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Oilers sign Darcy Hordichuk (1year/$850k)

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07-03-2012, 05:20 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
I thought Hordichuk has magical goon powers that prevent players like Boll from running our players just by having Hordi on the team.

That's what people in here are telling me.
The strawman argument.

The last bastion of those who are fighting a lost battle.

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07-03-2012, 05:23 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
I thought Hordichuk has magical goon powers that prevent players like Boll from running our players just by having Hordi on the team.

That's what people in here are telling me.
That's between you and other posters. I don't recall saying anything like that but cool story bro!

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07-03-2012, 05:27 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
They're going to tell you that Renney wouldn't let them which is nonsense.

I would like to see any example from any team in the league where a goon stopped a player from being run.

I like Eager though. He is actually a hockey player.
I will, after you prove to me there is no god.

Have you ever played hockey where there was a real possibility of getting your face beaten in?

Im going to go out on a limb and say no.

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07-03-2012, 05:30 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
That's between you and other posters. I don't recall saying anything like that but cool story bro!
If players like Boll are running our players, Hordichuk isn't going to be able to do anything about it. Sure he can try to "send a message" but how many times have we seen a player change the way they play because another player fought them? It happens very rarely if ever.

I just can't see any benefit in having a player that isn't good at anything except for fighting on the team. I'd rather use that roster spot on a player who can kill penalties, score a goal more than once every fifty games or at least play more than four minutes a night.

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07-03-2012, 05:31 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I will, after you prove to me there is no god.

Have you ever played hockey where there was a real possibility of getting your face beaten in?

Im going to go out on a limb and say no.
Check my post on the last page where I showed three examples of a star player getting run despite the presence of goons on their team.

Goons don't prevent players from being run/injured.

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07-03-2012, 05:32 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
Check my post on the last page where I showed three examples of a star player getting run despite the presence of goons on their team.

Goons don't prevent players from being run/injured.
You wouldnt know one way or the other would you?

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07-03-2012, 05:33 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I will, after you prove to me there is no god.

Have you ever played hockey where there was a real possibility of getting your face beaten in?

Im going to go out on a limb and say no.
I don't understand his argument. It's like saying "prove to me someone didn't do something because they didnt wanna get punched in the face" well I can't prove it to you... Because they simply didn't do it... Because they didn't wanna get punched in the face...

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07-03-2012, 05:36 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
You wouldnt know one way or the other would you?
I have a pretty good idea.

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Originally Posted by ChokeOnOil View Post
I don't understand his argument. It's like saying "prove to me someone didn't do something because they didnt wanna get punched in the face" well I can't prove it to you... Because they simply didn't do it... Because they didn't wanna get punched in the face...
Yet I showed you situations where players were run despite a goon being on the team.

Were the players that threw those hits afraid of being "punched in the face"?

When I made that post I was hoping someone could show me a situation where a goon "sent a message" to another player after he ran someone and that player never ran anyone again. Has it ever happened?

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07-03-2012, 05:37 PM
  #109
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It will never stop. Humans make split second decisions and they aren't always the right one.

I am waiting for the day where the Oil start focusing on the other teams stars.

Will that day come?

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07-03-2012, 05:44 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
I have a pretty good idea.



Yet I showed you situations where players were run despite a goon being on the team.

Were the players that threw those hits afraid of being "punched in the face"?

When I made that post I was hoping someone could show me a situation where a goon "sent a message" to another player after he ran someone and that player never ran anyone again. Has it ever happened?
How old are you? Ever wonder how Gretzky played in the league all those years?

You are trying to quantify something that cannot be put into a nice equation and shown as being effective or not to people who have never been on the ice before.

That is usually the crux of the argument. You usually see people who have never been on the ice when there is a chance he may have to fight say that is doesn't do anything. I don't know how you can say it doesn't do anything when you have never been there yourself.

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07-03-2012, 06:00 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Joe Hallenback View Post
How old are you? Ever wonder how Gretzky played in the league all those years?
Was it because there was a player on his team that couldn't contribute offensively, is a defensive liability, only plays three minutes a night and is useless outside of getting into staged fights with other useless players?

Quote:
You are trying to quantify something that cannot be put into a nice equation and shown as being effective or not to people who have never been on the ice before.

That is usually the crux of the argument. You usually see people who have never been on the ice when there is a chance he may have to fight say that is doesn't do anything. I don't know how you can say it doesn't do anything when you have never been there yourself.
If you take a look at which teams have goons and which don't you will notice that it is largely random which teams get run a lot. The Oilers have goons, our players get hurt all of the time. Detroit has no goons, they don't usually have injury problems. It's not quantifiable but it's easy to tell there is no correlation.

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07-03-2012, 06:15 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
If you take a look at which teams have goons and which don't you will notice that it is largely random which teams get run a lot. The Oilers have goons, our players get hurt all of the time. Detroit has no goons, they don't usually have injury problems. It's not quantifiable but it's easy to tell there is no correlation.
Easy to tell from behind your keyboard?

Glen Sather has always had one of the toughest guys around on his team. His teams have NEVER been pushed around.

Look at the Rangers last year. Led the league in fighting majors.

But I guess we should take your word over the actions of Glen Sather.

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07-03-2012, 06:16 PM
  #113
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How silly...That's like saying how do you know speed limits lead to less incidents..You don't know there are less because they didn't have an incident??

What example would you expect? Someone to say, "Well, I remember a time back in '05 when having some tough guy on X team stopped someone else from getting hurt"...

Really, you want an example?
Or at least an argument of some sort which seems to be beyond you.
You cant 'prove' that having a tough guy who can't play the game is a deterrent to a skill player getting injured. Having said that there are plenty of examples of where a tough guy was dressed and an Oiler still got run.

What is the point of having a tough guy bang some heads after the fact...the damage is done.
Here is the reality....a tough guy that can't play the game does not help the team win. That is a matter of statistical record.


Last edited by guymez: 07-03-2012 at 06:26 PM.
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07-03-2012, 06:27 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Easy to tell from behind your keyboard?

Glen Sather has always had one of the toughest guys around on his team. His teams have NEVER been pushed around.

Look at the Rangers last year. Led the league in fighting majors.

But I guess we should take your word over the actions of Glen Sather.
Your pretty good at making observations from behind your keyboard as well

The Red Wings had the least amount of fighting majors and had very few injury problems last year.

Ken Holland > Glen Sather

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07-03-2012, 06:29 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
Your pretty good at making observations from behind your keyboard as well

The Red Wings had the least amount of fighting majors and had very few injury problems last year.

Ken Holland > Glen Sather
Well...when an argument has to draw examples from the 1980's that tells you all you need to know about its validity.

Whats next...examples form the 50's on relevant goaltending styles.

The game has changed and most people (Ken Holland included) have taken notice.


Last edited by guymez: 07-03-2012 at 06:35 PM.
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07-03-2012, 06:30 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
Your pretty good at making observations from behind your keyboard as well

The Red Wings had the least amount of fighting majors and had very few injury problems last year.

Ken Holland > Glen Sather
You are, in effect calling gm's, and coaches in the nhl, a collection of dumbasses because they dress players like Hordichuk.

Do you really think Hordichuk's five minutes a night is what is holding us back from the playoffs?

Im no nhler but I did play junior and intimidation is real, not imagined.

You should take a step back and look at the absurdity of what you are suggesting.

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07-03-2012, 06:40 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
I have a pretty good idea.

No you don't, you clearly have no experience with how intimidation works on the ice.

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07-03-2012, 06:41 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post

The game has changed and most people (Ken Holland included) have taken notice.
Yes, they have noticed that when you play soft teams you can let someone like kronwell take border line hits, and then not worry about repercussions

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07-03-2012, 06:44 PM
  #119
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No you don't, you clearly have no experience with how intimidation works on the ice.
It doesn't work.

Why do you think our star players get run so much even though we employ players like Hordichuk and MacIntyre?

Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
You are, in effect calling gm's, and coaches in the nhl, a collection of dumbasses because they dress players like Hordichuk.

Do you really think Hordichuk's five minutes a night is what is holding us back from the playoffs?

Im no nhler but I did play junior and intimidation is real, not imagined.

You should take a step back and look at the absurdity of what you are suggesting.
I'm not saying it's holding us back from the playoffs. It certainly isn't making our team better. That roster spot could be used on a player that actually has a use.

Who do you think Hordichuk is intimidating?

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07-03-2012, 07:00 PM
  #120
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Yes, they have noticed that when you play soft teams you can let someone like kronwell take border line hits, and then not worry about repercussions
What repercussions were there? Did Eager being dressed have any impact on that hit?

Potter took a roughing penalty and Ben Eager did nothing. (Oh...he did fight Commadore later in the game but it was meaningless)

Eagers presence did nothing to prevent the hit.

Even if Eager did do something after the fact it doesn't erase the hit.

Hemsky still gets destroyed either way...thats the point.

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07-03-2012, 07:06 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by OilerTyler View Post
I'm not saying it's holding us back from the playoffs. It certainly isn't making our team better. That roster spot could be used on a player that actually has a use.

Who do you think Hordichuk is intimidating?
Hordichuk has a use.

Players on the other team?

Have you ever been punched in the face by an adult who is much bigger and stronger than you?

If yes, how did it feel?

Did it feel like something you would want to have happen again?

If no, then you dont know what you are talking about.

I can tell you from experience, having a player on your team who you know has your back, gives you confidence. Not having that has the opposite effect.

Its a simple, but very real concept.

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07-03-2012, 07:07 PM
  #122
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Stauffer's interview with Hordi today is must listen radio. He implies (without trying to criticize Renney too much) about how he's looking forward to "doing the job that he loves" now that Krueger is coach. Other highlights:

-- He's still planning on settling the score against Dorsett
-- mentioned how the one game he missed (his wife was having a baby) against Calgary was the one Sarich went after Hall. Hordi's got payback in mind!
-- Bob mentioned Glencross trying to start a fight with Nuge. Hordi didn't know that, now he wants Glencross too! He said, "If you let him do that once, he'll think he can get away with all the time. My kid is the same way. Now I have to treat Glencross like a 3 year old!"
I Hordi.

Let the haters hate.

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07-03-2012, 07:11 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Hordichuk has a use.

Players on the other team?

Have you ever been punched in the face by an adult who is much bigger and stronger than you?

If yes, how did it feel?

Did it feel like something you would want to have happen again?

If no, then you dont know what you are talking about.
How many fights were there last season? I don't think players are as intimidated by getting punched in the face as you think they are. Especially the type of players that will take runs at other guys.

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07-03-2012, 07:13 PM
  #124
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How many fights were there last season? I don't think players are as intimidated by getting punched in the face as you think they are. Especially the type of players that will take runs at other guys.
You dont know one way or the other.

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07-03-2012, 07:22 PM
  #125
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You dont know one way or the other.
And I'm sure you know exactly what goes through an NHLers head, right?

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