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Old
07-02-2012, 12:05 PM
  #176
Rockinz
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
So size is more important than anything else?

Wonder why he didn't go after Reinhart?
Reinhart was taken 4th... We had the 5th pick...

Maybe thats why.

NTM Rielly has great skill and Burke has said numerous time he likes skill players with early picks.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:06 PM
  #177
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We don't need every single Top 6 player to be 6'3, 230 pounds.

Ducks Top 6 when they won the cup:
McDonald 5'11 185 lbs
Kunitz: 6'0, 193 lbs
Selanne 6'0, 196 lbs
Perry 6'3 203 lbs
Getzlaf 6'4 224 lbs
Penner 6'4 242 lbs
Three very big guys (Penner, Getzlaf, Perry), and a guy not that big, but very physical (Kunitz). I'd say that top 6 was pretty awesome physically.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:08 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
So because you can't get a 1st. line center you trade your best 2nd. line center?

Where the heck are you going with this? Let's put a 2nd. line AHL part time center on the 1st. line in the NHL?

Ah, you are thinking about 2013 draft? Tank and grab a Canadian center in the draft? Okay, that makes sense. I'm not in a hurry, I can see the team as built today has no chance or ever winning the Cup.
Grabo is only the best 2nd line C, because we are dreadfully mediocre as a team right now. He would have not made the lineup for the last 2 stanley cup winners, this we know. He's not better than Bergeron/Krejci or Richards/Kopitar. And he certainly would not be as effective as a 3rd line checking C as Kelly and Stoll were.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:08 PM
  #179
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I wouldn't mind if TO traded Kessel in a package for a legit first line center who plays a physical game - only if TO is able to sign Doan. They can have a first line that plays with heart and old fashioned grit.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:09 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Rockinz View Post
speaking of teams who need to reach the cap floor, how in the world is PHX going to make it? They have 18 players signed and need to spend $13+ M to reach the floor.

Lombardi to PHX for a 3rd rd pick makes a lot of sense for them and he has had success their before.
Two-for-one deal; take Lombardi for a pick and you get one Komisarek, absolutely free! Call now, because we can't do this all day!

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:10 PM
  #181
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Doesn't B.Ryan have a problem with Carlyle? It got to a point where Murray wanted to trade Ryan but couldn't so he fired Carlyle.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:11 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Pyromaniac3 View Post
Doesn't B.Ryan have a problem with Carlyle? It got to a point where Murray wanted to trade Ryan but couldn't so he fired Carlyle.
I think also losing tons of games contributed to Carlyle's firing.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:12 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Rockinz View Post
Reinhart was taken 4th... We had the 5th pick...

Maybe thats why.

NTM Rielly has great skill and Burke has said numerous time he likes skill players with early picks.
Good point on Reinhart, the next Pronger .

But Interactif is saying size is more important.

However, I think he's saying it isn't about winning it is about getting talent. I doubt a team with Bozak, Connolly as their top 2 centers wins anything, so at this point results are secondary to accumulating talent. Interactif is a tanker.

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Vaive and Ludzik on collapse, and Phaneuf.
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Old
07-02-2012, 12:14 PM
  #184
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So I'm going back and looking at what transpired and I see Connolly + Komisarek for Duchene...

If it were that easy we'd have Duchene, Rielly and Stastny as our top 3 centres and Colorado would have Bozak, Colborne, and McClement.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:14 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Grabo is only the best 2nd line C, because we are dreadfully mediocre as a team right now. He would have not made the lineup for the last 2 stanley cup winners, this we know. He's not better than Bergeron/Krejci or Richards/Kopitar. And he certainly would not be as effective as a 3rd line checking C as Kelly and Stoll were.
Don't worry I understand your thought process. Get rid of the team's best center for a winger. Tank nation lives.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:14 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Good point on Reinhart, the next Pronger .

But Interactif is saying size is more important.

However, I think he's saying it isn't about winning it is about getting talent. I doubt a team with Bozak, Connolly as their top 2 centers wins anything, so at this point results are secondary to accumulating talent. Interactif is a tanker.
Did you miss the last 2 finals Ulf...

BTW I said size is part of the equation, not the only thing that matters. But don't let that stop you from misquoting me.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:16 PM
  #187
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You're objecting to trading Grabo as the centerpiece of a deal for Ryan? This is just about the most off the wall thing you have ever posted to me Ernie. I don't know what to say to this....

There is not one GM out there that would rather keep Grabo than to acquire a young elite talent than Bobby Ryan. None.
first, there is NO DEAL revolving around Bobby Ryan to be discussed, so I'm not objecting to anything.

Seoncondly, I didn't specify that I wouldn't trade Grabbo for Ryan (I would if the circumstances were right), I specified that I wouldn't trade for Ryan right now, at all.

My point is, in the draft, you go BPA, because you don't know the needs of your team in 3-4 years when the kid is ready. When you have a choice in assets, AKA: trading or signing them, you don't focus your best, most valuable assets, on a position that is considered a strength, when they could be used to upgrade a position of need.

Ryan IS NOT a center. We need a better #1 center. If you're going to blow the wad (of assets), you do it on the piece you need. Last year, Richards and Carter became available, and we were outbid, but THAT was a smart use of the assets. If we landed either, we had our #1 center.

Those opportunities rarely come along, but they come along every now and then, when a team needs to shake-up the team, or change the culture/leader.

Marleau is one, but I shiver at what it would cost.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:16 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Don't worry I understand your thought process. Get rid of the team's best center for a winger. Tank nation lives.
Correction, I want to get better players than the best center on the 5th worst team last year. 2nd worst 2 years ago and 7th worst the year before that...

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:17 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Did you miss the last 2 finals Ulf...

BTW I said size is part of the equation, not the only thing that matters. But don't let that stop you from misquoting me.
So if size isn't the most important getting rid of two "Russians" in Kulemin and Grabovski is? Or is that just coincidental?

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:17 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Did you miss the last 2 finals Ulf...

BTW I said size is part of the equation, not the only thing that matters. But don't let that stop you from misquoting me.
Last 2 cup winners had good centre depth while having wingers that were a step below the centres' skill level.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:19 PM
  #191
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I agree, but IF Burke could swallow his pride, he COULD fix most of the Leafs problems. Moving the likes of Phaneuf and Kessel in separate packages could get 2 high end forwards with size/skill. Depth on defense makes Dion expendable, Kessel's a great sniper, but too 1 dimensional. Love to trade a package to the Cap's to obtain Laiche.
o_O!

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:20 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by ErnieLeafs View Post
first, there is NO DEAL revolving around Bobby Ryan to be discussed, so I'm not objecting to anything.

Seoncondly, I didn't specify that I wouldn't trade Grabbo for Ryan (I would if the circumstances were right), I specified that I wouldn't trade for Ryan right now, at all.

My point is, in the draft, you go BPA, because you don't know the needs of your team in 3-4 years when the kid is ready. When you have a choice in assets, AKA: trading or signing them, you don't focus your best, most valuable assets, on a position that is considered a strength, when they could be used to upgrade a position of need.

Ryan IS NOT a center. We need a better #1 center. If you're going to blow the wad (of assets), you do it on the piece you need. Last year, Richards and Carter became available, and we were outbid, but THAT was a smart use of the assets. If we landed either, we had our #1 center.

Those opportunities rarely come along, but they come along every now and then, when a team needs to shake-up the team, or change the culture/leader.

Marleau is one, but I shiver at what it would cost.
You are sure locked into the Center thing, even when there are none available that would accomodate your critaria. Guess we should all sit on our hands until one falls into our laps. Either that or keep enjoy watching 55 pt seasons from the best, untradable #2C in the ENTIRE NHL. Hello lottery pick.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:22 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
So I'm going back and looking at what transpired and I see Connolly + Komisarek for Duchene...

If it were that easy we'd have Duchene, Rielly and Stastny as our top 3 centres and Colorado would have Bozak, Colborne, and McClement.
UGH

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:23 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
You are sure locked into the Center thing, even when there are none available that would accomodate your critaria. Guess we should all sit on our hands until one falls into our laps. Either that or keep enjoy watching 55 pt seasons from the best, untradable #2C in the ENTIRE NHL. Hello lottery pick.
So you want to go with 45-50pt Bozak and 35-40pt Connolly instead of 55-60pt Grabo.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:25 PM
  #195
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So if size isn't the most important getting rid of two "Russians" in Kulemin and Grabovski is? Or is that just coincidental?
When a talent like Ryan is available, you do. Size is part of the equation for Grabo, he's not Parise or Richards. They use their modest size's to their advantage and are tough to knock off the puck. where Grabo is a figure 8 energizer bunny who gets knocked around too easily, not a style that CARLYLE will enjoy, he is not equipped to play an effective physical game. As I said, you are clouding the size issue when I said it is only part of the equation. There are players smaller that can play effectively, Grabo is not one of them.

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07-02-2012, 12:26 PM
  #196
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Here comes the Grabo love...LOL

Always amusing here.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:27 PM
  #197
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When a talent like Ryan is available, you do. Size is part of the equation for Grabo, he's not Parise or Richards. They use their modest size's to their advantage and are tough to knock off the puck. where Grabo is a figure 8 energizer bunny who gets knocked arounf too easily, he is not equipped to play an effective physical game. As I said, you are clouding the size issue when I said it is only part of the equation. There are players smaller that can play effectively, Grabo is not one of them.
I would have to agree with that.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:28 PM
  #198
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
You are sure locked into the Center thing, even when there are none available that would accomodate your critaria. Guess we should all sit on our hands until one falls into our laps. Either that or keep enjoy watching 55 pt seasons from the best, untradable #2C in the ENTIRE NHL. Hello lottery pick.
So who was Ryan's center in Anaheim, looking at assists probably Getzlaf.

I'm sure Connolly can do just as well.

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:28 PM
  #199
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Here comes the Grabo love...LOL

Always amusing here.
he's a 1B - 2A type of center ... i don't get why you hate him so much

he's extremely skilled, hard-working, a good leader, and isn't afraid of physicality

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Old
07-02-2012, 12:30 PM
  #200
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If the Leafs aren't willing to trade the likes of Kessel, Gardnier, Lupul, Kulemin and IMO the over rated Phaneuf, they're not getting much in return. Trading under achieving over paid players isn't going to get the Leafs much, either will the few prospects they other teams would be interested in.
It's almost like you have no memory of any burke trade

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