How much could a longer contract affect the salary (downwards), say 8 years? Long contracts got their downsides but sure it could get Edler cheaper too. I just ask as everyone seems to exclude the option, is it that unreasonable?
I'd give Edler a long contract right now until he's forty if he's willing to do something like this:
This is a joke right? 4 million can't get you anything, you go try signing a 27 year old 50 point defenseman for 4 mill on the free market. Not that good? Continuously upward trending scoring totals would say otherwise.
Gillis has previously said that he's not the biggest fan of retirement contracts (didn't give the Sedins one, didn't even discuss about one for Ehrhoff) and that Luongo was an exception because he's a goalie.. and look how that turned out.
Add in the fact that those contracts shouldn't even be an option when the season starts (hopefully, with new CBA) so I don't see that as very likely to happen. It's probably going to be 5-7 years... anything below the cap hit of 6 and I'm happy.
Probably needs more up front and less at the end though.
If I read this right, at 30 he'll be making $5M, $4.5M at 31, $4M at 32, $3.5M at 33, $3M at 34 and $2.5M at 35. Those are still going to be in his good years, and even though he's making money upfront, he's only making above market value for his first two years, so not enough to compensate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus
Yea, if we structured it like this:
9+9+8+8+7+7+5+3+1+1+1+1+1 = $4.70 AAV
If he retires at 35 years old, the AAV is $7M.
This would be closer to his value with a minor tweak in the bolded part because I believe you can't drop by more than 50% in a year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vajakki
Gillis has previously said that he's not the biggest fan of retirement contracts (didn't give the Sedins one, didn't even discuss about one for Ehrhoff) and that Luongo was an exception because he's a goalie.. and look how that turned out.
Add in the fact that those contracts shouldn't even be an option when the season starts (hopefully, with new CBA) so I don't see that as very likely to happen. It's probably going to be 5-7 years... anything below the cap hit of 6 and I'm happy.
But then there's this. So it might all be moot.
I'd be fine at $6M for 6 years, I think $5.5M is good value and $5M is great value given what the market will pay him.
I'd sign Edler to that deal. I'd prefer less though.
We can all talk about how he'd be the undisputed #1 UFA d-man in 2013, but I think teams would be hesitant to sign an introvert who likes to be a passenger or a under the radar player to HUGE money.
You want to pay big money to guys you know can either a) provide Elite level consistency or b) can provide significant leadership.
Edler is too 'shy' for low level teams to trot out as a FA coup. Not saying teams like Detroit or Pittsburgh (who have established leadership groups) wouldn't pursue Edler, but I also feel they wouldn't overpay or pay significantly more than the Canucks would.
I think Edler is happy and comfortable playing in Vancouver, and will likely sign a favourable deal for both himself and the club (much like we saw with the Twins, Kesler, Bieksa, Burrows, Hamhuis, Garrison etc, etc). He wants to be here, as far as i can tell and Gillis continues to try and build his confidence up by talking him up in the media, so I'd think the feeling is mutual.
If Gillis manages to lock up Edler for less than Enstrom...i'll be extremely impressed. Enstrom is a great defender in his own right, but Edler significantly outpaced him in point production, and has a huge edge in the physical dimension he can bring to the ice. Winnipeg or not, i think Edler/his agent will press hard for a deal above what Enstrom got.
Seabrook is a much fairer comparable i think, as you threw him in there. But that contract was signed in a different cap environment, and with the inflation we've seen since then...that's a $6M+ deal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DL44
I wrote in the 'Around' thread... i think this Enstrom contract now establishes the floor for the Edler contract...
Edler is now the lone remaining defensive gem left for the 2013 UFA class... and we all know what the gems of their positions get in Free Agency...
Edler 27...
and then who...
Smid, The Anton, Whitney, Scuderi, Murray...
And then 35 and older:
Streit, Lydman, Visnovsky, Timonen, Zidlicky
Gillis should just gamble that the gong show that was Edler this spring was simply growing pains and sign him now. Then hope he gets hit with a 15-20% rollback in cost.
If I'm Edler, I will obviously try to test free agency next yr IF UFA AGE REMAINS 27. So there's that side of the gamble for Edler as well.
Agreed. That Enstrom deal helps to set a 'baseline' for an Edler contract...but unless Gillis pulls off a massive coup with his whole, 'Hamhuis-cap' philosophy and Edler is gullible/nice enough to buy it...i just don't see how Edler's agent will look at that Enstrom deal and not be able to say...Edler is the better player, and as such, deserves more money.
If Gillis manages to lock up Edler for less than Enstrom...i'll be extremely impressed. Enstrom is a great defender in his own right, but Edler significantly outpaced him in point production, and has a huge edge in the physical dimension he can bring to the ice. Winnipeg or not, i think Edler/his agent will press hard for a deal above what Enstrom got.
Seabrook is a much fairer comparable i think, as you threw him in there. But that contract was signed in a different cap environment, and with the inflation we've seen since then...that's a $6M+ deal.
Edler most certainly did not significantly out produce Enstrom. That would be like suggesting Enstrom blew Edler out of the water last year as Edler was the one injured.
Their paces were with 6 or 7 points of eachother, Enstrom has actually hit 50 points in his career, and doesn't have get the luxury of racking up points with the Sedin's. Edler wasn't invited to the 2010 Olympics, Enstrom was.
Edler is in the group of players that make under $6m/yr AAV.
I really don't see a rush into signing him now, nor would I go over $6.
Edler's agent can't want all he would like, Gillis is in no rush and with a smaller cap, he'll be signing a similar deal to ENstrom, Seabrook, Burns.
I could easily make 30% more money doing the same work in Alberta right now but I choose not to. Gillis forces players to make that kind of decision. Beyond the cap savings, I think it says something about their character. Gillis might not get Edler for 4.6m x 6 but he isn't going to open up the vault for him either. At least nothing in his past says that he will.
I could easily make 30% more money doing the same work in Alberta right now but I choose not to.
Yeah but hockey players spend half of their work year out of town anyway, and their salaries make it much easier for them to travel back to where they actually want to live. I don't know, but I bet Edler also spends a good amount of the off-season in Sweden. His situation is really not comparable to most regular people.
Somewhat related, I was born in Whalley and I can say that I would gladly take a 30% pay cut to not live there. So I guess it depends on personal preferences.
Somewhat related, I was born in Whalley and I can say that I would gladly take a 30% pay cut to not live there. So I guess it depends on personal preferences.
I don't live in Whalley anymore but I'd rather live there than Alberta or Winnipeg.
I could easily make 30% more money doing the same work in Alberta right now but I choose not to. Gillis forces players to make that kind of decision. Beyond the cap savings, I think it says something about their character. Gillis might not get Edler for 4.6m x 6 but he isn't going to open up the vault for him either. At least nothing in his past says that he will.
Is Enstrom any good??? I sense mad overpayment here. Edler at 5.5 a year home discount. He will get 6 mil on the free market for 1000 years
Enstrom is the better of the two IMO, but I think Edler has the better upside. Also his size matters in the playoffs. Enstrom at 5.75MM is a good deal. Especially playing in Winnipeg.
I hope we re-sign him this off season... I rather pay him now then watch him breakout this season with a steady defenceman in Garrison and get something like 20G 40A +20 and having to pay through the nose.
I rather pay him now then watch him breakout this season with a steady defenceman in Garrison and get something like 20G 40A +20 and having to pay through the nose.
I'm curious, how much more than the 5.5-6m per that people are suggesting we sign him for do you think that will earn him? If I'm paying Edler that much money, I'm expecting those numbers.
I'm curious, how much more than the 5.5-6m per that people are suggesting we sign him for do you think that will earn him? If I'm paying Edler that much money, I'm expecting those numbers.
60pts is like 7MM category. I think right now he's at 5-5.5MM on a 5-6 year deal, including inflation.
5.5 is great value for the potential and a slight overpayment if he remains stagnant.
Not at all kid.
His current value for what he brings is 5.5 a year minimum. A 50 point defenceman that plays 22-25 minutes a night isn't running on potential...he has arrived, and he's been a highly coveted defenceman around the league for 3 or 4 years now.
His current value for what he brings is 5.5 a year minimum. A 50 point defenceman that plays 22-25 minutes a night isn't running on potential...he has arrived, and he's been a highly coveted defenceman around the league for 3 or 4 years now.
Of course he has but his real potential is to be a top 3-5 dman.. he's just way too inconsistent defensively to pay him like one right now. Let's see how he is with a legit partner and not a slow Salo.
So it might all be moot. 
