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Breaking news: insurance companies will no longer cover the Blue Jays...

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Old
07-10-2012, 03:55 PM
  #151
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I loved the article about Gose on DJF today.

I'm on my phone because I just moved, but can someone tell her how long we have KJ for and what our 2B position looks like from an organizational pov. Thanks!

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07-10-2012, 03:56 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
No I dont, but I bet you he is more likely to stand pat then deal 3 of our top prospects.
Why?
He's always said his goal is too NOW make the ML team better and that he hopes to become a team that will trade a few top prospects for a player rather then be the team trading away the player for the top prospects.

These deals involving our top prospects in my mind arent for rentals so I dont understand why you're making it seem like these are all short sighted moves.

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07-10-2012, 03:58 PM
  #153
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Why?
He's always said his goal is too NOW make the ML team better and that he hopes to become a team that will trade a few top prospects for a player rather then be the team trading away the player for the top prospects.

These deals involving our top prospects in my mind arent for rentals so I dont understand why you're making it seem like these are all short sighted moves.
How about we just see what happens?

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07-10-2012, 04:04 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
How about we just see what happens?
That's not entertaining at all though. Plus, it would render this thread useless.

Next 2/3 weeks we should see lots of roster movement. Fun times.

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07-10-2012, 04:11 PM
  #155
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That's not entertaining at all though. Plus, it would render this thread useless.

Next 2/3 weeks we should see lots of roster movement. Fun times.
Yep, probably a reliever with control (Lincoln) and a #5 veteran pitcher like Blanton. I would be happy with that.

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07-10-2012, 04:12 PM
  #156
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http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/81...s-reduced-2013

Doesn't really affect us.

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07-10-2012, 04:28 PM
  #157
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My take on all of this:

If there are controllable core or potential core pieces out there, AA is looking into them. He is not trading a bunch of really good pieces for a rental like Grienke or Hamles but for a guy like J. Upton? You bet your ass AA is on the phone and would be willing to trade 3 or 4 good prospects. J. Upton is a potential MVP candidate and basically any team could use that and I think it stabilizes our offense for a long time. AA has said it himself he wants to buy, not sell. The team is good right now but AA wants to make it great and he has the farm system to do so. That doesn't mean he will push all in right now, in fact, he won't, at all. But we have already seen him deal prospects and major league players to improve the roster in deals like Colby/Santos/Yunel. He is not going to trade Bautista or Edwin or KJ or Oliver or etc. There are nice core pieces but with some obvious holes of course and that's where you have to patch.

AA said he wanted to see if the talent would come together before pushing and I think we are seeing the talent come together. Lawrie is really good, Colby is excellent, Jose is Jose, Edwin might not be this great going forward but he has taken the next step forward and shown potential with his bat before. Morrow took that next step forward, Hutch showed tons of upside and the young arms are still developing in guys like Alvarez and Drabek (even though he will miss most of next season). Jays main arms are all the way in Lansing and I don't think you can wait 2-3 years to reach majors and then make a push. Ideally, you want to try making a little bit of a push for this season (not rentals) and the seasons after so then you can have the next wave of talent upcoming and getting closer to majors while you are competing. Sure, you might trade off some of that talent but Jays have accumulated enough that it will keep coming and if they continue drafting and dipping into IFA, they should have a steady steam of talent coming.

If there is one prospect I would say that AA won't trade, it might be d'Arnaud just because he is basically MLB ready and he has a good bat + glove and plays catcher so I doubt he gets traded but any other prospect is in play and so are guys like Snider/Thames/Cooper.

AA usually surprises so it will be interesting to see what he does but I think he will definitely be looking to buy. Don't get too disappointed if he doesn't buy, it didn't mean he didn't try.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tootoo Train View Post
Completely forgot that Hutch didn't decide to go the surgery route. He was pitching so well, would be a big boost to even get him back into the rotation.

----------------

per J.Heyman

J.C. Romero, veteran lefthanded reliever, decided to opt out of his Orioles deal after a month in the minors for them and is now a free agent.

Romero was 1-0 with a 2.51 ERA in 14 1/3 innings pitching in Triple-A for the Orioles. Romero has extensive experience and could be a viable lefty option for several teams in need.


With Perez out for the year and the lack of lefty depth in the organization, I'd think AA will be one of the first guys giving JC a call.
We're so signing him.

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07-10-2012, 04:31 PM
  #158
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The Blue Jays were among the most aggressive teams when the international signing period opened on July 2, signing three of the top 20 international prospects to put them slightly over their $2.9 million international bonus pool.

Toronto signed Venezuelan shortstop Franklin Barreto ($1.45 million), Venezuelan shortstop Luis Castro ($800,000) and Dominican shortstop Richard Urena ($725,000), putting their international amateur spending for the 2012-13 signing period at $2,975,000. That means the Blue Jays are 2.6 percent over their international bonus pool, so for their $75,000 overage they will have to pay a 75 percent tax, which comes to $56,250.

The Blue Jays won't face any penalties beyond the tax unless they choose to spend more than five percent above the $2.9 million pool ($3,045,000), after which they would have to pay a 100 percent tax on the overage and would be prohibited from signing any player for a bonus greater than $500,000 during the 2013-14 international signing period that begins next year on July 2.

While the Blue Jays are probably done for the next 11 months in terms of six-figure international amateur signings, the Collective Bargaining Agreement does have some exemptions that will allow them to still sign players without having to face any further penalties. Each club gets six exemptions on signings of up to $50,000, so the Blue Jays still have up to $300,000 to spread across six players if they want for the rest of the signing period. Teams can also sign unlimited players for $7,500 or less and they won't count against their pool space.

During the 2011 calendar year, the Blue Jays ranked second in international amateur spending with estimated bonus expenditures of $7.57 million.
http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/...al-bonus-pool/

All shortstops belong to us!

We're done signing big names but we can still sign guys for 50,000 and unlimited signings of guys for 7,500 or less.

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Old
07-10-2012, 04:39 PM
  #159
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Hey listen prospects are great and when you have tons its even better but how many of those prospects will become MLB all-stars? How many will contribute to the levels that Rasmus, Romero, Morrow are doing now?

To me its just shuffling the deck chairs its out with the old and more costly guys and in with the new cheap younger versions.

To me I don't see it as we have 3 starters down and a closer down and Lind at 1b....its wow we are in the WC hunt with all that missing. If they go out and get a guy or 2 especially a couple of pitchers then you can slot guys back to their roles and that should spark a good 2nd half.

Don't forget Drabek is done for almost next year as well and it takes almost 24 months before getting back from 1st TJ and Hutch who knows how he will come back. Getting Garza or giving money to Hamels or Grienke those are pieces that will be around for a while. Besides the 3 kids in Lansing who is the next pitcher coming up to be a top 1-3 in the majors??

To me you trade for Cole and then sign him to a huge deal then your top of the rotation is Hamels, Morrow, Romero.....pretty effing solid with Alvarez coming in at 4th and then you only need to fill 5 next year.
Baseball prospects are a huge gamble and most will not make the big step. That's why have so many is important in baseball. The contracts we've moved out were Wells which was a miracle and now the Angels are stuck and have no idea how to move him. That was an insane good move by AA. The only other real contract we moved out was Marcum. IMO having Lawrie as our everyday 3B was a great trade for us long term. We had something like 7 3b in 6 years or something insane like that. Downs they let walk for the compensation picks. He was old and they could get strong value from letting him walk. I loved Downs but understand the move. So I don't get this part of your argument.

Yes we are holding on with all of our injuries but so are the yanks and rays and so on. Many teams are dealing with the same issues allowing us to stay in it (for now). There are tons of rumours about AA looking in to many pitchers at the moment. He's been linked this week to Garza, Hamels, Grienke, Rodriguez and someone else I can't remember. IMO he'll only trade for someone like Hamels or Grienke if he can get a contract in place ahead of the trade. So your assuming he isn't trying to make these deals but you don't just throw whatever a team asks for to make it happen. Remember apparently the Phillies are asking for 4 to 5 top prospects with major league ready ones involved for Hamels right now. That's almost twice what we got for Halladay and he was a better pitcher then than Hamels is now IMO. He's simply waiting until asking prices become a little more reasonable IMO. If I were guessing I'd say he's looking to add a piece long term like Garza and a short term fix for this season like Stanton. That would go a long way to helping us this season and going forward. So one costly piece and one cheap addition. It's just a waiting game at the moment.

Don't forget he can address issues like Drabek and possibly Hutch being down for next year in the coming off season. He could just sign someone like Marcum, Hamels or Grienke if he wanted at that time. Who knows. Why do we need prospects for the 1-3 in our rotation ahead of Lansing? We have 4 rotation spots locked down right now if you don't include the injuries. Romero, Morrow, Alvarez, Hutch. That's a real nice rotation as it stands. Alvarez is struggling right now but that's to be expected from a young pitcher. Anyway, you get my point. I just wouldn't worry about it right now as I'm sure AA is very active calling around to try and make something happen. I just don't want to see us burn quality assets for a fix for this season. Unless we are guaranteed some term I don't want to see prospects wasted.

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Old
07-10-2012, 04:43 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by Tootoo Train View Post
He's not the only one. Both Romero and Farrel have come out and said that they really need some help. It's great to see these guys so passionate about wanting to win, but the problem is that they're really handcuffing AA. The market for starters is already in high demand, now with these 3 coming out recently and voicing their concerns, it certainly doesn't help AA in getting fair value in a deal.

By the way, I don't think there's any truth behind that Jose comment you highlighted. He's just desperate to win considering we're so close despite all the teams setbacks.
What would help is if Romero pitched like a ****ing ace and Farrell figured out how to manage a baseball team. Those two things alone could help us make a strong push.

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07-10-2012, 04:49 PM
  #161
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All shortstops belong to us!
Urena is the only one of the three that projects to stick at SS.

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Old
07-10-2012, 04:54 PM
  #162
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Urena is the only one of the three that projects to stick at SS.
I was kidding...

Barreto projects as a CF, maybe a 2nd baseman too. Don't know much about Castro though.

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07-10-2012, 05:44 PM
  #163
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Jim Callis:

"The Blue Jays may have more quality pitching in their farm system than any team, though most of it is at least a couple of years away from making a big league impact. Here's how I'd stack up their 10 best mound prospects:
1. Aaron Sanchez, rhp
Misses bats with mid-90s fastball and curve, just needs command.
2. Noah Syndergaard, rhp
A little less dynamic but more polished than Sanchez.
3. Daniel Norris, lhp
$2 million second-rounder from 2011 can touch 96 mph with his fastball.
4. Marcus Stroman, rhp
Jays stole most electric arm in 2012 draft with 22nd overall pick.
5. Justin Nicolino, lhp
Classic finesse southpaw has quality changeup, best command in system.
6. Matt Smoral, lhp
Slid from mid-first round to 50th pick in 2012 after breaking bone in his foot.
7. Adonys Cardona, rhp
Can hit 94 mph, set record for Venezuelan pitchers with $2.8 million bonus.
8. Roberto Osuna, rhp
Lacks projection but reaches mid-90s and commands three pitches.
9. Tyler Gonzales, rhp
2012 sandwich pick repeatedly touched 97, showed big league slider in spring.
10. Kevin Comer, rhp
Projectable athlete has good life on fastball, feel for secondary pitches.

It's possible to dream on all of these guys and envision them becoming at least No. 3 starters, though Nicolino and Comer will have to add more velocity to profile that well. Sanchez and Syndergaard definitely look like frontline starters, and Norris has flashed that ability in his 15 innings in pro ball.

The main reason Stroman slid in the June draft is that he's 5-foot-9, leading a lot of teams to pigeonhole him as a reliever and making them reluctant to select him early in the first round. He's very athletic and may have the durability to make it as a starter, so I wouldn't peg him as a closer just yet. Gonzales is wiry and has a lot of effort in his delivery, making him the most likely member of this group to wind up in the bullpen."

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07-10-2012, 06:44 PM
  #164
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Gausman unlikely to sign with the Orioles and Appel unlikely to sign with the Pirates. The Pirates offered around 4 million and he isn't taking it. Not sure what this kid is expecting.

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07-10-2012, 07:13 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight K Schrute View Post
Jim Callis:

"The Blue Jays may have more quality pitching in their farm system than any team, though most of it is at least a couple of years away from making a big league impact. Here's how I'd stack up their 10 best mound prospects:
1. Aaron Sanchez, rhp
Misses bats with mid-90s fastball and curve, just needs command.
2. Noah Syndergaard, rhp
A little less dynamic but more polished than Sanchez.
3. Daniel Norris, lhp
$2 million second-rounder from 2011 can touch 96 mph with his fastball.
4. Marcus Stroman, rhp
Jays stole most electric arm in 2012 draft with 22nd overall pick.
5. Justin Nicolino, lhp
Classic finesse southpaw has quality changeup, best command in system.
6. Matt Smoral, lhp
Slid from mid-first round to 50th pick in 2012 after breaking bone in his foot.
7. Adonys Cardona, rhp
Can hit 94 mph, set record for Venezuelan pitchers with $2.8 million bonus.
8. Roberto Osuna, rhp
Lacks projection but reaches mid-90s and commands three pitches.
9. Tyler Gonzales, rhp
2012 sandwich pick repeatedly touched 97, showed big league slider in spring.
10. Kevin Comer, rhp
Projectable athlete has good life on fastball, feel for secondary pitches.

It's possible to dream on all of these guys and envision them becoming at least No. 3 starters, though Nicolino and Comer will have to add more velocity to profile that well. Sanchez and Syndergaard definitely look like frontline starters, and Norris has flashed that ability in his 15 innings in pro ball.

The main reason Stroman slid in the June draft is that he's 5-foot-9, leading a lot of teams to pigeonhole him as a reliever and making them reluctant to select him early in the first round. He's very athletic and may have the durability to make it as a starter, so I wouldn't peg him as a closer just yet. Gonzales is wiry and has a lot of effort in his delivery, making him the most likely member of this group to wind up in the bullpen."
I'm shocked that he has Gonzales in there over a guy like Joe Musgrove or John Stilson.

But when you have so many high ceiling pitchers I guess everyones going to have a different opinion on who they like more.

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07-10-2012, 07:20 PM
  #166
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I'm shocked that he has Gonzales in there over a guy like Joe Musgrove or John Stilson.

But when you have so many high ceiling pitchers I guess everyones going to have a different opinion on who they like more.
I agree with you. I would have put Stilson in their for sure based on scouting reports I have read and his limited stats.

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07-10-2012, 07:36 PM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weems View Post
I'm shocked that he has Gonzales in there over a guy like Joe Musgrove or John Stilson.

But when you have so many high ceiling pitchers I guess everyones going to have a different opinion on who they like more.
John Stilson is seen as a reliever, although I guess so is Gonzales but he is younger and you can try smoothing out his delivery. I probably would have had Musgrove instead of Gonzales. I like the size, he throws in the low 90's and has some more projection left.

Gotta love the run of high ceiling arms.

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07-10-2012, 07:43 PM
  #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
John Stilson is seen as a reliever, although I guess so is Gonzales but he is younger and you can try smoothing out his delivery. I probably would have had Musgrove instead of Gonzales. I like the size, he throws in the low 90's and has some more projection left.

Gotta love the run of high ceiling arms.
I think its a little premature to say Stilson is just a reliever going forward.
Hes been pretty good starting in his first year of pro ball.

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07-10-2012, 07:53 PM
  #169
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We all know Justin Upton would be a guy AA would probably love to add. Rumour is the Dbacks had scouts at the last 5 51's games. What type of package do you guys think they would be looking for?

Gose, Hechavarria, and Nicolino.... more or less?

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07-10-2012, 07:56 PM
  #170
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Woah Bautista, easy on the dives, it's only the ASG, wait, this game means something.

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07-10-2012, 07:57 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by Dwight K Schrute View Post
We all know Justin Upton would be a guy AA would probably love to add. Rumour is the Dbacks had scouts at the last 5 51's games. What type of package do you guys think they would be looking for?

Gose, Hechavarria, and Nicolino.... more or less?
I think that package all depends on how you view Hech.
If you view him as slightly better Johnny Mac then I'm not sure thats enough but if you project him into a Alcides Escobar player then I would think thats a very nice offer. On first glance tho I would think its a bit thin but others would prolly think otherwise.

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07-10-2012, 07:59 PM
  #172
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Originally Posted by Dwight K Schrute View Post
We all know Justin Upton would be a guy AA would probably love to add. Rumour is the Dbacks had scouts at the last 5 51's games. What type of package do you guys think they would be looking for?

Gose, Hechavarria, and Nicolino.... more or less?
Hech is who they were looking at. Can't see Hech and Gose going in one package for a fielder. Just my opinion.

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07-10-2012, 08:09 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
Hech is who they were looking at. Can't see Hech and Gose going in one package for a fielder. Just my opinion.
I could if it means acquiring a perennial mvp, gold glove and silver slugger candidate.

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07-10-2012, 08:17 PM
  #174
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I think its a little premature to say Stilson is just a reliever going forward.
Hes been pretty good starting in his first year of pro ball.
I've never seen him pitch so I'm not sure but I believe Law has said his delivery or arm action is violent and will keep him as a reliever... or uhm, something like that. I think Goldstein sees him as a reliever too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dredeye View Post
Hech is who they were looking at. Can't see Hech and Gose going in one package for a fielder. Just my opinion.
You easily trade both of them for J. Upton. Though any team that gets is gonna get a whole ton of runs saved.

I think just for pure defense, I would love to see Hech at SS, Gose at CF, Rasmus at LF/RF, d'Arnaud at catcher and Lawrie at 3rd base. Christ, that is one freaking good defensive club.

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07-10-2012, 08:48 PM
  #175
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Gausman unlikely to sign with the Orioles and Appel unlikely to sign with the Pirates. The Pirates offered around 4 million and he isn't taking it. Not sure what this kid is expecting.
They have no leverage, what are they doing.

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