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Zanon signing to set-up another move?

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07-06-2012, 01:44 AM
  #1
hawkeyguru93
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Zanon signing to set-up another move?

When The Avalanche signed Zanon it had me scratching my head... All that does is bury our good young defensemen in the minors for another season. With Johnson, Hejda, Wilson, O'Brien, O'Byrne, Elliott, Barrie, Gaunce, Hunwick and possibly Holos (and not to mention Siemens in the minors could push for a spot if injuries arise near the deadline) all good enough to play in the NHL, the signing of Zanon just does not make sense.

But then it got me thinking that maybe Sherman has something up his sleeve to trade one or two of our young defensemen like Elliott, Gaunce, Barrie, Hunwick and Siemens along with Statsny for an upgrade on offense or a number one defenseman to play alongside Johnson.

What does everyone else think about the Zanon signing? Could it be setting up a possible trade?

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07-06-2012, 01:46 AM
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Congo Jack
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Maybe a ROB trade?

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07-06-2012, 01:49 AM
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hawkeyguru93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STEVE RANDESKOGAH View Post
Maybe a ROB trade?
That was a thought of mine but what would we get for him? I don't think we would get anything that we need in return. Like a top 6 forward and number 1 dman.

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07-06-2012, 01:58 AM
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Congo Jack
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Originally Posted by hawkeyguru93 View Post
That was a thought of mine but what would we get for him? I don't think we would get anything that we need in return. Like a top 6 forward and number 1 dman.
Highly doubt it. We'd probably just get a pick or a prospect, course what defenceman do we have that could fetch us a number 1 dman or a top six forward (besides EJ as we need him)?

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07-06-2012, 04:10 AM
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Kschey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeyguru93 View Post
That was a thought of mine but what would we get for him? I don't think we would get anything that we need in return. Like a top 6 forward and number 1 dman.
I'd guess if we trade one of our bottom dmen it will be in a packge. Maybe along with Stastny or somebody else in order to get a top 6 winger or number 1 dman.

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07-06-2012, 06:00 AM
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The Shermanator
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All of our Dmen creates a lot of internal competition amongst them. Hopefully it will bring out the best in all of them as they work to make the team and ultimately stay in the roster.

Trading one of them would be nice too.

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07-06-2012, 06:26 AM
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I get why people bring up O'Byrne (His contract) but hes one of only two RH-D that are actually full time NHL defenders for us.

He shouldn't be expensive to resign and hes a right hander.. Hes not going anywhere. There is a chance I think that management wasn't quite impressed with Hejda because he was suppose to enable EJ and instead did more to hurt that pairing than help it.

Hejda is ok but it's fairly easy to say that at 3M+ hes a bit over paid..

Wilson (Don't care that he just resigned he was an RFA) probably has a good chance of being moved as well. He does actually have value after scoring 21 points in a shortened season and currently being on a fairly cheap contract while still having some potential for growth.

I think Zannon may have been brought in to replace Hejda or to cover for SOB's defensive deficiencies. SOB is a great guy to have on the bench and on the ice but the Orr'Brien nickname is well deserved.

Zannon & SOB should allow SOB a little more freedom while minimizing the damage. Together they also form a scary tough guy type D pairing that is good enough defensively for bottom pairing sheltered minutes.

Another idea would be that eventually Zannon is a solid enough stay at home guy to allow a rookie offensive defender some room for growing pains as well. (Although I don't know what you do with SOB at that point.)

Over all.. Yeah it's difficult to make sense of..

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07-06-2012, 07:19 AM
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I don't think there is any great plan at work here other than just to have depth and competition. IMO...the Avs probably realized they were longshots for Suter and that the Carle bidding would get crazy. So the high-end options were really limited from the get-go. So you go to camp with 10 guys (well, 9 with Hejda out) who may legitimately stake a claim to a spot (Johnson, Hejda, O'Byrne, Wilson, Zanon, O'Brien, Hunwick, Elliott, Barrie & Gaunce) with the idea that competition for places is good for all.

I don't believe there is any talk about a big-name trade at the moment, I think the Avs want to see how this plays out before making any moves.

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07-06-2012, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CobraAcesS View Post
Wilson (Don't care that he just resigned he was an RFA) probably has a good chance of being moved as well. He does actually have value after scoring 21 points in a shortened season and currently being on a fairly cheap contract while still having some potential for growth.
Well, this is real life and not a video game, so that stuff kind of matters to maintain good relationships and image.

We can't afford to sign guys and dump them shortly after like the Flyers do, we don't have that prestige to keep pursuing players after something like that. It will raise serious questions amongst the other young players on the team, knowing full well that signing a 3 year contract means nothing in terms of how the organization values you moving forward.

It's all nice and dandy to discuss it here, but it's unlikely on a practical level.

Order of being traded, IMO:

1. O'Byrne
2. Hejda
3. Wilson
4. Hunwick
5. O'Brien
6. Zanon
7. Johnson

With that said, I do not want to see O'Byrne moved and would prefer we moved Hejda who is older, did not have a good season with us, but would still be attractive as he has size, shot blocking ability, and a decent reputation around the league. Trading a player a full year after signing him is not as bad as moving a guy after he signed a new deal within the last month.

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07-06-2012, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STEVE RANDESKOGAH View Post
Maybe a ROB trade?
I doubt O'Byrne is going anywhere. He is signed to a nice contract and is a key penalty killer for us along with Hedja.

If he were to go though I think he would fetch the same than Montreal got when they traded Hal Gill to Nashville at the deadline: a borderline NHLer (Geoffrion), an AHLer (Robert Slaney) and a later 2nd round pick.

If that is the case, we are better off keeping him for a playoff run.

As for trading Stastny, it's not happening unless a center with a big cap hit comes back as well. This team has 3 nice scoring lines. We will not break that up.

What we do have is alot of prospects on defense and a ton of good young forward prospects. I like the idea of Vlasic coming here. It would take Barrie, Olver/Hischon and probably a 1st or 2nd but it might be worth it.

EJ - Vlasic
O'Bryne - Hedja
Wilson - O'Brien
Zenon - Hunwick

*Elliot, Siemens, Guance

Even after a potential trade this team is still loaded with D-men.

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07-06-2012, 09:03 AM
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Heebs, I don't think we can take on a 1 way contract on D without offloading one. Failing to do so means we'd have 8 one way contracts on D. Also, keeping 8 means along with Hunwick, one of O'Brien/Zanon/Wilson or somebody is scratched. We would either need to carry 8 D(meaning only 1 extra forward) or waive/trade a guy during training camp/pre-season.

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07-06-2012, 09:19 AM
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I'd rather see us pursue Enstrom then Vlasic TBH.

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07-06-2012, 09:23 AM
  #13
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Originally Posted by KRM93 View Post
I'd rather see us pursue Enstrom then Vlasic TBH.
Any particular reason? Is it that you just feel Enstrom is better or he addresses more of a need?

In terms of the potential UFA defensemen next summer, I'd rank them in this order of my interest in the Avs signing them:

1. Weber
2. Edler
3. Vlasic
4. Enstrom
5. Smid
6. Green
7. Timmonen(1/2 year contract)

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07-06-2012, 09:27 AM
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I'd prefer to see Sherman hold on to our D until mid season when teams will begin facing injuries and gaps they'd like to solidify. I think Hjeda,RoB, SoB, and Hunwick will hold a nice value then. Don't want to see Wilson go, but I seem to see his potential and play far more positively than many on these boards.

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07-06-2012, 09:35 AM
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Foppa Frossa
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Don't think Hejda is movable at this point since he is recovering from surgery.

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07-06-2012, 09:38 AM
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Ivan13
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Quote:
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Don't think Hejda is movable at this point since he is recovering from surgery.
Agreed.

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07-06-2012, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
Heebs, I don't think we can take on a 1 way contract on D without offloading one. Failing to do so means we'd have 8 one way contracts on D. Also, keeping 8 means along with Hunwick, one of O'Brien/Zanon/Wilson or somebody is scratched. We would either need to carry 8 D(meaning only 1 extra forward) or waive/trade a guy during training camp/pre-season.
True.

Wilson
Barrie
Olver
2013 2nd

for

Vlasic

Looks about right.

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07-06-2012, 09:50 AM
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Bubba Thudd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heebs21 View Post
True.

Wilson
Barrie
Olver
2013 2nd

for

Vlasic

Looks about right.
That looks about right from our end.

But they will want quality over quantity, and if he goes on the block, they would get better quality offers than that.

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07-06-2012, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CobraAcesS View Post
I get why people bring up O'Byrne (His contract) but hes one of only two RH-D that are actually full time NHL defenders for us.

He shouldn't be expensive to resign and hes a right hander.. Hes not going anywhere. There is a chance I think that management wasn't quite impressed with Hejda because he was suppose to enable EJ and instead did more to hurt that pairing than help it.

Hejda is ok but it's fairly easy to say that at 3M+ hes a bit over paid..

Wilson (Don't care that he just resigned he was an RFA) probably has a good chance of being moved as well. He does actually have value after scoring 21 points in a shortened season and currently being on a fairly cheap contract while still having some potential for growth.

I think Zannon may have been brought in to replace Hejda or to cover for SOB's defensive deficiencies. SOB is a great guy to have on the bench and on the ice but the Orr'Brien nickname is well deserved.

Zannon
& SOB should allow SOB a little more freedom while minimizing the damage. Together they also form a scary tough guy type D pairing that is good enough defensively for bottom pairing sheltered minutes.

Another idea would be that eventually Zannon is a solid enough stay at home guy to allow a rookie offensive defender some room for growing pains as well. (Although I don't know what you do with SOB at that point.)

Over all.. Yeah it's difficult to make sense of..


Anyways, I don't think the Avs will be making any moves until training camp. I don't agree with bringing in all these average defensemen, but at least the Avs are showing that they want guys like Elliott and Barrie to really earn their spots or they'll be in Lake Erie.

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07-06-2012, 09:57 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heebs21 View Post
True.

Wilson
Barrie
Olver
2013 2nd

for

Vlasic

Looks about right.
Good luck with that. I'm sure they are as eager to do that as we are to trade them EJ for Doug Murray, Taylor Doherty, Tommy Wingels and their 2nd round pick in 2013.

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07-06-2012, 09:59 AM
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Ivan13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heebs21 View Post
True.

Wilson
Barrie
Olver
2013 2nd

for

Vlasic

Looks about right.
That's not enough, it's basically 4 mediocre pieces for one of the best defensive d-men in the NHL.

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07-06-2012, 10:04 AM
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What's wrong with competition? This team needs some of it for roster spots.

I haven't seen Zanon play a single game in the Avs system. So I don't think he replaces anyone yet.

I'm sure glad we didn't trade our wingers after we picked up Joakim Lindstrom last year.

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07-06-2012, 10:06 AM
  #23
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Look at the Kings team this year. Is this defense really that better than ours?

Drew Doughty - Rob Scuderi
Willie Mitchell - Slava Voynov
Alec Martinez - Matt Greene
Davis Drewiske

Compare that to:

Eric Johnson - Shane O'Brien
Jan Hedja - Ryan O'Bryne
Ryan Wilson - Greg Zanon
Matt Hunwick

I actually think our is deeper and better.

Is Jon Quick that much better than Semyon Varlamov?

Are LA's top two lines better than ours? They are pretty close.

Dustin Brown - Anze Kopitar - Justin Williams
PA Parenteau - Matt Duchene - Milan Hejduk

Dustin Penner - Mike Richards - Jeff Carter
Jamie McGinn - Paul Stastny - David Jones

Is their checking line better than ours? I don't think their 3rd line can come close to ours.

Dwight King - Jarret Stoll - Trevor Lewis/Simon Gagne
Gabriel Landeskog - Ryan O'Reilly - Steve Downie

What about the 4th line? It's pretty close again.

Brad Richardson - Colin Frasor - Jordan Nolan
Cody McLeod - John Mitchell - Marc Olver/Chuck Kobasew

I think this team is ready to contend. If we can somehow manage to sign a vet like Doan to play alongside Duchene and save the rest of our cap money to re-sign our young players when they hit UFA status, we will be in good shape.

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07-06-2012, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonzai12 View Post
What's wrong with competition? This team needs some of it for roster spots.

I haven't seen Zanon play a single game in the Avs system. So I don't think he replaces anyone yet.

I'm sure glad we didn't trade our wingers after we picked up Joakim Lindstrom last year.
So are you saying that if a prospect impresses in the camp and players excluding Zanon are "pretty much ok", you throw Zanon to waivers immediately (before a single game is played) after signing him to a multi-year contract?

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07-06-2012, 10:12 AM
  #25
Ivan13
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Mitchell and Scuderi are fantastic defensive defensmen, we have no one like that on our team. ROB is good, but he's more like Greene who played on their 3rd pairing. And they have a PMD on each pairing.

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