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Rick Nash continued - NYR BOS PHI PIT DET SJS

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Old
07-16-2012, 02:51 PM
  #951
kingpest19
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Originally Posted by bizoncol View Post
I see why you just dismissed Parise's contract example.
As a Jackets fan who saw some guys like Martinek, Dekanich and Huselius on the roster, but never on the ice, I could tell you that ability to stay healthy couldn't be overlooked.
And how Parise's injury affected his market value and goals scoring ability in the future? We probably still should consider him as a 45 goals scorer like 4 years ago cause he was injured and his 31 goals season should be dismissed? I like how Nash is declining and Parise's number were affected by injury, even though he still had just 31 goal in 82 games last year. Is he goes to Dubinsky's category (had a bad year) or to Carter's category (his feeling were hurt somehow)?
How did I dismiss it? He was the biggest UFA in a weak market. UFAs' like him always get overpaid. And hes not getting paid to just score goals, its his overall game.

Did Nash suffer a season ending knee injury last year? Or anytime in general the last few years? Knee injuries take time to recover from. If he comes back and only puts up 30 goals again next season the yes we can talk about his goal scoring declining.

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07-16-2012, 03:11 PM
  #952
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The only saga more boring than this one is Luongo.

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07-16-2012, 03:20 PM
  #953
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I would be thrilled!
I would too.

Every rumor in Rangerland seems to center around Nash and Shane Doan.

One is overpriced in terms of both assets and contract, and the other is declining and will get a multi-year 35+ contract. No thanks to both.

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07-17-2012, 11:36 PM
  #954
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per Anser Kahn, the Red Wings made "a hell of an offer" for Nash

Quote:
The Red Wings made "a hell of an offer" to Columbus for Nash, according to a person with knowledge of the situation. But the offer generated no conversation.
No counteroffer, no back and forth negotiation, nothing.
It is clear Columbus has no intention of trading the face of its franchise to the team it considers to be its top rival, a Detroit club that has dominated the Blue Jackets since they entered the NHL in 2000-01.
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Which forwards might the Red Wings move to get a franchise player like Nash? The two that come to mind are Johan Franzen and Valtteri Filppula, though it's unlikely Detroit would deal both.
Quote:
For now, Howson's asking price for Nash is more than any club is willing to give, and Nash-to-Detroit is a pipe dream.
http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index....tch_for_r.html

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07-17-2012, 11:40 PM
  #955
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Good, Rick Nash would kill Columbus for six years. Howson got that right.

I believe they put up a good offer, because Rick Nash would be great on that team.

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07-17-2012, 11:49 PM
  #956
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Originally Posted by caley View Post
per Anser Kahn, the Red Wings made "a hell of an offer" for Nash
As we've seen, a hell of an offer for Nash means different things to different people.

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07-17-2012, 11:50 PM
  #957
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nash is a loser. just sayin'
whoever gets him will never win a cup. FACT

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07-17-2012, 11:58 PM
  #958
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caley View Post
per Anser Kahn, the Red Wings made "a hell of an offer" for Nash





http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index....tch_for_r.html
man this thing should just end...I feel bad for the blue jacket fans for facing such a dilemma

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07-18-2012, 12:02 AM
  #959
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Originally Posted by clownquestionbro View Post
nash is a loser. just sayin'
whoever gets him will never win a cup. FACT
Yeah, he's never won anything before...






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07-18-2012, 12:04 AM
  #960
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I'm not sure why Columbus won't deal him to Detroit. The Jackets are not going to be competitive for years anyways, so they might as well take the best offer.

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07-18-2012, 01:29 AM
  #961
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I'm not sure why Columbus won't deal him to Detroit. The Jackets are not going to be competitive for years anyways, so they might as well take the best offer.
Meh, it's still understandable. We'd probably re-sign him at the end of the contract aswell. The least Howson can do at this point is to make sure he moves him out of the division and not to their biggest rival.

On the other hand I'm not that high on trading for Nash, so I'm good either way.

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07-18-2012, 01:34 AM
  #962
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Originally Posted by Mickey Redmond View Post
I'm not sure why Columbus won't deal him to Detroit. The Jackets are not going to be competitive for years anyways, so they might as well take the best offer.
I want to be friends with you

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07-18-2012, 01:42 AM
  #963
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Redmond View Post
I'm not sure why Columbus won't deal him to Detroit. The Jackets are not going to be competitive for years anyways, so they might as well take the best offer.
Because Detroit can go **** themselves straight to hell. That's why.

(Also, there's that in-division thing. But I think the go **** themselves consideration takes precedence.)

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07-18-2012, 06:55 AM
  #964
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Originally Posted by TSA0402 View Post
So Brad Richards is more of a leader? I wouldn't disagree with that.

However cherry picking seems to be your specialty since Brad Richards was the beneficiary of a really stacked Tampa Bay team.
They had the one year in which they won the cup in which they were that good.

They were a squeaker in 2003, 2006, and 2007. Sucked in 01 and 02.

Stacked? For one year?

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How can you realistically compare a guy who has won a Conn Smythe to a guy who has played 4 playoff games. He's a better leader? Sure, but you're missing that obvious point that you always seem to forget. Opposite situations, Brad Richards never makes the playoffs in Columbus either. Its really irrelevant.
Oh, it's irrelevant when someone makes the point that hurts Nash?

I see.

Quote:
Feel free to call Nash an overpaid declining 30 goal man, and proclaim Dubinsky a 40-45 point player in your never ending wall of hypocrisy. Just don't expect many to listen.
4 STRAIGHT YEARS of 40+ points with INCREASING production during that time, with ONE bad year.

3 STRAIGHT YEARS of 30 goals and DECLINING production in points during that time.

Again, where is the hypocrisy? The only hypocrite is you. Anytime an argument is brought up that hurts Nash, you dismiss it.

Quote:
And goals are what get you the big bucks. Zach Parise just got paid more than Richards, because of them.
Zach Parise does more than just score. You're FOOLING yourself if you think Parise got paid just because of his goals. Then again, you lie to yourself so much that you actually believe it, so I don't even know where to start when it comes to you.

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07-18-2012, 07:16 AM
  #965
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My theory is that Howson subconsciously believes that if he turns down every deal, Nash will start the season in Columbus and the team will win a bunch of games and then he won't want to be traded any more.

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07-18-2012, 07:24 AM
  #966
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I'm not sure why Columbus won't deal him to Detroit. The Jackets are not going to be competitive for years anyways, so they might as well take the best offer.
Ohhh nooo, theyd have to face Nash a whole TWO extra games a year compared to if he was traded to another team in conference, and four games if he was traded out of conference.

Seriously, you cant take a less competitive package just because you will play Nash 2-4 times more than if he went out of division, ESPECIALLY because there's likely divisional realignment on the horizon, and one of Detroit or Columbus are probably the most prime candidates to be moved.

Ive never gotten the fear of trading within a division. This isnt baseball or football. Playoffs arent determined by divisional winner + wildcard, and divisional play in the season isnt as significant as in some other leagues (2/16 games 12.5% for NFL, 18/162 11.1% for MLB versus 6/82 7.3% for the NHL)

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07-18-2012, 07:28 AM
  #967
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Seriously, you cant take a less competitive package just because you will play Nash 2-4 times more than if he went out of division, ESPECIALLY because there's likely divisional realignment on the horizon, and one of Detroit or Columbus are probably the most prime candidates to be moved.

Ive never gotten the fear of trading within a division. This isnt baseball or football. Playoffs arent determined by divisional winner + wildcard, and divisional play in the season isnt as significant as in some other leagues (2/16 games 12.5% for NFL, 18/162 11.1% for MLB versus 6/82 7.3% for the NHL)
I can't understand this division problem either. If both teams will benefit different ways on that trade, just go for it. It's just building your team better, that's what good GM's should do.

I kind of laugh for Howson, if he trades Nash with worse package somewhere in the East, and after one year he is with his Jackets on the same division after Winnipeg's realignment. That would be something.

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07-18-2012, 07:36 AM
  #968
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My theory is that Howson subconsciously believes that if he turns down every deal, Nash will start the season in Columbus and the team will win a bunch of games and then he won't want to be traded any more.
I agree.

I think Howson has played this one wrong at the moment. I get having a value and not wanting to get rolled by Nash and his agent. I get CBJ wanting to maximise their return on him. But the problem is the limited supply (as well as other alternatives like Ryan specificially, or other high tier FAs like Semin, Doan etc).

Playing the "our way or the high way" card is just going to switch teams off, reducing a likely trade, embittering Nash even further and ironically, further quelling his value.

He's clearly willing to keep him there for now, like you say. I just think the problem will come when Nash breaks out and gets personal. Then Howson will have no negotiation room and he'll have blown his chance to find some, which is now - to get a deal done.

The CBA can't be underestimated too. If there's any suggestion that cap issues could come under scrutiny going forward, Nash's contract could look very errrm, 'inflexible', very quickly.

Howson's window is now - being prepared to wait it out is a disaster waiting to happen... once Nash opens his mouth, there's a huge problem brewing.

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07-18-2012, 07:37 AM
  #969
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I can't understand this division problem either. If both teams will benefit different ways on that trade, just go for it. It's just building your team better, that's what good GM's should do.

I kind of laugh for Howson, if he trades Nash with worse package somewhere in the East, and after one year he is with his Jackets on the same division after Winnipeg's realignment. That would be something.

I would say it is more of a fear of a trade backfiring and getting terrible value. It is easier to hide how badly you were burnt if you play a player you just traded twice a year instead of every couple of weeks.

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07-18-2012, 07:46 AM
  #970
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Originally Posted by clownquestionbro View Post
nash is a loser. just sayin'
whoever gets him will never win a cup. FACT
Thanks for the insight.

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Old
07-18-2012, 08:10 AM
  #971
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Originally Posted by Guy Boucher View Post
My theory is that Howson subconsciously believes that if he turns down every deal, Nash will start the season in Columbus and the team will win a bunch of games and then he won't want to be traded any more.
I too think he's an unrealistic moron.

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07-18-2012, 08:17 AM
  #972
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I would say it is more of a fear of a trade backfiring and getting terrible value. It is easier to hide how badly you were burnt if you play a player you just traded twice a year instead of every couple of weeks.
Thats probably accurate. But it doesnt mean its a good way to do things. It means the GM is putting his own pride / fear of failure ahead of the teams long term success. To win in this league, you have to beat the best teams, regardless of whether or not theyre in your division. So taking the best package available should be what Howson does.

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07-18-2012, 08:28 AM
  #973
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Originally Posted by caley View Post
per Anser Kahn, the Red Wings made "a hell of an offer" for Nash





http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index....tch_for_r.html
I think it's funny how narrow minded Howson seems to be. This isnt 1980, 1990 or even 2000. The movement within divisions these days is rampant. Chris Chelios ended up playing longer for Detroit than he did for Chicago for god's sake.

If Detroit offers you the best deal, you'd be stupid to not take it.

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07-18-2012, 08:30 AM
  #974
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Im starting to hope Anaheim and Columbus just swap Ryan and Nash. This could go on forever

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07-18-2012, 08:35 AM
  #975
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Im starting to hope Anaheim and Columbus just swap Ryan and Nash. This could go on forever
As the odds of the season starting on time are pretty low, GMs are in no rush to make any big trades. It is going to take forever.

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