad defensively when he came into the league and Rundblad is that much worse.
Michalek for Rundblad isn't really fair value for Ottawa. Whatever the reasons (I'm not a Michalek fan) he scored 35 goals and 60 points last year which is pretty damn impressive.
Rundblad has a huge amount of potential, but his likelihood of reaching that potential has diminished in the last year when he was an absolute trainwreck defensively in Ottawa and didn't seem to improve much in Phoenix or their AHL affiliate based on his +/- which is of course a terrible stat, but I mean with respect to his teammates and in particular other defenseman where he was worst on the team with -18.
His point totals were also pretty low putting up 16 points in 30 games.
For those reasons, Michalek for Rundblad is pretty much off the table.
Silfverberg is a toughy...I haven't seen him play outside the playoffs but all accounts of him are that he's a very good player and dominated the SEL (sound familiar ). I think the value is close and that in any event 2nd round picks or later could be added on either side to balance the value exactly but I'm not sure Murray would make that trade because of the already "failed-attempt" with Rundblad (I use the term loosely).
In reality I think Ottawa is done with Rundblad, but I'd be happy to reverse the trade if I could today.
I understand why Ottawa would be hesitant to trade Michalek, but I don't see the Coyotes willing to pay the premium for him, either. One bounceback season after a few lackluster ones, and all of a sudden he's a total stud? The inconsistency, at least at that price tag, is a worry.
I'm open to trading Rundblad, but I don't think you're being fair to his value. Portland was an absolute trainwreck last year, and given the circumstances, 16 points in 30 games from the back end after joining the team in midseason is pretty impressive. Here are the defensemen on that team who outscored him:
Nathan Oystrick (a longtime vet who just signed in the KHL)
Tyler Eckford (another AHL vet)
Michael Stone (likely to be either the Coyotes #7 this year or the Pirates #1)
Nick Ross (former first rounder with whom the Coyotes seem to have cut ties)
The only one who had a higher points/game average was Oystrick, but he's eight years older than Rundblad, played for the team the whole season, and likely saw a lot more minutes (though I can't seem to find those stats for the AHL). It's safe to say Rundblad was the best offensive defenseman on the team last year and will definitely be next year, as well. Keep in mind this is a team that saw only one player crack the 50-point mark.
His defense is, quite obviously, suspect, but as you mentioned, +/- is a misleading stat, and Rundblad won't be a top pairing defenseman anyway. On the Coyotes, he won't need to be. OEL has the #1 slot locked down for probably the next decade and a half, and Yandle isn't exactly small potatoes. Gormley projects as a pretty great #3 himself. In the few games he got with the big club last year, Rundblad looked a little lost defensively but was a revelation offensively. He has a lot to add to this organization if he can get his defensive play to a competent level.
Luckily, the Coyotes can afford to bring him along slowly. For the coming season, five defense slots are already taken by vets (OEL, Yandle, Klesla, Morris, Michalek), and the #6 is likely to be Schlemko or Gormley, with the other guy taking the #7 spot and filling in for whomever is hurt/slacking. The next injury callups are, I would guess, Michael Stone and Chris Summers. The point here is that, in all likelihood, Rundblad will play the large majority of the season in the AHL, getting accustomed to the North American game. His offensive skills are already just shy of elite, so he just needs to focus on his defensive game a bit, and he'll be gold.
I understand why Ottawa would be hesitant to trade Michalek, but I don't see the Coyotes willing to pay the premium for him, either. One bounceback season after a few lackluster ones, and all of a sudden he's a total stud? The inconsistency, at least at that price tag, is a worry.
I'm open to trading Rundblad, but I don't think you're being fair to his value. Portland was an absolute trainwreck last year, and given the circumstances, 16 points in 30 games from the back end after joining the team in midseason is pretty impressive. Here are the defensemen on that team who outscored him:
Nathan Oystrick (a longtime vet who just signed in the KHL)
Tyler Eckford (another AHL vet)
Michael Stone (likely to be either the Coyotes #7 this year or the Pirates #1)
Nick Ross (former first rounder with whom the Coyotes seem to have cut ties)
The only one who had a higher points/game average was Oystrick, but he's eight years older than Rundblad, played for the team the whole season, and likely saw a lot more minutes (though I can't seem to find those stats for the AHL). It's safe to say Rundblad was the best offensive defenseman on the team last year and will definitely be next year, as well. Keep in mind this is a team that saw only one player crack the 50-point mark.
His defense is, quite obviously, suspect, but as you mentioned, +/- is a misleading stat, and Rundblad won't be a top pairing defenseman anyway. On the Coyotes, he won't need to be. OEL has the #1 slot locked down for probably the next decade and a half, and Yandle isn't exactly small potatoes. Gormley projects as a pretty great #3 himself. In the few games he got with the big club last year, Rundblad looked a little lost defensively but was a revelation offensively. He has a lot to add to this organization if he can get his defensive play to a competent level.
Luckily, the Coyotes can afford to bring him along slowly. For the coming season, five defense slots are already taken by vets (OEL, Yandle, Klesla, Morris, Michalek), and the #6 is likely to be Schlemko or Gormley, with the other guy taking the #7 spot and filling in for whomever is hurt/slacking. The next injury callups are, I would guess, Michael Stone and Chris Summers. The point here is that, in all likelihood, Rundblad will play the large majority of the season in the AHL, getting accustomed to the North American game. His offensive skills are already just shy of elite, so he just needs to focus on his defensive game a bit, and he'll be gold.
I wouldn't recommend paying a premium for Michalek either as I think he's carried by Spezza and Karlsson so I think we agree there.
I also think Rundblad will develop nicely especially if given a slow development path where he can take his time, I'm just not prepared to trade 1/2 of our legitimate top 6 players for a defenseman who may or may not ever develop according to what he was supposed to amount to.
Like I said, Silfverberg makes some sense on both sides...but I don't think Murray would pull the trigger. It's not really fair to Rundblad since Silfverberg may just go the same direction next year as Rundblad did this year, but it's also possible he goes the direction many hoped Rundblad would (ie. seamless transition to NHL) so it's a tough call for Ottawa on that, but I'd probably do it.
I can't really see a deal for Yandle and I don't want to make a deal for Rundblad. If I had to make a Yandle offer it would probably be this:
To Ottawa:
Yandle
To Phoenix:
Michalek
Greening
Da Costa
Wiercioch
But I know that doesn't get it done for Phoenix. That's the most offense Ottawa could give up, and we don't have any pieces on D to make a difference (at least that we'd give up). I just added in Wiercioch as a last ditch throw in. I don't think this is a terrible package for Phoenix but I do think they could get a better one elsewhere. Da Costa WILL be an NHLer, that I have almost zero doubt about... I have him rated behind only Zibanejad, Noesen, Lehner, Ceci, Stone and Silfverberg in our prospect pool, but his upside is right up there with them. Could really be an elite 2nd line C.
I think this deal is good for the Yotes in the sense that they would be a better team, simply because they have the depth to replace Yandle to more of an extent than they could emulate Michalek + Greenings production. Here's how I see their lineup (note: will be innaccurate, I was out of the country for most of this regular season)
Boedker-Vermette-Doan (I think he resigns)
Korpikoski-Da Costa-Vrbata
Greening-Hanzal-Michalek
Torres-Gordon-Miele
Gives Phoenix 3 legit scoring lines and 9 players who can score above 35 pts (easy top 6 production). Leaves Phoenix with 9 NHL ready DMen (I'd say Wiercioch is just as ready as Rundblad, w.o obvious huge upside). I don't think Phoenix does it because there are better deals, but I do think it improves Phoenix.
Sorry for the long drawn out post... I like to see where my split second ideas go.
If the Senators traded all their players, they'd have an all-star team the way Senator fans value their players.
?
Boedker has done absolutely nothing to suggest he'll be a top 6 forward. Phoenix fans have admitted Rundblad doesn't have top pairing potential, and Sens fans know this as well.
Potential 2nd pair + Long shot future top 6 forward for 35 goal scorer/Legit top 6 who would likely be their best forward.
Leafs fans just love to hate and have no idea what they're talking about.
Boedker has done absolutely nothing to suggest he'll be a top 6 forward. Phoenix fans have admitted Rundblad doesn't have top pairing potential, and Sens fans know this as well.
Potential 2nd pair + Long shot future top 6 forward for 35 goal scorer/Legit top 6 who would likely be their best forward.
Leafs fans just love to hate and have no idea what they're talking about.
Just saying, your Rundblad + Boedker for Michalek proposal is a really good, solid one. Props on that.
Boedker has done absolutely nothing to suggest he'll be a top 6 forward. Phoenix fans have admitted Rundblad doesn't have top pairing potential, and Sens fans know this as well.
Potential 2nd pair + Long shot future top 6 forward for 35 goal scorer/Legit top 6 who would likely be their best forward.
Leafs fans just love to hate and have no idea what they're talking about.
What? Boedker may have been the Coyotes best forward in the playoffs this past year....he certainly was in the Chicago series when he scored OT games in back-to-back games.
There is no way GMDM trades Bods even up for Michalek
Boedker has done absolutely nothing to suggest he'll be a top 6 forward. Phoenix fans have admitted Rundblad doesn't have top pairing potential, and Sens fans know this as well.
Potential 2nd pair + Long shot future top 6 forward for 35 goal scorer/Legit top 6 who would likely be their best forward.
Leafs fans just love to hate and have no idea what they're talking about.
I think Boedker's recent performance in the Stanley Cup Playoffs provided some hope that he can jump into a Top 6 role as early as this season in Phoenix. You make it sound like he's a write off and that's clearly not the case.
As for Rundblad. He's a prospect that Phoenix has every right to be excited about. His offensive vision is elite. Maloney is on record that he believes Rundblad to be the second coming of Sergei Zubov and that he'll be part of our top 4 as early as next season. Yes, his defensive game needs work but that's a heck of a lot easier to teach than what he already brings to the table.
What? Boedker may have been the Coyotes best forward in the playoffs this past year....he certainly was in the Chicago series when he scored OT games in back-to-back games.
There is no way GMDM trades Bods even up for Michalek
How homerish of you
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbk
I think Boedker's recent performance in the Stanley Cup Playoffs provided some hope that he can jump into a Top 6 role as early as this season in Phoenix. You make it sound like he's a write off and that's clearly not the case.
As for Rundblad. He's a prospect that Phoenix has every right to be excited about. His offensive vision is elite. Maloney is on record that he believes Rundblad to be the second coming of Sergei Zubov and that he'll be part of our top 4 as early as next season. Yes, his defensive game needs work but that's a heck of a lot easier to teach than what he already brings to the table.
And that's why both for Michalek is a fair trade.
Boedker played the best hockey of his career in the playoffs, and that's an extremely small sample size. Not close to being a sure-fire top 6 forward as of now.
Rundblad has problems right now and high bust chance.
I mean +/- doesn't tell you the whole story, but that's telling. Rundblad hasn't shown ability to translate to the North American game, while Silfverberg likely won't have as much difficulty.
). I think the value is close and that in any event 2nd round picks or later could be added on either side to balance the value exactly but I'm not sure Murray would make that trade because of the already "failed-attempt" with Rundblad (I use the term loosely).
