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Ales Hemsky To Pittsburgh

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Old
07-12-2012, 09:44 PM
  #151
misfit
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Originally Posted by rockinghockey View Post
This is ironic that they want a top 6 winger but will only give up low end prospects. EDM has plenty of those type of prospects so why would they give him up for nothing.
Exactly.

The Oilers aren't trying to get rid of Hemsky. They just signed the guy to a two year extension and they're not in any danger of going over the cap. If they trade him, they'll have to have a reason. I'd have to think it would be to fill an actual hole on the roster or because an offer came in that was too good to pass up. B level prospects and 2nd/3rd round picks aren't things that are going to give the Oilers a reason to trade Hemsky.

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07-12-2012, 09:45 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
I seem to remember a team called the Penguins winning some sort of cup with Chris Kunitz as their best winger. Offence was definitely the Pens problem in the series against the Flyers.
That was 4 years ago man.

Since then, tell me what the Pens have done of significance? 1st & 2nd Round exits?

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07-12-2012, 09:45 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
I think you're definition of starters is pretty lose, if you played in less than half the games then you shouldn't be counted as a starter.
That's what I mean, guys like Elliot/Halak I didn't want to NOT count, as they were phenomenal, so I just counted one of them. I still ended up in the 23rd area.

Back on subject, looking at Corsi shows Hemsky as having the "hard" shifts in terms of opponent quality, all while going out with Horcoff and Gagner, I can see the reason for the dip in production.

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07-12-2012, 09:51 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by RehnX View Post
Back on subject, looking at Corsi shows Hemsky as having the "hard" shifts in terms of opponent quality, all while going out with Horcoff and Gagner, I can see the reason for the dip in production.
Hemsky's production had nothing to do with his linemates or role. He's been Horcoff's linemate for years, and Horc has always drawn the toughest assignments, so Ales has played against good players for a while. Hemsky didn't put up the numbers last year because he was injured pretty much the whole year which should've been blatantly obvious to anyone who watched him play at all last year. When he finally seemed to be over the injury late in the season, he was outstanding. He was also terrific at the Worlds.

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07-12-2012, 09:53 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Gobo View Post
That was 4 years ago man.

Since then, tell me what the Pens have done of significance? 1st & 2nd Round exits?
I don't think we should play that game, my point was that offense wasn't our biggest problem. I'm not sure how Hemsky helps the Pens where he carries a risk of being on IR by the time the playoffs role around.

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Originally Posted by RehnX View Post
That's what I mean, guys like Elliot/Halak I didn't want to NOT count, as they were phenomenal, so I just counted one of them. I still ended up in the 23rd area.

Back on subject, looking at Corsi shows Hemsky as having the "hard" shifts in terms of opponent quality, all while going out with Horcoff and Gagner, I can see the reason for the dip in production.
Hemsky always played with relatively modest linemates so I don't think that's a huge factor in the dip in production. PP production is the main reason for his dip, He put up 31 PPP and 35 ESP in 08-09 (72 GP) and in 11-12 he put up 27 ESP and only 9 PPP (69GP).

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07-12-2012, 09:56 PM
  #156
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A 2013 1st plus Eric Tangradi and Simon Despreses to Edmonton for Hemsky.

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07-12-2012, 09:57 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by tony d View Post
A 2013 1st plus Eric Tangradi and Simon Despreses to Edmonton for Hemsky.
Not a chance.

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07-12-2012, 10:04 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by misfit View Post
Hemsky's production had nothing to do with his linemates or role. He's been Horcoff's linemate for years, and Horc has always drawn the toughest assignments, so Ales has played against good players for a while. Hemsky didn't put up the numbers last year because he was injured pretty much the whole year which should've been blatantly obvious to anyone who watched him play at all last year. When he finally seemed to be over the injury late in the season, he was outstanding. He was also terrific at the Worlds.
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Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
I don't think we should play that game, my point was that offense wasn't our biggest problem. I'm not sure how Hemsky helps the Pens where he carries a risk of being on IR by the time the playoffs role around.



Hemsky always played with relatively modest linemates so I don't think that's a huge factor in the dip in production.
Quality of linemates has a bit to do with it, otherwise there would be no reason to add anyone around star players. Penner was much better at finding the back of the net than Gagner or Horcoff during his time with the Oilers, and I don't think it's entirely to blame with his recovering injuries(some of it, maybe).

Also, the WC doesn't disprove the linemates thing, wasn't he with Krejci and Erat? Again>Horcoff/Gagner

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07-12-2012, 10:11 PM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
A 2013 1st plus Eric Tangradi and Simon Despreses to Edmonton for Hemsky.
If I were the Penguins, I wouldn't trade any one of those assets for Hemsky.

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07-12-2012, 10:30 PM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
A 2013 1st plus Eric Tangradi and Simon Despreses to Edmonton for Hemsky.
Just want to point out that not one months ago, a more productive, less fragile center was traded from Dallas to Washington for a 2nd round pick and a much lesser prospect than Despres.

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07-12-2012, 10:34 PM
  #161
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he is actually, exactly the player they need. so I KNOW they wont get him

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07-12-2012, 10:41 PM
  #162
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he is actually, exactly the player they need. so I KNOW they wont get him
right. We suck and get no good players.

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07-12-2012, 10:42 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by RehnX View Post
I've said it before and I'll say it again, if Hemsky's shoulders are fixed, then I want him.

He's only missed something like ~30 games due to ANY OTHER INJURY in his career. The past 2 seasons are not worth bringing up as he shut himself down for both of them to have surgery, he COULD have played. If the shoulders are good than he is an awesome pick-up and could likely be had for fairly cheap(Note: Cheap for a player of his caliber).

He's not soft, he's really not as injury prone as the Hive-Mind thinks, and he's HIGHLY skilled.

If he can take this hit and get up, then I'm convinced.

Would rather have Semin, but if the Pens miss him, Hemsky would not be a bad consolation prize.
Thank you, sir. People who say he's soft either don't know what soft means or don't watch him play.

Hemsky is the perfect player to illustrate the difference between being soft and being injury-prone.

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07-12-2012, 10:42 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by spiny norman View Post
If I were the Penguins, I wouldn't trade any one of those assets for Hemsky.
You wouldn't trade Tangradi 1-1 with Hemsky?! You on crack? Tangradi hasn't even managed to secure a regular spot in the lineup (anywhere in the lineup!!)... Hemsky has proven to be a skilled top 6 winger. Yes his value is down slightly due to his injuries and crappy season... but he's easily worth a lot more than Tangradi.

I wouldn't move any of Despres, Morrow, Dumoulin or Harrington for Hemsky. I could see the Pens moving Tangradi, and either a 1st or one of their other D prospects. But I don't think the fit is close enough between Hemsky and the Pens to justify it.

I think a more realistic option is the Pens waiting to see how some of the rookies play (Despres, Dumoulin, Strait and Bort) to see if they can move Niskanen. Then shopping Niskanen and perhaps another D prospect for a top 6 winger.

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07-12-2012, 10:43 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by spiny norman View Post
If I were the Penguins, I wouldn't trade any one of those assets for Hemsky.
This is a little disingenuous. The Pens do have enough scoring BUT no one can discount what a winger like Hemmer could bring to Crosby AND vice versa.

To suggest that no one of these assets brings Hemsky to the Pens is ludicrous! Remove the Penguin tattoo from your ass and be objective. I don't want to move Hemmer for the entire package but it would be tough to pass up.

If I were a Pens fan I wouldn't want to give up Despres because of the need at D that is obvious (as it is for the Oilers) but as for the 20th to 30th pick or Tangradi (who has accomplished nothing) I see zero incentive for the Oilers to attain the latter two assets as the cupboards are stocked with great prospects, certainly better than Tangradi or a late first rounder.

As for Despres, he is a nice up and coming d man but his value is no where close to 83.

These two teams have similar needs on the blue line and Despres do not fill the need Edmonton has (1-2 dman).

Tired of the Hemsky bashing. Going to be glad to re-read this post after next season and smirk a little knowing how undervalued he has been. Hemsky in a deal including Letang, let's talk.

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07-12-2012, 10:50 PM
  #166
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right. We suck and get no good players.
OH EM GEEEE get to a conference finals gams in the past 3 years before boring me with sarcasm

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07-12-2012, 10:59 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by Gobo View Post
That was 4 years ago man.

Since then, tell me what the Pens have done of significance? 1st & 2nd Round exits?
Hemsky isn't the difference between the Pens winning a cup or not.

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07-12-2012, 11:00 PM
  #168
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I don't think the Oilers brass is foolish enough to sell low. Hemsky is well liked by management and teammates. Still, one of the best skaters in the NHL. He's finally healthy, following two years of shoulder surgeries and rehab. In previous seasons, he's posted nearly a point per game average. I think the Oilers want to give him at least another year to see if and where he fits. He's too good of a talent to just let go for futures.

More likely, if they were to trade Hemsky it would be in a package for a bigger piece.

Most likely, the Oilers keep him for at least another season.

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07-12-2012, 11:03 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by Slatsmsg View Post
This is a little disingenuous. The Pens do have enough scoring BUT no one can discount what a winger like Hemmer could bring to Crosby AND vice versa.

To suggest that no one of these assets brings Hemsky to the Pens is ludicrous! Remove the Penguin tattoo from your ass and be objective. I don't want to move Hemmer for the entire package but it would be tough to pass up.

If I were a Pens fan I wouldn't want to give up Despres because of the need at D that is obvious (as it is for the Oilers) but as for the 20th to 30th pick or Tangradi (who has accomplished nothing) I see zero incentive for the Oilers to attain the latter two assets as the cupboards are stocked with great prospects, certainly better than Tangradi or a late first rounder.

As for Despres, he is a nice up and coming d man but his value is no where close to 83.


These two teams have similar needs on the blue line and Despres do not fill the need Edmonton has (1-2 dman).

Tired of the Hemsky bashing. Going to be glad to re-read this post after next season and smirk a little knowing how undervalued he has been.
Despres was the Pens' best defenseman outside of Letang last year, at age 20. He's a 6'4", two-way horse who played for Team Canada at the WJCs, anchored a Mem Cup squad, and is a strong candidate to play on the Pens' 1st pairing with Letang next year. All for under a mil per for the next two years.

Yes, he's worth more than a perpetually injured Hemsky, coming off a garbage season, making 5 mil per for the next 2 years.

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Hemsky in a deal including Letang, let's talk.


Reminds me of this gem from last year:

Quote:
A top-line player in Hemsky for a guy with fringe top-six potential. Wow. Just wow.

James Neal. The guy has yet to show he can be anything more than a 50+ point player. Edmonton gets back a big bodied scorer they lost in Penner. The guy can fight as well. Pittsburgh gets a guy who is a legitimate first-line player. It equals out for Edmonton as Neal is younger and an RFA, so he matches up better with the rebuild.

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07-12-2012, 11:10 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Lowball View Post
I don't think the Oilers brass is foolish enough to sell low. Hemsky is well liked by management and teammates. Still, one of the best skaters in the NHL. He's finally healthy, following two years of shoulder surgeries and rehab. In previous seasons, he's posted nearly a point per game average. I think the Oilers want to give him at least another year to see if and where he fits. He's too good of a talent to just let go for futures.

More likely, if they were to trade Hemsky it would be in a package for a bigger piece.

Most likely, the Oilers keep him for at least another season.
We heard he was healthy going into last year. I remember impassioned arguments from Oilers fans about how his shoulder was surgically repaired, and the sort of injury he had allowed him to come back 100%.

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07-12-2012, 11:25 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
We heard he was healthy going into last year. I remember impassioned arguments from Oilers fans about how his shoulder was surgically repaired, and the sort of injury he had allowed him to come back 100%.
Hemsky wasn't healthy going into the last offseason, and he was supposed to be ready for the season, but obviously he wasn't. This year he'll have a full offseason of training, and should be close to 100%. From what I read/heard, his shoulder strength should return to 100%, but his motion is unlikely to get to 100%. Could be wrong though.

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07-12-2012, 11:26 PM
  #172
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Rowdy I will be interested to read your posts after the upcoming season.

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07-12-2012, 11:57 PM
  #173
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Seriously, if Pens fans don't want to see Hemsky passing the puck to Malkin/Crosby, then the only hope they've got is Semin... which is risky in many ways.

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07-13-2012, 12:04 AM
  #174
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Seriously, if Pens fans don't want to see Hemsky passing the puck to Malkin/Crosby, then the only hope they've got is Semin... which is risky in many ways.
This is just so funny. OMGZ the only hope!!! Crosby and Malkin don't need a playmaker to set them up.

I really thought when Edmonton re-signed Hemsky for 2 more years it would at least stop the trade talk to Pittsburgh for a while. For a guy that's so valuable, Edmonton fans sure would love to get rid of the guy since he's in every proposal.

Hemsky is the new Tomas Kaberle of trade proposals.

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07-13-2012, 01:01 AM
  #175
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Seriously, if Pens fans don't want to see Hemsky passing the puck to Malkin/Crosby, then the only hope they've got is Semin... which is risky in many ways.
Given the choice, I'd much rather have Semin; he's an UFA and he shoots the puck which, IMHO, the Penguins would want that skill in a top-6 winger.

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