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Quincey Files for Arbitration

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Old
07-05-2012, 06:47 PM
  #26
TheMoreYouKnow
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Souray is 36, Corvo is 35. Quincey is 26. A mid 20s D-man who has shown some all-round potential is worth way more than those guys, hence why we gave up a first round pick for im.

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07-05-2012, 06:57 PM
  #27
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Effing Quincey..

I bet he'll play a sub-mediocre season.

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07-05-2012, 07:11 PM
  #28
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Why don't ya'll just calm the f down.

He filed so he can get something done and move on. It happens all the time. A lot of players file so they can get something done before arbitration. But just because quincey didn't live up to your expectations doesn't mean you need to flame the guy. Let him have his $3.8 and see what he does in a detroit uniform next year.

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07-05-2012, 07:12 PM
  #29
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This is genius move by Q.
He knows Holland well (who thinks Q is good top 4). Holland will over-value Q, thinking if he goes to arbitration he will get more money, and offer Q something like 4M per for few years before the hearing.

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07-05-2012, 07:41 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by last_sd View Post
This is genius move by Q.
He knows Holland well (who thinks Q is good top 4). Holland will over-value Q, thinking if he goes to arbitration he will get more money, and offer Q something like 4M per for few years before the hearing.
Yeah, from a contract perspective, I doubt that Quincey was too upset that the Wings didn't land Suter. He knows that Detroit needs him or some other semi-competent defensemen pretty badly, so he's probably hoping this translates into him getting close to $4mil or so. I'm hoping that we trade for Enstrom or somebody comparable, pick up a decent bottom pairing guy like Rozsival, and see Quincey sent off in a deal somewhere else. Actually, I'd really like Holland to sign him to a decent extension and then flip him to the 'Peg as part of the deal for Enstrom.

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07-05-2012, 07:42 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyBuddha View Post
Why don't ya'll just calm the f down.

He filed so he can get something done and move on. It happens all the time. A lot of players file so they can get something done before arbitration. But just because quincey didn't live up to your expectations doesn't mean you need to flame the guy. Let him have his $3.8 and see what he does in a detroit uniform next year.
The post above you tells you what he will do.

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07-05-2012, 08:05 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by TheMoreYouKnow View Post
He's a RFA, as far as I know he can't simply test the open market.
That's what the FA in RFA stand for. Free agent. He can sign with anyone. The only "restriction" is that Kenny has the option to match. **** matching... take the picks and run!

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07-05-2012, 08:14 PM
  #33
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we should have put that trade for him through arbitration.

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07-05-2012, 08:31 PM
  #34
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That's what the FA in RFA stand for. Free agent. He can sign with anyone. The only "restriction" is that Kenny has the option to match. **** matching... take the picks and run!
Yeah but that's not really an open market because teams have to weigh the picks against his services.

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07-05-2012, 08:38 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Henkka View Post
I just don't understand what Quincey is thinking. His qualifying offer was 3.125 million, the same salary than at last year. Isn't that enough? Quite nice money already to make a fresh start for the next season.

This is just dump ass move, to maybe get some laughs, if the arbitrator gives the same money or even less.
Seriously guys? (Not just to Henkka, but most people here...)

There's a good chance he wants out of Detroit. He's 27 next year. He'll be an UFA if he's not signed to a long term contract.

Pretty simple plan: File for arbitration, don't agree to anything the Wings offer in the mean time*, let the arbitrator rule whatever salary he wants (doesn't really matter to Q, Wings weren't going to pay him well regardless), hit the free market next year and get a 4+ year/$4M+ deal.

*Remember, Holland said Quincey's agent never made a counter offer to his initial proposal.

And who knows, maybe the Wings panic (doubtful) and give him the long term deal before arbitration. Regardless, it was a smart move by Quincey. (For the Wings--if this happens--not so smart, considering it cost them a 1st rounder. So maybe they do panic? lol)

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07-05-2012, 08:44 PM
  #36
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Yeah but that's not really an open market because teams have to weigh the picks against his services.
I believe that's where the R for Restricted comes into play.

The more I think about it, the more I hope Kenny goes against his own history and signs him to a 3 or 4 year deal at a reasonable cap hit, then uses him as trade bait as part of a package for someone better- Q at a decent contract for 3/4 years would be more attractive than trying to trade him as is.

Don't blame Q for wanting to see if he can squeeze more $$ out of the Wings, and I sure wouldn't blame Kenny for signing and then trading him to maximize his value.

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07-05-2012, 08:50 PM
  #37
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The little punk... Geeze, can it get any worse?

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Old
07-05-2012, 08:57 PM
  #38
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"and after reviewing his case, arbitration decides quincey is not actually worth more to a team than new trident layers and will be paid accordingly"

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07-05-2012, 09:03 PM
  #39
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Can't blame a dude for looking out for himself when I myself am a selfish person, but man is Kyle Quincy just the gift that keeps on giving or what?

With that being said, anything under 3.5 million and I won't care. It's not like we have any better options and at least he has shown spurts of being good in the past.

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07-05-2012, 09:08 PM
  #40
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Pretty clear that nobody knows anything about NHL arbitration...

Quote:
Originally Posted by norrisnick View Post
That's what the FA in RFA stand for. Free agent. He can sign with anyone. The only "restriction" is that Kenny has the option to match. **** matching... take the picks and run!
By filing for arbitration, Q is forgoing the right to sign an offer sheet. He knows that nobody is going to offer sheet him for the compensation that would be required to top his arbitration award, whatever that may end up being. Therefore there can be no picks, no matching, no signing, etc.

Here are the possible outcomes, now that Q has filed for arb:

1. They agree to a contract before the hearing.
2. They go through the hearing and the Wings agree to the arb number. Q plays out the contract and becomes UFA afterward.
3. They go through the hearing and the Wings decide the arb number is too high and cut him loose.

There is absolutely zero chance that scenario 3 happens. If it were possible for there to be less than zero chance, that would be how much chance there would be of scenario 3 happening. They paid a 1st rounder for him, and they're going to give him the opportunity to justify that expenditure.

Scenario 1 and 2 are about equally likely IMO, and there isn't likely to be a lot of difference between the numbers in either case. I don't expect the Wings to sign him long-term, so they'd be talking about a 1 year deal anyway. Maybe 2 years, but I doubt it.

Filing for arbitration has practically no impact on the handling of Q this summer. He's going to get about $3.5 million to play next season for the Wings and then he's going to UFA next July. Both sides will hope he has a big year.

Everybody needs to chill the hell out on this. It's not any kind of nasty or negative thing for Q to be doing. Instead of sitting around all summer waiting for offer sheets that will never come and waiting for Ken Holland to finish trying to sign other free agents, it's going to be settled by early August. Chillax.

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07-05-2012, 09:45 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarcastro View Post
Pretty clear that nobody knows anything about NHL arbitration...



By filing for arbitration, Q is forgoing the right to sign an offer sheet. He knows that nobody is going to offer sheet him for the compensation that would be required to top his arbitration award, whatever that may end up being. Therefore there can be no picks, no matching, no signing, etc.

Here are the possible outcomes, now that Q has filed for arb:

1. They agree to a contract before the hearing.
2. They go through the hearing and the Wings agree to the arb number. Q plays out the contract and becomes UFA afterward.
3. They go through the hearing and the Wings decide the arb number is too high and cut him loose.

There is absolutely zero chance that scenario 3 happens. If it were possible for there to be less than zero chance, that would be how much chance there would be of scenario 3 happening. They paid a 1st rounder for him, and they're going to give him the opportunity to justify that expenditure.

Scenario 1 and 2 are about equally likely IMO, and there isn't likely to be a lot of difference between the numbers in either case. I don't expect the Wings to sign him long-term, so they'd be talking about a 1 year deal anyway. Maybe 2 years, but I doubt it.

Filing for arbitration has practically no impact on the handling of Q this summer. He's going to get about $3.5 million to play next season for the Wings and then he's going to UFA next July. Both sides will hope he has a big year.

Everybody needs to chill the hell out on this. It's not any kind of nasty or negative thing for Q to be doing. Instead of sitting around all summer waiting for offer sheets that will never come and waiting for Ken Holland to finish trying to sign other free agents, it's going to be settled by early August. Chillax.
Yep. So, we most likely gave up a 1st round draft pick so he could play a season with us and then become a UFA.

Awesome.

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Old
07-05-2012, 09:55 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by HockeyBuddha View Post
Why don't ya'll just calm the f down.

He filed so he can get something done and move on. It happens all the time. A lot of players file so they can get something done before arbitration. But just because quincey didn't live up to your expectations doesn't mean you need to flame the guy. Let him have his $3.8 and see what he does in a detroit uniform next year.
Why don't you stop telling people what to do? The last DRW to take the organization to arbitration was Jiri Hudler. That didn't exactly work out so well: he bolted to the KHL, played like crap the next season, and then had a solid season when he spent the entire year on Fil and Z's line. He was not a difference maker but was paid like one.

Holland has to walk the **** away from Quincey. **** it, sign Scott Hannan I really don't ****ing care, just don't overpay Quincey for 1 or 2 years. We may not sign guys like Ryan Suter or Zach Parise but please let us at least continue to get the player valuation thing right and let Quincey go play for someone else. I mean seriously, throw Jakub Kindl out there so the fanboys can realize just how not ready he is to play in the NHL. At least he costs next to nothing and doesn't seriously impact our cap space if we can somehow acquire an elite player through voodoo or just plain dumb luck.

Seriously.

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07-05-2012, 09:57 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Hckytwn View Post
Yep. So, we most likely gave up a 1st round draft pick so he could play a season with us and then become a UFA.

Awesome.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost_dilemma

Quote:
A sunk cost dilemma is a dilemma of having to choose between continuing a project of uncertain prospects already involving considerable sunk costs, or discontinuing the project. Given this choice between the certain loss of the sunk costs when stopping the project versus possible – even if unlikely – long-term profitability when going on, policy makers tend to favour uncertain success over certain loss.
The pick is gone. Nothing will ever bring it back. The Wings can only hope that his play this season will in some way justify the cost.

Throwing him away for nothing would be sinking the cost up front, denying them the possibility of success. In other words, dumping him now is failure and there exists the possibility that they'll have success by hanging onto him.

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07-05-2012, 10:02 PM
  #44
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Why don't you stop telling people what to do? The last DRW to take the organization to arbitration was Jiri Hudler. That didn't exactly work out so well: he bolted to the KHL, played like crap the next season, and then had a solid season when he spent the entire year on Fil and Z's line. He was not a difference maker but was paid like one.

Holland has to walk the **** away from Quincey. **** it, sign Scott Hannan I really don't ****ing care, just don't overpay Quincey for 1 or 2 years. We may not sign guys like Ryan Suter or Zach Parise but please let us at least continue to get the player valuation thing right and let Quincey go play for someone else. I mean seriously, throw Jakub Kindl out there so the fanboys can realize just how not ready he is to play in the NHL. At least he costs next to nothing and doesn't seriously impact our cap space if we can somehow acquire an elite player through voodoo or just plain dumb luck.

Seriously.
Despite our mutual Q hate, Hudler's arbitration # was fine. He was great for his price this past season. One of the guys on the team who actually made offense happen outside of Dats.

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07-05-2012, 10:03 PM
  #45
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Yep. So, we most likely gave up a 1st round draft pick so he could play a season with us and then become a UFA.

Awesome.
It's called throwing good money after bad. It's just becoming a bigger money pit. The fact remains the Red Wings qualified Quincey at a very reasonable salary and Quincey:

A. Didn't accept it
and
B. Clearly feels like he's worth more money

Why waste your time and risk having an arbitrator agree with Quincey? I mean at least Hudler had some sex appeal, Quincey has been dumped by three franchises thus far. Quincey feels like he's worth more than Detroit does. Best case scenario is you determine what he wants to sign for and you come up with a trade for him that is contingent on him being signed to that new dollar amount he is seeking and a term that is amenable to the new team.

Get it done.

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07-05-2012, 10:05 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Megan Foxs Thumbs View Post
Despite our mutual Q hate, Hudler's arbitration # was fine. He was great for his price this past season. One of the guys on the team who actually made offense happen outside of Dats.
We could have signed Sammy and told Hudler to go **** himself. That's what I would have preferred to see Ken Holland do in that situation.

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07-05-2012, 10:12 PM
  #47
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We could have signed Sammy and told Hudler to go **** himself. That's what I would have preferred to see Ken Holland do in that situation.
Don't think it would've made a difference at this point, do you?

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07-05-2012, 10:15 PM
  #48
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Don't think it would've made a difference at this point, do you?
Well we wouldn't have gotten 1 good year in 3 seasons so yeah, I am pretty sure it would have been better than having Hudler on the team.

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07-05-2012, 10:18 PM
  #49
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Well we wouldn't have gotten 1 good year in 3 seasons so yeah, I am pretty sure it would have been better than having Hudler on the team.
I think if anything, it would've given Nyquist more of a chance at ice. Which is the only difference I think. But meh anyways. Hudler is gone now and Sammy is back. So now we just have to hope Q takes a hike as well.

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07-05-2012, 11:08 PM
  #50
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F him. Let him walk and max out an offer sheet to weber.

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