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Leafs are high on Korbinian Holzer

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Old
07-11-2012, 08:28 AM
  #26
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Best defensive defenceman on the best defensive team in the AHL last season but only the Leafs 12th best prospect, apparently.

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07-11-2012, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Espher View Post
Prior to 1992-1993 they were a miserable team across the board, so there's going to be nothing pleasant to look at from 85-92. Similarly, I think we all know about the post lockout problems.

1993-1994 they were 6th in goal dif. 1998-1999 they were 5th. 1999-2000 they were 10th. 2000-2001 they were 9th. 2001-2002 they were 5th. 2002-2003 they were 9th. 2003-2004 they were 7th.

So, in seven of eleven seasons, they were top ten in goal differential, and in each of those seasons, they were above +20. I don't have particulars on things like ESGD vs. PPGD vs. SHGD, but they might be out there -- I just don't care to do that much research for you.
thanks for the research. They also had world class goaltending during the Quinn years which I think saved their butts on most nights

I also remember many playoff games in those Quinn years where their defense disappeared completely - if their goalies had an off night they were screwed.

here's a great example of this - in 2 back to back years against Philly in the playoffs - in critical playoff games (a game 5 and and a game 7) they were blown out by scores of 6-1 and 7-2.

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07-11-2012, 08:33 AM
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Thanks Ulf - if you have a bit of time, other than 1 season in nearly 30 years (from 1985 to now) any other good defensive years from Toronto?
I don't have time right now, but if I were to begin a search I'd look at coaching as a hook.

Pat Burns sprang to mind, and then of course Roger Neilson would be the next guy I'd look at.

I wouldn't suspect Pat Quinn, but I could be wrong there.

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07-11-2012, 08:35 AM
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Keep hoping, I remember some around here having Schenn expendable because of Holzer. Hopefully he can come in and play well and is at least allowed some sort of learning curve.
You do realize Schenn was 3rd. pairing with amongst the least TOI/g for all defenders?

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07-11-2012, 08:56 AM
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I feel a little cheated that he's getting this attention and *New* praise from the fans. I predicted last fall that Schenn would be moved to make room for Holzer and I was soundly booed.

I'm happy for Holzer
Disappointed by this board.


Coming soon:

My prediction for Deschamps coming true.

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07-11-2012, 08:58 AM
  #31
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I think otherwise he would have left the Leafs for the DEL, good Germans earn more money here than in the AHL on a 2-way-contract. I'm not saying he is all about the money, but he has already spent 2 years in the AHL, I can't see him staying patient forever.

I hope he can snag a roster place and become a regular this year, really love his game .
No doubt the 1-way 1-year guaranteed $575k contract was influenced by Holzer having options outside the NHL, including returning home.

The 1-year deal near league minimum also an incentive for Holzer to prove what he can do at the next level, and hopefully he has success so that his next contract will also have some term.

Holzer is a stay at home defensive dman that embraces a shutdown role and often these styles of players don't get enough appreciation for what they bring to a team outside of goals and assists. With Leafs being the 2nd worst team in goals against last season, Holzer's impact will be seen in an improvement in that part of Leafs game.

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07-11-2012, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
You do realize Schenn was 3rd. pairing with amongst the least TOI/g for all defenders?
Square peg in a round hole in Wilson's pond hockey system a reason for that.

Another was he was also one of the youngest Leaf players with only Gardiner younger this past season, and "playing the kids" not something that is promoted in Toronto when a team is desperate to make the playoffs, as player development takes a secondary role in priorities.

Schenn began his NHL career at age 18 and has played over 300 NHL games to date, whereas Holzer will be cutting his teeth this year at age 24. That is a 6 year difference in NHL arrival date and expectations from Schenn to Holzer. So at age 24 Holzer will be physical & mentally more mature, as well as a wealth of more professional hockey experience making his adjustment and adaptation to NHL life an easier transition.

Holzer plays a very similar game style to Schenn, but not as physical. However under Carlyle, I expect Hozler to be sheltered by a better defense oriented system, and line matching that will see Korbinian up against the 3rd and 4th lines of other teams and well as 2nd pairing PK duties.

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07-11-2012, 10:06 AM
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and Holzer can skate and fight, unlike Schenn, while costing millions less.

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07-11-2012, 10:15 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by mooseOAK View Post
Best defensive defenceman on the best defensive team in the AHL last season but only the Leafs 12th best prospect, apparently.
Needs more YouTube videos in order properly endorse this "unknown" individual.


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07-11-2012, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
Needs more YouTube videos in order properly endorse this "unknown" individual.

Only bad defence ends up on Youtube.

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07-11-2012, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by ForSpareParts View Post
I feel a little cheated that he's getting this attention and *New* praise from the fans. I predicted last fall that Schenn would be moved to make room for Holzer and I was soundly booed.

I'm happy for Holzer
Disappointed by this board.


Coming soon:

My prediction for Deschamps coming true.
Well, Schenn was moved to acquire JVR. That is a fact. We don't that he was moved to make room for Holzer. For all we know, Burke might have preferred to move Holzer for JVR, but Philadelphia insisted on Schenn.

Still, Schenn is gone and Holzer is his likely replacement, so I'll give you partial marks.


Last edited by rojac: 07-11-2012 at 01:55 PM.
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07-11-2012, 11:32 AM
  #37
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Well, Schenn was moved to acquire JVR. That is a fact. We don't that he was moved to make room for Holzer. For all we know, Burke might have preferred to move Holzer for JVR, but Philadelphia insisted on Schen.

Still, Schenn is gone and Holzer is his likely replacement, so I'll give you partial marks.
I'm going to stick my neck out even further and say that he will have a big impact, and will be on the second pairing before you know it.

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07-11-2012, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Heatleys Eye View Post
Thanks Ulf - if you have a bit of time, other than 1 season in nearly 30 years (from 1985 to now) any other good defensive years from Toronto?
yep they sucked defensively in the early 90's. in fact, one year they had the 2nd best GA for the league. slackers. and the next they were something like 6th best GA.

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07-11-2012, 11:47 AM
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Not that I necessarily disagree, but what is this based on?
The Marlies games I went to & watched on TV. Not to mention the Olympics even though that was an extremely small sample size. I think he can handle more minutes than a 5/6 dman from time to time, but on good teams, he's the type of unnoticeable guy you want on your bottom pairing. But who knows, maybe the Leafs make their pairings based on chemistry rather than skill set.

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07-11-2012, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Around in 67 View Post
yep they sucked defensively in the early 90's. in fact, one year they had the 2nd best GA for the league. slackers. and the next they were something like 6th best GA.
wow those are incredible statistics you got there - so out of 30 years they were never the best in Goals Against but came close a couple of times?

Maybe it's better if we look at it like this - in 30 years they were not near the top of the league in let's say 25 of those years and that is being generous

Slackers


Last edited by Heatleys Eye: 07-11-2012 at 12:00 PM.
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07-11-2012, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Heatleys Eye View Post
wow those are incredible statistics you got there - so out of 30 years they were never the best in Goals Against but came close a couple of times?

Maybe it's better if we look at it like this - in 30 years they were not near the top of the league in let's say 25 of those years and that is being generous

Slackers
you asked the question and I answered it. not my problem you don't like the answer

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07-11-2012, 12:34 PM
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Disappointed by this board.
Pretty much sums it up.

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07-11-2012, 01:05 PM
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Good bottom pairing guy. Franson shouldn't be moved to make room. We only have 7 NHL caliber defencemen, we can't trade any of them cause of injury risks...

Gunnar-Phaneuf
Gardiner-Franson
Liles-Holzer

Komisarek

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07-11-2012, 01:10 PM
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You do realize Schenn was 3rd. pairing with amongst the least TOI/g for all defenders?
Yet he still led all defensemen in the league in hits...again.

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07-11-2012, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Heatleys Eye View Post
wow those are incredible statistics you got there - so out of 30 years they were never the best in Goals Against but came close a couple of times?

Maybe it's better if we look at it like this - in 30 years they were not near the top of the league in let's say 25 of those years and that is being generous

Slackers
92-93: 241GA (2nd)
93-94: 243GA (6th)
00-01: 207GA (10th)
02-03: 208GA (10th)

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07-11-2012, 01:58 PM
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I'm going to stick my neck out even further and say that he will have a big impact, and will be on the second pairing before you know it.
I'd argue that no one on the Internet who uses any kind of an alias is sticking their neck out very far at all, because if they are very wrong, they can simply shut down their current alias and move on to another and most with few or no consequences.

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07-11-2012, 02:09 PM
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I'd argue that no one on the Internet who uses any kind of an alias is sticking their neck out very far at all, because if they are very wrong, they can simply shut down their current alias and move on to another and most with few or no consequences.
to be far to spare parts, he's wrong A LOT and sticks to the same alias

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07-11-2012, 02:18 PM
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I'd argue that no one on the Internet who uses any kind of an alias is sticking their neck out very far at all, because if they are very wrong, they can simply shut down their current alias and move on to another and most with few or no consequences.
There are those that do that?

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07-11-2012, 02:39 PM
  #49
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The day Luke Schenn was traded I believe Brian Burke said it opened up a chance for Holzer to make the roster coming out of training camp, so I guess they think he is ready and he just needs to prove it.

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07-11-2012, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by rojac View Post
I'd argue that no one on the Internet who uses any kind of an alias is sticking their neck out very far at all, because if they are very wrong, they can simply shut down their current alias and move on to another and most with few or no consequences.
Sticking your neck out in these parts always is interpreted as "trolling".

I'm "trolling" if I say Schenn will be moved in order to make room for Holzer.

I start a thread praising Deschamps, and saying that he threatens Kadri's call-up opportunity then I get my thread deleted.

I say that McCabe will have a hard time finding a NHL team to play for and I have someone following me from thread to thread and filling up my inbox.

Yeah. Sticking my neck out.


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