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If Nash is NOT traded....

View Poll Results: If Nash is NOT traded, what happens to start the 2012-2013 season?
Nash returns, keeps the C 32 32.00%
Nash returns, but gives up the C 58 58.00%
Nash refuses to report 6 6.00%
Something else (?) 4 4.00%
Voters: 100. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
07-10-2012, 08:54 PM
  #51
Robert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe View Post
What does the team want?

That is the only question relevant to me on this issue -- not management, not Nash, and damn sure not the fans.

Whatever the 20+ guys in the room want, so be it.
True, but Nash would be voted in simply based on respect not necessarily on what is best for the team; hell, if George Washington had defected to Britain his troops would still vote him to be their leader.

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07-10-2012, 09:07 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
True, but Nash would be voted in simply based on respect not necessarily on what is best for the team; hell, if George Washington had defected to Britain his troops would still vote him to be their leader.
I wouldn't be sure of that. Of the whole leadership group that has been talked about, the Dispatch has made it sound like they've already seceded from the union and have moved on without Nash.

On top of that, we have Foligno, Aucoin, and Bobrovsky who are fresh to the team and can make their own determinations during Training camp. Letestu comes from an organization where Crosby was the leader and should be smart enough to understand the difference in a leader that has come to accept losing and one that hates to lose. Atkinson wasn't around enough last season to fall into the circle of suck plus there will probably be a couple of new faces additional just so we make sure we are above the cap floor.

That's like 1/2 the team right there who should be able to revolt and establish who is a true, natural leader on this team.

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07-10-2012, 09:13 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
I wouldn't be sure of that. Of the whole leadership group that has been talked about, the Dispatch has made it sound like they've already seceded from the union and have moved on without Nash.

On top of that, we have Foligno, Aucoin, and Bobrovsky who are fresh to the team and can make their own determinations during Training camp. Letestu comes from an organization where Crosby was the leader and should be smart enough to understand the difference in a leader that has come to accept losing and one that hates to lose. Atkinson wasn't around enough last season to fall into the circle of suck plus there will probably be a couple of new faces additional just so we make sure we are above the cap floor.

That's like 1/2 the team right there who should be able to revolt and establish who is a true, natural leader on this team.
Excellent rebuttal.... the new roster will certainly have new blood, nevertheless Rick Nash, the face of the organization and core of the CBJ for almost a decade is the subject here.. We will see.

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07-10-2012, 09:17 PM
  #54
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Nash might have asked for a trade, but it was howson who went public with it

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07-10-2012, 09:18 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
True, but Nash would be voted in simply based on respect not necessarily on what is best for the team; hell, if George Washington had defected to Britain his troops would still vote him to be their leader.
So?

Their team, their choice.

Frankly, if naming Nash captain is such an affront to team chemistry/dynamics/morale that some feel it may be, then someone else in the room needs to stand up and stop it.
But again, that should be up to the players.

Worth noting though that players had Nash's back when the trade news came out. Most of them probably don't share the same ire expressed here.

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07-10-2012, 09:31 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe View Post
So?

Their team, their choice.

Frankly, if naming Nash captain is such an affront to team chemistry/dynamics/morale that some feel it may be, then someone else in the room needs to stand up and stop it.
But again, that should be up to the players.

Worth noting though that players had Nash's back when the trade news came out. Most of them probably don't share the same ire expressed here.
Nash appears to be one of the most universally respected players on and off ice. Only those in the room really know the details of his leadership or lack thereof.

I don't think message board anger influences their position.


Last edited by Derby: 07-10-2012 at 09:33 PM. Reason: Agreeing
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Old
07-10-2012, 09:49 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe View Post
So?

Their team, their choice.

Frankly, if naming Nash captain is such an affront to team chemistry/dynamics/morale that some feel it may be, then someone else in the room needs to stand up and stop it.
But again, that should be up to the players.

Worth noting though that players had Nash's back when the trade news came out. Most of them probably don't share the same ire expressed here.
The question is: "Do they really have his back or are they playing the PC game and this is what we should say to the media?"

Off the record, I believe there were a couple of un-named players coming into the offseason who indicated to Porty that they had not spoken with Nash since the season ended and I believe that was not status quo from previous season. This was approximately 3 weeks after the season actually ended if I'm not mistaken.

If he doesn't get traded, there is still a different vibe being created this off season and there seems to be some distance being created between Nash and some players. Subconsciously or not. That vibe cannot continue into training camp if he is still here.

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Old
07-10-2012, 10:11 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by CBJ103 View Post
Who wears the "C" is one of the most overrated and least important things in the NHL. A leader will lead on and off the ice whether or not he has the "C". The room will follow and respond to those leaders irregardless of if they have extra letters on their uniforms or not.

The CBJ did not finish 30th in the NHL last year because the wrong guy wore the "C". They finished last because of a lack of talent throughout the organization. If Nash stays, I would have him continue to be the captain. Giving the "C" to someone else isn't going to miraculously fix the goaltending problem, make anyone into a top line center, or transform Richards into a top NHL coach. All it would do is perhaps "embarrass" him at a time when the CBJ needs him to be a leader and give 100% both on and off the ice.....either because the CBJ actually are able to ice a competitive team this year or because they need him to bring the optimal return when he is traded.

I agree taking away the C does more harm then good. People can change their mind and their hart. Columbus had one of the most epically bad and embarrassing seasons in the history of the NHL. Question: wouldn't you be more upset if Nash "didn't" want to leave? I would question his sanity if he wanted to stay on a sinking ship. People can change and management and players can make up. Maybe last season's adversity is what gels the team this season. It was a long and very uncomfortable season for everyone. I think its water under the bridge

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07-10-2012, 10:13 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Nash might have asked for a trade, but it was howson who went public with it
Also this, it was Hawson and not Nash that created this mess. He didn't have to publicly announce Nash requested a trade.

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07-10-2012, 10:40 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedorov View Post
Also this, it was Hawson and not Nash that created this mess. He didn't have to publicly announce Nash requested a trade.
It was a harsh move no doubt but it solved a ton of debate here, Nash wants to be traded and that is not debatable any longer. Now, the final debate if the CBJ are better or worse with Nash traded or not is the next step that must be taken for this board to move forward.

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07-10-2012, 11:20 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by St1ngr View Post
Although I don't think it's what will ultimately happen, I think the best possible ending to this saga would be keeping Nash without the C. IMO it would make this whole drama worth it if this whole mess acted like some kind of Dr. Seuss-type machine designed to strip the C off Nash's chest and change nothing else.

It is clear any possible return on Nash's trade will be undervalued. I cannot dream up any sequence of events that would turn the tables in Howson's favor between now and the start of the season. Possibly by the 2013 trade deadline, but not before then....

Nash with the C has gotten us nowhere for how many years now....

Nash without the C - maybe if he can focus on playing hockey and leave the leadership stuff to somebody more qualified like JJ or VP, he might just start to look like the beast he can be playing for team Canada...
I agree with this. I think the guys in the room have his back to some extent, and I think he respects the city too much to hold out. I would like to see him stay not as the captain; I think that would be the best outcome.

The loud voices calling for a trade for the sake of a trade are misjudging in my opinion the dynamics of the guy and the rest of the team.

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Old
07-11-2012, 06:37 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
The question is: "Do they really have his back or are they playing the PC game and this is what we should say to the media?"

Off the record, I believe there were a couple of un-named players coming into the offseason who indicated to Porty that they had not spoken with Nash since the season ended and I believe that was not status quo from previous season. This was approximately 3 weeks after the season actually ended if I'm not mistaken.

If he doesn't get traded, there is still a different vibe being created this off season and there seems to be some distance being created between Nash and some players. Subconsciously or not. That vibe cannot continue into training camp if he is still here.
The answer is, of course, we'll probably never truly know.
Pro-Nash folk will read quotes literally as statements of support, anti-Nash folk will see it as "PC" regardless of what is said publicly. Such is life.

I recall that report as well. But is the lack of communication due to the fact that they figure he is a goner or because they're upset with him? Or some combination of both? Maybe everyone involved was just too busy?

This gets back to my point though, which is there are 20 or so people who do know how they feel. And it should be their call.
If they're cool with Nash, I'm not going to bash it.

As was pointed out earlier, the "C" is really only a patch of fabric.
Others can lead too by words and actions regardless of if you wear a letter.

If the Blue Jackets players haven't realized that before and don't realize that now then their problems run much deeper than Nash.

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07-11-2012, 07:56 AM
  #63
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Question:

Where's the quote that Nash said he "WANTED" to be traded?
I seem to recall he was "willing" tone traded if it was "best for the team"

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07-11-2012, 08:01 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JACKETfan View Post
Question:

Where's the quote that Nash said he "WANTED" to be traded?
I seem to recall he was "willing" tone traded if it was "best for the team"
Answer:

There is none. Yet people have inferred it based on the little we actually know. In fact, I expect to be told "Oh, that's what he said, but here's what he really meant." by someone who doesn't know what he really meant very soon. If not in here, then, well, I'm pretty sure I know where I can find a ready uninformed stance - I won't say where, but it rhymes with bain moards.

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07-11-2012, 08:01 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe View Post
Whatever the 20+ guys in the room want, so be it.
Honestly, its needs to be a joint decision.... As much as I don't like Management/coaching wholly making the decision, we've been giving the guys in the room the power (because management was so indecisive) on far too many things and look where we are.

The easy way to decide this is to have no one wear this "C" at all this season, or have it rotate, and start fresh next training camp. Players voting now or this season will just vote Nash out of either PR or a sense of loyalty (assuming he's still here). One training camp isn't enough for this decision.

If Nash stays, he has a chance to earn it back, I just don't think there's anyway he can, he just not a captain personality for this particular phase the organization is in.

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07-11-2012, 08:26 AM
  #66
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So sick of Portzline's breathless tweets about what show he's appearing on to talk about "a certain captain on the trading block". He is sounding more and more like an insufferable teen girl with newfound popularity.

IMO he is pushing the notion of bad blood aka divorce between parties because it keeps him in demand. His many frequent Nash tweets are starting to creep me out. Every so often he sends an "all quiet" or "no news" tweet. Uh... Thats news?

Gotta unfollow him to keep away the heebie jeebies.

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07-11-2012, 08:36 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassé View Post
Answer:

There is none. Yet people have inferred it based on the little we actually know. In fact, I expect to be told "Oh, that's what he said, but here's what he really meant." by someone who doesn't know what he really meant very soon. If not in here, then, well, I'm pretty sure I know where I can find a ready uninformed stance - I won't say where, but it rhymes with bain moards.
The whole Nash demanded a trade line was created by the "media" to drum up hits and radio appearances.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derby View Post
So sick of Portzline's breathless tweets about what show he's appearing on to talk about "a certain captain on the trading block". He is sounding more and more like an insufferable teen girl with newfound popularity.

IMO he is pushing the notion of bad blood aka divorce between parties because it keeps him in demand. His many frequent Nash tweets are starting to creep me out. Every so often he sends an "all quiet" or "no news" tweet. Uh... Thats news?

Gotta unfollow him to keep away the heebie jeebies.
I also love how he keeps using the line "One call can change all". Attention ***** Hack.

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07-11-2012, 08:37 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Derby View Post
So sick of Portzline's breathless tweets about what show he's appearing on to talk about "a certain captain on the trading block". He is sounding more and more like an insufferable teen girl with newfound popularity.

IMO he is pushing the notion of bad blood aka divorce between parties because it keeps him in demand. His many frequent Nash tweets are starting to creep me out. Every so often he sends an "all quiet" or "no news" tweet. Uh... Thats news?

Gotta unfollow him to keep away the heebie jeebies.
Ask him what he thinks Dineen would do on the Nash situation, then you'll join the ranks of us who have been #PortyBanned

Gotta love a guy who is in the publishing business who loves to ban his followers.

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07-11-2012, 08:45 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post
Ask him what he thinks Dineen would do on the Nash situation, then you'll join the ranks of us who have been #PortyBanned

Gotta love a guy who is in the publishing business who loves to ban his followers.
Are you for real just sad. BTW he is still pissed Konopka is gone, now that obsession is extra creepy.

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07-11-2012, 08:54 AM
  #70
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I voted what I think will happen..

Nash stays. Every offer that has even been insinuated is lowball when you look at the results of this guy carrying our offense. Don't believe me? study the statistics.. look at how big a % of our offense Nash is over his career in comparison to the other 30+ goal scorers in the same time period. They all have help coming from some where, he has very little support.

The Blue Jackets haven't been able to score from the blue line and for most of his career haven't even given him an adequate pivot/center. It is very hard to make a run on the net with or without the puck if there are no other credible threats. The entire defense strategy flexes to him.

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07-11-2012, 09:09 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by LetsGOJackets!! View Post
Nash stays. Every offer that has even been insinuated is lowball when you look at the results of this guy carrying our offense. Don't believe me? study the statistics.. look at how big a % of our offense Nash is over his career in comparison to the other 30+ goal scorers in the same time period. They all have help coming from some where, he has very little support.

The Blue Jackets haven't been able to score from the blue line and for most of his career haven't even given him an adequate pivot/center. It is very hard to make a run on the net with or without the puck if there are no other credible threats. The entire defense strategy flexes to him.
I pretty much agree. Trouble is, without trading our most (only?) valuable piece, I don't know where additional scoring help is coming from. We've added Folino upfront and can look for more offense from the blue line, but we're still dependent on improved output from guys like Brassard, Atkinson, Calvert, etc. Just looks like more of the same old same old, to me.

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07-11-2012, 09:13 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derby View Post
So sick of Portzline's breathless tweets about what show he's appearing on to talk about "a certain captain on the trading block". He is sounding more and more like an insufferable teen girl with newfound popularity.

IMO he is pushing the notion of bad blood aka divorce between parties because it keeps him in demand. His many frequent Nash tweets are starting to creep me out. Every so often he sends an "all quiet" or "no news" tweet. Uh... Thats news?

Gotta unfollow him to keep away the heebie jeebies.
Honestly, what else is going on that is demanding attention in the NHL right now? I guarentee you these shows are calling Portie around the clock to come on and talk about it.

I'm no great fan of Portie's either, but there really is nothing going on right now. The closer we get to the CBA expiration, and then that will quickly take over, right now, the league's spotlight is on this situation, much like before the deadline when news slipped that the team was potentially moving Nash (before it became known that Nash asked out, reasons aside) We saw it with the playoffs, the Nash chatter took a back seat until the Cup was won.

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07-11-2012, 09:19 AM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JACKETfan View Post
Question:

Where's the quote that Nash said he "WANTED" to be traded?
I seem to recall he was "willing" tone traded if it was "best for the team"
Who knows what has been said behind closed doors, but what I personally remember being said was that he went to management and "asked them to consider trading him, for the good of the team and his career."

- which is probably more than "willing to be traded" but certainly not the "demanding to be traded" that some media and board posters have turned it into.

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07-11-2012, 09:20 AM
  #74
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Just looks like more of the same old same old, to me.
Which they've repeatedly said it won't be... I agree Pete. I've come to the realization that until he's moved, we can't really move forward as he's been the focal point, both on and off the ice.

The best option I could see is staying stuck in a neutral-esque type of position where we were after the Carter trade with Nash still here, we just haven't added enough to move away from needing him to try and shoulder most of the load. But then we might be talking Nash as a distraction, even if he doesn't mean to be one. I don't think there's anyway we are as bad as we were were the first half last year, but we are likely close to being a lottery team again. And even then, we are putting a tremendous amount of faith in Bob..... he goes down or isn't the answer, we are sunk.


Last edited by KeithBWhittington: 07-11-2012 at 10:18 AM.
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07-11-2012, 09:20 AM
  #75
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Portzline's real love of Konopka was enough to destroy my ironic love of Konopka

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