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Old
07-05-2012, 04:37 PM
  #26
IslesRock4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluechipbonzo View Post
Tavares - 41
Moulson - 39
Okposo - 25
Grabner - 25
Boyes - 25
Bailey - 17
Nielsen - 15
Ullstrom - 14
Joensuu- 12
Cizikas - 11
Streit - 10
Visnovsky - 10
Martin - 10
Hamonic - 8
Reasoner - 8
A. MacDonald - 7
de Haan - 6
C. MacDonald 5
Donovan - 3
Kabanov- 2
Carkner - 0
293 goals would have been the best in the NHL last year by 20 goals. That's a lot of optimism for a pessimistic thread.

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Old
07-05-2012, 04:38 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Bride of Chuckie View Post
I guess Seth Jones wouldn't be such a bad alternative. Am I being too positive for this thread?
MacKinnon. Forget Seth Jones.

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Old
07-05-2012, 04:48 PM
  #28
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looks like rain...

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Old
07-05-2012, 04:52 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by beach View Post
So, I think if you are going to do this, you need to define more specifically what is now frowned upon in topic specific threads. I suggest defining "bashing the organization" as a start.

For example, if we are in the Free Agency thread, are we only allowed to say what a great draft the Isles had, or can we say that drafting seven D men is ridiculous? Or does that comment only happen here?

And if we are in the 2012/2013 New York Islanders Lineup/Roster Thread, can we say that letting Haley go while signing Boulton is a joke, or is that only allowed here?

Running a board like a police state because you don't like negativity does not seem very constructive, since the whole objective of a forum is to hear different sides of an argument. It is not the posters' fault that almost every thread is cause for negative commentary about the Islanders' organization. When it stops being Mickey Mouse, the sentiments will evolve.
When threads degrade into a Wang/Snow basharama (as many seem to do) then it's difficult for people wanting to stay on topic to wade through those posts to continue the discussion. There have been several requests to have a thread so people can go hog wild with all of this 'Micky Mouse' organization talk as you put it. Fire Snow, Fire Wang, this team absolutely sucks. Fine, it's a broken record.

The intention is not to police the threads to eliminate all negativity because we all know that is impossible. The Isles are a bottom feeder team with a whole heap of issues so it's going to be an underlying theme in any type of discussion on here. In the example of the Free Agency thread, opinions and counter arguments is definitely the objective, but is it really necessary to have a bunch of 'Fire Snowang' posts that add little or nothing to the topic being discussed? I personally don't find that very enjoyable and others have expressed similar sentiments.

In the end, everyone is free to do as they please on here and the only rules that need to be followed are the ones listed in the site rules. Nothing is going to change because this is not a successful organization and we have an almost endless supply of material to get upset over. For those that want to try and make some sort of attempt to lessen the negativity in other threads and 'vent' on here, great! If not, that's great too. This thread is an attempt to try and alleviate that a tad and was requested by several individuals.

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Old
07-05-2012, 05:19 PM
  #30
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Yes, I confess. I am pessimistic, and deserve condescension.

Honestly, PWJunior, I think we should all agree to ignore this thread, and its ill-considered sentiment.

Lockstep people. Lock. Step.

Cheers,

Dan-o

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Old
07-05-2012, 05:22 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beach View Post
So, I think if you are going to do this, you need to define more specifically what is now frowned upon in topic specific threads. I suggest defining "bashing the organization" as a start.

For example, if we are in the Free Agency thread, are we only allowed to say what a great draft the Isles had, or can we say that drafting seven D men is ridiculous? Or does that comment only happen here?

And if we are in the 2012/2013 New York Islanders Lineup/Roster Thread, can we say that letting Haley go while signing Boulton is a joke, or is that only allowed here?

Running a board like a police state because you don't like negativity does not seem very constructive, since the whole objective of a forum is to hear different sides of an argument. It is not the posters' fault that almost every thread is cause for negative commentary about the Islanders' organization. When it stops being Mickey Mouse, the sentiments will evolve.
this clearly should have been in the FAQ thread

in all honesty, i am going to reserve all judgment until training camp starts...one big splash for a high caliber player (not saying its going to happen....but it wouldnt shock me) would make most people here cautiously optimistic for a playoff spot

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Old
07-05-2012, 05:47 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by bluechipbonzo View Post
A ten point improvement next season has the Islanders knocking on the door of the playoffs. I think it possible with the current line-up...and here's why:

Tavares line- he moves into yet another gear, cracking 90 points on the season. Moulson will eclipse the 30 goal mark again, and perhaps threaten 40. Boyes is a big body that will be highly motivated on a one-year deal. Parenteau will become an afterthought when he fails to put up similar numbers in Colorado.

Nabokov- veteran stability the team hasn't had since Osgoode will carry the bulk of the load and cut goals against. An improved defense goes a long way here too.

Streit/Viznovsky- both offensive minded defenders still have plenty left in the tank, and should combine for a deadly powerplay

Hamonic/MacDonald- these two youngsters will continue to develop, and yet carry enough NHL experience to be a second pairing tandem on most NHL squads. Splitting them with Streit and Viz will only help.

Rookies and pups- Bailey, Okposo, Martin, and Grabner all have more to offer. No reason to expect regression here, particularly with Tavares' line drawing top checkers. Ullstrom and Cizikas look ready for full-time duty, bringing strong forechecking with offensive support players like Rolston and Pandolfo could never provide.

Snow- the stated goal is to make the playoffs, and what's different this time around is he has publicly stated that the prospect pool is now deep enough to start trading up. The Islanders will be as close as ever to make the playoffs, and I expect Snow will be adding at the trade deadline this year- something he hasn't really done yet since announcing the rebuild.

Sure, this is all speculative on my part. However, It's not rose-coloured glasses, it's being fair:

There's no solid reason to think the kids won't improve.

There's no solid reason to think that the goaltending numbers won't be better with Nabokov as the number one.

There's no solid reason to think the powerplay won't be deadly this year, even with the loss of Pap.

The team is more experienced, grittier, and most of all, hungry.

The dressing room is tight, and the players know it's time to step up.

IMO, they will.
Only one thing to say to this:



but seriously I hope you are right.

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Old
07-05-2012, 05:53 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PWJunior View Post
When threads degrade into a Wang/Snow basharama (as many seem to do) then it's difficult for people wanting to stay on topic to wade through those posts to continue the discussion. There have been several requests to have a thread so people can go hog wild with all of this 'Micky Mouse' organization talk as you put it. Fire Snow, Fire Wang, this team absolutely sucks. Fine, it's a broken record.

The intention is not to police the threads to eliminate all negativity because we all know that is impossible. The Isles are a bottom feeder team with a whole heap of issues so it's going to be an underlying theme in any type of discussion on here. In the example of the Free Agency thread, opinions and counter arguments is definitely the objective, but is it really necessary to have a bunch of 'Fire Snowang' posts that add little or nothing to the topic being discussed? I personally don't find that very enjoyable and others have expressed similar sentiments.

In the end, everyone is free to do as they please on here and the only rules that need to be followed are the ones listed in the site rules. Nothing is going to change because this is not a successful organization and we have an almost endless supply of material to get upset over. For those that want to try and make some sort of attempt to lessen the negativity in other threads and 'vent' on here, great! If not, that's great too. This thread is an attempt to try and alleviate that a tad and was requested by several individuals.
Thanks for the explanation.

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Old
07-05-2012, 07:34 PM
  #34
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To all you folks that constantly moan and groan in the other threads, I'm gonna be a bastion of optimism and crap all over the crap-all-over thread with my blind faith.

Tavares will have a monster year, over 100 pts. The rest of the kids (Bailey, KO, Grabs) will all have at least 60 points as they come into their own after getting rid of that dead weight PAP. MM will have a 50 goal campaign on JT's wing and Boyes rediscovers his scoring flair on the other side. On D, Hammer wins the Norris, AMac continues to show he's the best-value D in the league and Streit and Viz both have over 40 assists while DeHaan becomes a calder candidate with Nino coming up in mid-season and scoring 20. Nabby plays his butt off and DP is healthy and backs him up for 5 games before breaking his hip and retiring. The Isles are in first place in the Atlantic by Feb and that's enough to get the fans back as sell-outs convince the county to finally get a stadium deal done. Isles, with a new deal in place become buyers at the deadline and go on a nice deep run in the POs led by JT. Cappy is runner up for Jack Adams and Garth finally talks to the press without using cliches and muttering...

Take that, you Negative Nancy's and Party Poopers!!

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Old
07-05-2012, 07:37 PM
  #35
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Old
07-05-2012, 08:18 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluechipbonzo View Post
A ten point improvement next season has the Islanders knocking on the door of the playoffs. I think it possible with the current line-up...and here's why:

Tavares line- he moves into yet another gear, cracking 90 points on the season. Moulson will eclipse the 30 goal mark again, and perhaps threaten 40. Boyes is a big body that will be highly motivated on a one-year deal. Parenteau will become an afterthought when he fails to put up similar numbers in Colorado.

Nabokov- veteran stability the team hasn't had since Osgoode will carry the bulk of the load and cut goals against. An improved defense goes a long way here too.

Streit/Viznovsky- both offensive minded defenders still have plenty left in the tank, and should combine for a deadly powerplay

Hamonic/MacDonald- these two youngsters will continue to develop, and yet carry enough NHL experience to be a second pairing tandem on most NHL squads. Splitting them with Streit and Viz will only help.

Rookies and pups- Bailey, Okposo, Martin, and Grabner all have more to offer. No reason to expect regression here, particularly with Tavares' line drawing top checkers. Ullstrom and Cizikas look ready for full-time duty, bringing strong forechecking with offensive support players like Rolston and Pandolfo could never provide.

Snow- the stated goal is to make the playoffs, and what's different this time around is he has publicly stated that the prospect pool is now deep enough to start trading up. The Islanders will be as close as ever to make the playoffs, and I expect Snow will be adding at the trade deadline this year- something he hasn't really done yet since announcing the rebuild.

Sure, this is all speculative on my part. However, It's not rose-coloured glasses, it's being fair:

There's no solid reason to think the kids won't improve.

There's no solid reason to think that the goaltending numbers won't be better with Nabokov as the number one.

There's no solid reason to think the powerplay won't be deadly this year, even with the loss of Pap.

The team is more experienced, grittier, and most of all, hungry.

The dressing room is tight, and the players know it's time to step up.

IMO, they will.
Well, I usually stay positive and agree with some of this but your two bolded statements are a little far fetched. You say there is no solid reason to think the kids will improve but I would really like to see your solid reason on why they are going to improve. I mean, seriously give me one good reason they are. The good reasons I will give that they "might" not is that Grabner's production declined, and Bailey as shown marginal improvement, nowhere near significant enough to warrant the thought that he will contribute on a grand level. The only one who improved was Okposo and he is actually poised for a breakout since he started the season so slow last year coming off of injury. So I really don't see the rationale in Grabner and Bailey. I do hope Grabner gains his scoring touch back, but I gave up hoping for good things from Bailey a LONG time ago. If he ever produces it will be a pleasant surprise for me.

Secondly once again no solid reason to say the PP won't be deadly this year. We lost a 67pt man and replaced him with someone who was playing the 4th line. Sure he has something to prove. Does that mean he'll be able to prove he's a 30 goal scorer again? I'm sure the first year that Cheecho declined they said that about the next year, and then maybe even the one after that. Hell, I remember him signing with the Senators and they were still saying that. I'm not saying he won't, but using the word "solid" for Boyes upcoming season, that's just ballsy. You are only as good as your last season.

So these two statements don't seem anywhere near as solid as you make them out to be. I look at them as question marks just like they were last season and hopefully they will be answered with exclamation points and not ellipses.

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Old
07-05-2012, 09:51 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by leaponover View Post
Well, I usually stay positive and agree with some of this but your two bolded statements are a little far fetched. You say there is no solid reason to think the kids will improve but I would really like to see your solid reason on why they are going to improve. I mean, seriously give me one good reason they are.
Because that's what young hockey players, and honestly young players in basically every major sport do?

Honestly, you don't think a single Islanders player will improve going into next year? That every single player has hit their peak, the absolute best of their abilities? That might be the most ridiculously pessimistic thing I've ever heard on these forums.

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Old
07-05-2012, 10:24 PM
  #38
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Since the sky is falling does it mean I can walk on the clouds?

Always wanted to.

And if I hit a nine iron off a tee on a cloud, does that mean I am on Cloud 9?

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Old
07-05-2012, 11:23 PM
  #39
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That about sums it up right there...

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Old
07-05-2012, 11:49 PM
  #40
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I just want a new arena and/or a def solution already.

Is that too much to ask for?
"yes" -Kate Murray

Next question

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Old
07-06-2012, 12:32 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluechipbonzo View Post
A ten point improvement next season has the Islanders knocking on the door of the playoffs." I think it possible with the current line-up...and here's why:
Tavares line- he moves into yet another gear, cracking 90 points on the season. Moulson will eclipse the 30 goal mark again, and perhaps threaten 40. Boyes is a big body that will be highly motivated on a one-year deal. Parenteau will become an afterthought when he fails to put up similar numbers in Colorado.
Nabokov- veteran stability the team hasn't had since Osgoode will carry the bulk of the load and cut goals against. An improved defense goes a long way here too.
Streit/Viznovsky- both offensive minded defenders still have plenty left in the tank, and should combine for a deadly powerplay
Hamonic/MacDonald- these two youngsters will continue to develop, and yet carry enough NHL experience to be a second pairing tandem on most NHL squads. Splitting them with Streit and Viz will only help.
Rookies and pups- Bailey, Okposo, Martin, and Grabner all have more to offer. No reason to expect regression here, particularly with Tavares' line drawing top checkers. Ullstrom and Cizikas look ready for full-time duty, bringing strong forechecking with offensive support players like Rolston and Pandolfo could never provide.
Snow- the stated goal is to make the playoffs, and what's different this time around is he has publicly stated that the prospect pool is now deep enough to start trading up. The Islanders will be as close as ever to make the playoffs, and I expect Snow will be adding at the trade deadline this year- something he hasn't really done yet since announcing the rebuild.
Sure, this is all speculative on my part. However, It's not rose-coloured glasses, it's being fair:
There's no solid reason to think the kids won't improve.
There's no solid reason to think that the goaltending numbers won't be better with Nabokov as the number one.
There's no solid reason to think the powerplay won't be deadly this year, even with the loss of Pap.
The team is more experienced, grittier, and most of all, hungry.
The dressing room is tight, and the players know it's time to step up.
IMO, they will.
Where to begin...
- It will take more than a ten point improvement to make the playoffs.
- Tavares will have a hard time improving with the current group of forwards.
- There is no reason to think the evolution of Okposo, Bailey, Nino, or Grabner is a "gimmee." We thought that last year. I dare say, we wuz wrong.
- Boyes get's talked up like the next Gretzky in here. 29 Other teams disagree. I give Garth the leeway to prove them all wrong, but not everyone succeeds on his wing.
- I like the goaltending as long as the Rick is not involved, but the defense is not greatly improved, more "somewhat" improved. It will still be somewhat below average, particularly when they play two rookies back there. And yes, they will...
- Viz has been an injury bug lately, and Streit has shown too much inconsistency the past two seasons he played to pretend we have some sort of magic combination in the offensive defenseman dept. Neither offer anything physically which was the number one need.
- The PP gained Viz, but lost PAP. I don't see some sort of massive improvement there as you took one of John's tools away and replaced it with what, Boyes?
- Hamonic will surely improve, but MacDonald? I counted as many good games as awful from him last year. Hard to see how his transformation into Pronger is being scouted.
- The hot dogs will be grittier. Could be all those season ticket plans getting ground up and added to the filler.

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Old
07-06-2012, 07:19 AM
  #42
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293 goals would have been the best in the NHL last year by 20 goals. That's a lot of optimism for a pessimistic thread.

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Old
07-06-2012, 08:42 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by A Pointed Stick View Post
Where to begin...
- It will take more than a ten point improvement to make the playoffs.
- Tavares will have a hard time improving with the current group of forwards.
- There is no reason to think the evolution of Okposo, Bailey, Nino, or Grabner is a "gimmee." We thought that last year. I dare say, we wuz wrong.
- Boyes get's talked up like the next Gretzky in here. 29 Other teams disagree. I give Garth the leeway to prove them all wrong, but not everyone succeeds on his wing.
- I like the goaltending as long as the Rick is not involved, but the defense is not greatly improved, more "somewhat" improved. It will still be somewhat below average, particularly when they play two rookies back there. And yes, they will...
- Viz has been an injury bug lately, and Streit has shown too much inconsistency the past two seasons he played to pretend we have some sort of magic combination in the offensive defenseman dept. Neither offer anything physically which was the number one need.
- The PP gained Viz, but lost PAP. I don't see some sort of massive improvement there as you took one of John's tools away and replaced it with what, Boyes?
- Hamonic will surely improve, but MacDonald? I counted as many good games as awful from him last year. Hard to see how his transformation into Pronger is being scouted.
I see things much like this as well.

Fortunately, my gut feeling tells me that while Moulson, Okposo and Nielsen will all hover around 50 point land, with Boyes getting back into 40 pointville, that particularly Tavares, Bailey and Streit will see a considerable rise in their stats. Dunno why, just think it's coming.

Hopefully it'll be enough.

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Old
07-06-2012, 08:52 AM
  #44
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The only thing that I'm absolutely sure on is that JT will get about 96 points this year based on trend. He improved 13 points from years 1 to 2 and 14 points years 2-3. So if he improves 15 points years 3-4 I'll be very happy.

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Old
07-06-2012, 09:01 AM
  #45
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And who wouldn't ever agree with "A picture is worth 1,000 words."


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Old
07-06-2012, 09:15 AM
  #46
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Who is the crackhead that had Okposo, Grabner & Bailey combining for 70+ goals?

LOL

Clearly, some of us have gotten more sun than others..

With the safe assumption that SnoWang will not be making any big moves this summer and acquiring anyone who will help ( Kill DP, get two solid D men, or find the next Stamkos), we will have.....

wait for it......





THE SAME SEASON AS LAST YEAR. FILLED WITH PAIN.



See ya in October....

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Old
07-06-2012, 09:17 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Bones45 View Post
Who is the crackhead that had Okposo, Grabner & Bailey combining for 70+ goals?

LOL

Clearly, some of us have gotten more sun than others..

With the safe assumption that SnoWang will not be making any big moves this summer and acquiring anyone who will help ( Kill DP, get two solid D men, or find the next Stamkos), we will have.....

wait for it......





THE SAME SEASON AS LAST YEAR. FILLED WITH PAIN.



See ya in October....
I think his real name is Garth Snow.

I'll be surprised if they combine for 55.

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Old
07-06-2012, 09:20 AM
  #48
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I know I'm an idiot, but I am looking forward to October. Is this the year Kyle Okposo comes running out of the gate? I'm anxous to see how Brad Boyes looks with JT and Matt Moulson. Can this team excel in spite of the coaching and ownership challenges? I'm a sucker.

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Old
07-06-2012, 09:25 AM
  #49
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I know I'm an idiot, but I am looking forward to October. Is this the year Kyle Okposo comes running out of the gate? I'm anxous to see how Brad Boyes looks with JT and Matt Moulson. Can this team excel in spite of the coaching and ownership challenges? I'm a sucker.
and Isbister will come back and score 35 for us, right?


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Old
07-06-2012, 09:28 AM
  #50
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wondering if Garth Snow has a twitter account. I'd like to thank him for this looooong rebuild, and to tell him that he is a clown GM and that he sucks!!! But yes because I like to scream and yell like a maniac and because I like being in "fits of rage" I will continue to watch and support this trainwreck from afar. You suck Snowang!!!

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