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Plekanec to Phoenix

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Old
07-11-2012, 10:12 AM
  #51
Blind Gardien
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I think Phoenix just has to look elsewhere. The Habs are already weak at center, and can't afford to trade Plekanec. Wait a few years, see if Eller and/or Galchenyuk step up, then maybe Plekanec becomes available, but atm the Habs just can't afford to move him.

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07-11-2012, 10:13 AM
  #52
brian70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halifaxhab View Post
I never said Pheonix and Montreal making this kind of deal made sence, but if the Yotes want him, they'd have to pay the price to get him, weather it's something they want to or not is on them.


Remember, the OP stating Maloney wanting a centre was posted by a Coyotes fan, not a Habs fan.
Wasn't contradicting you. I was simply adding that I was aware of Plekanec's true value to a team, despite the number of offensive centers around the league, and that the Yotes can't help Montreal much.

Some mentioned Rundblad. Excellent puck-moving defenseman but does that resolve a problem on the Habs roster?

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07-11-2012, 10:14 AM
  #53
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I don't see why the Yotes would pay a high price when re-signing Langkow or re-acquiring Lombardi could be done without giving up assets. Plekanec is better, but cost-benefit would show that starting the year and going to the deadline with Langkow or Lombardi is way more prudent and economically sound.

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07-11-2012, 10:17 AM
  #54
Habitant le colon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
here are Centers I would prefer to Plekanec...

Ryan Getzlaf (ANA)
Tyler Seguin (BOS)
Patrice Bergeron (BOS)
David Krejci (BOS)
Eric Staal (CAR)
Jordan Staal (CAR)
Jonathan Toews (CHI)
Dave Bolland (CHI)
Ryan O'Reilly (COL)
Paul Stastny (COL)
Matt Duchesne (COL)
Derek Roy (DAL)
Pavel Datsyuk (DET)
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (EDM)
Anze Kopitar (LAK)
Mike Richards (LAK)
Jeff Carter (LAK)
Mikko Koivu (MIN)
Mike Fisher (NSH)
John Tavares (NYI)
Brad Richards (NYR)
Jason Spezza (OTT)
Kyle Turris (OTT)
Sean Couturier (PHI)
Martin Hanzal (PHX)
Evgeni Malkin (PIT)
Sidney Crosby (PIT)
Joe Thornton (SJS)
David Backes (STL)
Patrik Berglund (STL)
Steven Stamkos (TBL)
Vincent Lecavalier (TBL)
Henrik Sedin (VAN)
Ryan Kesler (VAN)
Mike Ribeiro (WAS)
Nicklas Backstrom (WSH)
so there is 21 team with a real 1 c ?? ... why on EARTH a versatile Center is so unrated ... oh yeah 50-60 point .... ... the far best foward pker of the league ...

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07-11-2012, 10:22 AM
  #55
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Yes some of the names on the list aren't better than Plekanec, but there are several players left off who are better (Giroux, Marleau, Zetterberg). The point was that he is a very good 2c. If PHX truly wants to deal Yandle for a stud center, they can probably find a better one than Plekanec.

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07-11-2012, 10:49 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
thing is, Plekanec plays ALL the hard minutes in a game.
- Takes most FO in the defensive zone
- 1st unit PK
- play last minutes of most games (unless a blowout one way or another) in all situation - trailing - leading - tied
- is used on the PP
- asked to shutdown opponent first lines
- and finally, he's the ones we give ****** wingers to...
not too mention that he loves playing in montreal, is a very good "lead by example" locker room presence, and has shown to have quality 1st line production potential when paired with half-decent wingers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VegasSabreFan View Post
Sorry but Yandle is worth more than a 2nd line center, no way Coyotes have to add Runblad and a 1st.

I know you guys don't have a lot of depth at the position but I would think Montreal would trade Plekanec straight for Yandle and try Galchenyuk now before they would even think of asking Phoenix to add to that deal. Not that Phoenix would ever offer the deal to begin with.
see above.

and given that Yandle's strength mirror the strengths we already have on defense, and his short-comings fall in line with exactly what we're missing, I highly doubt habs would even remotely consider a 1-for-1 swap Pleks/Yandle. Simply doesn't make any sense for us, regardless if the HF "value" seems about right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronaldo123 View Post
That's a ridiculous price for Plekanec. Yandle alone is worth more. Im sure Phoenix would not move Rundblad and a 1st for him as well though I could be wrong
don't doubt that Phoenix would say no... i thought i made that pretty clear?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
That is utterly ridiculous and I am a Habs fan. At best, Yandle and Plekanec are a wash value wise, otherwise you could make a case the former would covet more. I could see something around...

Rundblad
Lessio
2013 1st

Admittedly, I do not know Phoenix's prospect pool well excluding Rundblad or Gormley. Murphy may be another piece Montreal would target. Frankly, I do not believe asking for Gormley is unreasonable however Rundblad has significant upside from what Ottawa fans went on about, thus there might be interest there.
my post was a reply to the OP, who plainly stated that for the purpose of this thread, Gormley was off the table.

while your deal might be closer in a hypothetical "value" sense, as a Habs fan you should understand much better what value Pleks has to the Habs. The kind of value that would require significant overpayment or perfect need solution... Your deal does neither, so imo wouldn't be considered by the habs.

Prospect pool is deep enough that trading away an established and much needed talent like Pleks, for prospects/pick, makes no sense unless the prospects are of the elite variety, which Rundblad falls a bit short of.


Bottom line is that quite likely there isn't a trade btw these two teams involving Plekanec that would make sense for both sides.

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Old
07-11-2012, 10:56 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Montreal Shadow View Post
To be fair, the one who posted the list really went to the bottom of the barrel to make his point. Kyle Turris? This has to be a gag.
At least Kyle Turris plays center. Seguin has been a winger since coming into the league.

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07-11-2012, 11:00 AM
  #58
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How about a Phoenix 2012 1st and 2013 1st. I mean, that is the only attractive assets the Coyotes have once you remove all the players that the OP refuses to consider.

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07-11-2012, 11:02 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
At least Kyle Turris plays center. Seguin has been a winger since coming into the league.
Why is Turris even on the list? He's barely a 2nd line centerman on any team in the league (incl. the Leafs).

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07-11-2012, 11:03 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by ronaldo123 View Post
He is not a true clear cut no1 C. He is better suited for the no2 job. His D is good but not elite. Very good 2nd line C who can put up 50-60 points
That's where you're wrong. It is top 10 in the league.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:07 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I think Phoenix just has to look elsewhere. The Habs are already weak at center, and can't afford to trade Plekanec. Wait a few years, see if Eller and/or Galchenyuk step up, then maybe Plekanec becomes available, but atm the Habs just can't afford to move him.
Don't forget about Gomez. With him we have enough talent to field a roster, not enough to be competitive but enough to get through the season and burn off some old contracts.

It doesn't make any sense to me to have both Gomez and Plekanec in the line-up and if we can get a good young player/prospect for Pleks I hope we trade him.

---------------

I would only want Gormley, otherwise I'd trade him to someone else for a better return.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:08 AM
  #62
Halifaxhab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brian70 View Post
Wasn't contradicting you. I was simply adding that I was aware of Plekanec's true value to a team, despite the number of offensive centers around the league, and that the Yotes can't help Montreal much.

Some mentioned Rundblad. Excellent puck-moving defenseman but does that resolve a problem on the Habs roster?
sure they could, they can help us a ton. Trade us Gormley + 2013 1st for Weber + 2013 2nd. Boom! #bighelp

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:51 AM
  #63
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Can I join? If Andrei is healthy how about Plekanec, Markov, and to balance out contract lengths maybe Leblanc, for Hanzal and Yandle.

Montreal goes forward with Descharnais, Hanzal, Eller, and Galchenyuk at center, while Phoenix upgrades with a better offensive center which they need and adds a good center prospect. Markov/Yandle is a little trickier but if Markov can come back health he was just as good before the injuries as Yandle is now, just with a short shelf life due to contract/age.

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07-11-2012, 11:57 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
here are Centers I would prefer to Plekanec...

Ryan Getzlaf (ANA)
Tyler Seguin (BOS)
Patrice Bergeron (BOS)
David Krejci (BOS)
Eric Staal (CAR)
Jordan Staal (CAR)
Jonathan Toews (CHI)
Dave Bolland (CHI)
Ryan O'Reilly (COL)
Paul Stastny (COL)
Matt Duchesne (COL)
Derek Roy (DAL)
Pavel Datsyuk (DET)
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (EDM)
Anze Kopitar (LAK)
Mike Richards (LAK)
Jeff Carter (LAK)
Mikko Koivu (MIN)
Mike Fisher (NSH)
John Tavares (NYI)
Brad Richards (NYR)
Jason Spezza (OTT)
Kyle Turris (OTT)
Sean Couturier (PHI)
Martin Hanzal (PHX)
Evgeni Malkin (PIT)
Sidney Crosby (PIT)
Joe Thornton (SJS)
David Backes (STL)
Patrik Berglund (STL)
Steven Stamkos (TBL)
Vincent Lecavalier (TBL)
Henrik Sedin (VAN)
Ryan Kesler (VAN)
Mike Ribeiro (WAS)
Nicklas Backstrom (WSH)
That list is, in general, just plain awful. I've scratched a few and others on that list are debatable.

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Old
07-11-2012, 11:59 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanHabtic View Post
How about a Phoenix 2012 1st and 2013 1st. I mean, that is the only attractive assets the Coyotes have once you remove all the players that the OP refuses to consider.
I don't think Phoenix can trade their 2012 1st round pick.

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Old
07-11-2012, 12:10 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
you won't like any of the proposals habs fans will put forward... Pleks is hugely valuable to us, would take a significant offer to be worth moving him, and with those 4 assets out of the equation, not much left...

Yandle
Rundblad
2013 1st


not that i think the yotes would bite, but that would be the kind of asking price it would take.
Plekanec is more or less useless and redundant on the Yotes, we probably won't give anything more than a decent prospect like Summers and a 2nd. Plek is on the downside of his career, and would not be able to adjust to WC style of play anyways. He is also not someone that can produce unless playing behind better forwards that draw the top defensive assignment from the opposition.

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07-11-2012, 12:13 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by letowskie View Post
Plekanec is more or less useless and redundant on the Yotes, we probably won't give anything more than a decent prospect like Summers and a 2nd. Plek is on the downside of his career, and would not be able to adjust to WC style of play anyways. He is also not someone that can produce unless playing behind better forwards that draw the top defensive assignment from the opposition.
Is this entire post a joke?

When has Plekanec played behind better forwards that draw the top defensive assignments from the opposition that allowed him to produce?

How would he not be able to adjust to WC style of play?

How is he on the downside of his career? He's only 30.

And how on Earth is he redundant on the Coyotes? He's significantly better than Vermette and Hanzal, he would be the Coyotes best center, and if Doan isn't back he would be their best forward.

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07-11-2012, 12:15 PM
  #68
letowskie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsterix View Post
That list is, in general, just plain awful. I've scratched a few and others on that list are debatable.
Plekanec is not a viable top 6 player on a contender. On an average team, it might be OK to slot him into 2C. But he simply is not anywhere near a game breaking player or a premier forward, he's a complementary scorer at best, similar to the likes of Burrows, Glencross, Matt Cullen, David Jones, Foligno. Stop shopping him around, if you are expecting something valuable for him, his value is basically a decent prospect and a 2nd, period.

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07-11-2012, 12:19 PM
  #69
letowskie
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Originally Posted by UniverStalinGraduate View Post
Is this entire post a joke?

When has Plekanec played behind better forwards that draw the top defensive assignments from the opposition that allowed him to produce?

How would he not be able to adjust to WC style of play?

How is he on the downside of his career? He's only 30.

And how on Earth is he redundant on the Coyotes? He's significantly better than Vermette and Hanzal, he would be the Coyotes best center, and if Doan isn't back he would be their best forward.
It's entirely serious.

Paccioretty would be a good example of a better forward that draws the top D assignment, not Plek. He doesn't have the hockey sense to be the top line player, or against the better transition games that are played in the WC. He is basically the same ilk as Vermette, Boedker, Korpikoski, etc, decent complementary players, nothing special.

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07-11-2012, 12:19 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by letowskie View Post
Plekanec is not a viable top 6 player on a contender. On an average team, it might be OK to slot him into 2C. But he simply is not anywhere near a game breaking player or a premier forward, he's a complementary scorer at best, similar to the likes of Burrows, Glencross, Matt Cullen, David Jones, Foligno. Stop shopping him around, if you are expecting something valuable for him, his value is basically a decent prospect and a 2nd, period.
Lol. Okay man.

You know that over the last 5 years he's one of the top 30 producing centermen right?

Your list of comparisons is a joke, a huge one as well. Half of them aren't even centers, and a guy like Matt Cullen has never had 50 points in a season in his career.

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07-11-2012, 12:20 PM
  #71
ronaldo123
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Ryan Getzlaf
Tyler Seguin
Patrice Bergeron
David Krejci
Eric Staal
Jordan Staal
Jonathan Toews
Paul Stastny
Matt Duchene
Jamie Benn
Pavel Datsyuk
Henrik Zetterberg
Jeff Carter
Miker Richards
Anze Kopitar
Mikko Koivu
John Tavares
Brad Richards
Jason Spezza
Claude Giroux
Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Joe Thornton
Logan Couture
David Backes
Steven Stamkos
Henrik Sedin
Ryan Kesler
Nicklas Backstrom

That is 29 centers better than Plekanec. Like I said he is not a true cut no1 C but better suited to be a no2.

Ryan O'reilly
Valteri Filpulla
Travis Zajac
Daniel Briere
Joe Pavelski
Patrik Berglund
Vincent Lecavalier
Derek Roy
Mike Fisher

These guys are all similar players to Plekanec. Plekanec is a very good number 2 center but not a number 1 guy

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Old
07-11-2012, 12:21 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by letowskie View Post
It's entirely serious.

Paccioretty would be a good example of a better forward that draws the top D assignment, not Plek. He doesn't have the hockey sense to be the top line player, or against the better transition games that are played in the WC. He is basically the same ilk as Vermette, Boedker, Korpikoski, etc, decent complementary players, nothing special.
These comments you are making are entirely false.

It's pretty funny, but I mean...you're just embarrassing yourself.

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07-11-2012, 12:21 PM
  #73
Clipitar
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Originally Posted by letowskie View Post
Plekanec is not a viable top 6 player on a contender. On an average team, it might be OK to slot him into 2C. But he simply is not anywhere near a game breaking player or a premier forward, he's a complementary scorer at best, similar to the likes of Burrows, Glencross, Matt Cullen, David Jones, Foligno. Stop shopping him around, if you are expecting something valuable for him, his value is basically a decent prospect and a 2nd, period.
Very poor assessment. I'm sorry to say but either your hockey talent evaluations skills are way off, or you simply haven't watched Tomas enough to properly assess his game.

"Might be OK" to slot him as 2nd C on an average team? Really?

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07-11-2012, 12:22 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by FanHabtic View Post
How about a Phoenix 2012 1st and 2013 1st. I mean, that is the only attractive assets the Coyotes have once you remove all the players that the OP refuses to consider.
As mentioned by others, I can't see Habs trading Pleks for picks or prospects this summer. Without him center would be by far our weakest position, basically we'd be looking for a top 6 center ourselves.

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Old
07-11-2012, 12:23 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by ronaldo123 View Post
Ryan Getzlaf
Tyler Seguin
Patrice Bergeron
David Krejci
Eric Staal
Jordan Staal
Jonathan Toews
Paul Stastny
Matt Duchene
Jamie Benn
Pavel Datsyuk
Henrik Zetterberg
Jeff Carter
Miker Richards
Anze Kopitar
Mikko Koivu
John Tavares
Brad Richards
Jason Spezza
Claude Giroux
Sidney Crosby
Evgeni Malkin
Joe Thornton
Logan Couture
David Backes
Steven Stamkos
Henrik Sedin
Ryan Kesler
Nicklas Backstrom

That is 29 centers better than Plekanec. Like I said he is not a true cut no1 C but better suited to be a no2.

Ryan O'reilly
Valteri Filpulla
Travis Zajac
Daniel Briere
Joe Pavelski
Patrik Berglund
Vincent Lecavalier
Derek Roy
Mike Fisher

These guys are all similar players to Plekanec. Plekanec is a very good number 2 center but not a number 1 guy
Can you explain to me how Bergeron, Krejci and Seguin are ALL better centers than Plekanec?

Thanks.

Also...Jeff Carter plays wing, not center.

I also don't think you'd see many Habs fans who say Plekanec is a legitimate number 1 center, although every number you can measure that sort of thing by, in the last 5 or so years, he does qualify as one...for years we've talked about him as a great number 2 center, only his team doesn't have a number 1 center.

So again, I don't get what people are trying to prove with all of these lists they keep posting...but please, explain how Bergeron, Krejci, and Seguin are ALL better centers than him.

Thanks.

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