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IIHF Releases World Junior Rankings

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07-02-2012, 06:39 AM
  #1
Propane Nightmares
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IIHF Releases World Junior Rankings

The IIHF has made a ranking of world junior teams, using the same format as the senior ranking using the tournaments of the past 2 years including both U20 and U18 teams.

http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/n...ash=1a0a78a1ba

Sweden is #1, scroll down for full ranking

Edit: To be clear this ranking was made for research purposes only! It is not official!


Last edited by Propane Nightmares: 07-02-2012 at 06:13 PM.
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07-02-2012, 04:22 PM
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Canada is 4th. What a joke. And then the IIHF wonders why no one takes them seriously.

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07-02-2012, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevyD View Post
Canada is 4th. What a joke. And then the IIHF wonders why no one takes them seriously.


What's wrong now? Not enough weight given to Junior Olympics?

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07-02-2012, 04:47 PM
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What's wrong now? Not enough weight given to Junior Olympics?
I have no idea what that means.

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07-02-2012, 05:02 PM
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italy is creepin up! would love to see them make the top group one year

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07-02-2012, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevyD View Post
Canada is 4th. What a joke. And then the IIHF wonders why no one takes them seriously.
It is only based on the past 2 years, and Canada does not have any gold medals in U18's or U20's during this time, so go figure.

I figured when I posted this thread there would be at least one ******** Canadian, and with the first reply in the thread I was not mistaken.


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07-02-2012, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
It is only based on the past 2 years, and Canada does not have any gold medals in U18's or U20, so go figure.
They should have not included U18's. It must've been obvious the whole thing will be questioned because of that.

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07-02-2012, 06:06 PM
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They should have not included U18's. It must've been obvious the whole thing will be questioned because of that.
Why? Just because one country could not send a near-full strength team?

If you actually read the article you will find the whole point of this ranking is to see what direction the national teams of countries are headed, it does not really apply to Canada because regardless of World Junior placing they will continue to pump out the talent year after year.

This is more aimed for the lower ranked countries as you can see Czech Republic and Norway have fallen 4 places from their senior ranking and Slovenia have improved 5 places, the purpose is just to compare where they are now and where they will be in the future. The top 5 IMO are all interchangeable and will probably not be different in the future.

For emphasis the bottom of the article reads:
Quote:
Note again that this Junior Ranking is unofficial and calculated only for research purposes and based on the principles of the IIHF World Rankings. The official IIHF World Rankings are only calculated for men's senior and women's senior competitions

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07-02-2012, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
Why? Just because one country could not send a near-full strength team?

If you actually read the article you will find the whole point of this ranking is to see what direction the national teams of countries are headed, it does not really apply to Canada because regardless of World Junior placing they will continue to pump out the talent year after year.

This is more aimed for the lower ranked countries as you can see Czech Republic and Norway have fallen 4 places from their senior ranking and Slovenia have improved 5 places, the purpose is just to compare where they are now and where they will be in the future. The top 5 IMO are all interchangeable and will probably not be different in the future.

For emphasis the bottom of the article reads:
Because in mens tournament, there is a reason for the rankings - determining the groups for WC and OG. It's not only U18 Canada who's missing players, but in both U18 and U20 WJC there are multiple teams missing players for various reasons. So it's just as distorted as the mens ranking + there is not that main purpose of the rankings here.

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07-02-2012, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by zorz View Post
Because in mens tournament, there is a reason for the rankings - determining the groups for WC and OG. It's not only U18 Canada who's missing players, but in both U18 and U20 WJC there are multiple teams missing players for various reasons. So it's just as distorted as the mens ranking + there is not that main purpose of the rankings here.
Just saying there's no reason for people to get all ******** over it since it's just for research purposes.

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07-02-2012, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
Just saying there's no reason for people to get all ******** over it since it's just for research purposes.
I have no problem with that at all, just saying that outcome has to be taken with a grain of salt anyways.

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07-03-2012, 04:41 AM
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I always wondered why the IIHF never ranked junior teams like Senior teams; I figured because generally since Canada started sending a true national team 30 years ago and win the U20 WHC on average every two years, (15 gold in 30 years) that Canada would always be ranked number 1. and we all know the IIHF is reluctant to rank Canada at number 1 at anytime. And since it is a 3 year gold medal drought, the IIHF pounces. LOL. I love it.

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07-03-2012, 05:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
Just saying there's no reason for people to get all ******** over it since it's just for research purposes.
I certainly understand your point, but it's completely arbitrary, the IIHF can take whatever statistical data (results) they want from a given time frame (period) give that date a numerical rating and spit out the results they want. It's manipulation. I for example choose the last 3 years, created a 3 point system for medal results (Gold-Silver Bronze) and based on that, Canada and Russia each have 5 pts and because Canada has medaled in all three years, the tie breaker goes to Canada, thus by my system Canada is ranked number 1. You see, so the IIHF ranking system for research purposes serves no purpose at all, because it is false data. Now if the purpose was to blow smoke up Sweden's *** then it's spot on. I'm actually quite impressed with the way Sweden has been developing their young players for the past 5-8 years. There was a period there they nearly fell off the map.

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07-03-2012, 05:30 AM
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Ireland not in the top 40? What a joke.

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07-03-2012, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr Writer View Post
I certainly understand your point, but it's completely arbitrary, the IIHF can take whatever statistical data (results) they want from a given time frame (period) give that date a numerical rating and spit out the results they want. It's manipulation. I for example choose the last 3 years, created a 3 point system for medal results (Gold-Silver Bronze) and based on that, Canada and Russia each have 5 pts and because Canada has medaled in all three years, the tie breaker goes to Canada, thus by my system Canada is ranked number 1. You see, so the IIHF ranking system for research purposes serves no purpose at all, because it is false data. Now if the purpose was to blow smoke up Sweden's *** then it's spot on. I'm actually quite impressed with the way Sweden has been developing their young players for the past 5-8 years. There was a period there they nearly fell off the map.

Its not an arbitrary ranking system (nor a conspiracy against Canada) if the ranking criteria remains consistent from year to year and is applied evenly to everybody. And it appears the junior rankings will do this....much like the senior rankings.

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07-03-2012, 06:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Zine View Post
Its not an arbitrary ranking system (nor a conspiracy against Canada) if the ranking criteria remains consistent from year to year and is applied evenly to everybody. And it appears the junior rankings will do this....much like the senior rankings.
What this guy said.

People on HF continue to not read or appreciate the meaning of the whole article and the other posts in the thread

They have only used the last 2 years because it is for research to look into the future of national teams, if you go back any further it becomes pointless because some of the players from those years will have already broken into the senior teams. There is no IIHF conspiracy against Canada

For the third time it is an unofficial ranking, there is no reason to be ********.

I actually find the results very interesting, I'm ignoring the top 5 since I believe they will be interchangeable in the future. It is interesting to see that Switzerland are on the rise overtaking Slovakia and Czech Republic, who everyone has been saying are declining and these results show that. It is also interesting to see that Slovenia is on the rise.

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07-03-2012, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
What this guy said.

People on HF continue to not read or appreciate the meaning of the whole article and the other posts in the thread

They have only used the last 2 years because it is for research to look into the future of national teams, if you go back any further it becomes pointless because some of the players from those years will have already broken into the senior teams. There is no IIHF conspiracy against Canada

For the third time it is an unofficial ranking, there is no reason to be ********.

I actually find the results very interesting, I'm ignoring the top 5 since I believe they will be interchangeable in the future. It is interesting to see that Switzerland are on the rise overtaking Slovakia and Czech Republic, who everyone has been saying are declining and these results show that. It is also interesting to see that Slovenia is on the rise.
Again, I see your point. I have no problem with the ranking system whatsoever. Like I said, I can create my own to give me the result I want, the IIHF can create it's own to come up with the result it wants, just like a marketing executive can manipulate a survey, creating a question to get the desired result or an accountant that can manipulate the numbers so a loss becomes a profit. It means nothing. I didn't need a ranking system to know that the Czechs and Slovaks have slipped in recent years. But if it helps the Czechs and Slovaks step up their game and turn their developmental system around, then lets have it boys!~ Maybe the Swedes can help out the Czechs and Slovaks a little. If young players coming to Canada has hurt the Czechs and Slovaks that much, then I'm all for import restrictions. Actually, I would prefer that there were less foreigners in Canadian junior hockey. Lets hope the ranking system for "research" has some positive impact on the developmental system there. Peace.

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07-03-2012, 07:28 AM
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They used exactly the same points system as they do for the normal senior rankings, so they are not really manipulating it to suit their own agenda. And there are already import restrictions in the CHL.

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07-03-2012, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
They used exactly the same points system as they do for the normal senior rankings, so they are not really manipulating it to suit their own agenda. And there are already import restrictions in the CHL.
Believe me, I know all about the import restrictions on the CHL. I'm talking having ZERO imports. Let all National federations take care of their own. If that's better for some European countries, then lets do that. I'd prefer Canadian junior players playing in Canadian junior leagues. So, I'm in full agreement with the Europeans on this one.

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07-03-2012, 08:16 AM
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Believe me, I know all about the import restrictions on the CHL. I'm talking having ZERO imports. Let all National federations take care of their own. If that's better for some European countries, then lets do that. I'd prefer Canadian junior players playing in Canadian junior leagues. So, I'm in full agreement with the Europeans on this one.
I agree you don't really need Russians or Swedes in the CHL but for players from countries like Germany it is better for their development to play in the CHL rather than be sitting on the bench in the DEL or tearing up the DNL.

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07-03-2012, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
I agree you don't really need Russians or Swedes in the CHL but for players from countries like Germany it is better for their development to play in the CHL rather than be sitting on the bench in the DEL or tearing up the DNL.
Nope, sorry, I prefer only Canadians in Canadian junior leagues. Let the European countries sink and swim on their own. If the Germans want, they can go play in Sweden or Russia. Can't have it both ways.

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07-03-2012, 08:38 AM
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Yes, lets not bother trying to grow the sport worldwide what a xenophobic view. "Rabble hockey is Canada's sport! Rabble!"

Plus people pay to watch the CHL. Without the Yakupov's and Grigorenko's the overall standard would fall and the fans get less value for what they pay.


Last edited by Propane Nightmares: 07-03-2012 at 08:46 AM.
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07-03-2012, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
Yes, lets not bother trying to grow the sport worldwide what a xenophobic view.

Plus people pay to watch the CHL. Without the Yakupov's and Grigorenko's the overall standard would fall and the fans get less value for what they pay.
You see the hyprocracy, I happen to agree with the European federations that Europeans leaving at a young age to play in N.America is not a good thing for their overall development, not good for them and for the leagues they leave behind. I agree with the Europeans, but yet in your opinion that makes me xenophobic. Too cool. either Europeans from all countries (with import restrictions) can play in the CHL or NOBODY can. Simple as that.

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07-03-2012, 08:51 AM
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Nope, sorry, I prefer only Canadians in Canadian junior leagues. Let the European countries sink and swim on their own. If the Germans want, they can go play in Sweden or Russia. Can't have it both ways.
I'm all for this.

Btw. I've heard some time ago HC was considering reducing CHL imports to 1 per team, but I haven't heard about it again since. Anybody has a clue if that idea is still alive?

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07-03-2012, 08:51 AM
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Now that Canada is rated 4th in junior world rankings, with the Swedes and Russians so much better, maybe it's time for Canada to rethink it's import rules for junior age European players, perhaps because Canada is so bad a developing players (thus 4th in world ranking) Canada shouldn't be concerning itself with growing the game globally. This is all hilarious.


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