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Sharks no longer interested in Daniel Winnik

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:00 AM
  #101
RammsteinGT
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Originally Posted by nix at home View Post
If he does come back, Clowe-Winnik-Wingles doesn't look too bad to me.
Looks okay, but I think it'll get brutalized in defensive zone starts as Winnik is barely a 50% faceoff man. He's more suited to the wing on our roster.

That said, these points are moot as he won't be in Teal this fall.

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07-11-2012, 11:12 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by nix at home View Post
If he does come back, Clowe-Winnik-Wingles doesn't look too bad to me.
That would be an expensive 3rd line with not that much scoring.

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07-11-2012, 02:17 PM
  #103
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They are moot points... But not like we have anything else better to debate, they're pretty much all moot points. Still, fun to speculate.

I think with lower minutes and quality of comp, Clowe could do well. That line would grind and cycle like madmen.

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07-11-2012, 02:38 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by nix at home View Post
They are moot points... But not like we have anything else better to debate, they're pretty much all moot points. Still, fun to speculate.

I think with lower minutes and quality of comp, Clowe could do well. That line would grind and cycle like madmen.
They just might be cycling in the defensive zone.

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07-11-2012, 02:55 PM
  #105
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I know everyone is down on Clowe at the moment but let's not forget what he actually brings to the table. The guy is an elite passer, absolutely great hands, good puck possession skills and can shoot the puck with great accuracy. He's a finisher when he decides to shoot and beast when he decides to go to the net.

Also, he is obviously a better player when he's healthy, unlike last season.

With all that said, he is still possibly the slowest forward in the league.. His top speed is okay but his acceleration is absolutely horrible... which is strange considering he shows flashes of having decent agility. He's just the opposite of quick.

I do think he can and usually does makes his linemates better. Especially with his ability to set players up. I could see Wingels potting some goals with his shot and a guy like Clowe with him. Not to mention Winnik has some speed and would keep the play in the attacking zone better than most. Really though... it's all about chemistry.

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07-11-2012, 03:12 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by dwood16 View Post
I know everyone is down on Clowe at the moment but let's not forget what he actually brings to the table. The guy is an elite passer, absolutely great hands, good puck possession skills and can shoot the puck with great accuracy. He's a finisher when he decides to shoot and beast when he decides to go to the net.

Also, he is obviously a better player when he's healthy, unlike last season.

With all that said, he is still possibly the slowest forward in the league.. His top speed is okay but his acceleration is absolutely horrible... which is strange considering he shows flashes of having decent agility. He's just the opposite of quick.

I do think he can and usually does makes his linemates better. Especially with his ability to set players up. I could see Wingels potting some goals with his shot and a guy like Clowe with him. Not to mention Winnik has some speed and would keep the play in the attacking zone better than most. Really though... it's all about chemistry.
While all of that is true, he's got some major issues too.

1) He's incredibly slow

2) He's wildly inconsistent

3) He's fairly injury prone, and I worry about his long term health. Just a few seasons ago he was having constant knee problems, which is never a good sign. He tends to play through injury a lot, but when he does so he becomes almost totally ineffective as well.

4) He's very likely going to get over paid as a free agent.

Also, on a more speculative note I believe the league is heavily shifting towards a faster game. My bet is withing another season or two players who cannot skate are going to have a much more difficult time staying in the league, or breaking into the league. Clowe's value may decline further if this happens.

As much as I like Clowe, I feel this is a sell high point probably prior to a steep decline in value for various reasons. I like Clowe, but it's simply the right time to move on (for the right return).

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07-13-2012, 09:17 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
While all of that is true, he's got some major issues too.

1) He's incredibly slow

2) He's wildly inconsistent

3) He's fairly injury prone, and I worry about his long term health. Just a few seasons ago he was having constant knee problems, which is never a good sign. He tends to play through injury a lot, but when he does so he becomes almost totally ineffective as well.

4) He's very likely going to get over paid as a free agent.

Also, on a more speculative note I believe the league is heavily shifting towards a faster game. My bet is withing another season or two players who cannot skate are going to have a much more difficult time staying in the league, or breaking into the league. Clowe's value may decline further if this happens.

As much as I like Clowe, I feel this is a sell high point probably prior to a steep decline in value for various reasons. I like Clowe, but it's simply the right time to move on (for the right return).
This is like deja vu. Did you paste this from one of your other posts? In any case, I agree 100% with every aspect.

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07-20-2012, 12:09 PM
  #108
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Average of 1.8m? WHAT? Why were we not on in this? 2 years at 3.6m.... Just really..

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07-20-2012, 12:16 PM
  #109
Ninja Hertl
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Bracing for the overreaction from this board...

..but it's clear that him and his agent were asking for too much and got burned. He was probably asking for a lot more and then realized that teams were closing their doors. This is a good price for him but I highly doubt he was anywhere near that when communicating with DW about another contract.

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07-20-2012, 12:18 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Sharksfan83 View Post
Average of 1.8m? WHAT? Why were we not on in this? 2 years at 3.6m.... Just really..
He's kind of a tweener, Burnish is better fit for the same cap hit. Also, we need more high end offensive wingers which he is not. Only way he gets signed here is if he's available *and* we've not filled our other winger needs - just before camp.
Given that he's a tweener and does not address specific needs like Burnish does i'd say he's not worth the 1.8m to us either.

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07-20-2012, 12:47 PM
  #111
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i dont know how i feel about this. im guessing he was asking for more from us, but we will never know for sure.

at that caphit and term he makes us better

wingels-zeus-winnik
galiardi-desi-burish

maybe he is looking for more scoring talent in the bottom six...who knows.

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07-20-2012, 12:48 PM
  #112
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You're right, DW. He definitely didn't deserve $1.8M.

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07-20-2012, 12:55 PM
  #113
Ninja Hertl
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Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
You're right, DW. He definitely didn't deserve $1.8M.
So... you know that's what he was asking for when UFA hit?

Cmon people... easy to see what happened here.

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07-20-2012, 12:59 PM
  #114
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I'm really wondering if there are character issues with Winnik. He's what, 26? This is the 3rd team to pass on him.

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07-20-2012, 12:59 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
So... you know that's what he was asking for when UFA hit?

Cmon people... easy to see what happened here.
Plus its not that this is surprising. Did DW not already say something to the tune of us going in a different direction.

Its eerily quiet right now. Maybe over the next few weeks DW announces 3 big acquisitions, all in one day ..

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07-20-2012, 01:05 PM
  #116
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Im awaiting the huge overreaction...I'm pretty sure he was asking for way more than what he got and a lot of teams moved on.

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07-20-2012, 01:06 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Rickety Cricket View Post
I'm really wondering if there are character issues with Winnik. He's what, 26? This is the 3rd team to pass on him.
I agree, I think there must have been character issues. DW loves overpaying for 3rd liners, for him to utterly shut down any conversation with Winnik like he did tells me he wanted nothing to do with the guy.

That or Winnik didn't like it here, and did not want to come back. Entirely possible with his comments about our system. Good luck winning in Anaheim though heh.

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07-20-2012, 01:06 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Rickety Cricket View Post
I'm really wondering if there are character issues with Winnik. He's what, 26? This is the 3rd team to pass on him.
If by character issues you mean that he wants more money than he's worth than yes he has character issues, but other than that he seems like a good guy and a locker-room favourite.

His initial contract demans were much higher than 1.8mil according to sources on Avs board and that's probably why Sharks didn't even offer him an official contract extension.

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07-20-2012, 01:06 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
So... you know that's what he was asking for when UFA hit?

Cmon people... easy to see what happened here.
Pretty much, DW screwed this one up. Traded good assets for a player known to be a tough sign - did it anyways, then didn't sign him - after saying he was done with rentals. DW wanted to keep Winnik, but said he was done with him only after he got rejected.

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07-20-2012, 01:07 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Fistfullofbeer View Post

Its eerily quiet right now. Maybe over the next few weeks DW announces 3 big acquisitions, all in one day ..
lets hope quiet means DW is working on it, i hope. he needs to spread them out for us HFer boarders. We don't want to much at once, need to enjoy the summer.

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07-20-2012, 01:08 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Rickety Cricket View Post
I'm really wondering if there are character issues with Winnik. He's what, 26? This is the 3rd team to pass on him.
Its pretty alarming. Hes a useful player but has bounced around a bit for being a younger guy.

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07-20-2012, 01:09 PM
  #122
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seems obvious what happened when you see how quickly he got burish on that exact contract.

there isnt a world of difference between the two players. winnik definitel holds the edge in possession, but i would say burish affects the play more in terms of offensive/defensive output, and he drives possession forward at a higher rate.

we may come to see burish as a better option, but time will tell.

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07-20-2012, 01:10 PM
  #123
Ninja Hertl
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Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
Pretty much, DW screwed this one up. Traded good assets for a player known to be a tough sign - did it anyways, then didn't sign him - after saying he was done with rentals. DW wanted to keep Winnik, but said he was done with him only after he got rejected.
Yes, you are correct, hindsight is indeed 20/20.


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07-20-2012, 01:12 PM
  #124
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Damn... that's almost Torrey Mitchell money.

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07-20-2012, 01:13 PM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gene Parmesan View Post
Its pretty alarming. Hes a useful player but has bounced around a bit for being a younger guy.
Winnik is 27. Has bounced from one team to another. Is known to be a pain in the butt with regard to negotiating contracts. Everyone wants him back.

Semin is 28. Has played for the same team all his NHL career. In undoubtedly the better player of the two. Is 'rumored' to have character issues. Nobody wants him.

The double standards are pretty sad. I'll take Semin over Winnik any day.

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