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Sign Claude Giroux to a 10+ year contract extension ASAP

View Poll Results: Is it time?
Yes -- new provisions in the next CBA could be scary 35 72.92%
No -- too much risk 13 27.08%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
07-07-2012, 07:35 PM
  #1
Damaged Goods
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Sign Claude Giroux to a 10+ year contract extension ASAP

a la the Pittsburgh Penguins and their recent pact with Sidney Crosby.

Claude's current deal expires in 2014 when he will be 26 (with one year of RFA eligibility remaining).

I'm thinking 10-12 years with an ~$8 M annual cap hit.

Pros

+ This is the Flyers last chance to offer a "franchise" contract in the Richards/Carter mold under the current CBA rules. Giroux is a brighter star and the cap is higher now, so the price will be higher, but the Flyers can stick to the same basic structure of those previous deals.

+ There is talk that the new CBA will make cap hits equal to the current year salary. If that goes into effect, it means a team with lots of cap space could easily send us a devastating poison pill offer sheet in 2014.

+ The new CBA could also limit the length of contracts, considerably inflating Giroux's cap hit after 2014.

+ Eliminates a lot of uncertainty about the Flyers long-term cap structure

+ Guarantees your franchise superstar is on board for another decade


Cons

- Why sign Giroux while his value is at its peak?

- Why take so much risk (regression or injury) a year or two before it is necessary?

- What if the cap goes way down and Giroux becomes comparatively overpaid?


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Old
07-07-2012, 07:41 PM
  #2
MsWoof
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I doubt Giroux does this, at least, if he's smart he does not.

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Old
07-07-2012, 07:43 PM
  #3
SolidSnakeUS
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I'd say wait closer. I mean ****, he's still an RFA after this current contract is done.

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Old
07-07-2012, 07:43 PM
  #4
Alchemy
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I hate those contract. The NHL has gotten out of control with them.

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Old
07-07-2012, 07:43 PM
  #5
FLYERSFAN18
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I thought he couldnt sign an extension until July 1st, 2013 because he has to be in the last year of his current deal?

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07-07-2012, 07:47 PM
  #6
Krishna
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We have a great track of signing people to long term deals and keeping them, right?

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07-07-2012, 07:49 PM
  #7
Damaged Goods
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
I doubt Giroux does this, at least, if he's smart he does not.
It could be tougher to get this kind of contract under the new CBA. I think that's why Crosby and the Penguins did their deal now. It's a win for the Penguins salary cap structure and a win for Crosby in terms of guaranteed cash.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
I'd say wait closer. I mean ****, he's still an RFA after this current contract is done.
Because the new CBA could make teams much more vulnerable to poison pill offer sheets. It's all speculation right now, but if the league attacks the "circumvention" issue by making cap hits equal to AV instead of AAV, a small market team with cap space could send Giroux an offer sheet that goes $14 M, $14 M, $14 M, $7 M, $7 M etc. That kind of offer could destroy the Flyers cap structure for several seasons because the front-loading would not be distributed over the life of the contract.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sm0ka47 View Post
I hate those contract. The NHL has gotten out of control with them.
That's why you do it while you still can.

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Old
07-07-2012, 07:49 PM
  #8
BillyShoe1721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damaged Goods View Post
a la the Pittsburgh Penguins and their recent pact with Sidney Crosby.

Claude's current deal expires in 2014 when he will be 26 (with one year of RFA eligibility remaining).

I'm thinking 10-12 years with an ~$8 M annual cap hit.

Pros

+ This is the Flyers last chance to offer a "franchise" contract in the Richards/Carter mold under the current CBA rules. Giroux is a brighter star and the cap is higher now, so the price will be higher, but the Flyers can stick to the same basic structure of those previous deals.
This is a legitimate point.

Quote:
+ There is talk that the new CBA will make cap hits equal to the current year salary. If that goes into effect, it means a team with lots of cap space could easily send us a devastating poison pill offer sheet in 2014.
This is a legitimate point, but as far as I've heard, this is purely speculation by fans. I've heard nothing about this from the NHLPA or NHL. It's not something I'd be really concerned about.

Quote:
+ The new CBA could also limit the length of contracts, considerably inflating Giroux's cap hit after 2014.
I don't know about "considerably" inflating his cap hit. You proposed a deal that would pay him 8 million a year. That would put him as the 5th highest cap hit in the NHL. I don't think a limit on the length of contracts would make his cap hit much higher, he can't demand to be paid more than the best players in the world(Malkin & Crosby at 8.7).

Quote:
+ Eliminates a lot of uncertainty about the Flyers long-term cap structure
It helps us plan for the future, but as we've seen, I don't know how much planning for the extreme long term future is worth with Holmgren as GM.

Quote:
+ Guarantees your franchise superstar is on board for another decade
This team is not going to let Giroux reach restricted free agency where he can be poached. Holmgren is not the kind of GM to let things like that happen.
Quote:
Cons

- Why sign Giroux while his value is at its peak?
His value is at its peak in his career so far, but who's to say that he doesn't put up 100 next year?

Quote:
- Why take so much risk (regression or injury) a year or two before it is necessary?
Giroux has no history of injuries, and this is a problem that you could say pertains to signing anyone to an extension.

Quote:
- What if the cap goes way down and Giroux becomes comparatively overpaid?
The cap could go down, and it probably will a bit, but with now revenues are going in the NHL, I can't see it going down enough for this to be an issue.

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Old
07-07-2012, 07:50 PM
  #9
Giroux tha Damaja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
I doubt Giroux does this, at least, if he's smart he does not.
Why wouldn't he? Because the Flyers might trade him in two years? So what, he is getting locked in for ten years, that kind of financial security, whilst signing at his peak value...he'd be stupid not to accept a fair offer for that term. Besides, he can still get traded even if he doesn't sign a long term deal.

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07-07-2012, 07:56 PM
  #10
Alchemy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Why wouldn't he? Because the Flyers might trade him in two years? So what, he is getting locked in for ten years, that kind of financial security, whilst signing at his peak value...he'd be stupid not to accept a fair offer for that term. Besides, he can still get traded even if he doesn't sign a long term deal.
Flyers will not be trading Giroux in two years.

The first center since Lindros to put up a 90 point season.

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07-07-2012, 07:58 PM
  #11
Damaged Goods
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYERSFAN18 View Post
I thought he couldnt sign an extension until July 1st, 2013 because he has to be in the last year of his current deal?
Ah crap, you're right. I thought the Penguins were just waiting until July 1 with Crosby because of tagging.



Oh well. Nevermind then. Now I'm scared about the new CBA.

Maybe offer sheeting Weber isn't as clever as I thought. It could bite us in the behind with Giroux.

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07-07-2012, 08:10 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
I'd say wait closer. I mean ****, he's still an RFA after this current contract is done.
He could still get offer sheeted by a team with more cap space and a better reputation for being kind to players they just extended...

Also, fun fact: Giroux recently signed with Pat Brisson, so now he and Crosby have the same agent. Pay day!

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Old
07-07-2012, 08:12 PM
  #13
Damaged Goods
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gagne Come Back View Post
He could still get offer sheeted by a team with more cap space and a better reputation for being kind to players they just extended...

Also, fun fact: Giroux recently signed with Pat Brisson, so now he and Crosby have the same agent. Pay day!

Well it's all academic now. Giroux can't get any new contracts until next July. I still say sign him ASAP, though.

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07-07-2012, 08:27 PM
  #14
Giroux tha Damaja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sm0ka47 View Post
Flyers will not be trading Giroux in two years.

The first center since Lindros to put up a 90 point season.
Appreciated, but Woof has been on and on about the whole Richards and Carter thing for ages now, and seems to think they were woefully mistreated.

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07-07-2012, 08:48 PM
  #15
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ill go on record rite now and say Roo plays all his most important years in Philly.

not worried about him or his contract. Snider will pay what is required

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07-07-2012, 09:06 PM
  #16
Bryzard of Oz
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Originally Posted by Flyerfan4life View Post
ill go on record rite now and say Roo plays all his most important years in Philly.

not worried about him or his contract. Snider will pay what is required
I agree, but if it's possible to do some kind of 14-15 year, 100M contract which trims his cap hit down to 6.5-7 a year so we can spend a bit more in a couple years I'd be all for it.

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07-07-2012, 09:06 PM
  #17
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Yes. Make it impossible for somebody to wedge in and steal him.

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07-07-2012, 10:07 PM
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YuioIklo
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People thinking that players are scared to sign longterm deals with Holmgren because of Richards and Carter should get over it. He had to trade them and did it, things like that happen and players know it. Any GM could do it. I've got the feeling that Giroux really enjoys the Flyers and would like to stay with us, and it probably won't take a 8mil salary to keep him. But it's just a feeling.

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07-07-2012, 10:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YuioIklo View Post
People thinking that players are scared to sign longterm deals with Holmgren because of Richards and Carter should get over it. He had to trade them and did it, things like that happen and players know it. Any GM could do it. I've got the feeling that Giroux really enjoys the Flyers and would like to stay with us, and it probably won't take a 8mil salary to keep him. But it's just a feeling.
So did Richards, Carter, and JVR.

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07-07-2012, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Hollywood Couturier View Post
So did Richards, Carter, and JVR.
And none of them were ever or will ever be a top 5 player in the game.

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07-07-2012, 10:36 PM
  #21
Giroux tha Damaja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood Couturier View Post
So did Richards, Carter, and JVR.
Should the Flyers never trade another player as long as they exist? Trades happen. It's not a knife in the back.


Holy crap.

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07-07-2012, 10:44 PM
  #22
Hollywood Couturier
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And none of them were ever or will ever be a top 5 player in the game.
Not saying that they were. I'm just stating the fact that Giroux wants to be here means very little. What matters is whether the organization wants them. JVR, Richards, and Carter were moved because the Organization soured on them. I do not want to see Giroux moved and i'm 99% sure he won't be at any point. I expect him to play all of his meaningful years with the Flyers.

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07-07-2012, 10:48 PM
  #23
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Originally Posted by Giroux tha Damaja View Post
Should the Flyers never trade another player as long as they exist? Trades happen. It's not a knife in the back.


Holy crap.
Trades happen, but non-rebuilding teams don't trade members of their core as frequently as the Flyers. The Gagne, Richards, Carter, and JVR trades show that Holmgren sees his players as disposable commodities. There is no loyalty from the Flyers to players that come up through the organization.

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07-07-2012, 11:05 PM
  #24
JohnnyOnTheSpot
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People keep throwing the JVR, Richards and Carter signings as proof that no one's sacred. I know this is speculation, but even if we believe 1% of the rumors that come out (smoke = fire, etc.), Richards and Carter were moved for ice off issues, and Homer didn't want to do it. And I think JVR was moved because he's been kind of disappointing so far.

I think Giroux gets that if he 1) produces and 2) keeps himself clean off ice, he will be safe. I think that's fair to ask of your players.

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07-07-2012, 11:08 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
Trades happen, but non-rebuilding teams don't trade members of their core as frequently as the Flyers. The Gagne, Richards, Carter, and JVR trades show that Holmgren sees his players as disposable commodities. There is no loyalty from the Flyers to players that come up through the organization.
I think the Richards and Carter trades had some complicating factors. It's tough to read into Holmgren's philosophy on team building from that trade. The whole dynamic/situation there was weird, and that's even if you give Carter and Richards the benefit of the doubt about things that aren't absolute fact.

Gagne being part of the core of the team at that point in his career is debatable, but I do wish they'd have held onto him. I actually dislike the degree of roster turnover we've seen in general under Holmgren, so I won't defend all of his moves tooth and nail. I just disagree with premise from which the accusations of disloyalty are made. Trading someone isn't a form of betrayal. Trades are a necessary part of doing business.

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